Packer punting - a bit inconsistent

[Patler]

6 punts today, but only two "good" ones. In order:

From
GB 29 - 33 yards, downed. - net 33 yards
GB 44 - 56 yards. touchback - net 36 yards
GB 41 - 43 yards, fair catch - net 43 yards (Good one!)
GB 23 - 39 yards, returned 8 - net 31 yards
GB 15 - 52 yards, returned 9 - net 43 yards (Good one!)
GB 45 - 39 yards, retuned 6 - net 33 yards

Ryan seems to need to learn the "art" of punting. Kicking into the endzone on the fly from 56 yards away is not a "good" punt. Kicking for only 33 yards from your own 29, and 39 yards from your own 23 are not "good" punts. The last one was only so-so.

[Pacopete4]

very mis leading if you dont say which way he was punting the ball. It was obvious the Packers had the wind in the 2nd and 4th quarters which is one of the reasons both Mare and Rayner were kcking the ball thru the endzone when they had the wind and about to the 5-10 yrd line kicking the other way. Also, it was one of the reasons Rayners FG that didnt count was a bomb and was probably good from 60..

[MJZiggy]

I also noticed that on his first one, there was a bad snap. He had to get it out of the dirt.

[Patler]

I also noticed that on his first one, there was a bad snap. He had to get it out of the dirt.

"Longwell excuses" work for punters, too? :mrgreen: :lol: :mrgreen: :lol:

[MJZiggy]

Funny. I'm not sayin'...I'm just sayin'.

[Patler]

very mis leading if you dont say which way he was punting the ball. It was obvious the Packers had the wind in the 2nd and 4th quarters which is one of the reasons both Mare and Rayner were kcking the ball thru the endzone when they had the wind and about to the 5-10 yrd line kicking the other way. Also, it was one of the reasons Rayners FG that didnt count was a bomb and was probably good from 60..

The wind wasn't that strong. Game sheet lists it at 9 mph. Perhaps enough so kickoffs wouldn't be touchbacks, causing the teams to kick directionally toward one endzone, and letting it fly in the other. But touchbacks aren't that common on kickoffs anyway, so even a low wind can cause that.

[Pacopete4]

so that low wind just caused 2 kickoffs to damn near sail in the stands going one way but to the 7 yrd line the other way.. but its not that strong? ha.. thats 15-20 yrds difference, it was obvious the normal human eye, I dont need a wind report on it

[Patler]

so that low wind just caused 2 kickoffs to damn near sail in the stands going one way but to the 7 yrd line the other way.. but its not that strong? ha.. thats 15-20 yrds difference, it was obvious the normal human eye, I dont need a wind report on it

No, its not a 15-20 yard difference. When teams believe they can't get a touchback, they will often kick directionally and with more height. To do that the kicker will "take something off" the kick to make sure he keeps it in bounds. To get under it for more height, some even tee the ball a bit differently, and their run-up to the ball is different. It may only be a potential 5 yard difference in distance caused by the wind that makes a team take a completely different approach on the kickoff. If they think with the wind they can kick 7 yards deep and get a touchback, they go for it. Against the wind it will be two yards deep and returned, so they kick higher, with more control to a corner to get better downfield coverage. It may only make the 5-10 yardline, but with a short, safe return. In the first instance the kicker kicks away to the center of the field with everything he has. In the second he kicks toward a corner with much less behind it to gain more control. That's what Rayner did on a couple of his kickoffs. The wind itself doesn't account for the total difference in distance.

[Pacopete4]

thats a good strategy and not sayin thats not what he didnt do, but the point was the wind was blowing one way which affected kickoffs(which you just described) and punts. More so punts because they hang in the air, not really driven downt he field. Which goes back to my original statement in saying that you can conclude the punting was incosistent.. cause the wind was blowing from one endzone for half of the game...

[Pacopete4]

and he is averaging over 46 yrds a punt which is 4th in the NFL.. i think there are lot more things that are incosisten that his punting..

[Patler]

and he is averaging over 46 yrds a punt which is 4th in the NFL.. i think there are lot more things that are incosisten that his punting..

Look at his net - 29th best in the league.
He is tied for 29th through 32nd for most fair catches, having only two.
He is tied for 29th through 32nd for most downed inside the 20.
He is tied for 8th-13 for most touchbacks, a stat you would like to be ranked low in, not high.

That is why I stated in my original post, "Ryan seems to need to learn the "art" of punting. " Punting isn't just kicking it as far as you can.

On the positive side, he seems to be doing well as a holder (not sure if he could meet "Longwell standards"!), and he does have a strong leg. But clearly he is a work in progress and a long way away from being a top punter at this point. I think the next off-season will be crucial for his development.

[packrulz]

Not making excuses but I read an article about how his Dad is dying of cancer so that has to be tougher for him. He has had some line drives but he also has hit nice floaters causing the returner to back pedal for the catch and the coverage is so poor the guy stll gets a good return. The stats really don't mention how poor the coverage is and I don't think I've seen the punt return coverage stoked up much this year. He will hopefully become more consistent, he's got the leg.

[Patler]

Not making excuses but I read an article about how his Dad is dying of cancer so that has to be tougher for him. He has had some line drives but he also has hit nice floaters causing the returner to back pedal for the catch and the coverage is so poor the guy stll gets a good return. The stats really don't mention how poor the coverage is and I don't think I've seen the punt return coverage stoked up much this year. He will hopefully become more consistent, he's got the leg.

When they have been reported, his hangtimes have been marginal, and also somewhat inconsistent. I think he has lots of tools, including a good mental approach, it seems.

One thing I had worried about was blocks. He had several last year, and one team that scouted him said it would be a problem at least for a couple years, because of the changes he would have to make and the time it would take to do it. To his credit, it has not been an issue this year so far. He seemed to make the corrections faster than some thought he could.

[HarveyWallbangers]

He is tied for 8th-13 for most touchbacks, a stat you would like to be ranked low in, not high.

To be fair on this one. He only has 4. Kind of a small sample size on this right now. There are a couple of guys who only have 3, but they only have 25 punt attempts compared to Ryan's 32 punts.

[Patler]

He is tied for 8th-13 for most touchbacks, a stat you would like to be ranked low in, not high.

To be fair on this one. He only has 4. Kind of a small sample size on this right now. There are a couple of guys who only have 3, but they only have 25 punt attempts compared to Ryan's 32 punts.

I completely agree, with only 6 games in the books stats can fluctuate wildly. On the other hand you can look at touchbacks and "inside the 20" kicks together. Ryan is with that group that are successful only about 50% of the time at keeping it inside the 20 (5 inside the 20, 4 touchbacks). Most of the better punters are in a 2:1 or even 3:1 ratio, although some of it depends on opportunities, too.

I like to look at the whole picture. Ryan is low in keeping kicks inside the 20, high in touchbacks, low in fair catches and low in net distance. I hope to see improvement in all of those areas.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I'd say Ryan has been a slight disappointment. Knowing the leg strength that he does have, I was hoping he'd be a little more consistent. Then again, I kind of expected this. With regards to his touchbacks, I know a couple of them have been like the one this week. I think he booted it around 56 yards, so it's not like he was really trying to pooch it down there. Being at your own 44 or whatever, you kind of have to give it a big swing and hope it gets a good bounce.

[Patler]

You know me, I love looking at numbers. After 6 games last year, BJ Sander had 25 punts for a gross average of 41.56 yards, with 8 downed inside the 20 and only 1 touchback. Of course he fell apart in the second half of the season for what ever reason. Hopefully Ryans stronger leg will hold up better in the bad weather to come.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I sure hope Ryan doesn't fall off like that. The leg strength is the big difference. Ryan's gross average will likely fall off a bit, but I'm hoping his gross average improves.

[Patler]

I know a couple of them have been like the one this week. I think he booted it around 56 yards, so it's not like he was really trying to pooch it down there. Being at your own 44 or whatever, you kind of have to give it a big swing and hope it gets a good bounce.

That's where the "art" comes in, knowing your own strength and getting the ball to do what you want it to, by controlling the distance, kicking out of bounds, or with enough height for fair catches. Ryan seems to struggle a bit with all 3 options. I also hope to see more 50+ yarders when the Packers are backed up, not when they are near midfield.

I don't think of him as a disappointment, I worried about blocks more than anything. I am realistic enough though to know that he has quite a way to go before he is the long-term answer to GB's punting problems. At least he has leg strength to work with.

[Patler]

I sure hope Ryan doesn't fall off like that. The leg strength is the big difference. Ryan's gross average will likely fall off a bit, but I'm hoping his gross average improves.

I assume you meant you hope his "net" average improves.
People overlook that. For example, if Ryan had been able to keep 2 or 3 of his touchbacks at around the 10 yard line instead, his gross average would be about a yard WORSE, but his net effectiveness would be better. That's what counts.

[gbgary]

i have no complaints with the punting or place kicking. both have done well considering their experience and the overall situation.

[FavreChild]

The punts need more hang time. However, again, this is really the least of our troubles. Could the punting be improved? Yep, you bet. But it is far down the list of reasons why we have only won two games.

There is plenty of reason to believe that Ryan can only get better, though. So we got that goin' for us...

[HarveyWallbangers]

The other thing to remember is that when looking at his gross average is that the Packers have gone up against Devin Hester, Reggie Bush, Eddie Drummond, Dexter Wynn, and Wes Welker. That's a pretty good group of returners. His net average was really affected by the Hester return. Without that he easily ranks in the top half in the league in net average.