Big spending doesn't pay in free agency

[woodbuck27]

http://www.nfl.com/nflnetwork/story/10028966

Big spending doesn't pay in free agency


By Adam Schefter
NFL Analyst


(Feb. 28, 2007) --

Thanks to the millions of dollars that Redskins owner Daniel Snyder and Browns owner Randy Lerner spent at this time last year, NFL teams have been provided an easy-to-use handbook on how the free agent process works.

Or, more aptly, how it doesn't.

Neither Edgerrin James, Terrell Owens, Steve Hutchinson, Charles Woodson or LaVar Arrington -- just some of the headliners from last year's free-agent class -- helped their new teams to a single playoff win this past season.

And it goes beyond the free-agent class of 2006. More than a decade's worth of spending sprees -- many stemming from the mints in Washington and Cleveland -- has demonstrated one lesson as much as any other:

Free agency is intended to accessorize a roster, not customize it.


The Cards spent big on Edgerrin James but finished with the same 5-11 record as in 2005.

Indianapolis added a kicker, the most clutch kicker in postseason history, and Adam Vinatieri kicked Baltimore out of the playoffs and Indianapolis on to the AFC Championship Game.

But beyond Vinatieri, none of the other five previous Super Bowl champions -- Pittsburgh, New England and Tampa Bay -- used a newly-acquired free agent to make the difference in the standings or in a season.

In fact, New England's big free-agent splash last offseason was wide receiver Reche Caldwell, who, like his new team, dropped the ball when it looked like they were ready to move on to Miami and a game versus the Chicago Bears.

The last big-dollar, big-name, three-down free agent to catapult his new team to a world championship was tight end Shannon Sharpe, who provided leadership off the field and big plays on it. But more often than not, it's pay for lack of plays.

Now, sometimes there is free-agent gold. Just last offseason, the New Orleans Saints struck it when they signed quarterback Drew Brees. Philadelphia did the same with Jeff Garcia. But for every Brees and Garcia, there is a Scott Mitchell and a Drew Bledsoe.

And with the new free-agent signing period about to kick off, and with players such as cornerback Nate Clements and linebacker Adalius Thomas about to cash in, and with owners about to open their checkbooks in an even grander fashion than they've done in the past, they would be well advised to recognize how wasteful their spending habits often can be.

Unintentionally, millions already have been spent -- on research and lack of development.

[KYPack]

We have a nearby example, The Vikes, for this lesson.

Several of the Vikes recent free agent classes looked golden, but essentially, they haven't improved that team even a little.

A FA CAN help, I'd say Vinateri and Brees were some of the best FA's to come along recently. But you can't count on much from high priced FA.

NO totally revitalized their D with guys picked up off the scrap heap.

I'd like to see our guy improve dramatically in that area. NE did the same thing in the early part of the decade. TT needs to add vet FA's in the right spots, & I don't mean Earl Little, Matt O'Dwyer and those kinda bums either.

[Packnut]

Free Agency is nothing more than a tool and like any tool, it's as good or as bad as the person using it.

[retailguy]

Free Agency is nothing more than a tool and like any tool, it's as good or as bad as the person using it.

Then, perhaps, maybe someone should give Ted some lessons. :shock:

[Zool]

Maybe Sherman could give him the lessons?

[retailguy]

Maybe Sherman could give him the lessons?

Good One. But someone sure needs to. Sherman could certainly help with the PR issues, and learning to "speak the truth".

[MJZiggy]

I was thinking Snyder, but...well...

[Partial]

Free Agency is nothing more than a tool and like any tool, it's as good or as bad as the person using it.

Then, perhaps, maybe someone should give Ted some lessons. :shock:

I would reckon that Woodson and Pickett were excellent pickups.

[Packnut]

Free Agency is nothing more than a tool and like any tool, it's as good or as bad as the person using it.

Then, perhaps, maybe someone should give Ted some lessons. :shock:

I would reckon that Woodson and Pickett were excellent pickups.


I would agree. Let's also look at the flip side-Manuel was a bust. I don't think it's asking to much for him to fix the mistake. he has the money and guys like Grant and Hamlin are out there. Only an idiot would not agree that both would be a HUMONGOUS upgrade ove Manuel.

[MJZiggy]

And how do you know he hasn't been in contact with both?

[retailguy]

Free Agency is nothing more than a tool and like any tool, it's as good or as bad as the person using it.

Then, perhaps, maybe someone should give Ted some lessons. :shock:

I would reckon that Woodson and Pickett were excellent pickups.

Things are a bit different this year, P. Presumably the "core" is there and spots can be filled via Free Agency.

This is the same crap that happened in Seattle. I was there. I watched it. Seattle had some holes, but FEW holes, for about THREE years. There were few attempts to patch them.

I'm not looking to be the next Washington or the next Minnesota. That being said, there are a few holes that could be patched with relatively young players at fair prices.

Pointing to Woodson and Pickett is the same thing as pointing to Joe Johnson & Cleditus Hunt. You can't single out individual players. That's not reasonable in EITHER direction.

[retailguy]

And how do you know he hasn't been in contact with both?


And here is the issue. Do we deserve to know? I suppose not, but all this 007 secrecy is stupid. Just stupid.

[Packnut]

And how do you know he hasn't been in contact with both?

It's in MCGINN's latest column towards the bottom. He has'nt contacted Hamlin's agent.

[Partial]

Free Agency is nothing more than a tool and like any tool, it's as good or as bad as the person using it.

Then, perhaps, maybe someone should give Ted some lessons. :shock:

I would reckon that Woodson and Pickett were excellent pickups.

Things are a bit different this year, P. Presumably the "core" is there and spots can be filled via Free Agency.

This is the same crap that happened in Seattle. I was there. I watched it. Seattle had some holes, but FEW holes, for about THREE years. There were few attempts to patch them.

I'm not looking to be the next Washington or the next Minnesota. That being said, there are a few holes that could be patched with relatively young players at fair prices.

Pointing to Woodson and Pickett is the same thing as pointing to Joe Johnson & Cleditus Hunt. You can't single out individual players. That's not reasonable in EITHER direction.

Right, all I am saying is thus far his free agency track record as general manager is not too bad. 66% . Definitely above league average I would say.

Likewise, I don't blame Sherman for the Hunt and Johnson. You've gotta do what you've gotta do. If it wasn't Sherman, someone else would have made the same mistake. It just comes down to a player getting money and not knowing how to handle himself.

[MJZiggy]

What other GM in the league is announcing to the AP and local media every time they make a phone call? I mean it would be seriously nice if TT would call Mad up every time he did anything to have him post it for us, but doing that might just get us into some bidding wars...

[MJZiggy]

And how do you know he hasn't been in contact with both?

It's in MCGINN's latest column towards the bottom. He has'nt contacted Hamlin's agent.

When was that written? Got a link?

[retailguy]

What other GM in the league is announcing to the AP and local media every time they make a phone call? I mean it would be seriously nice if TT would call Mad up every time he did anything to have him post it for us, but doing that might just get us into some bidding wars...

You make my point. It's not the GM's that talk, it's the AGENTS. What agent has leaked info about the Packers....

Can't you infer from that, that there are few if any phone calls?, and further, if that's the case, LIMITED interest?

[MJZiggy]

They wouldn't announce it if the player wasn't willing to negotiate. Too easy for it to backfire and bite them in the ass regardless of the possibility of enticing another team.

[woodbuck27]

Free Agency is nothing more than a tool and like any tool, it's as good or as bad as the person using it.

Then, perhaps, maybe someone should give Ted some lessons. :shock:

I would hope and trust that Ted Thompson isn't all the show in regards to adopting policy and priority in terms of FA.

The early period of FA shouldn't necessarily be ignored or bypassed to only step up for the best price market. There are conditions that exist when real talent hits free agency and justifies serious consideration.

I am picking up on at least an undercurrent belief. That production on the Packers will be attained through a program of sustained and competent coaching and I have difficulty buying that. Certainly the proper fundamentles should have been instiled in a player by the time he enters the draft or more certainly has spent time in the NFL.Then it's just a matter if he's the right fit for that teams system.

I believe that real athletic talent offers it's own rewards to a teams objectives, and can't be necessarily or reasonably expected in a three or four season span of coaching a player.

The Packers need more natural playmakers.

The Packers are about to allow one in the fold to walk away, in the name of Ahman Green.

[retailguy]

The Packers need more natural playmakers.

The Packers are about to allow one in the fold to walk away, in the name of Ahman Green.


Don't worry Buck. They'll draft a guy in the 4th round who'll be ready to contribute in 2009. Gotta build through the draft, you know?

[retailguy]

They wouldn't announce it if the player wasn't willing to negotiate. Too easy for it to backfire and bite them in the ass regardless of the possibility of enticing another team.

True, but HOW OFTEN does this happen? C'mon Zig, all the excuses in the world won't wash this. He's either come in with ridiculous offers, or has little interest... and FEW phone calls.

[Partial]

The Packers need more natural playmakers.

The Packers are about to allow one in the fold to walk away, in the name of Ahman Green.


Don't worry Buck. They'll draft a guy in the 4th round who'll be ready to contribute in 2009. Gotta build through the draft, you know?

Why is everyone so down on Morency? He had WAY more big plays than Green last year, is clearly a skilled zone runner, and certainly seems to avoid the big hit.

[red]

Free Agency is nothing more than a tool and like any tool, it's as good or as bad as the person using it.

Then, perhaps, maybe someone should give Ted some lessons. :shock:

I would reckon that Woodson and Pickett were excellent pickups.

Things are a bit different this year, P. Presumably the "core" is there and spots can be filled via Free Agency.

This is the same crap that happened in Seattle. I was there. I watched it. Seattle had some holes, but FEW holes, for about THREE years. There were few attempts to patch them.

I'm not looking to be the next Washington or the next Minnesota. That being said, there are a few holes that could be patched with relatively young players at fair prices.

Pointing to Woodson and Pickett is the same thing as pointing to Joe Johnson & Cleditus Hunt. You can't single out individual players. That's not reasonable in EITHER direction.

YES YES YES

thats is the difference. you don't build through FA. you build through the draft and use FA to fill holes

absolutely

we are the youngest team in the nfl, and have a few solid base of young guys, with a few holes that need to be filled

those guys that we need are sitting right there, but we're not doing anything about it. and those guys will not break the bank. a TE is not going to get 50 million like thomas will, ken hamlin will got get a 20 million dollar bonus like clements. but these guys are in high demand, and will be gone soon

and if we don't get those guys, we risk having to settle for mark romans, or other david martins and david lee's to try and fill those hole

we don't need to sign 6 of the top 10 FA's. but a couple of the top 50 shouldn't be out of the question. when they would be a clear upgrade at that position. and not kill our cap for the next decade

[retailguy]

Why is everyone so down on Morency? He had WAY more big plays than Green last year, is clearly a skilled zone runner, and certainly seems to avoid the big hit.

This is really quite simple. AT MOST, the Packers are THREE players away from a prolific offense, a good TE, a WR to complement Driver and a RB that can be counted on.

Could Morency make it? Sure. Will he? WHO KNOWS. For kicks, lets just say that we get a TE that can catch, and a second receiver threat, but lose green and need to rely on Morency. Do you really want to risk him looking like Lamont Jordan over a couple of million dollars? WHY RISK THAT?

It's STUPID. Ahman Green is not the next coming of Christ, but he's a "more sure bet" than Morency at a REASONABLE rate.

As far as the contract, look at Fred Taylor. This is NOT THAT HARD Partial.

[wist43]

Lest anyone forget the greatest FA signing of all time, IMO, Reggie White.

As for Morency, I'm not down on him; however, he is what he is, a third down back. He lacks the size and physicality to hold up as an every down back.

Letting Green walk, if he does leave, will definitely hurt the offense; whether or not TT drafts Lynch. Green is an extremely valuable player, IMO.

[retailguy]

YES YES YES

thats is the difference. you don't build through FA. you build through the draft and use FA to fill holes

absolutely




:shock: :shock: Red AGREES with me? Next thing you know, SOV will be drinking the kool-aid.

Batten down the hatches, we're about to crash into the SUN.... :wink:

[Partial]

Why is everyone so down on Morency? He had WAY more big plays than Green last year, is clearly a skilled zone runner, and certainly seems to avoid the big hit.

This is really quite simple. AT MOST, the Packers are THREE players away from a prolific offense, a good TE, a WR to complement Driver and a RB that can be counted on.

Could Morency make it? Sure. Will he? WHO KNOWS. For kicks, lets just say that we get a TE that can catch, and a second receiver threat, but lose green and need to rely on Morency. Do you really want to risk him looking like Lamont Jordan over a couple of million dollars? WHY RISK THAT?

It's STUPID. Ahman Green is not the next coming of Christ, but he's a "more sure bet" than Morency at a REASONABLE rate.

As far as the contract, look at Fred Taylor. This is NOT THAT HARD Partial.

Right, I agree. My guess is Ahman turned that contract down, though.

[red]

YES YES YES

thats is the difference. you don't build through FA. you build through the draft and use FA to fill holes

absolutely




:shock: :shock: Red AGREES with me? Next thing you know, SOV will be drinking the kool-aid.

Batten down the hatches, we're about to crash into the SUN.... :wink:

yeah, its been a weird day for me

first i find myself agreeing with wist, and now you

i need a nap

[GBRulz]

Who is in charge of the cap? TT or Andrew Brandt? According to his bio, it seems like Brandt is in charge of the cap. Just wondering.

http://www.packers.com/team/staff/brandt_andrew/

[woodbuck27]

Who is in charge of the cap? TT or Andrew Brandt? According to his bio, it seems like Brandt is in charge of the cap. Just wondering.

http://www.packers.com/team/staff/brandt_andrew/

Here is some support for that:

“We’re having conversations,” Thompson said of team negotiator Andrew Brandt and Green’s agent, “and again you never know when that last conversation takes place that you have a deal. But we’re trying, and we’ve made clear all along we’d like to have him back.”

[Brohm]

I hope they get Ahman back and get it done soon. Ahman and Morency were a good 1:2 punch last year.

As far as size is concerned, Ahman is 6'0" and 218.
Morency is listed as 5'9" and 212.

Thats actually pretty good height to weight ratio for Morency. It's not like he is slight of build. Very compact runner. Hopefully he can stay healthy a be more productive in the offense. Combined with AG, its an excellent rotation. Just add in a fresh pair of legs via the draft....

Get it done! :shock:

[HarveyWallbangers]

It's in MCGINN's latest column towards the bottom. He has'nt contacted Hamlin's agent.

Where was this? His latest articles don't mention anything about whether Thompson has contacted Hamlin's agent or not. There was a Press Gazette article that mentioned other players the Packers had not contacted, but Hamlin wasn't included in the list.

[HarveyWallbangers]

It's in MCGINN's latest column towards the bottom. He has'nt contacted Hamlin's agent.

When was that written? Got a link?

You beat me to it.
:D

[HarveyWallbangers]

As for Morency, I'm not down on him; however, he is what he is, a third down back. He lacks the size and physicality to hold up as an every down back.

I think it's a little early to pigeon-hole Morency as only a third down back. He looked pretty good when he played. He got 99 yards and 101 yards in the two games that he got more than 10 carries. I don't think you can assume he can take a whole load, but I don't think it's a conclusion that can be made yet.

[Partial]

As for Morency, I'm not down on him; however, he is what he is, a third down back. He lacks the size and physicality to hold up as an every down back.

I think it's a little early to pigeon-hole Morency as only a third down back. He looked pretty good when he played. He got 99 yards and 101 yards in the two games that he got more than 10 carries. I don't think you can assume he can take a whole load, but I don't think it's a conclusion that can be made yet.

I agree, I think at the very least he'd be servicable. I saw flashes where he looked very good last year, but who knows if he can hold up to the pounding. I will say that he looks like he has an ability to avoid the big hit.

[pbmax]

I'm not picking on wist, because I'm sure he knows this, but Reggie White would have never made it to FA without a court order and a CBA that prevented the Eagles from Franchise Tagging him.

He won his anti-trust court battle, the CBA listed him (and others) as an exception, and the Eagles lost a court battle to apply the tag.

Players of his caliber and worth do not make it to FA except in rare cases.

And everyone in the first week is overpaid. Too much cash and too few players.

Daniel Graham just got $10 mil guaranteed (inital report) to block. This is the TE you think will put the offense over the top?

The Packers are at least a year and another good draft away from being a true playoff team. Buying the most expensive FAs now is foolish.

Most overnight successes in the NFL have actually been drafting in the top 10 for years before they break out, rack up some wins and get noticed.


Lest anyone forget the greatest FA signing of all time, IMO, Reggie White.

[pbmax]

Hamlin not called, 12th paragraph by my count:

http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=572372

Link for Hamlin not contacted reference. Its unattributed, and it wouldn't be Thompson, so unsure where Bob got the tip.

[BallHawk]

Who is in charge of the cap? TT or Andrew Brandt? According to his bio, it seems like Brandt is in charge of the cap. Just wondering.

http://www.packers.com/team/staff/brandt_andrew/

Here is some support for that:

“We’re having conversations,” Thompson said of team negotiator Andrew Brandt and Green’s agent, “and again you never know when that last conversation takes place that you have a deal. But we’re trying, and we’ve made clear all along we’d like to have him back.”

Brandt does all the dirty work while TT sits in his leather recliner, browsing through packerrats.com, using the fans' input to decide what to do next. :D

[wist43]

I'm not picking on wist, because I'm sure he knows this, but Reggie White would have never made it to FA without a court order and a CBA that prevented the Eagles from Franchise Tagging him.

He won his anti-trust court battle, the CBA listed him (and others) as an exception, and the Eagles lost a court battle to apply the tag.

Players of his caliber and worth do not make it to FA except in rare cases.

And everyone in the first week is overpaid. Too much cash and too few players.

Daniel Graham just got $10 mil guaranteed (inital report) to block. This is the TE you think will put the offense over the top?

The Packers are at least a year and another good draft away from being a true playoff team. Buying the most expensive FAs now is foolish.

Most overnight successes in the NFL have actually been drafting in the top 10 for years before they break out, rack up some wins and get noticed.


Lest anyone forget the greatest FA signing of all time, IMO, Reggie White.

He was a freakin FA... who cares how he got there.

[woodbuck27]

Who is in charge of the cap? TT or Andrew Brandt? According to his bio, it seems like Brandt is in charge of the cap. Just wondering.

http://www.packers.com/team/staff/brandt_andrew/

Here is some support for that:

“We’re having conversations,” Thompson said of team negotiator Andrew Brandt and Green’s agent, “and again you never know when that last conversation takes place that you have a deal. But we’re trying, and we’ve made clear all along we’d like to have him back.”

Brandt does all the dirty work while TT sits in his leather recliner, browsing through packerrats.com, using the fans' input to decide what to do next. :D

If that's not actually the case, it's indeed solid advice BallHawk. :)

[HarveyWallbangers]

Hamlin not called, 12th paragraph by my count:

http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=572372

Link for Hamlin not contacted reference. Its unattributed, and it wouldn't be Thompson, so unsure where Bob got the tip.

Cool! I read the article, and didn't even notice. I'm a little disapointed in that. Hamlin is a guy I would like. It doesn't sound like there's a lot of movement with Hamlin. Maybe Thompson feels he can wait on him. I know some teams are concerned with his injury long-term.

[Bretsky]

Hamlin not called, 12th paragraph by my count:

http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=572372

Link for Hamlin not contacted reference. Its unattributed, and it wouldn't be Thompson, so unsure where Bob got the tip.

Cool! I read the article, and didn't even notice. I'm a little disapointed in that. Hamlin is a guy I would like. It doesn't sound like there's a lot of movement with Hamlin. Maybe Thompson feels he can wait on him. I know some teams are concerned with his injury long-term.

THANKS

I was thinking you guys were drunk or something; I knew I read that about Hamlin too. Just could not remember where.

At least TT is not on vacation :lol: