Chris Gamble

[HarveyWallbangers]

He still isn't very good. He's better than Ahmad Carroll, but he's nothing more than adequate.
:D

I never argued that Carroll was better when we had this discussion in the past. Just argued that Gamble is vastly overrated by most fans.

This team report on the Panthers from FOX Sports:


Richard Marshall proved to be an outstanding cover man, but Chris Gamble struggled on the other side. Everyone keeps waiting for the talented Gamble to have a breakout season, but it just hasn't happened.

[MadtownPacker]

Lets not talk about Carroll.... :oops:

But Richard Marshall?? Fresno State, like so many other NFLers.

[wist43]

Haven't followed Gamble since his rookie year...

Regardless of how the two of them turned out, however, Gamble was clearly the better choice; and, GB's choosing Carroll just serves as another indictment against Green Bay's pathetic scouting dept.

TT had a good draft last year... it'll take more than one in a row to make me a believer.

I'd still fire Dorsey for the Carroll debacle... Carroll was Dorsey's pick. As near as I can tell, a crack addict would have better luck at recommending college talent by throwing a dart at a copy of a PFW rank sheet, than has Dorsey.

[Patler]

Let's see, the scouting department had successful drafts under Wolf, and seem to so far under TT. But not Sherman....Hmmmmm. Yup! Clearly Dorsey was to blame!

[Patler]

I'd still fire Dorsey for the Carroll debacle... Carroll was Dorsey's pick.

I heard that Sherman was the one who was sold on Carroll after he interviewed him. In fact, in the 2004 Packer Yearbook, Sherman went on and on about Carrolls athletic ability, and then is quoted as saying, "This is my guy."

[wist43]

Let's see, the scouting department had successful drafts under Wolf, and seem to so far under TT. But not Sherman....Hmmmmm. Yup! Clearly Dorsey was to blame!

Wolfe had his share of clunkers... we all, and I'm included in this, give him a pass b/c of the '95 draft, Brett Favre, Reggie White, Gilbert Brown, Santana Dotson, and Sean Jones.

All of those guys were FA's, and Wolfe did just enough in the draft to get the team over the top...

Truth be told, Green Bay's draft record under Wolfe isn't all that great - I know, blasphemer!!!! - under Sherman it was a joke, and under TT it is, so far, .500.

Carroll was Dorsey's guy... can't deny that; and, can't deny that Carroll was a huge bust.

[Patler]

Carroll was Dorsey's guy... can't deny that; and, can't deny that Carroll was a huge bust.

Yes, I can deny that, since Sherman specifically took credit, saying Carroll was his guy. In fact, the stories grew each year of Sherman's tenure that he listened to the scouts less and less, upto and including the infamous "walkout" by a couple when he traded up to draft B.J. Sander.

[wist43]

Carroll was Dorsey's guy... can't deny that; and, can't deny that Carroll was a huge bust.

Yes, I can deny that, since Sherman specifically took credit, saying Carroll was his guy. In fact, the stories grew each year of Sherman's tenure that he listened to the scouts less and less, upto and including the infamous "walkout" by a couple when he traded up to draft B.J. Sander.

Perhaps, if I find myself in the middle of a mind numbingly slow day at work, I'll do some research and find the articles talking about Dorsey's high recommendation of Carroll...

I want to say McGinn as the source; but, we're years removed... memory isn't what it used to be.

[Patler]

Truth be told, Green Bay's draft record under Wolfe isn't all that great - I know, blasphemer!!!! - under Sherman it was a joke, and under TT it is, so far, .500.
.

Once again, I'm not sure what you expect. A good draft might net 3 contributers after 4 years. That's about all. The majority of picks are around for a few years, then disappear.

[Patler]

Perhaps, if I find myself in the middle of a mind numbingly slow day at work, I'll do some research and find the articles talking about Dorsey's high recommendation of Carroll...

I want to say McGinn as the source; but, we're years removed... memory isn't what it used to be.

I would be interested in seeing what you find. What I recall was Dorsey just spouting the company line, about how much they like him, etc.

I have Sherman's quote right in front of me, and Sherman said, "This is my guy."

[esoxx]

Of course Carroll was Sherman's pick. He fell in love with players all the time and either reached for them or traded up for them. Carroll was a reach pick.

Sherman is/was a nice man and a decent coach. But it's clear he was a control freak once he also got the GM job. No way in hell is he picking a first rounder soley based on some underlings recommendation.

You look back at that '04 draft that is stunningly bad and it has Sherm's fingerprints and "methodiology" all over it. Who in the hell from a scouting dept would ever recommend trading up that often in one draft, including for a punter. That has all the earmarks of a GM in over his head with blinders on. Nothing more, nothing less.

[prsnfoto]

Most everone including the Pack had Carroll as a late second possibly third round pick it was Sherman who reached for him as he did Reynolds and Washington, at least Carroll had work ethic Sherman's M.O. was draft the lazy underachiever who had boatloads of untapped potential. Wist more than likely you read an article where Dorsey defended the pick which is standard practice, he 's not going to come straight out and call him a dumbass.

[Guiness]

I certainly don't remember Carrol being touted as a late second round. IIRC he was considered a first round draft. Jamal as well. He likely wouldn't have been there if we hadn't moved. That would've been good for us of course, but no one knew at the time...

[esoxx]

He was mostly projected as a 2nd rounder. If the Packers thought so highly of him they could have traded down and got some extra picks. But that wasn't the Sherman way.

Here's a mock from About Football that had him going #62 overall:

25. (57) Greg Jones, RB Florida State
Eddie George is on the downside of his career and Chris Brown was slowed by injury. The Titans need to add some depth at running back and someone to compete with Brown as George's successor.

26. (58) Philadelphia Eagles - Julius Jones, RB Notre Dame
Duce Staley is gone and it's questionable whether Correll Buckhalter can hold up as a workhorse back. Look for the Eagles to grab a running back on day one to share the load.

27. (59) Indianapolis Colts - Jeremy LeSeuer, CB Michigan
Walt Harris isn't getting any younger and David Macklin is a free agent, so look for the Colts to grab a corner on the first day.

28. (60) New Orleans Saints (from St. Louis) - Bob Sanders, S Iowa
Jay Bellamy is beyond his prime, Victor Green probably won't be back, and Mel Mitchell is coming off a knee injury that cost him the entire 2003 season.

29. (61) Kansas City Chiefs - Isaac Sopoaga, DT Hawaii
The addition of Lional Dalton provides depth, but the Chiefs need a legitimate starter to line up next to Ryan Sims, who faces almost constant double teams.

30. (62) Carolina Panthers - Ahmad Carroll, CB Arkansas
Reggie Howard left via free agency and Terry Cousin was released, so depth is an immediate issue. Signing Artrell Hawkins filled a void, but the Panthers need a corner that can line up on the outside, allowing Ricky Manning Jr. to move inside.

31. (63) New England Patriots - Nat Dorsey, OT Georgia Tech
Adrian Klemm is coming off a season-ending ankle injury, and might be released. Tom Ashworth is a capable backup, but will likely struggle as a full-time starter. The Patriots will probably use one of their first-day picks to solidify the position.

Here's another that ranked the CB's just before the draft:

Cornerback Rankings 4/17/04

Although there is no blue chip prospect at this position, it is reasonably deep throughout the draft. Expect a run on corners in the latter half of the first round. Also, with the NFL trend toward WRs 6'2" and taller, NFL people are increasingly looking for tall CBs who can match up, and these rankings reflect that somewhat. There are a few tall CBs available at all stages of the draft.

1. Dunta Robinson, South Carolina 5'11" 196
Draft Projection: top 15 picks
Note: ran a 4.31 recently

2. DeAngelo Hall, Virginia Tech 5'10" 205
Draft Projection: top 15 picks
Note: ran a 4.35 recently

3. Chris Gamble, Ohio State 6'1" 197
Draft Projection: top 20 picks

4.Shawntee Spencer, Pittsburgh 6'0" 175
Draft Projection: late first round

5. Ahmad Carroll, Arkansas 5'10" 194
Draft Projection: 2nd round
Note: ran a 4.35 recently

6. Derrick Strait, Oklahoma 5'11" 195
Draft Projection: late first or early second round

7. Jeremy LeSueur, Michigan 6'0" 199
Draft Projection: 2nd round

8. Will Poole, USC, 5'10" 190
Draft Projection: 2nd round

9. Keith Smith, McNeese State 6'0" 200
Draft Projection: 3rd round

10. Keiwan Ratliffe, 5'10" 195
Draft Projection: 3rd round

[Merlin]

I think picking Ahmad Carrol was a good pick. He had the talent, he just didn't have the right attitude to turn that into skill. Attitude is something that is hard to gauge in interviews I would think. I don't fault Sherman for that pick, maybe he shouldn't have taken him that high, who knows. Scouting players is the scout team's job (duh), so they must have seen something in him to make the recommendation to Sherman.

[wist43]

I think picking Ahmad Carrol was a good pick. He had the talent, he just didn't have the right attitude to turn that into skill. Attitude is something that is hard to gauge in interviews I would think. I don't fault Sherman for that pick, maybe he shouldn't have taken him that high, who knows. Scouting players is the scout team's job (duh), so they must have seen something in him to make the recommendation to Sherman.

Ahmad Carroll had great physical tools... but, was raw as a player. It was clearly going to take him time to develop. No way do you take a guy like that in the 1st round.

Most predraft sites and publications had him in the 3rd round - which is where I saw him going.

I'll still give it a try to find the article that talked about Dorsey's sell job on Sherman to pick Carroll... as I said, pretty sure it was a McGinn article.

Went back and looked at the JS site for April and May of 2004... interesting to go back and look at what everyone had to say back then. I hated that draft then, and hate it now... BJ Sander was the last straw for me - I started calling for Sherman's head after that moronic pick.