Barnett Contract Done

[POLISHHAWK]

Nuff Said

[BF4MVP]

Packers sign Barnett to long-term extension

Press-Gazette

The Green Bay Packers announced this morning that they've signed linebacker Nick Barnett to a long-term contract extension.


General Manager Ted Thompson made the announcement in a statement released by the team.

Barnett, 25, has led the Packers in tackles three of his four seasons. The 6-foot-2, 232-pounder is going into his fifth season with the Packers.

He was to make $1.95 million in base salary this season, which was the final season of the contract he signed as a rookie.

[Sparkey]

Now that Barnett has his $$$, will he be more receptive to moving outside so that Hodge can play the middle?

Assuming Hodge is capable of playing the middle in the NFL ????

[BF4MVP]

Assuming Hodge is capable of playing the middle in the NFL ????
That's a pretty big assumption..Judging by his play last year, he's not as ready as I thought he'd be coming out of college..

[MJZiggy]

Assuming Hodge is capable of playing the middle in the NFL ????

That's the tricky part.

[woodbuck27]

I believe that Barnett's stance has always been that he deserves the middle.

[Chester Marcol]

That's great news getting this behind us. Hate the contract talks that outsiders always have to make an issue. We wouldn't have been able to listen to even one Barnett interview without hearing a contract question.

As far as where he plays, I would much prefer going into this season with more certainties than more experiments. Last year was a perfect time for that with the new coaches and not really knowing where everyone would shake out. The need to experiment and shake things up is for teams still finding their way. I'd like to think we are a team with fewer questions than last year, and what to do at MLB isn't one of them.

[CaliforniaCheez]

Reading between the lines

The Packers announced it. Barnett's agent is not crowing about how he screwed the Packers on the deal like a Rossenhaus would.

It would cost more to replace him than it would to keep him.

Barnett has proven he is worth keeping.

With the Kampmann, Wells, Driver, Jenkins, Barnett deals we can see that players will get long term deals from the Packers and what type of players the Packers want to retain.

The 2003 draft class is done and Williams is next from the 2004 draft class.
Looking to next year:
A decision after next season will be made on Cole.
Poppinga and Montgomery decisions will have to be made though they are signed through 2008.
Then the length of a Tauscher decision will have to be made. He too is signed through 2008.

[LL2]

I believe that Barnett's stance has always been that he deserves the middle.

He doesn’t DESERVE the middle any more than Hawk, Popps, or Hodge. It’s M3 that ultimately decides who plays where. He deserves to play where it makes the defense the best.

[LL2]

Reading between the lines

Barnett has proven he is worth keeping.

There is no doubt about that. Whether you like Barnett or not, he would’ve received twice in guaranteed money next year and TT wouldn’t have paid him. 5.5 per year is a excellent deal. Briggs is tagged to get 7.2 mil next year and I do not think Briggs is better. Briggs has been to the probowl but the probowl is a joke and a popularity contest. Bears LB’s always have received more attention.

[Partial]

'atta boy TT. Anyone have details?

I predict it is front-loaded for about 10mil this year, than about 6 mil the rest of the way. 4 years long. So, 28 million over 4 years. Not a bad deal for Barnett at all considering Adalius Thomas signed for 5 years, 35 mil (thank you adalius for keeping the market in check and saving us about 10 mil in barnett)

I have a hunch a good chunk (14 mil) is guaranteed.

[oregonpackfan]

TT was wise to get this contract extension finalized before the season began. This should end any speculation about free agency, etc.

This is a job well done by TT, IMO.

[CaliforniaCheez]

The more front loaded the better. Barnett is not an injury risk and deall along the lines of Wells or even Kampmann will be helpful.

[Packnut]

35 million over 6 years is a ton of cash. It would be nice to see him make a few game changing plays once in a while since he's getting paid this much.

[Packnut]

12 million for this season so it is heavily front loaded which everyone expected.

[GBRulz]

Found this on the PG...

Barnett's extension: 6 years, $35 million

He'll earn $12.5 million in the 1st year

By Rob Demovsky
rdemovsk@greenbaypressgazette.com


Linebacker Nick Barnett’s contract extension with the Green Bay Packers is a six-year deal worth a total of $35 million.


He will receive in the neighborhood of $12.5 million in the first year in the form of bonuses and base salary.

The deal, which runs through 2012, was completed early this morning and was announced in a statement by General Manager Ted Thompson.

Barnett, 25, has led the Packers in tackles in three of his four NFL seasons. A 6-foot-2, 232-pounder, Barnett was to make $1.95 million in base salary this season, the last year of his original rookie contract.

Barnett’s agent, Chuck Price, called his client “a throwback player.”

“Nick is about as old school a football player as you can find,” Price said in an afternoon press conference. “His values of team, his values of loyalty — he’s old school. That’s why I like working with him.”

Barnett, who has participated in the majority of the Packers’ offseason strength and conditioning programs, said he didn’t want to make his contract demands public like former teammate Javon Walker, who was dealt on draft day a year ago.

“Not a knock against their character or anything — I’m just not that type of person,” Barnett said.

No Packers officials were immediately available for comment.

[Partial]

After the first year the deal averages 4.5 mil/yr. Thats a freaking steal since we don't need the space this year anyway.

We'll have a lot of space next year too, the way it is looking. Hawk gets an 11 million dollar bonus this year in addition to his salary.

[Packnut]

After the first year the deal averages 4.5 mil/yr. Thats a freaking steal since we don't need the space this year anyway.

We'll have a lot of space next year too, the way it is looking. Hawk gets an 11 million dollar bonus this year in addition to his salary.

I don't think we'll have to worry about cap space for the next few years. No reason to believe Thompson will change stripes in regards to free agency. He's putting all his eggs in one basket with regards to the draft. Nothing else to do now but sit back and watch how he fills 5 holes on this team with this years draft.

[ND72]

ok, #1, I'm really happy this got taken care of. I for one am a Barnett fan...but I also know he can get a ton better, which is the part I like. Here's another part I love....how much is that gonna hurt the Bears signing of Briggs :lol: cause you know he's gonna want more than Barnett now.

I do like how Teddy does his contracts...Barnett's deal after year 1 & 2 basically comes out to a 4 year $16 Million dollar contract. Which means his cap hit won't kill us by year 5 and we'll have to cut him. That's the stuff I like. Good job Teddy...taking care of our people is what I'm all about.

[RashanGary]

"At least we did something. I'm guessing 6 years 36 million with 12 upfront."

This is what I said at 9:45 this morning at PC. I go there while at school cuz my school IP is apparently banned and I can't read but anyway...This was my prediction..

I'm pretty proud of that :)

[Bretsky]

12 million for this season so it is heavily front loaded which everyone expected.

What a surrprise

[RashanGary]

12 million for this season so it is heavily front loaded which everyone expected.

What a surrprise

I was just thinking how disappointed you'd be that we have to wait till our own new core comes up to really spend it.

TT is making sure that when his draft picks come up for paydays that he has the $$. He's basically planning on having a bunch of good drafts; something Sherm clearly didn't do.

[Bretsky]

12 million for this season so it is heavily front loaded which everyone expected.

What a surrprise

I was just thinking how disappointed you'd be that we have to wait till our own new core comes up to really spend it.

TT is making sure that when his draft picks come up for paydays that he has the $$. He's basically planning on having a bunch of good drafts; something Sherm clearly didn't do.


I've learned that if I want to win the Big Bowl soon, I need to expect disappointment out of Ted Thompson. He's planning for the future; not next year. To me it seems like the perfet model to keep us average until he changes his philosophy.

[RashanGary]

List some SB winners in the last 10 years who did it any other way B...

[RashanGary]

“We felt all along that now is the perfect time,” Thompson said. “(Barnett is) entering into the last year of his contract. Obviously from a player’s point of view, there’s always the risk of injury. From the club’s point of view, the closer you get to free agency, then it gets a little bit dicey. We just felt like and have always felt like somewhere right in this time is a good opportunity for both sides to work something out.”


Thompson is basically saying what many here have been saying all along. When you draft your own you get the RFA discount or the get yours early discount. Sherman was an idiot the way he paid full market value. People compare this to ADalius Thomas who got 20 mil up front on a similar per year contract but the guy who IMO Barnett is most like is Nate Clements. He's 26 and a borderline probowler. Clements got like 26 up front on a 70 million dollar deal. Barnett would have shattered this contract if he would have hit the open market. Jenkins and Kampman are both underpaid looking back too.

This is going to be a very good deal for the Packers and just more proof that teams can afford way more talent and better overall rosters when they draft well and get the RFA discount.

[Merlin]

I believe that Barnett's stance has always been that he deserves the middle.

He doesn’t DESERVE the middle any more than Hawk, Popps, or Hodge. It’s M3 that ultimately decides who plays where. He deserves to play where it makes the defense the best.

Barnett never said "I deserve the middle". His stance was that coming up on a contract year, why take a position move and jeopardize his next contract. I agree with that. If they moved him to the outside last year and he didn't adjust right away, it would ultimately effect what he would have signed for a contract. Although I am sure that has little to do with the coaches choice to keep him in the middle. Barnett has always maintained that he will play where ever they put him. And knowing the class that he has shown given all the bullshit he has been through, I know he would play safety if it meant he was on the field.

As far as he "doesn't deserve the middle anymore than Hawk, Popps, or Hodge", that is just hate talk there. He has the most experience and he is the most qualified on our roster. So if you are going to use the selfish "deserves", he does in fact deserve it more then any other LB we have.

[Bretsky]

List some SB winners in the last 10 years who did it any other way B...

The Green Bay Packers for one

[Bretsky]

This is going to be a very good deal for the Packers and just more proof that teams can afford way more talent and better overall rosters when they draft well and get the RFA discount.


Interesting proof by using a Mike Sherman draftee and a Ted Thompson deal to make your argument. One could say the same thing for Kampman, who was also a Sherman draft pick. :wink:

[retailguy]

I've learned that if I want to win the Big Bowl soon, I need to expect disappointment out of Ted Thompson. He's planning for the future; not next year. To me it seems like the perfet model to keep us average until he changes his philosophy.


Isn't that really what happened in Seattle? They were a solid team in a weak division, never getting over the hump... until... Thompson got the gig in Green Bay. They plugged a couple of holes with some free agents and got to the Super Bowl....

Mediocre? Guess that's better than the 70's and 80's.

Hope it's better than that.

[Scott Campbell]

I think some of you guys would be happier if Dan Snyder bought the Packers.

At least until September, when they started playing games.

[retailguy]

I think some of you guys would be happier if Dan Snyder bought the Packers.

At least until September, when they started playing games.


Isn't there a happy medium, Scott?

couldn't we plug 2 or 3 of the 7 major holes we've got?

Why is that so unreasonable?

[MJZiggy]

The Washington DC Metropolitan area would applaud that loudly.

[RashanGary]

List some SB winners in the last 10 years who did it any other way B...

The Green Bay Packers for one

There was a brand new CBA in place and teams at that time didn't know how to respond to free agency. During that era, more than any other there were quality FA's in bundles and Wolf was the type of GM who was aggressive in a way that proved to be effective during that era.

I don't believe Wolf would be successfull in todays NFL as Sherman took a similar approach and stripped our team of depth and talent over the course of 3 years.

That is why I said 10 years because the 11th was the one and only exception to the rule.

[Scott Campbell]

I think some of you guys would be happier if Dan Snyder bought the Packers.

At least until September, when they started playing games.


Isn't there a happy medium, Scott?

couldn't we plug 2 or 3 of the 7 major holes we've got?

Why is that so unreasonable?

It's not that unreasonable if you can find the right guys at the right price. That is one way of doing it. Ted is doing it another way. I'm ok with that for now, and am willing to see how it works out.

[Bretsky]

I think some of you guys would be happier if Dan Snyder bought the Packers.

At least until September, when they started playing games.


Isn't there a happy medium, Scott?

couldn't we plug 2 or 3 of the 7 major holes we've got?

Why is that so unreasonable?

It's not that unreasonable if you can find the right guys at the right price. That is one way of doing it. Ted is doing it another way. I'm ok with that for now, and am willing to see how it works out.

If Ted wins a Super Bowl in Green Bay I will issue a formal repentance to the entire forum and I will defend his greatness just as strong as I continue to defend Mike Holmgren.

If he does not I'll remember him as the guy who frontloaded deals and sacrificed our near term shot at a Super Bowl while our Hall of Fame QB played his last years for a future that never turned out.

[BooHoo]

Brett will be hard to reproduce. Great QBs don't come along very often. Just look at some of the guys we started over the years. I can understand TT's point in building for the long term but don't know if we will have the QB to get us to the SB.

[retailguy]

That is why I said 10 years because the 11th was the one and only exception to the rule.

How about the 2006 Chicago Bears? While they didn't win, at least they got there...

Hunter Hillenmeyer - Waiver Wire Pick up - Green Bay
Adewale Ogunleye - Trade with Miami for Marty Booker
Ricky Manning Jr - Free Agent
Brad Maynard - Free Agent
Robbie Gould - Free Agent
Rashied Davis - Free Agent
Mushin Muhammed - Free Agent
John Tait - Free Agent
John St. Clair - Free Agent
Ruben Brown - Free Agent
Roberto Garza - Free Agent
Fred Miller - Free Agent
Desmond Clark - Free Agent
John Gilmore - Free Agent
Jason Mckie - Free Agent
JD Runnells - Undrafted Free Agent
Brian Griese - Free Agent
Thomas Jones - Free Agent.

The majority of these guys are/were starters, including the ENTIRE offensive line except the center...

[RashanGary]

That's pretty fair but thinking that there is some FA out there that could possibly put this team over the top is being very optimistic IMHO, but I always respect your opinion more than the other TT haters because you present a reasonable case and you are fair and open to the possiblity that TT could be taking a good approach.

I'm probably more pro TT than most but I'm definitly open to the possiblity that he fails too. I dont' necessarily think that he has to win the SB to be a good GM because the odds of that are pretty slim and you have to get a little lucky with a special player but I do fully expect a competitor for multiple years starting this year. A team that has a shot over and over for 5 or 6 years. If he does that, I think he's a success. If he wins the SB he is one of the best GM's in this era considering the junk he took over.

[RashanGary]

Trades don't count as UFA pick ups and I count 3 or 4 starters from the UFA market there.

Hillenmeyer was a waiver pickup like you said so that isnt' quite like paying on the UFA market

Regardless, 3 or 4 is more than the usual team. Nice example but most of those guys were backup depth or didn't fit the criteria.

[BooHoo]

That's pretty fair but thinking that there is some FA out there that could possibly put this team over the top is being very optimistic IMHO, but I always respect your opinion more than the other TT haters because you present a reasonable case and you are fair and open to the possiblity that TT could be taking a good approach.

I'm probably more pro TT than most but I'm definitly open to the possiblity that he fails too. I dont' necessarily think that he has to win the SB to be a good GM because the odds of that are pretty slim and you have to get a little lucky with a special player but I do fully expect a competitor for multiple years starting this year. A team that has a shot over and over for 5 or 6 years. If he does that, I think he's a success. If he wins the SB he is one of the best GM's in this era considering the junk he took over.

I am not a TT hater and think he is overall doing a good job. However, I understand that only time will tell whether his approach will be successful. I just thought there might be just one FA out there who would have improved the team without breaking our bank.

[Bretsky]

Trades don't count as UFA pick ups and I count 3 or 4 starters from the UFA market there.

Hillenmeyer was a waiver pickup like you said so that isnt' quite like paying on the UFA market

Regardless, 3 or 4 is more than the usual team. Nice example but most of those guys were backup depth or didn't fit the criteria.


I believe there are eight starters in that group if I'm not mistaken.

New England also had several key, but not expensive free agents when they had their run.

Denver and New England are doing the anti TT this year with free agency and trades; it will be interesting to see if either succeeds.

B

[Scott Campbell]

I think some of you guys would be happier if Dan Snyder bought the Packers.

At least until September, when they started playing games.


Isn't there a happy medium, Scott?

couldn't we plug 2 or 3 of the 7 major holes we've got?

Why is that so unreasonable?


Isn't that exactly what he did last year?

[RashanGary]

Jones, McKie, Muhammed, Miller, Garza, Brown, Tait, Clark, kicker, punter....

Holy crap..You are correct. It is certainly alot more than the Colts, Patriots, Steelers, Eagles, Seahawks of late.

There is still a lot more evidence in the other direction but I can see you're point in that if you are smart; you can find good UFA's..

Bears got a little lucky with some of those aging guys too....Still, nice example RG..I wasn't expecting that to be honest; I've seen too much evidence over the years to the contrary.

[Bretsky]

That's pretty fair but thinking that there is some FA out there that could possibly put this team over the top is being very optimistic IMHO, but I always respect your opinion more than the other TT haters because you present a reasonable case and you are fair and open to the possiblity that TT could be taking a good approach.

I'm probably more pro TT than most but I'm definitly open to the possiblity that he fails too. I dont' necessarily think that he has to win the SB to be a good GM because the odds of that are pretty slim and you have to get a little lucky with a special player but I do fully expect a competitor for multiple years starting this year. A team that has a shot over and over for 5 or 6 years. If he does that, I think he's a success. If he wins the SB he is one of the best GM's in this era considering the junk he took over.

I am not a TT hater and think he is overall doing a good job. However, I understand that only time will tell whether his approach will be successful. I just thought there might be just one FA out there who would have improved the team without breaking our bank.


There are several excuses the pro TT group uses, and this should NOT be pointed at any one poster. There are plenty out there on both sides of the turtle :lol:

Some say nobody came at fair market value. Fair enough, but some are the same posters who were claiming Nick Barnett to be worth in the 4.5-5MIL area a few months ago. Market has changed.

And when all else fails, here comes the "no one player could put this team over the top." And they are right; nobody could.

But you make one GREAT POINT

I just thought there might be just one FA out there who would have improved the team without breaking our bank

Gosh, maybe there even might have been two :lol:

That's really all those of us that are frustrated are asking for.

We're not asking for TT to sacrifice the future; but maybe we'd rather not see him sacrifice the present for the future either.


Cheers,
B

[retailguy]

That is why I said 10 years because the 11th was the one and only exception to the rule.

How about the 2000 Baltimore Ravens?

Sam Adams - Free Agent
Obafemi Ayanbadejo - Free Agent
Robert Bailey - Free Agent
Tony Banks - Free Agent
Orlando Bobo - Free Agent
O. J. Brigance - Free Agent
Rob Burnett - Free Agent
Ben Coates - Free Agent
Anthony Davis - Free Agent
Billy Davis - Free Agent
Trent Dilfer - Free Agent
Chuck Evans - Free Agent
Corey Harris - Free Agent
Sam Gash - Free Agent
John Hudson - Free Agent
Qadry Ishmail - Free Agent
Clarence Love - Free Agent
Michael Mccrary - Free Agent
Carl Powell - free Agent
Kyle Richardson - Free Agent
Shannon Sharpe - Free Agent
Tony Siragusa - Free Agent
Matt Stover - Free Agent
Harry Swayne - Free agent
James Trapp - Free Agent
Kipp Vickers - Free Agent
Frank Wainwright - Free Agent
Keith Washington - Free agent
Larry Webster - Free Agent
Sammy Williams - Free Agent
Rod Woodson - Free Agent


I'm sure a lot of these guys were backups, but I recognize a fair amount of names as free agents. Also, many of these guys were picked up for the 2000 season, and only played one year in Baltimore.

THEY PICKED THEM UP TO GET OVER THE HUMP.

Should I keep going?..... 8-)

[BooHoo]

Understood.

And I like the turtle.

[RashanGary]

Thompson signed; Pickett, Woodson and Manuel so it's not like he ignores it. This was a really bad UFA class though.

I'm not ALL and ONLY about the draft but I do believe that it has to the the core and the biggest part of your team. I think Thompson wisely avoided a very inflated market this off season. I think many of our own guys are jsut as good as the overpaid ones that got away on the UFA market.

[RashanGary]

2006 INDIANAPOLIS

21 of the 22 starters were drafted by the Colts, or were signed as a rookie or street FA. One starter was acquired by trade. There were no FA starters on the Colts.

Reggie Wayne - draft
Tarik Glenn - draft
Ryan Lilja - rookie FA
Jeff Saturday - rookie FA
Jake Scott - draft
Ryan Diem - draft
Dallas Clark - draft
Marvin Harrison - draft
Peyton Manning - draft
Joseph Addai - draft
Ben Utecht - rookie FA

Robert Mathis - draft
Anthony McFarland - trade
Raheem Brock - street FA
Dwight Freeney - draft
Cato June - draft
Gary Brackett - rookie FA
Rob Morris - draft
Nick Harper - rookie FA
Jason David - draft
Antoine Bethea - draft
Bob Sanders - draft


2005 PITTSBURGH

19 of 22 starters were drafted by Pittsburgh or was a rookie FA. Two big name FAs. One other FA.

Antwaan Randle El - draft
Marvel Smith - draft
Alan Faneca - draft
Jeff Hartings - FA
Kendall Simmons - draft
Max Starks - draft
Heath Miller - draft
Hines Ward - draft
Ben Roethlisberger - draft
Willie Parker - draft
Dan Kreider - rookie FA

Aaron Smith - draft
Casey Hampton - draft
Kimo von Oelhoffen - FA
Clark Haggans - draft
James Farrior - FA
Larry Foote - draft
Joey Porter - draft
Ike Taylor - draft
Chris Hope - draft
Troy Polamalu - draft
Deshea Townsend - draft

2004 NEW ENGLAND

17 of their 22 starters were drafted by them or were signed as rookie or street FAs. One was traded for. Three were non-high profile FAs. Rodney Harrison was the only high profile FA on that team.

David Givens - draft
Matt Light - draft
Joe Andruzzi - no name FA
Dan Koppen - draft
Steve Neal - rookie FA
Brandon Gorin - street FA
Daniel Graham - draft
Deion Branch - draft
Tom Brady - draft
Corey Dillon - trade
Patrick Pass - rookie FA

Richard Seymour - draft
Vince Wilfork - draft
Ty Warren - draft
Willie McGinest - draft
Tedy Bruschi - draft
Roman Phifer - no name FA
Mike Vrabel - no name FA
Randall Gay - draft
Asante Samuel - draft
Rodney Harrison - FA
Eugene Wilson - draft

[RashanGary]

The Ravens took a big salary dive after the SB just liek the Packers did after almost getting there with Sherman.

I think there are better ways to do it like I listed above but I certainly see your point that some teams get short term fixes just long enough to get over the hump.

I don't think we are there at this point. IMO we're starting over but at the right time; teams can take a shot and win. Sherm did hsi best but his FA signings were junk.

[Packnut]

I think some of you guys would be happier if Dan Snyder bought the Packers.

At least until September, when they started playing games.


Isn't there a happy medium, Scott?

couldn't we plug 2 or 3 of the 7 major holes we've got?

Why is that so unreasonable?

It's not that unreasonable if you can find the right guys at the right price. That is one way of doing it. Ted is doing it another way. I'm ok with that for now, and am willing to see how it works out.

If Ted wins a Super Bowl in Green Bay I will issue a formal repentance to the entire forum and I will defend his greatness just as strong as I continue to defend Mike Holmgren.

If he does not I'll remember him as the guy who frontloaded deals and sacrificed our near term shot at a Super Bowl while our Hall of Fame QB played his last years for a future that never turned out.


Very well stated. I hope you and I are wrong and we both end up kissing Teddy's behind. I still believe the right way would have been to load up and give Brett 1 more chance. I'd rather have a shot now in this watered down league and win a SB than hope we become competitive in another 2 years. While Teddy is building through the draft in hopes of getting better, there are a few teams who are ahead of us like the Saints and those teams will also be getting better every year.

[retailguy]

That is why I said 10 years because the 11th was the one and only exception to the rule.

One more and I'm done....


2001 New England Patriots

Joe Andruzzi - Free Agent
Terrell Buckley - Free Agent
Matt Chatham - Free Agent
Je'Rod Cherry - Free Agent
Fred Coleman - Free Agent
Mike Compton - Free Agent
Bryan Cox - Free Agent
Marc Edwards - Free Agent
Jimmy Faris - free Agent
Bobby Hamilton - Free agent
Damon Huard - Free agent
Larry Izzo - Free agent
Charles Johnson - Free agent
Stephan Neal - Free Agent
Riddick Parker - Free Agent
David Patten - Free Agent
Lonnie Paxton - Free Agent
Roman Pfifer - free Agent
Anthony Pleasant - Free Agent
Grey Reugamer - Free Agent
Terrance Shaw - Free Agent
Antowain Smith - Free aGent
Otis Smith - Free Agent
Chris Sullivan - Free Agent
Adam Vinitairi - Free Agent
Mike Vrabel - Free Agent
Ken Walter - Free agent
Grant Williams - Free Agent

Again, as expected a fair amount of backups but some good starters as well.

I'm done now...

Peace.

[gbgary]

glad to see nick signed long term, he is one of the important players on this team.

as far as free agency goes, and the lack of spending, i'm with bretsky. one or two important players signed would have changed my mind on thompson. i know he doesn't want to over pay what he thinks fair market value is but there is one thing that i've alway said about Green Bay and the Packers...because of where and what Green Bay is, a small, non-glamorous, and like it or not i'm gonna say predominately white city, the Packers are going to HAVE to over pay to get the special player to come there...like Reggie. if ron wolf had just matched someone else's offer or just barely covered it Reggie wouldn't have signed and the third superbowl win probably wouldn't have happened. money is the ONLY thing the Packers have to lure players to Green Bay with. tradition, history, and the wonderful fans isn't enough. they have to pick a player, or players, to fill a need or to become a cornerstone on this team and then not take no for an answer.

[Partial]

I've learned that if I want to win the Big Bowl soon, I need to expect disappointment out of Ted Thompson. He's planning for the future; not next year. To me it seems like the perfet model to keep us average until he changes his philosophy.


Isn't that really what happened in Seattle? They were a solid team in a weak division, never getting over the hump... until... Thompson got the gig in Green Bay. They plugged a couple of holes with some free agents and got to the Super Bowl....

Mediocre? Guess that's better than the 70's and 80's.

Hope it's better than that.

What free agents did that Seahawks team add?

[Partial]

That is why I said 10 years because the 11th was the one and only exception to the rule.

How about the 2006 Chicago Bears? While they didn't win, at least they got there...

Hunter Hillenmeyer - Waiver Wire Pick up - Green Bay
Adewale Ogunleye - Trade with Miami for Marty Booker
Ricky Manning Jr - Free Agent
Brad Maynard - Free Agent
Robbie Gould - Free Agent
Rashied Davis - Free Agent
Mushin Muhammed - Free Agent
John Tait - Free Agent
John St. Clair - Free Agent
Ruben Brown - Free Agent
Roberto Garza - Free Agent
Fred Miller - Free Agent
Desmond Clark - Free Agent
John Gilmore - Free Agent
Jason Mckie - Free Agent
JD Runnells - Undrafted Free Agent
Brian Griese - Free Agent
Thomas Jones - Free Agent.

The majority of these guys are/were starters, including the ENTIRE offensive line except the center...




Hunter Hillenmeyer - Waiver Wire Pick up - Green Bay
Type of player found on every team in the league. Adequate at best.



Adewale Ogunleye - Trade with Miami for Marty Booker
Not a FA.


Ricky Manning Jr - Free Agent
Nickelback who is an underrated player. Good move.


Brad Maynard - Free Agent
He's a punter. I don't think this had any effect on them getting to the super bowl. Type of move every team makes.


Robbie Gould - Free Agent
He's a kicker. Marginal move. Type of move everyone makes. He happened to turn it on and have a good year.


Rashied Davis - Free Agent
4th wideout that every team has. Had no effect in getting to big game.


Mushin Muhammed - Free Agent
Good move.



John Tait - Free Agent
Good move.


John St. Clair - Free Agent
Who is this?

Ruben Brown - Free Agent
Good move. Moreso the line gelling together than good players, though.


Roberto Garza - Free Agent
??

Fred Miller - Free Agent
??


Desmond Clark - Free Agent
Adequate tight end at best. Type of player every team has. TE is a big need for the Bears.


John Gilmore - Free Agent
???


Jason Mckie - Free Agent
??


JD Runnells - Undrafted Free Agent
????



Brian Griese - Free Agent
Back-up QB. He's adeuqate at best. Didn't help them get to the big game.



Thomas Jones - Free Agent.
Good move.




RG, there are far more marginal moves than anything. That OL is a benefactor of playing together for a long time, not a sign of bringing in great talent. The line is average. Packers is better.

They made a couple moves to fill holes, but the vast majority of those people are just guys.

Jones is the only one who really had any effect in getting them to the super bowl. Maybe Muhammed, too.



My point is this: Unless you have a superstar(which the packers don't), you can bring in all the above-average or average players in the world and you'll never get to the super bowl. The Bears have the best defender in the game. The Colts have the best QB. The Ravens had the best defense the year they won and the best defender in the game. The Chargers have the best player in the game. The Patriots have a super-ultra-hall-of-fame-star at QB. Randy McMichael would have been nice, but does he really win us any more games or even make a difference? Probably not. Same with Nate Clements and Adalius Thomas. You need a true superstar to make a difference.

[Partial]

Trades don't count as UFA pick ups and I count 3 or 4 starters from the UFA market there.

Hillenmeyer was a waiver pickup like you said so that isnt' quite like paying on the UFA market

Regardless, 3 or 4 is more than the usual team. Nice example but most of those guys were backup depth or didn't fit the criteria.


I believe there are eight starters in that group if I'm not mistaken.

New England also had several key, but not expensive free agents when they had their run.

Denver and New England are doing the anti TT this year with free agency and trades; it will be interesting to see if either succeeds.

B

New England will succeed because they had very few holes. Now they are solid and deep. Also, they didn't overpay.

[Bretsky]

The Packers OL was better than the Bears last year ? :crazy:

[Bretsky]

Trades don't count as UFA pick ups and I count 3 or 4 starters from the UFA market there.

Hillenmeyer was a waiver pickup like you said so that isnt' quite like paying on the UFA market

Regardless, 3 or 4 is more than the usual team. Nice example but most of those guys were backup depth or didn't fit the criteria.


I believe there are eight starters in that group if I'm not mistaken.

New England also had several key, but not expensive free agents when they had their run.

Denver and New England are doing the anti TT this year with free agency and trades; it will be interesting to see if either succeeds.

B

New England will succeed because they had very few holes. Now they are solid and deep. Also, they didn't overpay.


New England paid the market value this year that many use as an excuse for TT not having to sign the key players. If they didn't overpay than there are a lot of teams in free agency that didn't overpay this year.

[ND72]

FACT is...Ted Thompson is building through the draft, because Mike Sherman really depleated the team of OUR own talent/depth. Until we get to the level the Bears are at, when we can add certain players that we can just plug in, and not expect to start, we have to build ourselves back up, give ourselves some talent, then add some free agents where needed if we want. All of you can bitch and moan about it, or even bitch that we signed Barnett to an extention. But 2 things are for sure....Ted Thompson is doing it right, and Nick Barnett is a better MLB than Abdul Hodge.

[HarveyWallbangers]

RG,

2001 NE is a bad example, I think. Not one of those guys, even Vrabel, were high profile FAs. Vrabel was a backup for 4 years in Pittsburgh. Obviously, your lists include street or rookie FAs because it includes guys like Adam Vinatieri--who was with NE his whole career, but wasn't drafted.

[Partial]

The Packers OL was better than the Bears last year ? :crazy:

This year they will be. We started 3 rookies..

[Bretsky]

The Packers OL was better than the Bears last year ? :crazy:

This year they will be. We started 3 rookies..


I truly hope you are right

[Partial]

Trades don't count as UFA pick ups and I count 3 or 4 starters from the UFA market there.

Hillenmeyer was a waiver pickup like you said so that isnt' quite like paying on the UFA market

Regardless, 3 or 4 is more than the usual team. Nice example but most of those guys were backup depth or didn't fit the criteria.


I believe there are eight starters in that group if I'm not mistaken.

New England also had several key, but not expensive free agents when they had their run.

Denver and New England are doing the anti TT this year with free agency and trades; it will be interesting to see if either succeeds.

B

New England will succeed because they had very few holes. Now they are solid and deep. Also, they didn't overpay.


New England paid the market value this year that many use as an excuse for TT not having to sign the key players. If they didn't overpay than there are a lot of teams in free agency that didn't overpay this year.

Adalius Thomas took 3 million less than Clements to play in NE 'cause he wanted to stay on the EC. He could have gotten way more, and I am sure he was offered 9 mil/year by San Fran. He took 7 mil a year for a guaranteed deal.

[Bretsky]

I was thinking of the Donte Stallworth deal; you are right on the Thomas deal

[Partial]

Free agency is good and nice. I have no problems with it. But I think its kind of stupid also, because you are never going to get anything beyond a solid player.

And solid players get you to .500 at best.

I would rather draft guys to fill those spots for less money and hopefully strike gold on a unproven commodity (see Marques Colston) versus paying someone who we already know what they can do(not enough for their team to warrant resigning them)

[HarveyWallbangers]

From JSO:


Because much of Barnett's 2007 money won't be delivered in a signing bonus, the Packers were able to eat up a considerable amount of their $21 million salary-cap surplus. They are now thought to be about $14 million below the cap.

And as a result of sewing up so many starters, they face an off-season in 2008 where defensive tackle Corey Williams is the only player of any significance who will be an unrestricted free agent. The others are players who aren't even guaranteed of making the team this year.

[Bretsky]

From JSO:


Because much of Barnett's 2007 money won't be delivered in a signing bonus, the Packers were able to eat up a considerable amount of their $21 million salary-cap surplus. They are now thought to be about $14 million below the cap.

And as a result of sewing up so many starters, they face an off-season in 2008 where defensive tackle Corey Williams is the only player of any significance who will be an unrestricted free agent. The others are players who aren't even guaranteed of making the team this year.


Sign him now and frontload it to 07 as well :lol:

[cpk1994]

Brett will be hard to reproduce. Great QBs don't come along very often. Just look at some of the guys we started over the years. I can understand TT's point in building for the long term but don't know if we will have the QB to get us to the SB.
If Wrecks Grossman can get to a Super Bowl, finding another QB to lead the Pack there isn't as hard as some make it out to be.

[b bulldog]

Not trying to bash Brett at all here but he is an old QB who won't play much longer. I like the fact that TT isn't trying to make moves so Brett can try to make a legit run in the NFC only to get smashed by a AFC team in the Super Bowl. We are farther away than most people think.

[retailguy]

RG,

2001 NE is a bad example, I think. Not one of those guys, even Vrabel, were high profile FAs. Vrabel was a backup for 4 years in Pittsburgh. Obviously, your lists include street or rookie FAs because it includes guys like Adam Vinatieri--who was with NE his whole career, but wasn't drafted.

Disagree. NE signed the type of players that GB should benefit from. Justin Griffith is an example.

NE was not expected to win in 2001. They were just trying to improve and caught lightning in a bottle and got damn lucky.

Free Agents could have helped this team to compete. That's my point.

Everyone thinks I want GB to look like Washington. I don't want that. I just want guys in here who are better than what we have.

[Partial]

RG,

2001 NE is a bad example, I think. Not one of those guys, even Vrabel, were high profile FAs. Vrabel was a backup for 4 years in Pittsburgh. Obviously, your lists include street or rookie FAs because it includes guys like Adam Vinatieri--who was with NE his whole career, but wasn't drafted.

Disagree. NE signed the type of players that GB should benefit from. Justin Griffith is an example.

NE was not expected to win in 2001. They were just trying to improve and caught lightning in a bottle and got damn lucky.

Free Agents could have helped this team to compete. That's my point.

Everyone thinks I want GB to look like Washington. I don't want that. I just want guys in here who are better than what we have.

Yeah, they happened to pull the a hall-of-famer out of the 6th round of the draft who was the best qb in the league even as a rookie.

I'm sorry, but that team with Drew Bledsoe doesn't advance out of the first round of the playoffs if even get that far.

[HarveyWallbangers]

NE was not expected to win in 2001. They were just trying to improve and caught lightning in a bottle and got damn lucky.

Free Agents could have helped this team to compete. That's my point.

Everyone thinks I want GB to look like Washington. I don't want that. I just want guys in here who are better than what we have.

Most of the guys you listed were street or rookie FAs. Name the FAs they signed that got more than $1M/year. Personally, I'd much rather have the team do what Thompson has done. He tried the cheap FA route the last two years and it got him the Matt O'Dwyers and Marquand Manuels. How did that work? It usually doesn't.

[Bretsky]

NE was not expected to win in 2001. They were just trying to improve and caught lightning in a bottle and got damn lucky.

Free Agents could have helped this team to compete. That's my point.

Everyone thinks I want GB to look like Washington. I don't want that. I just want guys in here who are better than what we have.

Most of the guys you listed were street or rookie FAs. Name the FAs they signed that got more than $1M/year. Personally, I'd much rather have the team do what Thompson has done. He tried the cheap FA route the last two years and it got him the Matt O'Dwyers and Marquand Manuels. How did that work? It usually doesn't.

Actually if you look at last year I'd say he signed two free agents for legit money and went the cheap FA route with the other two.

The two that worked were the ones he spent good money on.

[Partial]

I would agree with that Bretsky.

Those were fine signings. However, how many more positions are you satisifed with only being solid? At some point if we expect a championship we need to add someone spectacular. And you do that through the draft, not FA.

[Bretsky]

I would agree with that Bretsky.

Those were fine signings. However, how many more positions are you satisifed with only being solid? At some point if we expect a championship we need to add someone spectacular. And you do that through the draft, not FA.


It's going to be awefully hard to get something spectacular in free agency. I completely agree that you do that through the draft, and last year TT did that well. I don't think it hurts though, to get solid players where we are lacking them via free agency. He might still do some of that if he doesn't frontload another contract since he still has cap room he will eventually use. There are a lot of ways to get there and there is no exact route; I'm just more impatient than most in here and certainly TT.

[Partial]

I would agree with that Bretsky.

Those were fine signings. However, how many more positions are you satisifed with only being solid? At some point if we expect a championship we need to add someone spectacular. And you do that through the draft, not FA.


It's going to be awefully hard to get something spectacular in free agency. I completely agree that you do that through the draft, and last year TT did that well. I don't think it hurts though, to get solid players where we are lacking them via free agency. He might still do some of that if he doesn't frontload another contract since he still has cap room he will eventually use. There are a lot of ways to get there and there is no exact route; I'm just more impatient than most in here and certainly TT.

TT has proved to have incredible patience. That is for sure.

[mraynrand]

Not trying to bash Brett at all here but he is an old QB who won't play much longer. I like the fact that TT isn't trying to make moves so Brett can try to make a legit run in the NFC only to get smashed by a AFC team in the Super Bowl. We are farther away than most people think.

I'd rather see the Packers get smashed in the Superbowl than finish their season after week 17.

[Rastak]

Looks like Barnett got a lot more than EJ Henderson, which makes sense because Barnett has show a whole lot more in his career than EJ.


I think Henderson got 10 mil in total gar money. All in all, a pretty good move by the packers in my opinion. Nicely frontloaded which on the negative side prevents the Packers from recovering it should something go wrong legally (maybe a jaywalking spree) but on the positive side it eats up this years cap but keeps the cap down the next couple years. makes sense to me.

[MJZiggy]

Nah, Rastak, I've read the new policy. He gets caught jaywalking again, he'll get suspended for the year and we won't have to pay him... :wink:

[Rastak]

Nah, Rastak, I've read the new policy. He gets caught jaywalking again, he'll get suspended for the year and we won't have to pay him... :wink:


Except the upfront money already paid of course! Based on the bad pub Green Bay got last time, I do not expect there to be any jaywalking arrests anytime soon.

[retailguy]

Not trying to bash Brett at all here but he is an old QB who won't play much longer. I like the fact that TT isn't trying to make moves so Brett can try to make a legit run in the NFC only to get smashed by a AFC team in the Super Bowl. We are farther away than most people think.

I'd rather see the Packers get smashed in the Superbowl than finish their season after week 17.

Me too. Completely agree.

[retailguy]

Most of the guys you listed were street or rookie FAs. Name the FAs they signed that got more than $1M/year. Personally, I'd much rather have the team do what Thompson has done. He tried the cheap FA route the last two years and it got him the Matt O'Dwyers and Marquand Manuels. How did that work? It usually doesn't.

Harvey, listing the UFA's isn't the point I'm trying to make. I'm not looking for the next Reggie White in free agency.

I'm looking for the next Mike Vrabel, or Roman Pfifer. Everyone points to Brady, but it's deeper than that. New England has had constant cornerback problems, yet they find a way to win, using depth at other positions. That depth came largely from free agency of some type.

We've got 7 starting holes, plus a bunch of depth issues. We got ONE guy so far, and passed on at least THREE others who could have helped fill spots, EVEN IF we are building through the draft.

Brady didn't "carry" that 2001 team to the playoffs. Did he play well? Of course. But that was the year of the infamous "tuck rule" if you recall, and they got a bit of luck, plus the defense played well, including all those "no name" guys you mention.

Who is our "backup" fullback? How about a backup "Tight End"? How about a complementary wide receiver to Driver and Jennings (who is also unproven)? Who is going to run the damn ball? How about a backup safety for Manuel? Maybe a weakside linebacker? Kickoff returner? Some safety depth so we can rid ourselves of Manuel? We can't improve on Miree? We can't improve on Bubba Franks? We can't improve on Marquand Manuel?

ALL THESE GUYS are coming from the draft? ALL THESE GUYS are coming from within? We don't have that much talent, and rookies don't step up in those numbers. Somewhere, we are playing 2007 with HOLES. We don't know where yet, but we will. Why not reduce those odds a bit with a proven player at a fair price, even if he's just a stopgap for a season or two?

That's what New England and Baltimore did. Chicago also. That's my point. Get off the high dollar UFA kick. That's never been what I wanted, and you guys know that.

Slicing and dicing the "type" of free agent is pretty pointless and cheapens your argument. You all talk about "building through the draft", but the majority of players on any team bounce around and fill "roles". I agree that the "core superstars" should come from within, but what about the rest of the guys? what's wrong with some of them being free agents?

[esoxx]

Not trying to bash Brett at all here but he is an old QB who won't play much longer. I like the fact that TT isn't trying to make moves so Brett can try to make a legit run in the NFC only to get smashed by a AFC team in the Super Bowl. We are farther away than most people think.

I'd rather see the Packers get smashed in the Superbowl than finish their season after week 17.

Me too. Completely agree.

Yeah I'd sure hate to win an NFC Championship along the way.

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

TT should of paid Ahman Green and went after Griffin and Hamlin. Griffin signed for about a mil a year and Hamlin a got 1 year for 2.5 mil. None would of broke the bank and would of both been upgrades with no long term repercussions. Both of these pick ups would have been like the signing of Frank walker. They would buy time for us to draft their replacements.

While I am a TT supporter and I do agree with building through the draft, it wouldn't hurt to sign some cheap upgrades to help the team now while were filling our holes.

[ND72]

On the local Appleton espn radio...they said that Ted was in contact with Ahman Green's agent up until the last second, offering "about as much as the Texans did"...but Ahman's agent said Ahman felt it was just time to move on, and back into the system he loved in Sherman's.

So I don't blame Thompson for that...he tried. I am one who said from the beginning of the offseason, that if Ahman Green left, it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world. And I still don't. It just depends on how we do in the draft.

[retailguy]

On the local Appleton espn radio...they said that Ted was in contact with Ahman Green's agent up until the last second, offering "about as much as the Texans did"...but Ahman's agent said Ahman felt it was just time to move on, and back into the system he loved in Sherman's.

So I don't blame Thompson for that...he tried. I am one who said from the beginning of the offseason, that if Ahman Green left, it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world. And I still don't. It just depends on how we do in the draft.

I don't believe this. If that was the case, he could have locked him up before free agency started.

Reports at the time had Thompson maxing out at about 4.5million and this seems logical knowing what we know about Thompson.

I just cannot see Ted Thompson getting into a bidding war for GOD, much less a football player.

[ND72]

Thompson has been known for making some bids...he out bide Tampa Bay for Charles Woodson, and he stayed in the bidding war last year for LaVarr Arrington. And I'm sorry, Ahman Green isn't worth much more than what Thompson reportedly offered at 4.5 million. Even that, I feel, is too expensive.

[b bulldog]

I agree and with his running style and history of injury, his better days are behind him imo.