Griffith signs with Raiders

[justanotherpackfan]

http://www.nfl.com/nflnetwork/story/10033511

The Raiders reached agreement Friday evening with Atlanta 's free-agent fullback Justin Griffith on a three-year, $3.8 million contract, completing a whirlwind day of activity in Oakland. The deal is contingent upon Griffith passing his physical.

Another one bites the dust.

[Farley Face]

http://www.nfl.com/nflnetwork/story/10033511

The Raiders reached agreement Friday evening with Atlanta 's free-agent fullback Justin Griffith on a three-year, $3.8 million contract, completing a whirlwind day of activity in Oakland. The deal is contingent upon Griffith passing his physical.

Another one bites the dust.

Cheaper than I would have thought.

[HarveyWallbangers]

3y/$3.8M and we couldn't get the dude? It would be interesting to see what the Packers offered. I'm getting really worried.

[justanotherpackfan]

Cheaper than I would have thought.
Which makes it that much worse.... :(

[Freak Out]

WTF? I thought we were close to signing this guy and the next second Granny has the fucker under contract! Who do we have that can play FB at this time? Only Miree if I remember correctly. Well....I'm sure Luchey or whoever that fat fuck was is still out there waiting for a call.

[Farley Face]

Cheaper than I would have thought.
Which makes it that much worse.... :(

When Ovie Mughelli signed for 3 mil a year I figured this kid had his market set at about 2 mil a year.

[Freak Out]

Cheaper than I would have thought.
Which makes it that much worse.... :(

When Ovie Mughelli signed for 3 mil a year I figured this kid had his market set at about 2 mil a year.

Ovie Mughelli? Are you kidding me....what the heck kind of a name is Ovie?

[Farley Face]

Cheaper than I would have thought.
Which makes it that much worse.... :(

When Ovie Mughelli signed for 3 mil a year I figured this kid had his market set at about 2 mil a year.

Ovie Mughelli? Are you kidding me....what the heck kind of a name is Ovie?

Better than Lovie.

[MJZiggy]

And far better than Terdell.

[Farley Face]

And far better than Terdell.

Or who can forget Harry Colon. Or Dave Butz.

[red]

whoa look at that deal. thats insane

i'm sure glad we didn't piss away all that money to get a starting FB which we need

that would have ment we couldn't draft any players this year. and clearly would have ruined our cap for years to come

[Bretsky]

whoa look at that deal. thats insane

i'm sure glad we didn't piss away all that money to get a starting FB which we need

that would have ment we couldn't draft any players this year. and clearly would have ruined our cap for years to come



Yes, we're going to have plenty of roster spots open come draft day. If this deal is accurate the clones saying everybody is grossly overpaid surely cannot say that about this deal.

:laugh: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang:

[red]

stupid computer

DP

[gureski]

Before we all count to three and jump at the same time..... let's actually hold on til we find out how much Thompson offerred the guy. Every time a player goes somewhere else it's not because the money was better. Usually but not always. Vinatieri went to Indy because he wanted to win, not because the Packers didn't make a high offer. Let's just wait and see what comes out here. Mabye the Packers made a nice pitch but Griffith decided that he'd rather play in Oakland if the money is close?

[red]

so, you're saying he went to oakland because he wants to win?

[red]

look at this crap

from kffl

Packers | Team talking with Griffith
Fri, 9 Mar 2007 12:41:48 -0800

Pete Dougherty, of the Green Bay Press-Gazette, reports the Green Bay Packers are believed to be in contract negotiations with unrestricted free-agent FB Justin Griffith (Falcons). The negotiations do not seem urgent.

what the hell is that? a few hours later he signs with oakland. either tt just brought him in to make it look like he's doing something to keep his job, or he's doing it half assed

[MJZiggy]

Green Bay current temperature: 39 feels like 33 (actually kinda warm)
Oakland current temperature: 59 feels like 59.

I wonder if this has anything to do with it. That and the 2 feet of snow in GB? I'm just wondering.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Yeah, I'm sure that is it. We have no shot at signing FAs because Green Bay is just too damned cold.

[HarveyWallbangers]

If that's the case, we might as well fold the franchise and move it to LA.

[gureski]

Some guys prefer big cities and warm weather. IF the money was the same, maybe he chose Oakland for those reasons or maybe there will be some family connections that pop up. Who knows? That's my point. Before we form a mob and light torches with the intent of breaking down Thompson's door, let's just find out what happened first.

[TPF]

If that's the case, we might as well fold the franchise and move it to LA.

Perhaps Mexico City?

[MJZiggy]

Albuquerque.

[gureski]

Yeah, I'm sure that is it. We have no shot at signing FAs because Green Bay is just too damned cold.

Keith Jackson, a pro-bowl TE who was a proven playmaker was traded to G.B. and nearly retired because he didn't want to play/live in cold weather. I believe he held out 6 months (counting pre-season) before close friends like Reggie White convinced him to show up and play. The guy nearly retired rather then play in the cold and this was on a team where he had friends!

Let's keep things in perspective here. Some players hate the cold. Griffith just came from HOTlanta.

[Rastak]

Albuquerque.


Maybe Hydrobad?

[Bretsky]

Yeah, I'm sure that is it. We have no shot at signing FAs because Green Bay is just too damned cold.

Keith Jackson, a pro-bowl TE who was a proven playmaker was traded to G.B. and nearly retired because he didn't want to play/live in cold weather.

Let's keep things in perspective here. Some players hate the cold. Griffith just came from HOTlanta.


If he had no interest, why would he visit.

Not like he'd be able to use TT to drive up his price with other teams :wink:

[MJZiggy]

That would make for interesting tailgating! :o

[Bub]

A GM also has to sell the team and city. GB has plenty to offer.

This signing pissed me off.

[gureski]

Yeah, I'm sure that is it. We have no shot at signing FAs because Green Bay is just too damned cold.

Keith Jackson, a pro-bowl TE who was a proven playmaker was traded to G.B. and nearly retired because he didn't want to play/live in cold weather.

Let's keep things in perspective here. Some players hate the cold. Griffith just came from HOTlanta.


If he had no interest, why would he visit.

Not like he'd be able to use TT to drive up his price with other teams :wink:

Like Ziggy said, maybe the fact there is one hell of a lot of snow hanging around in March spooked him. It could've had an effect on him. He wouldn't be the first to be spooked by the cold weather. Agents drive the bus at this time of year in making contacts and setting up visits. I just want more info before I get as fired up as some people are getting over a 34 year old FB.

None of you know that Thompson didn't make one hell of a push to sign the guy! It's announced he signed with Oakland and suddenly people are inferring that Thompson didn't even try and that it was all a P.R. smokescreen! Let's get ahold of ourselves....

[Bretsky]

Yeah, I'm sure that is it. We have no shot at signing FAs because Green Bay is just too damned cold.

Keith Jackson, a pro-bowl TE who was a proven playmaker was traded to G.B. and nearly retired because he didn't want to play/live in cold weather.

Let's keep things in perspective here. Some players hate the cold. Griffith just came from HOTlanta.


If he had no interest, why would he visit.

Not like he'd be able to use TT to drive up his price with other teams :wink:

Like Ziggy said, maybe the fact there is one hell of a lot of snow hanging around in March spooked him. It could've had an effect on him. He wouldn't be the first to be spooked by the cold weather. Agents drive the bus at this time of year in making contacts and setting up visits. I just want more info before I get as fired up as some people are getting over a 34 year old FB.

None of you know that Thompson didn't make one hell of a push to sign the guy! It's announced he signed with Oakland and suddenly people are inferring that Thompson didn't even try and that it was all a P.R. smokescreen! Let's get ahold of ourselves....


It's not Griffith we're fed up with; it's the entire last week

[Farley Face]

Some guys prefer big cities and warm weather. IF the money was the same, maybe he chose Oakland for those reasons or maybe there will be some family connections that pop up. Who knows? That's my point. Before we form a mob and light torches with the intent of breaking down Thompson's door, let's just find out what happened first.

OK, I'll be patient. But I thought he was worth 1.5-2 mil a year. Seems we signed Luchey for more cash than this kid got. That was 3 or so years ago. Interesting.

[BF4MVP]

Luchey's deal was 6 years 6 mil.

I guess 1.2M a year was too expensive for TT to pay one of the best FBs in the league and the perfect fit for the ZBS :roll:

[BooHoo]

Possibly T2 didn't think he would help the team.

[Farley Face]

Possibly T2 didn't think he would help the team.

Then why bother bringing him in for a look?

[retailguy]

Luchey's deal was 6 years 6 mil.

I guess 1.2M a year was too expensive for TT to pay one of the best FBs in the league and the perfect fit for the ZBS :roll:


I've said this before and I'll say it again. We MUST build through the draft. ALL free agents are OVERPRICED. We will win again - in 2009.

[gbpackfan]

Ted Thompson has not done his job this offseason. Failing to sign Griffith is criminal. We have taken several steps back this offseason and if there isn't some sort of a miracle, the Packers will be a sub .500 team. If that happens, Thompson should be fired. You can't ALWAYS be building for a future that never comes. In the NFL, you need to win. You should try and win EVERY YEAR. Ted Thompson's records speak for themselves. 4-12 and 8-8. Anything under 10-6 next year and I would consider him to be a failure.

[pittstang5]

This signing or rather lack there of as me disturbed, but I just thought of something. Maybe the Pack is looking to make Herron a fullback.

I remember reading something last year to the fact that Herron could play fullback. With Hendo gone and the fact that Herron isn't anything better than a #3 RB, they have him focus on being a FB. That leaves Pope, Morency, Beach and probably a draft pick to compete for the RB spots.

Thin?

[PackerPro42]

I wouldn't consider him a failure. He came into a team that was crushed by stupid cap casualties and he came out and reduce the players salary and still has picked up some good players through the draft and FA. If we even finish 9-7 next year I'll be happy because it shows that the young team we have is gelling together and making some improvment towards becoming a better team. I don't think that you give up on TT just yet.

[retailguy]

if there isn't some sort of a miracle, the Packers will be a sub .500 team.

Have you seen the schedule for next season? It's tough.

[esoxx]

Let the rationalyzing begin:

Too cold

Maybe not enough money

Too windy

Was upset that the Georgia Pacific paper mill put that much smoke into the atmosphere

Herron could be a FB

Too many overweight people seen near the stadium

Didn't realize Green Bay was that close to Canada

Probably wasn't a good fit anyhow, even though he came from ZBS

Turned off that a Packer employee got him a Mr Pibb when he requested a Dr Pepper

[gureski]

This thread alone represents everything I'm against right now. A 34 year old FB (that was just in negotiations with G.B.) signs with Oakland and before anyone knows a single fact about how things went down people are lining up and screaming for Ted Thompson's head! It's ridiculous.

The following are real quotes that I pulled just from this one thread!

I'm getting really worried.

WTF? I thought we were close to signing this guy and the next second Granny has the fucker under contract! Who do we have that can play FB at this time? Only Miree if I remember correctly. Well....I'm sure Luchey or whoever that fat fuck was is still out there waiting for a call.

whoa look at that deal. thats insane
i'm sure glad we didn't piss away all that money to get a starting FB which we need
that would have ment we couldn't draft any players this year. and clearly would have ruined our cap for years to come

Yes, we're going to have plenty of roster spots open come draft day. If this deal is accurate the clones saying everybody is grossly overpaid surely cannot say that about this deal.

so, you're saying he went to oakland because he wants to win?

Yeah, I'm sure that is it. We have no shot at signing FAs because Green Bay is just too damned cold.

If that's the case, we might as well fold the franchise and move it to LA.

guess 1.2M a year was too expensive for TT to pay one of the best FBs in the league and the perfect fit for the ZBS

Ted Thompson has not done his job this offseason. Failing to sign Griffith is criminal. We have taken several steps back this offseason and if there isn't some sort of a miracle, the Packers will be a sub .500 team. If that happens, Thompson should be fired.

Let the rationalyzing begin:

Too cold

Maybe not enough money

Too windy

Was upset that the Georgia Pacific paper mill put that much smoke into the atmosphere

Herron could be a FB

Too many overweight people seen near the stadium

Didn't realize Green Bay was that close to Canada

Probably wasn't a good fit anyhow, even though he came from ZBS

Turned off that a Packer employee got him a Mr Pibb when he requested a Dr Pepper

end quotes

So, let me get this straight.... A 34 year old FB who was dumped by his old team, has never been to a pro-bowl, and whom I've never heard mentioned as one of the best FB's in the game is sending people into a frothing panic because he signed with Oakland! Overnight Griffith has become a must-have piece of G.B.'s puzzle? Suddenly, because Griffith signed with Oakland and without ever knowing what the facts surrounding that are, Thompson should be fired? It's criminal? How many of you even knew who the guy was before this year's free agency started?

The sarcasm and pessimism right now is unbelievable! Is anyone thinking clearly anymore? Everyday here it's a new panic over some 2nd or 3d tier player that would've merely filled a role for the Packers! Never mind that there are 50 more just like the guy out there waiting to be signed.....WE MISSED THIS ONE!!!! These aren't pieces to championship teams we're talking about! Guys like Randy McMichael are NOT the key to the Packers winning the North again! I don't get the rush to judgement on all these role players. It's like some of you are just looking for reasons to say negative things.

If you have something negative to say then I'm all for it. You wont find me hanging around the Romer Room singing Koombaya with everyone but for crying out loud at least have some real factual, hard hitting common sense behind what you're getting pissed about! Right now, people are just panicing and it's getting irritating because it lacks logic.

If you think this 34 year old FB was one of the keys to this year's season turning out then be mad. If not, don't act outraged just to do it. It's getting old.

[red]

This thread alone represents everything I'm against right now. A 34 year old FB (that was just in negotiations with G.B.) signs with Oakland and before anyone knows a single fact about how things went down people are lining up and screaming for Ted Thompson's head! It's ridiculous.

The following are real quotes that I pulled just from this one thread!

I'm getting really worried.

WTF? I thought we were close to signing this guy and the next second Granny has the fucker under contract! Who do we have that can play FB at this time? Only Miree if I remember correctly. Well....I'm sure Luchey or whoever that fat fuck was is still out there waiting for a call.

whoa look at that deal. thats insane
i'm sure glad we didn't piss away all that money to get a starting FB which we need
that would have ment we couldn't draft any players this year. and clearly would have ruined our cap for years to come

Yes, we're going to have plenty of roster spots open come draft day. If this deal is accurate the clones saying everybody is grossly overpaid surely cannot say that about this deal.

so, you're saying he went to oakland because he wants to win?

Yeah, I'm sure that is it. We have no shot at signing FAs because Green Bay is just too damned cold.

If that's the case, we might as well fold the franchise and move it to LA.

guess 1.2M a year was too expensive for TT to pay one of the best FBs in the league and the perfect fit for the ZBS

Ted Thompson has not done his job this offseason. Failing to sign Griffith is criminal. We have taken several steps back this offseason and if there isn't some sort of a miracle, the Packers will be a sub .500 team. If that happens, Thompson should be fired.

Let the rationalyzing begin:

Too cold

Maybe not enough money

Too windy

Was upset that the Georgia Pacific paper mill put that much smoke into the atmosphere

Herron could be a FB

Too many overweight people seen near the stadium

Didn't realize Green Bay was that close to Canada

Probably wasn't a good fit anyhow, even though he came from ZBS

Turned off that a Packer employee got him a Mr Pibb when he requested a Dr Pepper

end quotes

So, let me get this straight.... A 34 year old FB who was dumped by his old team, has never been to a pro-bowl, and whom I've never heard mentioned as one of the best FB's in the game is sending people into a frothing panic because he signed with Oakland! Overnight Griffith has become a must-have piece of G.B.'s puzzle? Suddenly, because Griffith signed with Oakland and without ever knowing what the facts surrounding that are, Thompson should be fired? It's criminal? How many of you even knew who the guy was before this year's free agency started?

The sarcasm and pessimism right now is unbelievable! Is anyone thinking clearly anymore? Everyday here it's a new panic over some 2nd or 3d tier player that would've merely filled a role for the Packers! Never mind that there are 50 more just like the guy out there waiting to be signed.....WE MISSED THIS ONE!!!! These aren't pieces to championship teams we're talking about! Guys like Randy McMichael are NOT the key to the Packers winning the North again! I don't get the rush to judgement on all these role players. It's like some of you are just looking for reasons to say negative things.

If you have something negative to say then I'm all for it. You wont find me hanging around the Romer Room singing Koombaya with everyone but for crying out loud at least have some real factual, hard hitting common sense behind what you're getting pissed about! Right now, people are just panicing and it's getting irritating because it lacks logic.

If you think this 34 year old FB was one of the keys to this year's season turning out then be mad. If not, don't act outraged just to do it. It's getting old.

where the hell do you get 34 from? you don't even have a f'ing clue who we're talking about

he's 25

[esoxx]

You seem to be the one who is pissed here. :roll:

[gureski]

I stand corrected in the age department but my overall point still stands. People are just frothing with negativity right now and every day its' a different player. I can see why some people would be pissed about the FB position and why they'd feel it's key but I haven't actually heard anyone say that and say why they feel it was such a key signing. It's just one big pile-on party right now and it's been going on for days every time a guy gets signed. It's getting old.

[Charles Woodson]

This thread alone represents everything I'm against right now. A 34 year old FB (that was just in negotiations with G.B.) signs with Oakland and before anyone knows a single fact about how things went down people are lining up and screaming for Ted Thompson's head! It's ridiculous.

The following are real quotes that I pulled just from this one thread!

I'm getting really worried.

WTF? I thought we were close to signing this guy and the next second Granny has the fucker under contract! Who do we have that can play FB at this time? Only Miree if I remember correctly. Well....I'm sure Luchey or whoever that fat fuck was is still out there waiting for a call.

whoa look at that deal. thats insane
i'm sure glad we didn't piss away all that money to get a starting FB which

we need
that would have ment we couldn't draft any players this year. and clearly would have ruined our cap for years to come

Yes, we're going to have plenty of roster spots open come draft day. If this deal is accurate the clones saying everybody is grossly overpaid surely cannot say that about this deal.

so, you're saying he went to oakland because he wants to win?

Yeah, I'm sure that is it. We have no shot at signing FAs because Green Bay is just too damned cold.

If that's the case, we might as well fold the franchise and move it to LA.

guess 1.2M a year was too expensive for TT to pay one of the best FBs in the league and the perfect fit for the ZBS

Ted Thompson has not done his job this offseason. Failing to sign Griffith is criminal. We have taken several steps back this offseason and if there isn't some sort of a miracle, the Packers will be a sub .500 team. If that happens, Thompson should be fired.

Let the rationalyzing begin:

Too cold

Maybe not enough money

Too windy

Was upset that the Georgia Pacific paper mill put that much smoke into the atmosphere

Herron could be a FB

Too many overweight people seen near the stadium

Didn't realize Green Bay was that close to Canada

Probably wasn't a good fit anyhow, even though he came from ZBS

Turned off that a Packer employee got him a Mr Pibb when he requested a Dr Pepper

end quotes

So, let me get this straight.... A 34 year old FB who was dumped by his old team, has never been to a pro-bowl, and whom I've never heard mentioned as one of the best FB's in the game is sending people into a frothing panic because he signed with Oakland! Overnight Griffith has become a must-have piece of G.B.'s puzzle? Suddenly, because Griffith signed with Oakland and without ever knowing what the facts surrounding that are, Thompson should be fired? It's criminal? How many of you even knew who the guy was before this year's free agency started?

The sarcasm and pessimism right now is unbelievable! Is anyone thinking clearly anymore? Everyday here it's a new panic over some 2nd or 3d tier player that would've merely filled a role for the Packers! Never mind that there are 50 more just like the guy out there waiting to be signed.....WE MISSED THIS ONE!!!! These aren't pieces to championship teams we're talking about! Guys like Randy McMichael are NOT the key to the Packers winning the North again! I don't get the rush to judgement on all these role players. It's like some of you are just looking for reasons to say negative things.

If you have something negative to say then I'm all for it. You wont find me hanging around the Romer Room singing Koombaya with everyone but for crying out loud at least have some real factual, hard hitting common sense behind what you're getting pissed about! Right now, people are just panicing and it's getting irritating because it lacks logic.

If you think this 34 year old FB was one of the keys to this year's season turning out then be mad. If not, don't act outraged just to do it. It's getting old.

where the hell do you get 34 from?

he's 25

hmm i guess it would help if you got his age right. 9 effing years is alot.




Rushing Stats
YEAR TEAM G ATT YDS AVG LNG TD FD FUM LOST
2003 ATL 16 38 168 4.4 15 0 12 0 0
2004 ATL 12 9 39 4.3 10 0 2 0 0
2005 ATL 16 15 65 4.3 19 0 3 0 0
2006 ATL 16 19 106 5.6 21 1 2 2 1
Career 60 81 378 4.7 21 1 19 2 1

Receiving Stats
YEAR TEAM G REC YDS AVG LNG TD FD FUM LOST
2003 ATL 16 21 122 5.8 24 2 6 0 0
2004 ATL 12 22 220 10.0 62 1 11 0 0
2005 ATL 16 21 111 5.3 17 3 7 1 1
2006 ATL 16 23 168 7.3 16 3 12 1 0
Career 60 87 621 7.1 62 9 36 2 1


Those are his stats. he would have helped out in the passing game, and with the limited carries he got, he didnt do to bad.

[Bretsky]

I stand corrected in the age department but my overall point still stands. People are just frothing with negativity right now and every day its' a different player. I can see why some people would be pissed about the FB position and why they'd feel it's key but I haven't actually heard anyone say that and say why they feel it was such a key signing. It's just one big pile-on party right now and it's been going on for days every time a guy gets signed. It's getting old.


one thing stood out to me; I've heard many call him one of the better blocking FB's in the NFL and one that fits the ZBS perfectly.

[gureski]

I am getting pissed. Nobody knows how Griffith ended up with Oakland yet everyone is furious and blaming Thompson to the point that some are calling for him to be fired! How does that makes sense?

Over the past week I've had to listen to guys throw tantrums because the Packers didn't get Randy McMichael and Eric Johnson and R.Droughns, A.Green, T.Henry, and many more I've forgotten because it's all blended together! THompson is getting criticised for not going after Stallworth and Moss and people are bringing up J.Walker and I'm just spent reading the same thing over and over and over! Give me something new! I know there are some that truly felt Griffith was a key to this rebuilding but not all fans that are chirping in here did. Some are just taking advantage of this to spew negativity. I mean, we don't know how this happened yet. Maybe Thompson tried. For some, they don't need details. The signing serves their purpose. It allows them to spew.

[retailguy]

I stand corrected in the age department but my overall point still stands. People are just frothing with negativity right now and every day its' a different player. I can see why some people would be pissed about the FB position and why they'd feel it's key but I haven't actually heard anyone say that and say why they feel it was such a key signing. It's just one big pile-on party right now and it's been going on for days every time a guy gets signed. It's getting old.

What's getting old is the pathological blind defenses of Ted's offseason. Your lines are the ones getting old. This team is not improving. AT ALL.

THERE IS ZERO REASON for this. Unless you're on the 2009 plan.

[gureski]

You guys can lay off the age thing. It was a mistake, not an indication that I'm clueless. It was Atlanta's other FB from last year whose age I was thinking of. His name is Fred McCrary and you can check the age if you don't believe me. McCrary was born in 72.

Now, can anyone follow up on the actual merit of my post or shall we continue with the age side-show that I"ve already admitted was my mistake?

[gureski]

I stand corrected in the age department but my overall point still stands. People are just frothing with negativity right now and every day its' a different player. I can see why some people would be pissed about the FB position and why they'd feel it's key but I haven't actually heard anyone say that and say why they feel it was such a key signing. It's just one big pile-on party right now and it's been going on for days every time a guy gets signed. It's getting old.

What's getting old is the pathological blind defenses of Ted's offseason. Your lines are the ones getting old. This team is not improving. AT ALL.

THERE IS ZERO REASON for this. Unless you're on the 2009 plan.

You are exactly what I'm ripe for a fight with. Tell me....please tell me what we've missed that is so important to the success of this coming season and our overall rebuilding process? Tell me what Thompson missed on that can't be had in the way of another player that is currently out there in free agency or in the draft!

Give me names and common sense based reasoning as to why the players you feel we missed on were the thing this team needed!

The fact is that you are soured on Thompson. It doesn't matter what he does or doesn't do. You're just using the fact that everyone is dying to see a signing to spew your negativity. A month from now, after many fans have settled down and have gotten behind what is going to happen, you'll be all alone but right now.....it's your time....right?

[red]

lets see, why are people upset about not getting this guy

we need a FB, and we run the ZBS

he is a FB, and a pretty good one

he's young

and he already knows the ZBS, and has played in it

and he didn't cost a ton of money

if there was one guy in the open market this year that would have been a perfect signing for this team, this would have been the guy

tt brought him in, took his time, jerked the guy around and watched him walk out and sign with another team

[retailguy]

I'll be all alone until week 4 when the rest of the bandwagon jumpers realize there is no one to run the ball.

Morency was good, WHEN AND ONLY WHEN, the line performed well. He SUCKED when the line sucked. That's the difference between him and Green.

The line has a ways to go and will face some SERIOUS defenses next season. Have you bothered to look at the schedule? I have and it's TOUGH.

Last season we beat ONE team with a winning record. Next season it's looking like ZERO.

As to fighting - nope not tonight. Your brand of irrationality is more than I can handle tonight.

Why don't you curl up with your Ted Thompson rookie card and head off to bed. Tomorrow is another day...

[gureski]

tt brought him in, tood his time, jerked the guy around and watched him walk out and sign with another team

And how do you know that Thompson jerked the guy around? Where do you get off assuming that the Packers didn't make a real effort to get Griffith?

Share the details that you have, why don't you. We'd all love to hear them. I doubt you have any deatails on how this went down right now though. My bet is that you're not really interested in knowing the details though. In your mind, you already know Thompson was at fault.

[falco]

retailguy, at least I give you credit for being consistent.

Its the other people, who lauded TT for his method and lambasted Mike Sherman for his, who should have a hard time justifying such a position now.

[red]

tt brought him in, tood his time, jerked the guy around and watched him walk out and sign with another team

And how do you know that Thompson jerked the guy around? Where do you get off assuming that the Packers didn't make a real effort to get Griffith?

Share the details that you have, why don't you. We'd all love to hear them. I doubt you have any deatails on how this went down right now though. My bet is that you're not really interested in knowing the details though. In your mind, you already know Thompson was at fault.

Packers | Team talking with Griffith
Fri, 9 Mar 2007 12:41:48 -0800

Pete Dougherty, of the Green Bay Press-Gazette, reports the Green Bay Packers are believed to be in contract negotiations with unrestricted free-agent FB Justin Griffith (Falcons). The negotiations do not seem urgent.

------------------

you bring a guy in and act like he's no big deal. you act like he's not important. he'll go somewhere that wants him

[gbpackfan]

So let me get this straight. We should go out and sign no one? Every other GM in the league is signing people EXCEPT for Ted Thompson. So I guess because Thompson works for the Packers, he is the one who knows everything. Everyone else is wrong. There are some players that were out there that could have helped the Packers.

1. Justin Griffith - PERFECT FIT HERE, TT let him go.
2. Randy McMichael - This team BADLY needs a pass catching TE. We have NO depth behind the blocking Franks. We basically have NO pass catching TEs.
3. Roderick Hood - This team needs a nickel back in the worst way. Not only could he be the 3rd corner, but he may even be the answer in a year or two when Harris' play starts to slip. Not to mention he returns kicks!
4. ANY OFFENSIVE PLAYMAKER. Your telling me that isnt one guy (or wasn't) that could have helped the Packers put some points up? Stallworth? Bennett? McMichaels? Even Stevens could help!

Just because we don't agree with the GM of the Green Bay Packers doesn't make us fair weather fans or stupid. It is fairly obvious that the Packers have HUGE holes on both sides of the ball that can't all be filled via the draft. Now can TT fix this team. Sure. But he is going to have to do some wheeling and dealing and start closing some f-ing deals!

[falco]

No offense, but you're assuming an awful lot from that one line. Was the reporter that posted it present at the negotiations?

[retailguy]

retailguy, at least I give you credit for being consistent.

Its the other people, who lauded TT for his method and lambasted Mike Sherman for his, who should have a hard time justifying such a position now.

Yep, if it wasn't so sad, I think I'd laugh.

I've been patient and supportive of Thompson since he got here. I am finding it very difficult to continue. The sad part is that Thompson has proven himself to be a really great evaluator of talent, but not such a great GM. If all he had to do was evaluate talent, we'd probably be OK.

Unfortunately, there's a lot more to the job than that. For me, at least, that's the problem.

Dealing with the OTHER aspects of Free Agency have proven difficult for Thompson. Either he's the greatest poker player I've ever seen, or he's clueless. Sadly, I'm betting on the latter.

He has ZERO comprehension that his words (or lack thereof) are speaking QUITE loudly to all available agents and players right now.

[falco]

retailguy, at least I give you credit for being consistent.

Its the other people, who lauded TT for his method and lambasted Mike Sherman for his, who should have a hard time justifying such a position now.

Yep, if it wasn't so sad, I think I'd laugh.

I've been patient and supportive of Thompson since he got here. I am finding it very difficult to continue. The sad part is that Thompson has proven himself to be a really great evaluator of talent, but not such a great GM. If all he had to do was evaluate talent, we'd probably be OK.

Unfortunately, there's a lot more to the job than that. For me, at least, that's the problem.

Dealing with the OTHER aspects of Free Agency have proven difficult for Thompson. Either he's the greatest poker player I've ever seen, or he's clueless. Sadly, I'm betting on the latter.

He has ZERO comprehension that his words (or lack thereof) are speaking QUITE loudly to all available agents and players right now.

I haven't given up on Thompson yet; we are only a week into FA. However, if the team takes a major step back this year (and it will if it doesn't get some talent on the offense), TT is a goner. Because if we suck this year with Favre, and you know Favre won't be back if thats the case, the next year after that is going to be horrible.

[gureski]

It's like the Twilight Zone in here right now! Now Sherman's GM ability is vindicated?

What the hell is happening?

Retail is sure we're going to face tough teams before free agency, the draft, and final rosters are even formed? HELL, OUR ROSTER isn't even formed but you're just dead set that it wont be enough!

I've called Thompson an idiot when he deserved it. He doesn't deserve the crap you guys are giving him right now. You ignored it in another thread so I'll say it again here....the O-Line will improve if only because those young guys will have had a full year and off-season in the offense. They will no longer have to think about assignments and will be able to concentrate more on their technique. Morency is a very quick RB. He's also fast. He's exactly what you'd want in a ZBS RB. He may not be the answer but it's too early to say! Who the hell was A.Green when the Packers dug him out of Seattle and stuck him in front of the Pro-Bowler D.Levens? And then there is the draft where the team could easily get a RB or the fact that guys like Chris Brown and C.Dillon are still out there in free agency. But you see nothing but hell, brimbstone, and fire! It's hopeless to you.

I happen to truly believe that there is reason to hope here. The only people who are dead set on doom and gloom are those that want it to happen. You want doom and gloom because you've tied yourself to it. You've tied yourself to it and you will hang from it when you're proven wrong.

[red]

No offense, but you're assuming an awful lot from that one line. Was the reporter that posted it present at the negotiations?

were you there, do you know different?

did TT shower him with flowers and cookies?

him leaving without a deal is enough for me to think TT wasn't showing him any love. other teams bring in guys and won't let them leave until we have a deal in place. we bring them in and tell them to keep looking

[red]

i'll still stand by what i believe that its a good thing sherman is gone. he didn't take the draft very serious and threw away a lot of money on guys that didn't deserve that money

however, TT is starting to look like the exact opposite, that will only concentrate on the draft and won't spend any money

we went from one extreme to the other

we need something in the middle

even the god damn patriots, the team everyone says is the build through the draft poster boys, are going after free agents

you can do both, and you should use both

we are not

[retailguy]

did TT shower him with flowers and cookies?




NO. Those cost too much. We must save that money to sign the draft choices.

[gbpackfan]

Mike Sherman put all his eggs in the FA basket and drafted like shit.

Ted Thompson is putting all his eggs in the draft basket and handles FA like shit.

Now, if only we could find TED SHERMAN!!!!! I'd even settle for Mike Thompson.

[retailguy]

Mike Sherman put all his eggs in the FA basket and drafted like shit.

Ted Thompson is putting all his eggs in the draft basket and handles FA like shit.

Now, if only we could find TED SHERMAN!!!!! I'd even settle for Mike Thompson.

One of those two would be GREAT. The problem is if we get the other guy, who sucks at free agency and sucks at drafting... :shock:

With our luck, you know who we'd get. :wink:

[Charles Woodson]

tt brought him in, tood his time, jerked the guy around and watched him walk out and sign with another team

And how do you know that Thompson jerked the guy around? Where do you get off assuming that the Packers didn't make a real effort to get Griffith?

Share the details that you have, why don't you. We'd all love to hear them. I doubt you have any deatails on how this went down right now though. My bet is that you're not really interested in knowing the details though. In your mind, you already know Thompson was at fault.

See the reason Thompson is at fault is because he had the resources. Thompson could have easily signed him, he has the money. The reason why he didnt offer him a contract like one that oakland offered him is beyond me.

[Charles Woodson]

Mike Sherman put all his eggs in the FA basket and drafted like shit.

Ted Thompson is putting all his eggs in the draft basket and handles FA like shit.

Now, if only we could find TED SHERMAN!!!!! I'd even settle for Mike Thompson.

One of those two would be GREAT. The problem is if we get the other guy, who sucks at free agency and sucks at drafting... :shock:

With our luck, you know who we'd get. :wink:

You mean like the Redskins GM?

[red]

Mike Sherman put all his eggs in the FA basket and drafted like shit.

Ted Thompson is putting all his eggs in the draft basket and handles FA like shit.

Now, if only we could find TED SHERMAN!!!!! I'd even settle for Mike Thompson.

One of those two would be GREAT. The problem is if we get the other guy, who sucks at free agency and sucks at drafting... :shock:

With our luck, you know who we'd get. :wink:

matt millen already has a team


thats why packer fans like the fact that he's the lions gm. it means he can't come here

[gureski]

Let's look at this purely from a market concept. Mughelli got 3 million a year in Atlanta. If this guy couldn't get $2 million a year from anyone then maybe there is something wrong that hasn't been publicized yet?

If many of you viewed the guy would get over 2 million a year from someone and in the end he didn't even get to 2 million a year then that should tell you there is something wrong. Either he's not as good as some thought or something is wrong with him physically or mentally. We just don't know yet so why get so pissed? The truth will come out.

[GBRulz]

I wonder how many people are asking TT tonight at Fan Fest why we didn't get Griffith signed? The coaches were all supposed to be around tonight, but if it was like last year, TT wasn't out talking with the people like the other coaches were.

[Charles Woodson]

It's like the Twilight Zone in here right now! Now Sherman's GM ability is vindicated?

What the hell is happening?

Retail is sure we're going to face tough teams before free agency, the draft, and final rosters are even formed? HELL, OUR ROSTER isn't even formed but you're just dead set that it wont be enough!

I've called Thompson an idiot when he deserved it. He doesn't deserve the crap you guys are giving him right now. You ignored it in another thread so I'll say it again here....the O-Line will improve if only because those young guys will have had a full year and off-season in the offense. They will no longer have to think about assignments and will be able to concentrate more on their technique. Morency is a very quick RB. He's also fast. He's exactly what you'd want in a ZBS RB. He may not be the answer but it's too early to say! Who the hell was A.Green when the Packers dug him out of Seattle and stuck him in front of the Pro-Bowler D.Levens? And then there is the draft where the team could easily get a RB or the fact that guys like Chris Brown and C.Dillon are still out there in free agency. But you see nothing but hell, brimbstone, and fire! It's hopeless to you.

I happen to truly believe that there is reason to hope here. The only people who are dead set on doom and gloom are those that want it to happen. You want doom and gloom because you've tied yourself to it. You've tied yourself to it and you will hang from it when you're proven wrong.

What makes you think that TT would pass up every RB that could have made an impact for us for some guys like Corey Dillion and Chris Brown. On of the reasons why i have no hope for this FA season is because TT hasnt given me anything to hope for. There have been numerous guys that could have had an impact for us and started for us. We didnt sign them because they were a little bit expensive. But wth, does it matter what they get paid if they prove they are worth it on the feild, yes no one knows how they will preform this upcoming season but you gotta take a chance on someone. Like ive mentioned in previous posts, our Win Lose record was very deceving. We only beat one team over 500 and that was the bears in the season finale. we were blown out by 10 points or more, more times than we beat somebody by 10 points or more. Sometimes you've gotta give some to get some.

[retailguy]

Let's look at this purely from a market concept. Mughelli got 3 million a year in Atlanta. If this guy couldn't get $2 million a year from anyone then maybe there is something wrong that hasn't been publicized yet?

If many of you viewed the guy would get over 2 million a year from someone and in the end he didn't even get to 2 million a year then that should tell you there is something wrong. Either he's not as good as some thought or something is wrong with him physically or mentally. We just don't know yet so why get so pissed? The truth will come out.


Honestly, couldn't this point be used with every free agent that Thompson eventually signs? C'mon man, you're grasping at straws here.

Don't you think that PERHAPS, JUST PERHAPS that Ted has botched the "PR" aspects of Free Agency by stating that players are typically overpriced? If you are a player looking for a GREAT deal, would you come here?

I sure the hell wouldn't.

[retailguy]

I wonder how many people are asking TT tonight at Fan Fest why we didn't get Griffith signed? The coaches were all supposed to be around tonight, but if it was like last year, TT wasn't out talking with the people like the other coaches were.


Ted has NEVER embraced the fans. He simply doesn't have those skills. Kind of sad.

[Charles Woodson]

Let's look at this purely from a market concept. Mughelli got 3 million a year in Atlanta. If this guy couldn't get $2 million a year from anyone then maybe there is something wrong that hasn't been publicized yet?

If many of you viewed the guy would get over 2 million a year from someone and in the end he didn't even get to 2 million a year then that should tell you there is something wrong. Either he's not as good as some thought or something is wrong with him physically or mentally. We just don't know yet so why get so pissed? The truth will come out.

Maybe he just got over looked, maybe it was a steal. Yes it could have been anything but the fact of the matter is he is better than anybody we have at FB right now.

[Bossman641]

I've been mostly a TT supporter but this is getting ridiculous. You're trying to tell me that there's not a single FA out there who would help the Pack. Our offense was bad enough last year. Now we're taking steps backward and we're gonna count on our main improvement coming from the strengthening of the OL? PLEASE. We need playmakers. Griffith would have been a great pickup.

I don't even know who I want that's out there anyone. What are we gonna have going into Week 1? 15 million? 20 million? Screw this, I'm getting drunk.

[gureski]

So let me get this straight. We should go out and sign no one? Every other GM in the league is signing people EXCEPT for Ted Thompson. So I guess because Thompson works for the Packers, he is the one who knows everything. Everyone else is wrong. There are some players that were out there that could have helped the Packers.

1. Justin Griffith - PERFECT FIT HERE, TT let him go.
2. Randy McMichael - This team BADLY needs a pass catching TE. We have NO depth behind the blocking Franks. We basically have NO pass catching TEs.
3. Roderick Hood - This team needs a nickel back in the worst way. Not only could he be the 3rd corner, but he may even be the answer in a year or two when Harris' play starts to slip. Not to mention he returns kicks!
4. ANY OFFENSIVE PLAYMAKER. Your telling me that isnt one guy (or wasn't) that could have helped the Packers put some points up? Stallworth? Bennett? McMichaels? Even Stevens could help!

Just because we don't agree with the GM of the Green Bay Packers doesn't make us fair weather fans or stupid. It is fairly obvious that the Packers have HUGE holes on both sides of the ball that can't all be filled via the draft. Now can TT fix this team. Sure. But he is going to have to do some wheeling and dealing and start closing some f-ing deals!

Nobody said we shouldn't sign anyone. I'm merely asking whether we need to riot every time someone signs someone?

And the Bears GM didn't sign anyone yet. He only built a team that was in the Superbowl a month ago. Is he an idiot? I mean, it's obviously a race, right?

The thing about your comments is that it's as if you feel you really know what is happening internally with the Packers. Reading you, I'm led to think that you KNOW exactly what is going on and disagree with the strategy. Maybe you do have inside info but if you don't than you need to realize that you're acting like a raging fanatic. You're saying all these things yet you don't know for sure if it's true. You're even coming off as if you know more then Thompson! It's as if you've lost touch with reality. They are there. We aren't. We're fans. IT's their life and job.

On the players you mention, sure...Griffith would've been nice but we don't know what happened yet. Why be so enraged at THompson and willing to point the finger when you don't know what happened?

McMichael sucks. I told you before. His stats are misleading. He's a fancy Bubba Franks. I'm not kidding. I've seen the statistical breakdown of McMichael created by the football scientist. He's not what you think he was. Stevens is the guy to hope for.

Yeah, we need another CB and just today word was leaked that the Packers are looking at Tory James. Looks like the team is looking at nickel backs. Does it have to be your guy for Thompson to be viewed as trying?

On the offensive playmakers front.....who do you think is really worth going after? Stallworth? Make me laugh. Moss is a playmaker and rumor has Thompson talking trade with Oakland. What else is there that you're dying to have? It's just not out there this year. When the talent isn't there you don't just buy buy buy what is there to make up for it. That's a waste. You don't just buy to buy. It has to be the right player. Be frustrated that the players aren't there this year, not at the GM.

I believe we can get at least one playmaker in the draft. I believe we can fill at least 2 holes, maybe 3 in the draft. Thompson has drafted 3 all rookie players in 2 drafts and multiple starters. Why doubt his drafting ability now and downplay his potential to get help in the draft?

As for Packer fans that disagree with the GM....that's fine. We all do at some time. The difference is that most fans give the guy the benefit of the doubt before calling for him to be fired. What happened tonight is that a guy was signed and before anyone knew any facts about what happened.....guys started ripping Ted Thompson and calling for him to be fired. That's not rationale.

[Charles Woodson]

Nobody said we shouldn't sign anyone. I'm merely asking whether we need to riot every time someone signs someone?

And the Bears GM didn't sign anyone yet. He only built a team that was in the Superbowl a month ago. Is he an idiot? I mean, it's obviously a race, right?



No the thing thats different is that we have more spots to fill than they do. Do they need a RB, TE, FB, WR, Nickel corner, and Saftey? i dont think so. I mean come on, they were in the SB they did something right. Were we in the SB? NO

[gureski]

tt brought him in, tood his time, jerked the guy around and watched him walk out and sign with another team

And how do you know that Thompson jerked the guy around? Where do you get off assuming that the Packers didn't make a real effort to get Griffith?

Share the details that you have, why don't you. We'd all love to hear them. I doubt you have any deatails on how this went down right now though. My bet is that you're not really interested in knowing the details though. In your mind, you already know Thompson was at fault.

See the reason Thompson is at fault is because he had the resources. Thompson could have easily signed him, he has the money. The reason why he didnt offer him a contract like one that oakland offered him is beyond me.

How do you know he didn't? This is what I'm talking about. YOu're blaming Thompson before you even know what happened.

[Charles Woodson]

Yeah, we need another CB and just today word was leaked that the Packers are looking at Tory James. Looks like the team is looking at nickel backs. Does it have to be your guy for Thompson to be viewed as trying?



The packers have "looked into" a few guys already. Have any of them signed? nope. What makes you think that we are getting Tory James.

[Bossman641]

So let me get this straight. We should go out and sign no one? Every other GM in the league is signing people EXCEPT for Ted Thompson. So I guess because Thompson works for the Packers, he is the one who knows everything. Everyone else is wrong. There are some players that were out there that could have helped the Packers.

1. Justin Griffith - PERFECT FIT HERE, TT let him go.
2. Randy McMichael - This team BADLY needs a pass catching TE. We have NO depth behind the blocking Franks. We basically have NO pass catching TEs.
3. Roderick Hood - This team needs a nickel back in the worst way. Not only could he be the 3rd corner, but he may even be the answer in a year or two when Harris' play starts to slip. Not to mention he returns kicks!
4. ANY OFFENSIVE PLAYMAKER. Your telling me that isnt one guy (or wasn't) that could have helped the Packers put some points up? Stallworth? Bennett? McMichaels? Even Stevens could help!

Just because we don't agree with the GM of the Green Bay Packers doesn't make us fair weather fans or stupid. It is fairly obvious that the Packers have HUGE holes on both sides of the ball that can't all be filled via the draft. Now can TT fix this team. Sure. But he is going to have to do some wheeling and dealing and start closing some f-ing deals!

Nobody said we shouldn't sign anyone. I'm merely asking whether we need to riot every time someone signs someone?

And the Bears GM didn't sign anyone yet. He only built a team that was in the Superbowl a month ago. Is he an idiot? I mean, it's obviously a race, right?

The thing about your comments is that it's as if you feel you really know what is happening internally with the Packers. Reading you, I'm led to think that you KNOW exactly what is going on and disagree with the strategy. Maybe you do have inside info but if you don't than you need to realize that you're acting like a raging fanatic. You're saying all these things yet you don't know for sure if it's true. You're even coming off as if you know more then Thompson! It's as if you've lost touch with reality. They are there. We aren't. We're fans. IT's their life and job.

On the players you mention, sure...Griffith would've been nice but we don't know what happened yet. Why be so enraged at THompson and willing to point the finger when you don't know what happened?

McMichael sucks. I told you before. His stats are misleading. He's a fancy Bubba Franks. I'm not kidding. I've seen the statistical breakdown of McMichael created by the football scientist. He's not what you think he was. Stevens is the guy to hope for.

Yeah, we need another CB and just today word was leaked that the Packers are looking at Tory James. Looks like the team is looking at nickel backs. Does it have to be your guy for Thompson to be viewed as trying?

On the offensive playmakers front.....who do you think is really worth going after? Stallworth? Make me laugh. Moss is a playmaker and rumor has Thompson talking trade with Oakland. What else is there that you're dying to have? It's just not out there this year. When the talent isn't there you don't just buy buy buy what is there to make up for it. That's a waste. You don't just buy to buy. It has to be the right player. Be frustrated that the players aren't there this year, not at the GM.

I believe we can get at least one playmaker in the draft. I believe we can fill at least 2 holes, maybe 3 in the draft. Thompson has drafted 3 all rookie players in 2 drafts and multiple starters. Why doubt his drafting ability now and downplay his potential to get help in the draft?

As for Packer fans that disagree with the GM....that's fine. We all do at some time. The difference is that most fans give the guy the benefit of the doubt before calling for him to be fired. What happened tonight is that a guy was signed and before anyone knew any facts about what happened.....guys started ripping Ted Thompson and calling for him to be fired. That's not rationale.

Do you know how long it took Angelo to build that Bears team? The cornerstones came through about a 5 year drafting window after screwing up royally for many, many years.

Look at how the rest of the team came together.

LT John Tait - Signed as FA in 05
LG Ruben Brown - Signed as a FA in 04
RG Roberto Garza - Signed as a FA in 05
RT Fred Miller - Signed as a FA in 05
TE Desmond Clark - Signed as a FA in 03
WR Moose - Signed as a FA in 05
LE Ogunleye - Came over as a trade in 04
LB Hillenmeyer - Signed in 03

Yea, they've been inactive this offseason. They also have a lot less holes to fill and have less money. They need younger guys to eventually replace their aging players (especially their OL), but that's what you do. You use the draft to groom the young players. You don't go in with 7 picks and expect to come out with 4-5 instant starters. This is what we are banking on right now.

[retailguy]

The Bears ENTIRE offensive line with the exception of Olin Kruentz came from Free Agency.

BAD EXAMPLE. Very bad.

[ND72]

I'm personally very disappointed in not getting this guy here. I honestly felt he was very important. Evidently, Teddy didn't agree.

[swede]

Sorry Gureski,

I have been a loyal TT supporter, but watching Griffith go as cheaply as he did to a fvckwad team like the Raiders pisses me off.

I have not been asking TT to throw money at any FA whose agent phones. I do expect him to fill a few of the many holes on a team that he has GM'ed for almost three years now.

Hey, Teddy! BOOOOOO!

[retailguy]

Sorry Gureski,

I have been a loyal TT supporter, but watching Griffith go as cheaply as he did to a fvckwad team like the Raiders pisses me off.

I have not been asking TT to throw money at any FA whose agent phones. I do expect him to fill a few of the many holes on a team that he has GM'ed for almost three years now.

Hey, Teddy! BOOOOOO!


Welcome to the dark side. I've pm'ed you a negative RED light sabre.

Go in peace.

[Packnut]

It's really mind-boggling that ANYONE defends Teddy's methods here. While other GM's were lining guys up for visits and stroking ego's, Thompson sat back and did NOTHING. He has not improved this team and anyone who says he has is a freaking idiot.

Thompson has no intention of winning this season or next. He could care less about Favre and that's a FACT. Don't you guys get it by now? Teddy is a DRAFT ADDICT. The draft is what floats his boat. He's gotta prove to everyone just how smart he is.

But some of you are so blinded that it's gonna take another 4-12 season before you open up your eyes. I suggest a few of you take a course in simple economics. Get over the whole -"that team really over-paid for that guy" shit and realize this is now the market. Several teams improved their roster and even a blind fool can't argue that fact. Sadly, the Green Bay Packers are worse off now than when the season ended. The Saints are better and so are the 49'ers.

Those who make excuses for Thompson do so out of blind faith. I saw lot's of that "blind faith" in the 70's and 80's. However there is a big difference between then and now. Back then, they did'nt have the cash the Packers do today and no one wanted to play in GB. Thompson has no excuses. There were guys out there who could help us NOW! He did'nt anticipate the feeding frenzy. He thought he could just sit back and wait. Well he was WRONG.

Thompson had the cash and the talent was out there to make 1 more run with Favre. That's what those of you who defend Teddy just don't get and it's sad. You think this slow and steady way stock-piling draft picks is the answer yet you fail to realize how every organization who loses their franchise QB has a hard time winning after he's gone. History does'nt lie.

This may come as a shock but the Brett Favre's don't come around every season. Thompson's legacy will be how he did'nt even try to win with Favre and that SHOULD be unforgivable for every Packer fan.........

[Bretsky]

He did'nt anticipate the feeding frenzy


Completely agree here

[Bretsky]

Q: janean of Cadott - It kind of drives me crazy when the JS columnists applaud Ted Thompson for not spending in free agency but fail to point out he is bringing back Favre at a high salary level but with no chance at winning the Superbowl because the Packers are not signing anyone of note to help Favre win. So, why did Thompson bring back Favre? Perhaps only to sell tickets.... It would have been better to be honest with the fans, and jettison the old warrior, right?

A: Cliff Christl - That's an excellent point. I wrote before last season that I thought Thompson should have traded Favre. I still think that. Now, it's too late. And it may turn out that by keeping Favre, Thompson will fail and get fired. I still think that's when the bottom might fall out: When Favre retires. And, by then, it might be time for a change of GMs. Then again, if the Packers had jettisoned Favre, as you've suggested, they might not be any better off and maybe even worse off. Why? Because I don't think Aaron Rodgers was ready to play as a rookie or last year. Maybe he's one of those quarterbacks who will benefit from sitting and learning for three, four years. Nobody knows. But that's an argument for keeping Favre. Plus, I think there's a difference between dumping Favre and say Green or Henderson. The Packers should be able to easily replace Green and Henderson. Backs capable of rushing for 1,059 yards are pretty much a dime a dozen now. You could replace Henderson with a fullback off the scrapheap. But it might take years for the Packers to find a quarterback even as good as the Favre of today, which is a good notch or two down from the Favre of the mid-1990s.

[Lurker64]

It would have been nice to sign Griffith, but sometimes a guy would rather live in California than Wisconsin. But other than him, there hasn't really been a guy on the market that I think would really improve our team noticeably beyond the guys who are already on the roster. The more I think about it, the more I'm convinced that this is just an abyssmal free agent class, and you're not really going to find anything here no matter how much money you throw at the problem.

Of all the signings that have been made thus far, if the Packers had made all of them my reaction, universally, would have been "meh." I don't fault Thompson for passing up "meh" guys.

[Bretsky]

It would have been nice to sign Griffith, but sometimes a guy would rather live in California than Wisconsin. But other than him, there hasn't really been a guy on the market that I think would really improve our team noticeably beyond the guys who are already on the roster. The more I think about it, the more I'm convinced that this is just an abyssmal free agent class, and you're not really going to find anything here no matter how much money you throw at the problem.

Of all the signings that have been made thus far, if the Packers had made all of them my reaction, universally, would have been "meh." I don't fault Thompson for passing up "meh" guys.


It's a weak free agency class; I'll give you that. Last year is the true year when he dropped the ball by not going nuts in that market. He could have signed two more very good players and still inked Woodson to a more traditional contract.

That being said, while the class is weak, there are tons of players that could help this squad.

I don't know that any of us can use the terms "overpaid" because this is a new market; but I could list a load of free agents that would upgrade our roster.

Hamlin, Grant, Thomas, Bennett, McMichael, Graham, Hood....many more

No, not a lot of stars, but definitely improvements.



B

[HarveyWallbangers]

Let's look at this purely from a market concept. Mughelli got 3 million a year in Atlanta. If this guy couldn't get $2 million a year from anyone then maybe there is something wrong that hasn't been publicized yet?

Or perhaps it could be that only a few teams run the ZBS and look for FBs like Griffith. The ones that do run the scheme have FBs they like (e.g. Kyle Johnson in Denver).

[esoxx]

It would have been nice to sign Griffith, but sometimes a guy would rather live in California than Wisconsin.

And you know this how?

[imscott72]

This thread alone represents everything I'm against right now. A 34 year old FB (that was just in negotiations with G.B.) signs with Oakland and before anyone knows a single fact about how things went down people are lining up and screaming for Ted Thompson's head! It's ridiculous.

The following are real quotes that I pulled just from this one thread!

I'm getting really worried.

WTF? I thought we were close to signing this guy and the next second Granny has the fucker under contract! Who do we have that can play FB at this time? Only Miree if I remember correctly. Well....I'm sure Luchey or whoever that fat fuck was is still out there waiting for a call.

whoa look at that deal. thats insane
i'm sure glad we didn't piss away all that money to get a starting FB which we need
that would have ment we couldn't draft any players this year. and clearly would have ruined our cap for years to come

Yes, we're going to have plenty of roster spots open come draft day. If this deal is accurate the clones saying everybody is grossly overpaid surely cannot say that about this deal.

so, you're saying he went to oakland because he wants to win?

Yeah, I'm sure that is it. We have no shot at signing FAs because Green Bay is just too damned cold.

If that's the case, we might as well fold the franchise and move it to LA.

guess 1.2M a year was too expensive for TT to pay one of the best FBs in the league and the perfect fit for the ZBS

Ted Thompson has not done his job this offseason. Failing to sign Griffith is criminal. We have taken several steps back this offseason and if there isn't some sort of a miracle, the Packers will be a sub .500 team. If that happens, Thompson should be fired.

Let the rationalyzing begin:

Too cold

Maybe not enough money

Too windy

Was upset that the Georgia Pacific paper mill put that much smoke into the atmosphere

Herron could be a FB

Too many overweight people seen near the stadium

Didn't realize Green Bay was that close to Canada

Probably wasn't a good fit anyhow, even though he came from ZBS

Turned off that a Packer employee got him a Mr Pibb when he requested a Dr Pepper

end quotes

So, let me get this straight.... A 34 year old FB who was dumped by his old team, has never been to a pro-bowl, and whom I've never heard mentioned as one of the best FB's in the game is sending people into a frothing panic because he signed with Oakland! Overnight Griffith has become a must-have piece of G.B.'s puzzle? Suddenly, because Griffith signed with Oakland and without ever knowing what the facts surrounding that are, Thompson should be fired? It's criminal? How many of you even knew who the guy was before this year's free agency started?

The sarcasm and pessimism right now is unbelievable! Is anyone thinking clearly anymore? Everyday here it's a new panic over some 2nd or 3d tier player that would've merely filled a role for the Packers! Never mind that there are 50 more just like the guy out there waiting to be signed.....WE MISSED THIS ONE!!!! These aren't pieces to championship teams we're talking about! Guys like Randy McMichael are NOT the key to the Packers winning the North again! I don't get the rush to judgement on all these role players. It's like some of you are just looking for reasons to say negative things.

If you have something negative to say then I'm all for it. You wont find me hanging around the Romer Room singing Koombaya with everyone but for crying out loud at least have some real factual, hard hitting common sense behind what you're getting pissed about! Right now, people are just panicing and it's getting irritating because it lacks logic.

If you think this 34 year old FB was one of the keys to this year's season turning out then be mad. If not, don't act outraged just to do it. It's getting old.

LOL, Gureski be careful, your starting to sound too much like me... :)

[imscott72]

I stand corrected in the age department but my overall point still stands. People are just frothing with negativity right now and every day its' a different player. I can see why some people would be pissed about the FB position and why they'd feel it's key but I haven't actually heard anyone say that and say why they feel it was such a key signing. It's just one big pile-on party right now and it's been going on for days every time a guy gets signed. It's getting old.

What's getting old is the pathological blind defenses of Ted's offseason. Your lines are the ones getting old. This team is not improving. AT ALL.

THERE IS ZERO REASON for this. Unless you're on the 2009 plan.

:roll: You and Woodbuck I tell ya..For some reason humans just LOVE negativity I guess..That must be why the first thing on the nightly news on a daily basis is death and destruction, not anything positive. People love it..

[imscott72]

tt brought him in, tood his time, jerked the guy around and watched him walk out and sign with another team

And how do you know that Thompson jerked the guy around? Where do you get off assuming that the Packers didn't make a real effort to get Griffith?

Share the details that you have, why don't you. We'd all love to hear them. I doubt you have any deatails on how this went down right now though. My bet is that you're not really interested in knowing the details though. In your mind, you already know Thompson was at fault.

See the reason Thompson is at fault is because he had the resources. Thompson could have easily signed him, he has the money. The reason why he didnt offer him a contract like one that oakland offered him is beyond me.

How do you know he didn't? This is what I'm talking about. YOu're blaming Thompson before you even know what happened.

Don't bother man. You might as well bang your head against a concrete wall. I understand the frustration from some of these guys, but as I've said in previous posts, TT's job depends on fielding a competitive team. He doesn't want to be known as a failure either. The season doesn't start next week, or next month. Give him until week one. I agree with the person that posted the comment that if we take a step back this year with the team (when the season starts) then I'm jumping right on the let TT go bandwagon, otherwise for God's sake give the guy a fighting chance.

All the negativity does wanna make you puke when it's seen on a daily basis. Again, come away from the cliff's edge people. No one knows why Griffith didn't sign. Maybe he didn't want to play here, it could be that simple.

[mmmdk]

I'm personally very disappointed in not getting this guy here. I honestly felt he was very important. Evidently, Teddy didn't agree.

I agree, TT blew this one BIG TIME!!! I cannot believe Griffith went for petty cash to Raiders. UNBELIEVABLE :evil: lousy GM work

[packers11]

"The Packers are working on a deal with FB Justin Griffith and it looks like he will be a Packer by Monday morning. I was told Griffith REALLY liked the facilities and thinks he can help the Packers do some good things. - March 9th... Pure Speculation part 12311231"

F!@K!!!!!!!!!!!! WRONG AGAIN

[Scott Campbell]

It would have been nice to sign Griffith, but sometimes a guy would rather live in California than Wisconsin.

And you know this how?


From watching the weather on TV.

[gureski]

I've been mostly a TT supporter but this is getting ridiculous. You're trying to tell me that there's not a single FA out there who would help the Pack. Our offense was bad enough last year. Now we're taking steps backward and we're gonna count on our main improvement coming from the strengthening of the OL? PLEASE. We need playmakers. Griffith would have been a great pickup.

I don't even know who I want that's out there anyone. What are we gonna have going into Week 1? 15 million? 20 million? Screw this, I'm getting drunk.

For crying out loud. The free agency period is 10 days old! It's not a race. The teams that start the fastest aren't necessarily the winners. In a weak free agent class, why be so upset that Thompson hasn't signed people yet? Be reasonable. All I'm hearing around me is that we're doomed because Thompson hasn't thrown millions of dollars around on the calibur of players that still exist on the free agent market in other names. It's like every time a team makes a signing a handful of people in here riot and call it proof of the end of the world! How much do you want to bet that by the end of free agency the team will have spent plenty of money and will have addressed multiple needs? It doesn't all have to happen in the first 10 days!

And you say we need playmakers.....since when is the FB a playmaker? Can't some of you see that you're just being impatient? Half the people are being impatient and the other half hates Thompson to begin with and have tied their credability with his failing.

I'd also like to know how many of you that are here screaming about the Packers not getting Griffith also cried foul when the Packers let W.Henderson go? I'd bet that some of you would've been happy with a declining Henderson but suddenly now, nothing short of Griffith can do or the team is screwed? Get real.

[gureski]

It would have been nice to sign Griffith, but sometimes a guy would rather live in California than Wisconsin. But other than him, there hasn't really been a guy on the market that I think would really improve our team noticeably beyond the guys who are already on the roster. The more I think about it, the more I'm convinced that this is just an abyssmal free agent class, and you're not really going to find anything here no matter how much money you throw at the problem.

Of all the signings that have been made thus far, if the Packers had made all of them my reaction, universally, would have been "meh." I don't fault Thompson for passing up "meh" guys.


It's a weak free agency class; I'll give you that. Last year is the true year when he dropped the ball by not going nuts in that market. He could have signed two more very good players and still inked Woodson to a more traditional contract.

That being said, while the class is weak, there are tons of players that could help this squad.

I don't know that any of us can use the terms "overpaid" because this is a new market; but I could list a load of free agents that would upgrade our roster.

Hamlin, Grant, Thomas, Bennett, McMichael, Graham, Hood....many more

No, not a lot of stars, but definitely improvements.



B

Grant is gone but Hamlin is still there and there are at least 3 safeties in the draft with a high to mid-first round rating. McMichael and Graham are gone...so what? J.Stevens and others are still there. Hood is gone? So what, there are others there that can fill the role of a Nickel back.

It IS a WEAK free agent class but nobody here bothered to modify their expectations in light of that info. If the talent isn't there you don't just buy buy buy to make up for that. Aside from Griffith, who was a specific player that had experience in our offense that no other FB on the market has, who else did the Packers lose out on that they can't make up for using the players that are still left in free agency and the draft? That answer is none. The team hasn't lost out on any MUST-HAVE free agents.

Why then are people freaking out? Why the anger and hostility and the calls for Thompson to be fired? None of that is called for. It's as if our world has been turned upside down and all the pessimists are in control.

[gureski]

There is something that needs to be said here because I can see those that are in the anti-Thompson crowd are starting to paint me as a Thompson apologist. You're wrong and my past statements going back in time prove it. The fact that my trying to be reasonable about things makes me a homer right now tells you something about the current state of things around here. It's what my original post that started this was all about. Where is this ultra-negativity coming from? Why are we checking common sense at the door?

For anyone who can recall, and I doubt many will, I was one of the original critics of Ted Thompson in free agency. Yeah....it's true. Those of you painting me as a Thompson apologist are way off. I'm also a critic of Thompson's lack of activity in free agency over the years he's been in charge of the team. Go back and look up my old posts and you'll see me screaming about needing a safety for the past two years (going all the way back to JSonline). I'm not a THompson homer. I'm trying to be fair here in an environment where some aren't.

As soon as Thompson was hired I did research and started to warn people that his biggest challenge as a GM was going to be utilizing free agency. I said then, and still feel now, that Thompson will not succeed in G.B. unless he learns to harness Free Agency the way Ron Wolf used to. You cannot just draft players. You DO need to utilize free agency to fill holes on your roster. This IS Thompson's weakest link. He's not a big free agency guy. He's said it himself prior to ever coming to G.B..

With that said, it is more then obvious to me that many of you are out of line in your current criticism of Thompson. He's had 10 days in free agency and many of you are screaming for his head. That's ridiculous. He made some good signings last year. He was horrendous the first year, some say because of the salary cap. I think he just got arrogant. Last year he was better. He learned from his mistakes. This year there isn't much of anything out there to go get. I can understand the desire to see the Packers improve and to want to see Thompson succeed in free agency on behalf of the team but keep things in perspective. This is a weak free agency class and we're only 10 days into it! Not getting Graham, Johnson, and McMichael means nothing when Stevens, Fauria, Wiggins, and Kinney are still there. What's the real difference between those players? You could argue that Stevens is the most talented and he's still out there!

The point of all this is to simply try to appeal to those who are just caught up in this negative cloud. Realize that you're jumping the gun a little bit. Hang in there. For cying out loud, give the guy a chance. There is still talent out there that can and will help this team. Hold your fire or you'll be out of ammo and credability when the time comes to truly evaluate the off-season.

None of you know that THompson isnt' trying. Don't pretend you know something that you don't. GM's don't conduct business in the press. They're not worried about checking in with the fans and making sure we know exactly what the plan is. We will not know about something going on til it's happening or already over. Settle down and focus on the overall picture. It's not where we start. It's where we finish that counts. That's all I'm saying. Realize that Thompson can still succeed and fill the needs the team has. Yeah, he still has to prove himself in free agency but you don't give up on the guy 10 days into a weak free agent class! That's just not rationale.

[SD GB fan]

i personally was disappointed that we did not sign griffith. all i know is that he was a starter in ATL who used the ZBS. he can catch. that is what i know about him. but i do not see the point in criticizing or defending TT right now. it is the off-season, there will be plenty of blame and praise to go around after the season, when we actually have the results to judge upon. im sure TT isnt a dumb guy, he himself acknowledges that he isnt a big fan of FA. there are a variety of reasons for his actions, or the lack thereof. perhaps, he has full faith in miree, who did a good job prior to his injury (which is why he cut henderson early). maybe griffith would have ruined team chemistry. i do not know, but it is not my job to know, that is TT's job.

[wist43]

Maybe they could move Wells to FB... he's about the size of an average FB. Watching him get the snot kicked out of him every week at center certainly isn't any fun.

[Charles Woodson]

Idk when you say that we dont know thompson isnt trying... the reason we think that is because no one is signed. I mean if he really wanted some one signed he could do it. I dissagree strongly on the fact that "stevens" is the most talented out there. I think McMichaels and Johnson are better. Dont know much bout Graham. The fact that Ted is satisfied with Manuels play at saftey is the thing that pisses me off. I have read articles that he says that he is content and satisfied. That is a urgent need. We could have filled that need in FA with Grant. Im a little errie about taking another Seahawks Saftey in Hamlin but if TT signs him i guess it could be good.

Another huge point

Okay we all know that Bretts years are limited. I would love to see a final run at being a contender. TT hasnt done much of anything to do that.

I would be happy if TT went through with the Moss trade but it prob. wont happen.

I think it was Harv that made the point of when you said why arent more teams going for Griffith, that it might be because he excells in the ZBS. I really think Griffith would have played a huge part in helping our back feild out with his ability to block, catch, and run.

We are 10 days in and most players that would have actually made a difference are all gone. I mean Hamlin and in your opinion Stevens are the people we need to pick up. But who after that i mean who else would actually make a difference.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Maybe they could move Wells to FB... he's about the size of an average FB. Watching him get the snot kicked out of him every week at center certainly isn't any fun.

This is a low blow. I think Wells is a solid player. He isn't Olin Kreutz, but I think he's at least an average starter in the NFL.

[SD GB fan]

The fact that Ted is satisfied with Manuels play at saftey is the thing that pisses me off. I have read articles that he says that he is content and satisfied. That is a urgent need.

either ted is too confident in manuel or he knows the safety position is one of need. but either way, i dont think he would publicly denounce a player.

ive also read that TT believes a lot of positions need can be upgraded.

[Lurker64]

The fact that Ted is satisfied with Manuels play at saftey is the thing that pisses me off. I have read articles that he says that he is content and satisfied. That is a urgent need.

either ted is too confident in manuel or he knows the safety position is one of need. but either way, i dont think he would publicly denounce a player.

ive also read that TT believes a lot of positions need can be upgraded.

Well, Underwood was looking really good last year before he got hurt and Culver definitely has upside. So even if we don't add a Safety, there's no reason to expect that Manuel will be our best option.

[Scott Campbell]

There is something that needs to be said here...................


Good post.

Weak FA class + Increased salary cap = GM's throwing cash around like drunken sailors.

[the_idle_threat]

It's really mind-boggling that ANYONE defends Teddy's methods here. While other GM's were lining guys up for visits and stroking ego's, Thompson sat back and did NOTHING. He has not improved this team and anyone who says he has is a freaking idiot.

Thompson has no intention of winning this season or next. He could care less about Favre and that's a FACT. Don't you guys get it by now? Teddy is a DRAFT ADDICT. The draft is what floats his boat. He's gotta prove to everyone just how smart he is.

But some of you are so blinded that it's gonna take another 4-12 season before you open up your eyes. I suggest a few of you take a course in simple economics. Get over the whole -"that team really over-paid for that guy" shit and realize this is now the market. Several teams improved their roster and even a blind fool can't argue that fact. Sadly, the Green Bay Packers are worse off now than when the season ended. The Saints are better and so are the 49'ers.

Those who make excuses for Thompson do so out of blind faith. I saw lot's of that "blind faith" in the 70's and 80's. However there is a big difference between then and now. Back then, they did'nt have the cash the Packers do today and no one wanted to play in GB. Thompson has no excuses. There were guys out there who could help us NOW! He did'nt anticipate the feeding frenzy. He thought he could just sit back and wait. Well he was WRONG.

Thompson had the cash and the talent was out there to make 1 more run with Favre. That's what those of you who defend Teddy just don't get and it's sad. You think this slow and steady way stock-piling draft picks is the answer yet you fail to realize how every organization who loses their franchise QB has a hard time winning after he's gone. History does'nt lie.

This may come as a shock but the Brett Favre's don't come around every season. Thompson's legacy will be how he did'nt even try to win with Favre and that SHOULD be unforgivable for every Packer fan.........

I got my undergraduate degree in economics, so allow me to explain why you are wrong.

Free agency is an auction market, where the highest bidder wins the free agent's services.* Where there are multiple bidders, some will value the free agent's services at exactly what they are worth, given the player's potential production, injury risk, age, etc.. Other bidders will undervalue the free agent's services, perhaps by focusing too much on the risk vs. the potential reward, and still others will overvalue the free agent's services, by ignoring or discounting known risks or overestimating the potential reward. The bidder who most overvalues the free agent's services will always win the auction. This is known as the "winner's curse".

This means that a team will always overpay for the free agents they land, unless there are truly no other teams interested (no other bidders), so a team is wise to sign as few as possible, and be very strategic about it. After all, the player has to perform to enhanced expectations in order to be worth the deal. Otherwise, you get a Joe Johnson or a KGB.

It's also fair to note that none of the teams who have signed big free agents have improved themselves yet. San Francisco and New England look better on paper than they did before, but they haven't won any games this month. Let the offseason play out before you jump off that ledge, or before you push fellow Packer fans off it because they are not in panic mode like you are.



*---Sure, there are other factors involved in signing a free agent, such as weather, tradition of the team, whether it's already a playoff team, quality of the facilities, etc. Since Green Bay has weather and (currently) playoff team counting against, and tradition and quality of facilities counting in favor, it's pretty much a wash, IMO.

[red]

yeah, idle, but every single player will try and get into that bidding war if the team they are on doesn't get close to the new type of money

a safety just scores big in free agemcy gets a 40 million. that sets the bar. now the next safty will come along and want the same thing or better

nick barnett is now saying, i want what so and so just got, i'm at least worth what he is. it doesn't matter is its a wide open auction or a normal marketplace

and unless we had a set list of values for players then we have to rely on the open market to see what

the nfl doesn't have a place like a wal-mart where we can just go in and get a player at a hard line price ("lets see, starting safety, thats 19.98"). the only thing the nfl has is the auction block. and that dictates the value

[retailguy]

I got my undergraduate degree in economics, so allow me to explain why you are wrong.

Free agency is an auction market, where the highest bidder wins the free agent's services.* Where there are multiple bidders, some will value the free agent's services at exactly what they are worth, given the player's potential production, injury risk, age, etc.. Other bidders will undervalue the free agent's services, perhaps by focusing too much on the risk vs. the potential reward, and still others will overvalue the free agent's services, by ignoring or discounting known risks or overestimating the potential reward. The bidder who most overvalues the free agent's services will always win the auction. This is known as the "winner's curse".

This means that a team will always overpay for the free agents they land, unless there are truly no other teams interested (no other bidders), so a team is wise to sign as few as possible, and be very strategic about it. After all, the player has to perform to enhanced expectations in order to be worth the deal. Otherwise, you get a Joe Johnson or a KGB.

It's also fair to note that none of the teams who have signed big free agents have improved themselves yet. San Francisco and New England look better on paper than they did before, but they haven't won any games this month. Let the offseason play out before you jump off that ledge, or before you push fellow Packer fans off it because they are not in panic mode like you are.



*---Sure, there are other factors involved in signing a free agent, such as weather, tradition of the team, whether it's already a playoff team, quality of the facilities, etc. Since Green Bay has weather and (currently) playoff team counting against, and tradition and quality of facilities counting in favor, it's pretty much a wash, IMO.


I have a BA in Managerial Accounting (after switching from an Economics/Political Science major (6 credits short)), I do have a minor in econ. I also have an MBA, and have taught macro and micro economics at the Community College level.

Let me explain what your analysis is missing.

First, a true economist would realize that you cannot "ESTABLISH EXACTLY" the value as you claim, you can only make educated approximations. I've evaluated the "worth" of businesses for YEARS, and always issue a "range" of value with "disclaimers". Failure to do so would render my analysis FLAWED.

Second, you fail to use capitalism to explain what happens AFTER the auction. I agree with you that the bidder who pays the most wins the auction, however, people continue to buy things at auctions everyday and will continue indefinitely into the future.

If the buyer always ended up losing money, as you imply, after a relatively short period of time, people would stop buying things at auction. They haven't and they don't stop. Why? Simple.

The value of what they bought increases or decreases after auction. It increases on a frequent enough basis that the auction model continues. Some "overbidders" (as you claim) are successful enough that the model keeps working.

I would maintain, that the winning bidder, pays the highest possible market value at that given time, provided the "most interested parties" that want the item are in the room.

In Ahman's case that's true, anyone who wanted to "bid" was accorded the opportunity. I happen to agree with you, in his case, by thinking that Ahman got more than he should have, but disagree that this is a "defined fact" as most posters in this room claim. There is more to the story, and the "outcome" can't be judged until Christmas.

That being said, whether Houston overpaid, or not, Green Bay still LOST in this deal, because Green was a good football player, and intrinsically, has more value HERE than anywhere else. Regardless of whether or not he was "overpaid", there is an unfilled HOLE in Green Bay, and any manner in which you choose to slice it, that's a LOSS.

[Scott Campbell]

I have a BA in Managerial Accounting (after switching from an Economics/Political Science major (6 credits short)), I do have a minor in econ. I also have an MBA, and have taught macro and micro economics at the Community College level.


Geesh - do you want to measure pee pees?

[falco]

i never brought it up before, but since we are all bragging, I have a dual phd in sports management and message board posting, so y'all need to just shut up.

[Scott Campbell]

i never brought it up before, but since we are all bragging, I have a dual phd in sports management and message board posting, so y'all need to just shut up.


Pffft - I can trump that. I slept in a Holiday Inn Express last night.

[falco]

i never brought it up before, but since we are all bragging, I have a dual phd in sports management and message board posting, so y'all need to just shut up.


Pffft - I can trump that. I slept in a Holiday Inn Express last night.

...now that you mention that i'm pretty sure that was how TT got the job.

[Bretsky]

I have a BS Degree

I'm a BullShit artist and pretty dang good at it.... :lol:

[BooHoo]

I have a degree in economics also. See: "economics is about making rational decisions among alternatives." :)

[oregonpackfan]

I have a master's in elementary education. With my behavior management skills with young children(or adults with minds of young children like Randy Moss) I would give Moss 5 minute timouts in the corner. When he timeout was completed he would do community service like cleaning the floor, picking up trash along the highways...

Only then would he be allowed to play pro football! :)

[Joemailman]

I had a good Christian raisin' and an 8th grade education.

[Patler]

That being said, whether Houston overpaid, or not, Green Bay still LOST in this deal, because Green was a good football player, and intrinsically, has more value HERE than anywhere else. Regardless of whether or not he was "overpaid", there is an unfilled HOLE in Green Bay, and any manner in which you choose to slice it, that's a LOSS.

You are just as guilty as those you complain about for posing as fact that which is not yet proven.

If Green goes out and drops off the ledge of production as Earl Campbell and Eddie George did from one season to the next, or if his leg gives out in preseason, the Packers did not lose in the deal, they GAINED. If they find a young runner or runners at substantially less cost who can perform as well as Green would THIS year (they don't have to be the Green of 2003, because Green himself no longer is) the Packers have not suffered a loss. In fact, with less cost and a longer future, they will have gained.

Losing out in the bidding for Green could be bad for Green Bay, or it could be the best thing that happened to them. We won't know until later.

Much the same thing happened with Marco Rivera. Again they had the opportunity to match what Dallas offered. In the long run, its fortunate that they let him go. We could all be saying the same thing about Green next year.

[gureski]

I have a BA in Managerial Accounting (after switching from an Economics/Political Science major (6 credits short)), I do have a minor in econ. I also have an MBA, and have taught macro and micro economics at the Community College level.


Geesh - do you want to measure pee pees?

They don't call me the Kilebasa Rat for nothing....

:lol:

[retailguy]

Well, here is the proof St. Lou was right. There really is a "clique" in here.

Funny how all I did was respond to Idle using the same language and credentials he had and you are all picking on me but not him.

WHY?

Simple

"The mob" agrees with him.

Even Bretsky.... Well, I expected better but not surprised.

[retailguy]

You are just as guilty as those you complain about for posing as fact that which is not yet proven.

If Green goes out and drops off the ledge of production as Earl Campbell and Eddie George did from one season to the next, or if his leg gives out in preseason, the Packers did not lose in the deal, they GAINED. If they find a young runner or runners at substantially less cost who can perform as well as Green would THIS year (they don't have to be the Green of 2003, because Green himself no longer is) the Packers have not suffered a loss. In fact, with less cost and a longer future, they will have gained.

Losing out in the bidding for Green could be bad for Green Bay, or it could be the best thing that happened to them. We won't know until later.

Much the same thing happened with Marco Rivera. Again they had the opportunity to match what Dallas offered. In the long run, its fortunate that they let him go. We could all be saying the same thing about Green next year.

Patler, if you read my posts carefully, you'll see that the "loss" is that Ahman Green is gone. That doesn't have anything to do with money. Claiming that he could get injured is a "much different thing". Every team is succeptible to that.

You know what my point is, please don't try to distort it.

Losing a back with Green's ability is a loss, even if it becomes the right financial decision.

[b bulldog]

It is only a loss if we can find a suitable replacement but you view the loss much greater than I. He is the only real player we have lost to date so we are pretty much standing still at the moment.

[Bretsky]

Well, here is the proof St. Lou was right. There really is a "clique" in here.

Funny how all I did was respond to Idle using the same language and credentials he had and you are all picking on me but not him.

WHY?

Simple

"The mob" agrees with him.

Even Bretsky.... Well, I expected better but not surprised.


What are you talking about ? I make a joke that is consistent with how I post on a daily basis ? I believe yesterday I was calling myself an @sshole; today I have a BS. If that was offensive it certainly was not meant to be; take a chill pill.

[b bulldog]

B, I find you very offensive and on a daily basis at that.

[Joemailman]

It is only a loss if we can find a suitable replacement but you view the loss much greater than I. He is the only real player we have lost to date so we are pretty much standing still at the moment.

I agree. Thus far we have lost a good, but not great running back, a talented but undependable and injury-prone Tight End, and a once great Fullback who mostly warmed the bench last year. I suspect there are moves other than the draft that will be made to strengthen this team. Time will tell.

[retailguy]

What are you talking about ? I make a joke that is consistent with how I post on a daily basis ? I believe yesterday I was calling myself an @sshole; today I have a BS. If that was offensive it certainly was not meant to be; take a chill pill.


Bretsky, you "piled on". It's part of the mob mentality. You participated. I'm disappointed. Why should you care? I thought I'd get better. I was wrong. I learned. I'm a quick study.

[Bretsky]

What are you talking about ? I make a joke that is consistent with how I post on a daily basis ? I believe yesterday I was calling myself an @sshole; today I have a BS. If that was offensive it certainly was not meant to be; take a chill pill.


Bretsky, you "piled on". It's part of the mob mentality. You participated. I'm disappointed. Why should you care? I thought I'd get better. I was wrong. I learned. I'm a quick study.

My apologies for offending; no harm or intention of piling on was meant by my crack

[retailguy]

It is only a loss if we can find a suitable replacement but you view the loss much greater than I. He is the only real player we have lost to date so we are pretty much standing still at the moment.

I agree. Thus far we have lost a good, but not great running back, a talented but undependable and injury-prone Tight End, and a once great Fullback who mostly warmed the bench last year. I suspect there are moves other than the draft that will be made to strengthen this team. Time will tell.


Hope you're right Joe. I'm not that optimistic. I think that Ahman's loss affects the early season play, much the same as the OL did last year.

I'm quite sure that they can "plug" someone in, however, it takes time to get that person up to speed. That's bad news for a successful 2007 season. In my mind, thats a big loss.

[retailguy]

My apologies for offending; no harm was meant by my crack

I'm a quick study, I won't put myself in that position again. Cross the mob - GET FUCKED and attacked.

It's simple really.

[b bulldog]

I think your making Green to be more than he was but we'll see once the season starts. My biggest question so far is how did TT allow Griffith to sign in Oakland?

[HarveyWallbangers]

Well, here is the proof St. Lou was right. There really is a "clique" in here.

Funny how all I did was respond to Idle using the same language and credentials he had and you are all picking on me but not him.

Seriously, what are you talking about? You are more of the "clique" than idle. You have more friggin' posts than he does and have been here longer.

Who cares what the "mob" thinks. Stand your ground. I find myself at odds with that dickweed Bretsky quite often.

[Bretsky]

Well, here is the proof St. Lou was right. There really is a "clique" in here.

Funny how all I did was respond to Idle using the same language and credentials he had and you are all picking on me but not him.

Seriously, what are you talking about? You are more of the "clique" than idle. You have more friggin' posts than he does and have been here longer.

Who cares what the "mob" thinks. Stand your ground. I find myself at odds with that dickweed Bretsky quite often.


Hey, Go find a Tight end, Wide Receiver, and Safety to sign, will ya ??

[retailguy]

I think your making Green to be more than he was but we'll see once the season starts. My biggest question so far is how did TT allow Griffith to sign in Oakland?

Because he doesn't "value" free agents. His perspective appears to be that they are all overpriced.

Bargain basement deals are a great thing, but paying fair value should be ok too.

I don't get this one either bulldog. I dont' think a FB makes a huge difference, but I think this guy could've got up to speed quickly since he's experienced in the system. Quicker than a rookie anyhow.

But really, relying on Morency has bigger problems than a fullback. I really, really think you minimize the impact of Ahman Green.

We'll see. That's why they play the game.

[retailguy]

Seriously, what are you talking about? You are more of the "clique" than idle. You have more friggin' posts than he does and have been here longer.

Who cares what the "mob" thinks. Stand your ground. I find myself at odds with that dickweed Bretsky quite often.

I have stood my ground and will continue to do so. I'm right after all.

I'm just tired of it Harvey. I went "in your face" for a reason. Everyone thinks I "went nuts" but that's OK. I'm really tired of the 'piling on'.

[Joemailman]

I think your making Green to be more than he was but we'll see once the season starts. My biggest question so far is how did TT allow Griffith to sign in Oakland?

I wonder if it was just about money. The new OC in Oakland coached Griffith in Atlanta. I wonder if that may have been a factor.

[b bulldog]

A good FB who can catch out of the backfield, a strong north, south runner and a strong blocker is a key to having a good running game in the system we are using. He would also be a good mentor for our rookie TB. Green's better days are behind him imo but we will see next season.

[retailguy]

A good FB who can catch out of the backfield, a strong north, south runner and a strong blocker is a key to having a good running game in the system we are using. He would also be a good mentor for our rookie TB. Green's better days are behind him imo but we will see next season.

Yeah, I agree with that too, but there's bigger issues. We need an RB. We need another WR. We need a Safety. We need a backup CB. A backup OT.

Not all of those can come from the draft and contribute in 2007. Just don't understand the plan. I question if there is a plan.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't you feel Thompson hasn't done enough this FA period?

[HarveyWallbangers]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=insidedishmcgaheemovestr&prov=tsn&type=lgns


The Redskins, the league leaders in bad free-agent signings, have done it again. CB Fred Smoot was exposed in Minnesota for being a step slow and unable to play within the design of the defense. If CB Shawn Springs winds up leaving, Smoot hardly will represent an upgrade. The best thing that could happen to the Redskins is for them to re-sign Springs and use Smoot as the third corner. Still, Smoot, 27, didn't warrant the $7 million signing bonus Washington gave him. . . .

FA doesn't work for Washington because they suck at it--not because signing FAs is an all together bad thing.

[retailguy]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't you feel Thompson hasn't done enough this FA period?

I don't think he has. At least not to fill the roster with bodies that could help in 2007.


I have never wanted him to overpay. I did want him to be price competitive.

I thought two or three solid guys to fill out with some of the rookies, gave hope for 07. All rookies makes the team look a lot like 06.

The schedule is tougher next year, and O is not looking too good right now. Big holes at RB, WR, and TE. FB too I guess.

Looks pretty difficult to field a strong team.

I have no clue what's going on in his head. Too many risks to get a reward, I think.

Holes could have been patched. With green, a good WR, and another body at TE, the offense could've been special. Don't see it now.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Well, two of the big "clique" guys in here, Bretsky and I, have your exact same view, and have been spending the last several days defending our positions. I haven't defended you or supported anybody else because I generally try to stay out of those all together--although I haven't always been perfect doing so.

RG, I don't think there is a "clique," but if there was one, I'd consider you a part of it.
:D

[Bretsky]

A good FB who can catch out of the backfield, a strong north, south runner and a strong blocker is a key to having a good running game in the system we are using. He would also be a good mentor for our rookie TB. Green's better days are behind him imo but we will see next season.

Yeah, I agree with that too, but there's bigger issues. We need an RB. We need another WR. We need a Safety. We need a backup CB. A backup OT.

Not all of those can come from the draft and contribute in 2007. Just don't understand the plan. I question if there is a plan.


You forget about WR; we need another starting Caliber WR as one of the top 3

[retailguy]

Well, two of the big "clique" guys in here, Bretsky and I, have your exact same view, and have been spending the last several days defending our positions. I haven't defended you or supported anybody else because I generally try to stay out of those all together--although I haven't always been perfect doing so.

RG, I don't think there is a "clique," but if there was one, I'd consider you a part of it.
:D

there is a clique. perhaps I was a part of it. i won't be any longer.

My point was that NO ONE defended me. NO ONE. KYPack seemingly tried about a week ago, but followed his half hearted defense with "I'm sick of his crap too". Whatever...

[retailguy]

A good FB who can catch out of the backfield, a strong north, south runner and a strong blocker is a key to having a good running game in the system we are using. He would also be a good mentor for our rookie TB. Green's better days are behind him imo but we will see next season.

Yeah, I agree with that too, but there's bigger issues. We need an RB. We need another WR. We need a Safety. We need a backup CB. A backup OT.

Not all of those can come from the draft and contribute in 2007. Just don't understand the plan. I question if there is a plan.


You forget about WR; we need another starting Caliber WR as one of the top 3

? Look at my quote? It's there. I don't think we need it any longer. We don't have an RB. Money spent on a starting caliber receiver is WASTED without a credible running threat.

[HarveyWallbangers]

And he totally forgot about TE or three, and possibly a starting LB. Maybe another DL for the rotation. Can never have enough of those guys..

[gureski]

YOu said we don't have a RB and I've heard multiple people say that but I wonder how different you consider Morency to be then W.Dunn?

With the ZBS, you don't need a RB that is pile driving through guys. YOu need a quick RB with good feet and instincts that can recognize holes and burst through.

The reason Morency has real potential is his speed and quickness. He's in the W.Dunn mold. If Dunn can do it with his limited size then why is it unrealistic to think Morency can possibly be that kind of RB? He has flashed some positive things.

Morency has been in 3 different offense's in 2 years! He came to the Packers after a year in Houston under Capers and then had training camp under Kubiak's offense before finally getting traded to G.B. to learn McCarthy's offense! 3 different offensive schemes in 2 years is alot for a young RB.

Morency has flashed some ability. He's not a power guy but that's okay. You can get another RB to be the change of pace guy and power back. The key here is that Morency has real potential. He may ultimately flop but many have given up on him prematurely. What he brings to the table fits the ZBS.

Morency's biggest challenge is staying healthy. That's what I'm most skeptical about but he's not so often injured that he should be considered unreliable. The jury is truly still out on the guy. This coming year will be the biggest of his career. It will make him or break him.

He can't handle it all himself and he's not the kind of back that A.Green was but that's the hidden point that nobody is talking about. The offense changed. We don't need a RB that plays like A.Green did to succeed in the running game in McCarthy's offense. A Morency could fill the bill. YOu have to look at the scheme being run here and match the RB up with it. Some RB's transcend scheme and can play anywhere. I see Morency as a guy who is physically suited for the ZBS. He's a legitimate option to lead the team in rushing. He will need a mate who can handle the tough yardage but overall, Morency could be another W.Dunn type player. The potential is there. It's valid. You guys should stop saying there is nothing left. We have at least one valid option. It's not a sure-thing but it's a valid option.

[Bretsky]

A good FB who can catch out of the backfield, a strong north, south runner and a strong blocker is a key to having a good running game in the system we are using. He would also be a good mentor for our rookie TB. Green's better days are behind him imo but we will see next season.

Yeah, I agree with that too, but there's bigger issues. We need an RB. We need another WR. We need a Safety. We need a backup CB. A backup OT.

Not all of those can come from the draft and contribute in 2007. Just don't understand the plan. I question if there is a plan.


You forget about WR; we need another starting Caliber WR as one of the top 3

? Look at my quote? It's there. I don't think we need it any longer. We don't have an RB. Money spent on a starting caliber receiver is WASTED without a credible running threat.

OH crap I'm losing it; meant TE

[retailguy]

YOu said we don't have a RB and I've heard multiple people say that but I wonder how different you consider Morency to be then W.Dunn?

With the ZBS, you don't need a RB that is pile driving through guys. YOu need a quick RB with good feet and instincts that can recognize holes and burst through.

The reason Morency has real potential is his speed and quickness. He's in the W.Dunn mold. If Dunn can do it with his limited size then why is it unrealistic to think Morency can possibly be that kind of RB? He has flashed some positive things.

Morency has been in 3 different offense's in 2 years! He came to the Packers after a year in Houston under Capers and then had training camp under Kubiak's offense before finally getting traded to G.B. to learn McCarthy's offense! 3 different offensive schemes in 2 years is alot for a young RB.

Morency has flashed some ability. He's not a power guy but that's okay. You can get another RB to be the change of pace guy and power back. The key here is that Morency has real potential. He may ultimately flop but many have given up on him prematurely. What he brings to the table fits the ZBS.

Morency's biggest challenge is staying healthy. That's what I'm most skeptical about but he's not so often injured that he should be considered unreliable. The jury is truly still out on the guy. This coming year will be the biggest of his career. It will make him or break him.

He can't handle it all himself and he's not the kind of back that A.Green was but that's the hidden point that nobody is talking about. The offense changed. We don't need a RB that plays like A.Green did to succeed in the running game in McCarthy's offense. A Morency could fill the bill. YOu have to look at the scheme being run here and match the RB up with it. Some RB's transcend scheme and can play anywhere. I see Morency as a guy who is physically suited for the ZBS. He's a legitimate option to lead the team in rushing. He will need a mate who can handle the tough yardage but overall, Morency could be another W.Dunn type player. The potential is there. It's valid. You guys should stop saying there is nothing left. We have at least one valid option. It's not a sure-thing but it's a valid option.

your whole point is based on the OL being suitable. the OL did not play well until the final few games of the year. Not PROOF by my standard. Green gained those yards last year largely on his own.

Morency will not do that. EVER.

It MIGHT be a valid option or might not.... we'll see cause he's all we've got.

[the_idle_threat]

I have a BA in Managerial Accounting (after switching from an Economics/Political Science major (6 credits short)), I do have a minor in econ. I also have an MBA, and have taught macro and micro economics at the Community College level.


Geesh - do you want to measure pee pees?

No ... I'll bet he doesn't. :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Patler]

Patler, if you read my posts carefully, you'll see that the "loss" is that Ahman Green is gone. That doesn't have anything to do with money. Claiming that he could get injured is a "much different thing". Every team is succeptible to that.

You know what my point is, please don't try to distort it.

Losing a back with Green's ability is a loss, even if it becomes the right financial decision.

Well, Retailguy, if you would read my posts carefully, you would know that my point was addressing exactly what you now say that your point is. I suggested that Green being gone may be no loss at all, and could just as well be a gain.. There is no way we can know now, today, whether not having him during the 2007 season will be a loss or not. It may be a loss or it may be a gain.

For you to write,

whether Houston overpaid, or not, Green Bay still LOST in this deal, because Green was a good football player, and intrinsically, has more value HERE than anywhere else. Regardless of whether or not he was "overpaid", there is an unfilled HOLE in Green Bay, and any manner in which you choose to slice it, that's a LOSS.

is not a provable condition at the present time. It is no more a "defined fact" than is the position of others about whom you complain, that Ahman Green was paid too much. In case you've forgotten, you wrote:


I happen to agree with you, in his case, by thinking that Ahman got more than he should have, but disagree that this is a "defined fact" as most posters in this room claim. There is more to the story, and the "outcome" can't be judged until Christmas.

I would suggest that your statement that "Green Bay LOST in this deal" also is not a "defined fact" and the outcome can't be judged until Christmas.

[Patler]

I think your making Green to be more than he was but we'll see once the season starts. My biggest question so far is how did TT allow Griffith to sign in Oakland?

I wonder if it was just about money. The new OC in Oakland coached Griffith in Atlanta. I wonder if that may have been a factor.

Of course not! Don't you realize that EVERY NFL player would chose to play in Green Bay if ONLY Ted Thompson would give them the chance to! :lol: :lol:

[SD GB fan]

I think your making Green to be more than he was but we'll see once the season starts. My biggest question so far is how did TT allow Griffith to sign in Oakland?

I wonder if it was just about money. The new OC in Oakland coached Griffith in Atlanta. I wonder if that may have been a factor.

Of course not! Don't you realize that EVERY NFL player would chose to play in Green Bay if ONLY Ted Thompson would give them the chance to! :lol: :lol:

yeah, the cold weather is really attractive, i hear.

[the_idle_threat]

Well, here is the proof St. Lou was right. There really is a "clique" in here.

Funny how all I did was respond to Idle using the same language and credentials he had and you are all picking on me but not him.

WHY?

Simple

"The mob" agrees with him.

Even Bretsky.... Well, I expected better but not surprised.

Sounds like "the mob" mostly agrees with you, professor ( :lol: ), in substance if not in style. They're not out to get you.

And the funny thing is, I mostly agree with you too, in substance but definitely not in style. It seems we both agree that TT would have had to overpay to keep Green (given the rational value---or value range :roll: ---that should be placed on a player with Green's talent given his age, recent production, injury history, etc.). And we both seem to agree that TT probably should have overpaid to keep Green, given the team's needs at running back, and Green's goodwill value in the community.

We differ where you seem to think that when TT decided Ahman's ultimate asking price was too high, then TT is an idiot who has not done his homework. I give TT the benefit of the doubt that he has stuck to a fair value. Funny thing is, with your apparent background, you should understand TT's side of things better than anybody. You're arguing against your own common sense.

Consider this: Say you spend an appropriate amount of time estimating the value of a business, by examining assets, sales, expenses, cash flow, overall market, competition, etc., and you arrive at a number (or a range :lol: ). Wouldn't you be pissed if a bunch of railbirds who just read about the business in the paper, or live near it, or maybe even shop there, called you an idiot because in their opinion the business is worth a whole lot more?

How is this different than our criticism of TT? He has a scouting staff and coaches and cap people at his disposal that allow him to make a pretty thorough analysis of any player's projected value. It's pretty pretentious to believe we know better than him because we read the newspaper and internet message boards, and we play fantasy football.

And by the way, if you have the credentials you claim in economics, then you know that the winner's curse (http://www.investopedia.com/terms/w/winnerscurse.asp) is not something I just made up. It's a valid concern in an auction market, and I'm certainly not the first to link it to free agency in sports. (http://economics.about.com/cs/baseballeconomics/a/winners_curse.htm)

My point is that since bidders tend to overpay in an auction market (free agency), they need to mostly avoid the auction market (build from within and sign their own developing players before they get to the open market), and when they do participate, be strategic about who to overpay and when so that they maximize the value of their allotted dollars. Isn't that the whole point of economics, professor? To allocate finite resources in order to maximize utility?

With half-a-dozen holes on the roster that need to be filled, TT is wise to avoid charging into bidding wars in the first week of free agency, where he will overpay to fill maybe two or three holes and then be stuck against the cap. There are other high-mileage running backs on the market (or soon to be on the market) who will sign for a lot less than $8 million in 2007: Dillon, Droughns, Mike Anderson all come to mind. Two of them even have a history of success in the ZBS. The offseason is young. TT's time to improve the roster has not yet run out.

[KYPack]

Well, two of the big "clique" guys in here, Bretsky and I, have your exact same view, and have been spending the last several days defending our positions. I haven't defended you or supported anybody else because I generally try to stay out of those all together--although I haven't always been perfect doing so.

RG, I don't think there is a "clique," but if there was one, I'd consider you a part of it.
:D

there is a clique. perhaps I was a part of it. i won't be any longer.

My point was that NO ONE defended me. NO ONE. KYPack seemingly tried about a week ago, but followed his half hearted defense with "I'm sick of his crap too". Whatever...

Hold the phone, RG.

I did defend you, mainly because you were lumped into a lunatic fringe reference with another poster that doesn't have a lot of crediblity.

I happen to think you are a knowlegeable Packer fans who has:

A Some unpopular ideas which are valid.
B Some crazy notions that don't hold any water.

You will defend both kinds of ideas ad nauseum and continue to bleat on no matter how much evidence to the contrary is presented.

And hey, that's OK. I've been on Forums that are pretty homogenous in their ideas, and those Forums are boring.

A good Forum has different kinds of posters and different philosophies.

You are a contrarian and contrarians are good for any forum.

But, they have to have a helluva lot thicker skin than you seem to possess.

So be a contrarian, but toughen up.

There ain't no mob.

You know the difference between a crowd and a mob?

A mob has a leader.

PS, KGB is an overpaid mistake

PSS, This thread does NOT blow.

[woodbuck27]

Before we all count to three and jump at the same time..... let's actually hold on til we find out how much Thompson offerred the guy. Every time a player goes somewhere else it's not because the money was better. Usually but not always. Vinatieri went to Indy because he wanted to win, not because the Packers didn't make a high offer. Let's just wait and see what comes out here. Mabye the Packers made a nice pitch but Griffith decided that he'd rather play in Oakland if the money is close?

'' Let's just wait and see what comes out here. Mabye the Packers made a nice pitch but Griffith decided that he'd rather play in Oakland if the money is close? '' gureski

Griffith signed with Oakland.Not a powerhouse.

[Zool]

Wow....just plain wow. I'm taking my ball and I'm going home.

If we want to stop new people from coming here we should have more threads like this whiny bitch session. It would do just the trick.

[woodbuck27]

'' If you think this 34 year old FB was one of the keys to this year's season turning out then be mad. If not, don't act outraged just to do it. It's getting old. '' guerski

He's not 34 years old.

# 33 Justin Griffith Position: FB Height: 5-11 Weight: 232
Born: 04/13/1981 College: Mississippi State NFL Experience: 5

[woodbuck27]

I stand corrected in the age department but my overall point still stands. People are just frothing with negativity right now and every day its' a different player. I can see why some people would be pissed about the FB position and why they'd feel it's key but I haven't actually heard anyone say that and say why they feel it was such a key signing. It's just one big pile-on party right now and it's been going on for days every time a guy gets signed. It's getting old.

What's getting old is the pathological blind defenses of Ted's offseason. Your lines are the ones getting old. This team is not improving. AT ALL.

THERE IS ZERO REASON for this. Unless you're on the 2009 plan.

:roll: You and Woodbuck I tell ya..For some reason humans just LOVE negativity I guess..That must be why the first thing on the nightly news on a daily basis is death and destruction, not anything positive. People love it..

Just exactly what has Ted Thompson done for OUR team of late (in free agency») that's positive to respond to with praise imscott72?

This forum is composed of people who can study what is going on and make rational analysis and resposes to either agree or otherwise with Ted Thompson's manner and approach to being OUR teams GM.

This is a forum or a form of the democratic process.

For any member to reduce it by making personal atttacks by calling out any member by name isn't proper behaviour imscott72.

If you don't like a member because of his or her stances. Debate the stance but don't attempt to win the membership to your side or view by calling member's out.

Defend your positions otherwise please.

Again.

If you don't like reading my critiques of Ted Thompson simply ignore my posts. I feel that's an acceptable, fair and mature response.

Now. I must say it's really very sad to see Ted Thompson dig his own grave with a lack of flexibility and a common sense approach towards making us competitive in 2007.

[gureski]

'' If you think this 34 year old FB was one of the keys to this year's season turning out then be mad. If not, don't act outraged just to do it. It's getting old. '' guerski

He's not 34 years old.

# 33 Justin Griffith Position: FB Height: 5-11 Weight: 232
Born: 04/13/1981 College: Mississippi State NFL Experience: 5

Please.... Read the posts before you start replying to stuff that's already been hashed over. I know he's not 34. I was thinking of the other FB in Atlanta from the past few years, McCrary. McCrary is 34. I admitted my mistake in that. The real issue that I was broaching was the rush to riot every time a player is signed somewhere else.

Within hours of the the word unofficially leaking about the Oakland deal with Griffith, guys were forming a 'mob' and calling for Thompson to be fired. Nobody knew anything for sure or how things happened but the 'mob' was coming for Thompson and his dog. It was a 'shoot first and ask questions later' mentality in here.

I called for some common sense to be reinjected into things. We were, as a group, getting impatient and jumping the gun with unsubstantiated negative criticism. That was happening. Missing one free agent is not grounds for termination. A GM's record of success over 10 days of free agency is not a legitimate amount of time to evaluate his performance. As fans, we are at the mercy of leaks and news reports. We don't know who is being contacted and who isn't. We don't know who has been in for visits or who has been invited to visits and declined. We don't know who was offerred contracts or for how much and how many years and we certainly have no idea (within hours of a deal being leaked) why some players choose other teams over G.B.. We don't know any of that and it needed to be said. Some guys were going overboard with negativity based on nothing more then their own impatient speculation. That kind of self-generating negativity does nothing for anyone, including the people posting it.

I think we're all back on track. I saw a couple of signings this weekend and did not witness the negative revolt that I had seen over the week prior. I think people have their bearings again. It's not about whether you like what's happening or not, it's about just keeping things in perspective so we can have legitimate debate over things. In a legitimate debate about Ted Thompson you would not point to a lack of signings over the first 10 days of free agency as reason for termination. (not unless you wanted the guy fired to begin with). In a normal conversation you would not scream for the GM to be fired just because he missed out on one single free agent FB. You could be pissed but common sense tells you that you should judge someone on their overall results, not one player. You can have a feeling about things but again, you wouldn't actually rush to the board and declare the upcoming season a failure because the first 10 days of a weak free agent class didn't produce a signing. That's crazy. How can you have legitimate debate when the premise is is anything but legitimate? That's all my intent was. You can agree that things were getting out of hand or not. It doesn't matter. I think the moment has passed.

[prsnfoto]

YOu said we don't have a RB and I've heard multiple people say that but I wonder how different you consider Morency to be then W.Dunn?

With the ZBS, you don't need a RB that is pile driving through guys. YOu need a quick RB with good feet and instincts that can recognize holes and burst through.

The reason Morency has real potential is his speed and quickness. He's in the W.Dunn mold. If Dunn can do it with his limited size then why is it unrealistic to think Morency can possibly be that kind of RB? He has flashed some positive things.

Morency has been in 3 different offense's in 2 years! He came to the Packers after a year in Houston under Capers and then had training camp under Kubiak's offense before finally getting traded to G.B. to learn McCarthy's offense! 3 different offensive schemes in 2 years is alot for a young RB.

Morency has flashed some ability. He's not a power guy but that's okay. You can get another RB to be the change of pace guy and power back. The key here is that Morency has real potential. He may ultimately flop but many have given up on him prematurely. What he brings to the table fits the ZBS.

Morency's biggest challenge is staying healthy. That's what I'm most skeptical about but he's not so often injured that he should be considered unreliable. The jury is truly still out on the guy. This coming year will be the biggest of his career. It will make him or break him.

He can't handle it all himself and he's not the kind of back that A.Green was but that's the hidden point that nobody is talking about. The offense changed. We don't need a RB that plays like A.Green did to succeed in the running game in McCarthy's offense. A Morency could fill the bill. YOu have to look at the scheme being run here and match the RB up with it. Some RB's transcend scheme and can play anywhere. I see Morency as a guy who is physically suited for the ZBS. He's a legitimate option to lead the team in rushing. He will need a mate who can handle the tough yardage but overall, Morency could be another W.Dunn type player. The potential is there. It's valid. You guys should stop saying there is nothing left. We have at least one valid option. It's not a sure-thing but it's a valid option.

your whole point is based on the OL being suitable. the OL did not play well until the final few games of the year. Not PROOF by my standard. Green gained those yards last year largely on his own.

Morency will not do that. EVER.

It MIGHT be a valid option or might not.... we'll see cause he's all we've got.

So what are you saying the line didn't block for Ahman and did for Morency? Because he had a better per rush average,one half the yards on 40% of the carries, and twice as many explosive runs. Look your'e a smart guy and we always seem to butt heads mainly because I don't share your Sherman love and now Ahman Green love. I liked Green but to use statements like never ever is nuts you may be right, I may be right ( I don't think we will miss Ahman as far as productivity on the field) we will all find out soon enough.

[woodbuck27]

I have a BS Degree

I'm a BullShit artist and pretty dang good at it.... :lol:

I'm a longtime Packer fan that can see the beginning of an off season that points in the direction of a losing season in 2007.

I'm surprized that Justin Griffith signed the contract he did with Oakland (only two seasons at not a ton of money) and that Ted Thompson couldn't offer him more incentive to sign with us.

Maybe Ted forgot to tell him to call him before signing a better offer? Maybe Ted forgot to make him any offer?

Did we absolutely need Justin Griffith?

NO !

I don't believe we should insist that TT sign many players. It's certainly fair to insist that Ted Thompson makes sensable moves overall in the offseason to allow us to advance in this season over last.

I don't believe that there is one member of this forum that revels over negativity or presumed failure on Ted Thompson's part.

With some $23 million under the CAP - the question is. Why did Justin Griffith go to Oakland when he appears now to have been a solid fit and affordable as well?

Ted Thompson will get criticism for this issue and the painful thing for this Packer fan is that it appears that he doesn't give a DAM.

It only appears that way. :)

Ted Thompson will be judged based on results in 2007. No rational Packer fan hopes that we are embarassed in this season or suffer a setback.

If 'in fact' we do just that.Are embarassed on the field I believe that Ted Thompson's days in Green Bay are about over.

I'm just a Packer fan. For me to call for him to be fired doesn't carry any weight. So why go there?

Yet. The collective fan reaction to his ways, certainly has a bearing on his future as GM.

[woodbuck27]

[quote=woodbuck27]'' If you think this 34 year old FB was one of the keys to this year's season turning out then be mad. If not, don't act outraged just to do it. It's getting old. '' guerski

He's not 34 years old.

# 33 Justin Griffith Position: FB Height: 5-11 Weight: 232
Born: 04/13/1981 College: Mississippi State NFL Experience: 5

'' Please.... Read the posts before you start replying to stuff that's already been hashed over. I know he's not 34. '' guerski

I apologize to you for that guerski.

I'm not taking you on personally guerski, or otherwise attempting to demean you. That's not my style.

When I made that post I read more than one of your posts that referred to Justin Griffith as being 34 years of age.In fact I had to check to ensure otherwise. :)

I should have read further through this thread. I've done that and it's HOT.

[gureski]

The issue revolves around whether or not it's accurate to look at Morency as a valid option. Some people have tied themselves to doom and gloom at the RB spot so much so that to admit Morency is a valid option....just to say he's a valid option....hurts their credability. If Morency is a valid option then it makes letting Green go less offensive. That's all this is about. Based on the same criteria that we judge players with all the time, Morency is a valid option at RB.

Last year and years prior, people looked at N.Davenport as a valid option for RB. S.Gado was looked upon as a valid option at RB. Some of the same people saying Morency is 'nothing' or not a valid option probably took different stances on Davenport and Gado. Why would that be? Morency was the 9th pick in the third round from just 2 years ago. He's got great speed and athletic ability. He's flashed promise when given the opportunity to play. Why would he not be considered a valid option?

Morency is more then just a warm body. He has real potential. Why can't some of you admit that? It's not crazy. It's substantiated by fact and his past performance. Nobody is pushing you to say he's going to be the answer. Just admit that he's a viable option. That's all. The cupboard isn't bare. There is at least one option sitting there.

[gureski]

[quote=woodbuck27]'' If you think this 34 year old FB was one of the keys to this year's season turning out then be mad. If not, don't act outraged just to do it. It's getting old. '' guerski

He's not 34 years old.

# 33 Justin Griffith Position: FB Height: 5-11 Weight: 232
Born: 04/13/1981 College: Mississippi State NFL Experience: 5

Please.... Read the posts before you start replying to stuff that's already been hashed over. I know he's not 34.

I apologize to you for that.

I'm not taking you on personally guerski, or otherwise attempting to demean you. That's not my style.

When I made that post I read more than one of your posts that referred to Justin Griffith as being 34 years of age.In fact I had to check to ensure otherwise. :)

I should have read further through this thread. I've done that and it's HOT.

No need for the apologies. I just didnt' want to rehash stuff that already had been gone over. I know you're not attacking me. I don't mind a negative comment when it's warranted. I was wrong on the age thing and deserved the flak I got from it. Don't apologize.

[woodbuck27]

''I called for some common sense to be reinjected into things. We were, as a group, getting impatient and jumping the gun with unsubstantiated negative criticism. That was happening. Missing one free agent is not grounds for termination. A GM's record of success over 10 days of free agency is not a legitimate amount of time to evaluate his performance. As fans, we are at the mercy of leaks and news reports. We don't know who is being contacted and who isn't. We don't know who has been in for visits or who has been invited to visits and declined. We don't know who was offerred contracts or for how much and how many years and we certainly have no idea (within hours of a deal being leaked) why some players choose other teams over G.B.. We don't know any of that and it needed to be said. Some guys were going overboard with negativity based on nothing more then their own impatient speculation. That kind of self-generating negativity does nothing for anyone, including the people posting it.

I think we're all back on track. I saw a couple of signings this weekend and did not witness the negative revolt that I had seen over the week prior. I think people have their bearings again. It's not about whether you like what's happening or not, it's about just keeping things in perspective so we can have legitimate debate over things. In a legitimate debate about Ted Thompson you would not point to a lack of signings over the first 10 days of free agency as reason for termination. (not unless you wanted the guy fired to begin with). In a normal conversation you would not scream for the GM to be fired just because he missed out on one single free agent FB. You could be pissed but common sense tells you that you should judge someone on their overall results, not one player. You can have a feeling about things but again, you wouldn't actually rush to the board and declare the upcoming season a failure because the first 10 days of a weak free agent class didn't produce a signing. That's crazy. How can you have legitimate debate when the premise is is anything but legitimate? That's all my intent was. You can agree that things were getting out of hand or not. It doesn't matter. I think the moment has passed.'' guerski

Are you directing any of this at me?

I have never posted in this off season that I felt that Ted Thompson should be FIRED for doing or not doing anything.

[gureski]

It was directed to you only with the intent to explain what happened. I wasn't saying you said certain things, I was explaining why this blow-up happened. There were a number of people, whom are quoted in one of my early posts, that were saying the things I mention about Thompson needing to be fired and the season having been lost already.

I was merely bringing you up to speed on why things happened, not accusing you of saying it.

[woodbuck27]

''Hold the phone, RG.

I did defend you, mainly because you were lumped into a lunatic fringe reference with another poster that doesn't have a lot of crediblity.'' KYPack

''mainly because you were lumped into a lunatic fringe reference with another poster that doesn't have a lot of crediblity'' KYPack

KYPack:

Who is this other poster who you state. . .

doesn't have alot of credibility?

I am digesting at his point in time that you are referring to me. That doesn't feel too good.

Oh wait a second. I should have thick skin?

NO !!

I should have a fair opportunity to debate and defend my SELF. Noone on this forum deserves to have to sustain backhanded stabs,snide or rude remarks or pêrsonal attacks based in ignorance.

Is that the direction we want to go to on this forum? Personal attacks and judgements based in ignorance and prejudice?

I'm negative because I'm a Canadian is bullshit and holds no water.I'm sometimes negative because my reactions to the affairs of the Packers is simply negative.

DAM it.

RG has defended his position on the loss of Ahman Green more than just OK. Yet no matter how that loss came about. I feel that as a collective (forum) we have to get past that now.

[Zool]

Can we let this die already?

[woodbuck27]

It was directed to you only with the intent to explain what happened. I wasn't saying you said certain things, I was explaining why this blow-up happened. There were a number of people, whom are quoted in one of my early posts, that were saying the things I mention about Thompson needing to be fired and the season having been lost already.

I was merely bringing you up to speed on why things happened, not accusing you of saying it.

Believe this.

I most often and have now read this entire thread. See my last post.

[the_idle_threat]

''Hold the phone, RG.

I did defend you, mainly because you were lumped into a lunatic fringe reference with another poster that doesn't have a lot of crediblity.'' KYPack

''mainly because you were lumped into a lunatic fringe reference with another poster that doesn't have a lot of crediblity''

KYPack:

Who is this other poster who you state. . .

doesn't have alot of credibility?

I am digesting at his point in time that you are referring to me.That doesn't feel too good.

Oh wait a second. I should have thick skin?

NO !! I should have a fair opportunity to debate and defend my SELF. Noone on this forum deserves to have to sustain backhanded stabs,snide or rude remarks or pêrsonal attacks based in ignorance.

Is that the direction we want to go to on this forum? Personal attacks and judgements based in ignorance and prejudice?

I'm negative because I'm a Canadian is bullshit and holds no water.I'm sometimes negative because my reactions to the affairs of the Packers is simply negative.

DAM it.

RG has defended his position on the loss of Ahman Green more than just OK. Yet no matter how that loss came about. I feel that as a collective (forum) we have to get past that now.

Woody, KY was talking about Tank, not about you. Somebody made a post that lumped together Retailguy and Tank.

[MJZiggy]

Can we let this die already?

I'm with you.

[woodbuck27]

''Hold the phone, RG.

I did defend you, mainly because you were lumped into a lunatic fringe reference with another poster that doesn't have a lot of crediblity.'' KYPack

''mainly because you were lumped into a lunatic fringe reference with another poster that doesn't have a lot of crediblity''

KYPack:

Who is this other poster who you state. . .

doesn't have alot of credibility?

I am digesting at his point in time that you are referring to me.That doesn't feel too good.

Oh wait a second. I should have thick skin?

NO !! I should have a fair opportunity to debate and defend my SELF. Noone on this forum deserves to have to sustain backhanded stabs,snide or rude remarks or pêrsonal attacks based in ignorance.

Is that the direction we want to go to on this forum? Personal attacks and judgements based in ignorance and prejudice?

I'm negative because I'm a Canadian is bullshit and holds no water.I'm sometimes negative because my reactions to the affairs of the Packers is simply negative.

DAM it.

RG has defended his position on the loss of Ahman Green more than just OK. Yet no matter how that loss came about. I feel that as a collective (forum) we have to get past that now.

Woody, KY was talking about Tank, not about you. Somebody made a post that lumped together Retailguy and Tank.

Whatever.. .but thanks for the post all the same.

This past week has been very difficult to be a concerned Packer fan. :)

I believe if we take Ahman Green out of the picture that there is still time for Ted Thompson to make a recovery.

I do question the fact he was unable to sign Justin Griffith.

A very bright man once said something to the effect:

''If as people observing a situation, we believe that we know all that went on to contribute to a result. Then we are most often mistaken.''

[the_idle_threat]

That's a very good quote, Woody. 8)

My 2 cents on Griffith, as I wrote elsewhere, is that I was surprised we didn't sign him too. He seemed to be a good fit, and it looks like he was not too expensive. But then I remembered that even the best rookie fullbacks are often drafted in the low rounds. Griffith isn't the only option out there. :idea:

[woodbuck27]

That's a very good quote, Woody. 8)

My 2 cents on Griffith, as I wrote elsewhere, is that I was surprised we didn't sign him too. He seemed to be a good fit, and it looks like he was not too expensive. But then I remembered that even the best rookie fullbacks are often drafted in the low rounds. Griffith isn't the only option out there. :idea:

My gut feeling after he left Green Bay:

That he wouldn't be a Packer. I based that on his talent, fit and age and OUR needs for such a player.

As I recall the Charles Woodson signing.The coming and the goings of players shouldn't necessarily signify a given result for or against us. I just had a gut feeling that Griffith was gone.

[KYPack]

''Hold the phone, RG.

I did defend you, mainly because you were lumped into a lunatic fringe reference with another poster that doesn't have a lot of crediblity.'' KYPack

''mainly because you were lumped into a lunatic fringe reference with another poster that doesn't have a lot of crediblity'' KYPack

KYPack:

Who is this other poster who you state. . .

doesn't have alot of credibility?

I am digesting at his point in time that you are referring to me. That doesn't feel too good.

Oh wait a second. I should have thick skin?

NO !!

I should have a fair opportunity to debate and defend my SELF. Noone on this forum deserves to have to sustain backhanded stabs,snide or rude remarks or pêrsonal attacks based in ignorance.

Is that the direction we want to go to on this forum? Personal attacks and judgements based in ignorance and prejudice?

I'm negative because I'm a Canadian is bullshit and holds no water.I'm sometimes negative because my reactions to the affairs of the Packers is simply negative.

DAM it.

RG has defended his position on the loss of Ahman Green more than just OK. Yet no matter how that loss came about. I feel that as a collective (forum) we have to get past that now.

OK Buck.

Calm down by a factor 10 or so.

Yeah, the "2nd man" to which I refer was the world famous goofball, Tank.

I didn't refer to him by name because my "Tank-hate" is pretty well chronicled by now, & I don't wanna keep bringing that up because it can be annoying to some.

"I am digesting at his point in time that you are referring to me."

Then you have a case of indigestion.

If I was gonna attack ya, I'd name ya and we'd go at it. I've never been known as the "shy guy".

As far as my attacking you for being a Canadian, my credentials as a Anti-Canadian, Anti-moose-jumping Canuck hater speak for themselves.

Take the afor-mentioned chill pill, bro.

As far as ending this thread, I say no.

This is the best thread on here since everybody yelled at Mazzin for her inability to read the piss sticks.

[Cobra Kai]

That's a very good quote, Woody. 8)

My 2 cents on Griffith, as I wrote elsewhere, is that I was surprised we didn't sign him too. He seemed to be a good fit, and it looks like he was not too expensive. But then I remembered that even the best rookie fullbacks are often drafted in the low rounds. Griffith isn't the only option out there. :idea:

Something else that may have happened is they gave Jagodzinski a call and ask him his thoughts on Griffith from his days in Atlanta. And perhaps Jags didn't give them such a glowing report.

[woodbuck27]

''Hold the phone, RG.

I did defend you, mainly because you were lumped into a lunatic fringe reference with another poster that doesn't have a lot of crediblity.'' KYPack

''mainly because you were lumped into a lunatic fringe reference with another poster that doesn't have a lot of crediblity'' KYPack

KYPack:

Who is this other poster who you state. . .

doesn't have alot of credibility?

I am digesting at his point in time that you are referring to me. That doesn't feel too good.

Oh wait a second. I should have thick skin?

NO !!

I should have a fair opportunity to debate and defend my SELF. Noone on this forum deserves to have to sustain backhanded stabs,snide or rude remarks or pêrsonal attacks based in ignorance.

Is that the direction we want to go to on this forum? Personal attacks and judgements based in ignorance and prejudice?

I'm negative because I'm a Canadian is bullshit and holds no water.I'm sometimes negative because my reactions to the affairs of the Packers is simply negative.

DAM it.

RG has defended his position on the loss of Ahman Green more than just OK. Yet no matter how that loss came about. I feel that as a collective (forum) we have to get past that now.

OK Buck.

Calm down by a factor 10 or so.

Yeah, the "2nd man" to which I refer was the world famous goofball, Tank.

I didn't refer to him by name because my "Tank-hate" is pretty well chronicled by now, & I don't wanna keep bringing that up because it can be annoying to some.

"I am digesting at his point in time that you are referring to me."

Then you have a case of indigestion.

If I was gonna attack ya, I'd name ya and we'd go at it. I've never been known as the "shy guy".

As far as my attacking you for being a Canadian, my credentials as a Anti-Canadian, Anti-moose-jumping Canuck hater speak for themselves.

Take the afor-mentioned chill pill, bro.

As far as ending this thread, I say no.

This is the best thread on here since everybody yelled at Mazzin for her inability to read the piss sticks.

Got it. :)

[the_idle_threat]

That's a very good quote, Woody. 8)

My 2 cents on Griffith, as I wrote elsewhere, is that I was surprised we didn't sign him too. He seemed to be a good fit, and it looks like he was not too expensive. But then I remembered that even the best rookie fullbacks are often drafted in the low rounds. Griffith isn't the only option out there. :idea:

Something else that may have happened is they gave Jagodzinski a call and ask him his thoughts on Griffith from his days in Atlanta. And perhaps Jags didn't give them such a glowing report.

Another interesting possibility ... :idea: :idea: :idea:

[HarveyWallbangers]

Wouldn't they have called him before bringing him in for a visit?

Seems like they would have done that research before taking the time and money to bring him in. Bringing a guy in for a visit signals that a team has serious interest in the player. Research should have been completed by the time the player visited.

[the_idle_threat]

Wouldn't they have called him before bringing him in for a visit?

Seems like they would have done that research before taking the time and money to bring him in. Bringing a guy in for a visit signals that a team has serious interest in the player. Research should have been completed by the time the player visited.

Possibly. But then again, maybe they had questions that came up as a result of the visit. The point is that we really don't know.

[woodbuck27]

Wouldn't they have called him before bringing him in for a visit?

Seems like they would have done that research before taking the time and money to bring him in. Bringing a guy in for a visit signals that a team has serious interest in the player. Research should have been completed by the time the player visited.

Jaysus, Mary and Joseph.

What evidence do we have that JAGS is still a consultant with 'the Packers'?

Yes Harvey. If he is then TT would call him (JAGS) prior to bringing in Griffith and wasting his time.

[gureski]

I read that there were two former members of the Falcons Offensive staff that are now on Oakland's staff and they were instrumental in getting Griffith to pick the Raiders. That's what I read on ESPN (I think it was).


edit:

I looked it up and it was from ESPN. Here is a tidbit of that article:

In Oakland, he will be reunited with assistant coaches Greg Knapp and Tom Cable on the staff assembled by rookie head coach Lane Kiffin. Knapp was the offensive coordinator in Atlanta for three of Griffith's four seasons there and Cable was the offensive line coach in 2006.


It is believed that both coaches lobbied hard for the addition of Griffith, who is a prototype West Coast offense fullback.

[MadtownPacker]

I had to shred my fan letter to Griffith. :cry:






:P

[MJZiggy]

What did you say that it needed shredding???!! :shock:

[Guiness]

Can we let this die already?

I'm with you.

Nah. It's too much fun. Maybe we can restrict the bitching about TT's lack of activity to one thread - and this signing (or lack of signing) seems to have hit the biggest nerve.

Myself, I'm with the confused group. :huh:

I don't know why TT hasn't signed anyone yet - I have trouble believing there is NO ONE out there that could've helped us. And we should have the pocket book to get who we target if we want them.

[Scott Campbell]

This past week has been very difficult to be a concerned Packer fan. :)


I think Woody hit the nail on the head here. This FA period has dissapointed many thus far, though it shouldn't be entirely a surprise given Ted's well documented methodology. It's difficult to be patient while other teams sign players, and we are intentionally left in the dark regarding the plan. So people are getting kind of pissy.

But some of the comments that blatently state that Ted isn't doing anything are just plain inflamatory. You might as well yell fire in a crowded theater. Just because you can't see what's going on, it doesn't mean that nothing is going on. In fact it's an assumption that borders on ridiculous. So those kind of irresponsible comments are bound to illicite equally strong responses and trigger escalated disagreements.

Having said that, I'd love to see us pluck a couple of starters out of the remaining scrap heap. But there is plenty of time before the games start. So I'm not going to get too worked up one way or the other for a while.

[KYPack]

The other thing that struck me about Griffith was that he seemed to fit TT's "vet FA" profile. A vet FA that came cheap and might give us a season.

Maybe TT has soured on these kind of guys after the Ben Taylor, Raynoch Thompson deals went fairly sour.

I'd hate to think that he's even soured on these kind of guys and wants to sit the whole dance out, but who really knows?

[Scott Campbell]

I'd hate to think that he's even soured on these kind of guys and wants to sit the whole dance out, but who really knows?


Can't you pick up those kinds of guys during the roster cut-downs? You'd sure pay a lot less then.

[the_idle_threat]

The other thing is ... the difference between the "best" almost-washed-up vet and the 3rd or 4th best almost-washed-up vet is probably not all that much. No sense in getting in a bidding war for the "best" guy in the first week of free agency if there are other guys out there.

[KYPack]

The other thing is ... the difference between the "best" almost-washed-up vet and the 3rd or 4th best almost-washed-up vet is probably not all that much. No sense in getting in a bidding war for the "best" guy in the first week of free agency if there are other guys out there.

These last two points are valid.

TT doesn't like the vet FA market and has never warmed to it.

An oft-repeated example is NO last year. Thye rebuilt their D with bargain basement guys. let's us get those evaluators and add some spots. Our team only has a few gaping holes, we just need 25% of the Saints luck!

[woodbuck27]

This past week has been very difficult to be a concerned Packer fan. :)


I think Woody hit the nail on the head here. This FA period has dissapointed many thus far, though it shouldn't be entirely a surprise given Ted's well documented methodology. It's difficult to be patient while other teams sign players, and we are intentionally left in the dark regarding the plan. So people are getting kind of pissy.

But some of the comments that blatently state that Ted isn't doing anything are just plain inflamatory. You might as well yell fire in a crowded theater. Just because you can't see what's going on, it doesn't mean that nothing is going on. In fact it's an assumption that borders on ridiculous. So those kind of irresponsible comments are bound to illicite equally strong responses and trigger escalated disagreements.

Having said that, I'd love to see us pluck a couple of starters out of the remaining scrap heap. But there is plenty of time before the games start. So I'm not going to get too worked up one way or the other for a while.

It's still early.

We'll put a decent team on the field after the smoke has cleared. It's often difficult all the same given all the smoke. :)

[Scott Campbell]

there is a clique. perhaps I was a part of it. i won't be any longer.

My point was that NO ONE defended me. NO ONE. KYPack seemingly tried about a week ago, but followed his half hearted defense with "I'm sick of his crap too". Whatever...

http://www.ehponline.org/docs/2005/113-2/crybaby.jpg