PDA

View Full Version : Defense Comes First



Joemailman
05-28-2007, 12:13 PM
http://packers.scout.com/2/647103.html

Interesting article. It won't satisfy those who are critical of TT for not "Getting Favre More Weapons", but I think it does provide some insight into what TT's approach is.

Defense comes first

By Tyler Dunne
Posted May 28, 2007

Thompson banking on unit to lead the way for Packers

An irritated 38-year old quarterback is surrounded by rookies and second year players. Call it a transition. Call it turmoil. Fact is, Green Bay’s offense is starting over.

How much will Mike McCarthy lean on the zone blocking scheme without Ahman Green and Jeff Jagodzinski? Exactly how short is the leash on Aaron Rodgers? Will the tight end position be reintroduced into the passing game? Does general manager Ted Thompson truly believe third round pick James Jones is a better receiving option than Randy Moss?

Uneasy questions infest an unpredictable Packers offense.

But it might not matter as much as you may think.

The overused clichés that the Packers will “go as far as No. 4 takes them” and “as long as you have Brett Favre, you have a chance to win” can officially be downgraded to secondary winning formulas.

Don’t pull out the Trent Dilfer-Baltimore Ravens comparison just yet, but Thompson’s road map of the franchise is treading a distinct pattern.

The Packers are pushing all their chips to the defensive side of the ball for the present and future.

A Change in Identity
Right now players at each level on the defense are hitting their prime. The onus is on them to carry the team. Not Favre. Not Donald Driver. Not a patchwork cavalry of running backs. By design, the offense has been reserved supplementary.

Talent-wise and financially, Green Bay’s success boils down to a unit that allowed only one touchdown in the season’s final 12 quarters. Ted Thompson and the Packers brass are banking on that momentum.

Not a bad idea. It’s just that nobody’s used to it.

“I’m excited about our defense,” said defensive end Aaron Kampman, who observed minicamp keenly from the sideline, following arthroscopic knee surgery. “When you talk to the guys in this locker room, you’re going to see that type of energy that we have.

“We get in the team meeting room and you can see it on the field,” he smiled, trying mightily to bottle his enthusiasm. “It’s transferring over. The guys are moving real well. The off-season work has been tremendous. Guys have made a lot of individual gains and now we’re seeing it collectively.”

For the first time in four years, this off-season progression was possible. Green Bay hasn’t retained its defensive coordinator since the Ed “4th and 26” Donatell Era. Instead of trying to adapt to a completely new scheme, the Packers’ defense finally knows what to expect from coordinator Bob Sanders and each other. There will be no “feeling out” process and no trial by error to begin the season. Secondary meltdowns, third-and-long conversions, and hesitant blitzing all but evaporated by the end of last year.

The defense plans to use last season’s four-game winning streak as a blueprint for this fall.

“We ended on a good note,” cornerback Charles Woodson said. “Anytime you do that, you try to carry it into the next season…We feel like the sky’s the limit. But like anything it’s about hard work and going out there and doing it.”

Woodson isn’t the aging, slow corner many believed he was. Teaming with Al Harris, Green Bay’s corner duo combined for 11 interceptions, 37 breakups, and 103 tackles in ‘06. Clearly in their prime, Woodson and Harris are justifying their $70 million in contract money. As Antuan Edwards and Ahmad Carroll proved, there’s no substitute for a pair of shutdown corners.

More than $73 million was pumped into the Nick Barnett-A.J. Hawk 1-2 punch at linebacker. A wise, low-risk move considering their Pro Bowl potential.

And finally the defense has found its leader in Kampman, who’s safely under contract through 2010. If San Diego’s Shawne Merriman swallows a few less steroids then Kampman is the reigning NFL sack champion. No longer just a beefy overachiever, Kampman is an elite two-way defensive end after posting 89 tackles and 15.5 sacks, most of them in crucial situations.

These are the Green Bay Packers. All under contract. All go-to playmakers. All peaking in their careers. All on defense.

Why is Favre steaming? Thompson refuses to make the offense the team’s focal point. It was expected that the Packers’ front office would use December’s success to springboard the offense. All of that excess dough just had to lure Moss, Michael Turner, Drew Bennett, and/or Kevin Curtis to cure an offense that scored only 18.8 points per game (22nd in NFL), elevating the team to a championship-level.

Then Thompson pulled a 180.

Available cap money was quietly replenished into the fading contracts of Cullen Jenkins, Nick Barnett, Al Harris. This strengthens continuity, solidifies the unit’s future, and lessens pressure on the entire offense… let alone Favre.

Green Bay is ready to win ugly, i.e. the Minnesota and Detroit home wins last season. That can be hard for a three-time MVP to accept. But for the first time since the days of Reggie White and LeRoy Butler, Green Bay is building a defense that can close games.

“We Feel Like One…”
It’s almost a given that Kampman, Barnett, Hawk, Woodson, and Harris will deliver. The question marks hover over one position at each level - defensive tackle, outside linebacker, and strong safety. Far too often last season, offenses exploited an individual on defense, whether it was Shaun Alexander running right at Abdul Hodge for 200 yards or Chad Pennington capitalizing on Brady Poppinga’s coverage woes to build a 31-0 lead.

For Bob Sanders’ defense to become elite, players like Poppinga must take the next step and assimilate naturally with the 10 others on the field.

Sure it’s only minicamp, but Poppinga believes he’s no longer a third wheel.

“The comfort level will add to my effectiveness and how we play as a defense,” said Poppinga, who registered 61 tackles last year- half of Hawk’s total.

Thompson had the cap money to entice prize free agent Adalius Thomas, who could have completed the NFL’s best linebacker trio. Could have. Instead he banked on team chemistry and knowledge of the system over foreign star power. Thompson ensured that Barnett is a Packer for six more years, simultaneously offering a vote of confidence to Poppinga.

Sometimes the best move is not making one, a risky approach that will affect Thompson’s approval rating this season.

“We feel like one,” Poppinga described his on-field relationship with Hawk and Barnett. “We feed off each other, [create] synergy, help each other, and support each other. We try to be as one.”

Poppinga won’t make or break the defense himself, but he epitomizes what Kampman touched on. Small individual improvements from last season’s holdovers and a dose of new blood (Marviel Underwood, Justin Harrell, etc.) equates to a mass improvement for Sanders’ unit.

High-priced, popular ball hawks were available for the Packers’ pickings. But who knows how fast Thomas’ learning curve would have been? Who knows what effort you’re getting from a newcomer after handing him millions?

Green Bay’s current defense is hungry and best of all, on the same page. It’s too bad the season had to end after the 26-7 win in Chicago. More and more games are needed to make that ‘synergy’ permanent. And then they’ll be playing more on instincts and less on delayed thought processes, a transformation Rex Grossman painfully got a taste of.

Youthful Depth
In the past three drafts, Thompson has drafted 16 defensive players. At least five of them will likely enter September as starters.

In comparison, Mike Sherman drafted 12 defensive players in his three seasons as general manager. Only three are those are still on the team - Corey Williams (’04), Nick Barnett (’03), and Aaron Kampman (’02).

For Thompson, quantity is valued over quality, with the hope that a handful of darkhorses surface. But how much is too much? Defensively, there shouldn’t be restrictions. Just let them battle for roster spots in July and August. Such depth should help Sanders from becoming a victim to busts and injuries.

Five years ago when Jamal Reynolds, Joe Johnson, and Cletidus Hunt flamed out quicker than Rosie O’Donnell’s career, Green Bay’s run defense vanished (if only Rosie could do the same). Emergency fill-ins Rod Walker, Chukie Nwokorie, and Steve Warren were better suited on an NFL practice squad, not vaulted into the defensive line rotation for a 12-4 team. But poor personnel moves limited Green Bay’s options. Not surprisingly, the Packers’ mince meat run defense promptly plummeted to 21st in 2002, ruining an otherwise dynamic team.

At one point, that team was featured on the cover of Sports Illustrated as a Super Bowl favorite, were in the driver’s seat for homefield advantage and next to Rich Gannon, Favre was the top MVP candidate. Then… poof! Michael Vick is prancing through the snow and through green and gold, single-handedly accounting for the Packers’ first playoff loss ever at Lambeau Field.

All because of a lack of depth.

Ever so quietly, Green Bay’s ensuring such an effect doesn’t occur this year. With borderline starters as backups (Corey Williams, Frank Walker, Kabeer Gbaja-Biamila) and a strong DL rotation brewing, an injury or two shouldn’t slow down Sanders’ system. Heading into training camp, the Packers will encourage competition at each position. Instead of acquiring veterans on the decline like Nwokorie and Hardy Nickerson, Thompson opts for loads of youth through the draft to push for playing time.

This luxury was gained at the expense of the offense’s explosiveness the past two drafts. Vernon Davis and Robert Meachem would have given Favre two physically-gifted weapons to play catch with. But now the defense has an unusual blend of youth and experience. Hawk and Harrell look to be safe, solid picks that could elevate an above-average defense (12th in NFL) to premier status.

Maybe Thompson’s inactivity during free agency caused receding hairlines throughout Packer Nation. At times it seemed he was oblivious to fact that the Packers are on the cusp of playoff contention, only a handful of playmakers away. But if you’re going to rely on new faces somewhere it might as well be at running back and receiver, where rookies and no-names have repeatedly become starters in the NFL. Not on defense, where games are typically won and lost.

Now the core of Green Bay’s defense is under contract together for the next 4-5 years. If they gel as expected, that could be a very special half-decade … it may have to bail the offense out more than any Favre-led team is accustomed to doing.

Tyler Dunne is a frequent contributor to PackerReport.com. E-mail him at tydunne07@yahoo.com.

[/url]

woodbuck27
05-28-2007, 01:31 PM
Good long read.

Here's hopeing. :)

GO PACKERS !!

The Shadow
05-28-2007, 01:40 PM
I'm on board!
Great read.
Great philosophy to resurrect the franchise.

FritzDontBlitz
05-28-2007, 02:17 PM
already caught on to tt's approach, and as a former defensive player i could never argue against shoring up the defense. most fail to realize that gb/brett favre hasnt really had stability on the defensive side since holmgren took fritz with him to seattle. i just wish he would have grabbed more via free agency. i am optimistic about a couple of players drafted though, most notably deshawn wynn - its just a hunch, but wynn is my pick to be the breakout player for the pack.

oregonpackfan
05-28-2007, 11:43 PM
Very interesting read. We shall see how accurate the writer actually is.

Fritz
05-29-2007, 06:48 AM
I'll take another glass of kool-aid, please.

Yeah baby!

Packnut
05-29-2007, 08:29 AM
A lot depends on Underwood coming back. IF he takes Manuel's spot, this D can be really good.

The Leaper
05-29-2007, 09:11 AM
I don't care how good the defense is.

If the Packers are once again 16-for-49 in terms of scoring TDs in the redzone, they aren't likely to conjure up any thoughts of the Ravens.

There is a difference between building a strong defense...and just flat out ignoring glaring offensive weaknesses.

Zool
05-29-2007, 09:21 AM
A lot depends on Underwood coming back. IF he takes Manuel's spot, this D can be really good.

That position looks to be by far the weakest on D. Poops should improve to mediocre. Will Collins step back to start the season again or will a year back there with Manuel make a difference?

Stupid summer...hurry up and get over so I can watch football again.

mmmdk
05-29-2007, 10:18 AM
Of course defense comes first, just look at some of the Packer offensive players lately; they sure know how to whine over money and management moves. Defense wins championships but...

I agree with the sentiment that the Packers offense in 2007 had better start producing in the red zone or it's gonna be a long season.

Fritz
05-29-2007, 11:40 AM
Let's check out TT's drafts to see how this Teddy's-gonna-focus-on-the-defense argument works out...

2007 1 1 16 16 Justin Harrell DT Tennessee
2 2 31 63 Brandon Jackson RB Nebraska
3 3 14 78 James Jones WR San Jose State
4 3 26 89 Aaron Rouse DB Virginia Tech
5 4 20 119 Allen Barbre T Missouri Southern State
6 5 20 157 David Clowney WR Virginia Tech
7 6 17 191 Korey Hall LB Boise State
8 6 18 192 Desmond Bishop LB California
9 6 19 193 Mason Crosby K Colorado
10 7 18 228 DeShawn Wynn RB Florida
11 7 33 243 Clark Harris TE Rutgers
2006 1 1 5 5 A.J. Hawk LB Ohio State
2 2 15 47 Daryn Colledge T Boise State
3 2 20 52 Greg Jennings WR Western Michigan
4 3 3 67 Abdul Hodge LB Iowa
5 3 11 75 Jason Spitz C Louisville
6 4 7 104 Cory Rodgers WR Texas Christian
7 4 18 115 Will Blackmon WR Boston College
8 5 15 148 Ingle Martin QB Furman
9 5 33 165 Tony Moll T Nevada
10 6 14 183 Johnny Jolly DT Texas A&M
11 6 16 185 Tyrone Culver DB Fresno State
12 7 45 253 Dave Tollefson DE Northwest Missouri State
2005 1 1 24 24 Aaron Rodgers QB California
2 2 19 51 Nick Collins DB Bethune-Cookman
3 2 26 58 Terrence Murphy WR Texas A&M
4 4 14 115 Marviel Underwood DB San Diego State
5 4 24 125 Brady Poppinga LB Brigham Young
6 5 7 143 Junius Coston C North Carolina A&T
7 5 31 167 Michael Hawkins DB Oklahoma
8 6 6 180 Mike Montgomery DT Texas A&M
9 6 21 195 Craig Bragg WR UCLA
10 7 31 245 Kurt Campbell DB Albany (NY)
11 7 32 246 William Whitticker G Michigan State

Focusing only on the top three rounds of each draft, we see that Thompson has taken a quarterback in the first round, a running back in the second, two wide receivers in the second, another wide receiver in the third, a guard in the second, and another guard in the third.

That's seven offensive players in the top three rounds in three years of drafts. Compare that to four defensive players taken in the top three rounds of the same three of TT's drafts.

Bretsky
05-29-2007, 06:36 PM
Let's check out TT's drafts to see how this Teddy's-gonna-focus-on-the-defense argument works out...

2007 1 1 16 16 Justin Harrell DT Tennessee
2 2 31 63 Brandon Jackson RB Nebraska
3 3 14 78 James Jones WR San Jose State
4 3 26 89 Aaron Rouse DB Virginia Tech
5 4 20 119 Allen Barbre T Missouri Southern State
6 5 20 157 David Clowney WR Virginia Tech
7 6 17 191 Korey Hall LB Boise State
8 6 18 192 Desmond Bishop LB California
9 6 19 193 Mason Crosby K Colorado
10 7 18 228 DeShawn Wynn RB Florida
11 7 33 243 Clark Harris TE Rutgers
2006 1 1 5 5 A.J. Hawk LB Ohio State
2 2 15 47 Daryn Colledge T Boise State
3 2 20 52 Greg Jennings WR Western Michigan
4 3 3 67 Abdul Hodge LB Iowa
5 3 11 75 Jason Spitz C Louisville
6 4 7 104 Cory Rodgers WR Texas Christian
7 4 18 115 Will Blackmon WR Boston College
8 5 15 148 Ingle Martin QB Furman
9 5 33 165 Tony Moll T Nevada
10 6 14 183 Johnny Jolly DT Texas A&M
11 6 16 185 Tyrone Culver DB Fresno State
12 7 45 253 Dave Tollefson DE Northwest Missouri State
2005 1 1 24 24 Aaron Rodgers QB California
2 2 19 51 Nick Collins DB Bethune-Cookman
3 2 26 58 Terrence Murphy WR Texas A&M
4 4 14 115 Marviel Underwood DB San Diego State
5 4 24 125 Brady Poppinga LB Brigham Young
6 5 7 143 Junius Coston C North Carolina A&T
7 5 31 167 Michael Hawkins DB Oklahoma
8 6 6 180 Mike Montgomery DT Texas A&M
9 6 21 195 Craig Bragg WR UCLA
10 7 31 245 Kurt Campbell DB Albany (NY)
11 7 32 246 William Whitticker G Michigan State

Focusing only on the top three rounds of each draft, we see that Thompson has taken a quarterback in the first round, a running back in the second, two wide receivers in the second, another wide receiver in the third, a guard in the second, and another guard in the third.

That's seven offensive players in the top three rounds in three years of drafts. Compare that to four defensive players taken in the top three rounds of the same three of TT's drafts.


he better be making an effort via the draft because he sure as hell isn't bringing in any proven talent on the offensive side of the ball via free agency.

TT's Free Agent Signings worth at least a dime

Roman, Manuel, Pickett, Wooden, Walker (maybe)

BooHoo
05-29-2007, 07:28 PM
Enjoyed reading. So do we have a strong defense and an average offense? :?:

Bretsky
05-29-2007, 07:31 PM
Enjoyed reading. So do we have a strong defense and an average offense? :?:


I'd be happy if that is the way 07 turns out. Lots of questions need to be answered before we can be considered average there IMO

Patler
05-30-2007, 07:13 AM
TT's Free Agent Signings worth at least a dime

Roman, Manuel, Pickett, Wooden, Walker (maybe)

Thompson doesn't get the "credit" for signing Roman, Sherman brought him in the year before Thompson came.

Bretsky
05-30-2007, 07:23 AM
TT's Free Agent Signings worth at least a dime

Roman, Manuel, Pickett, Wooden, Walker (maybe)

Thompson doesn't get the "credit" for signing Roman, Sherman brought him in the year before Thompson came.

danged I was busted :wink: it's been a while.
Snapper brought in Roman II with Manuel.

wist43
05-31-2007, 08:56 AM
Don't see how they can ever have a "premier" defense b/c of the scheme... they'll never be a lights out unit that can consistently win games 6-3.

They can be good enough to look like an elite unit against the woeful dregs of the NFC North, but against good offenses, with good offensive lines, they'll continue to get drilled.

Good offensive lines will be able to shut down the pass rush of the front 4, and since the scheme is nauseatingly passive, and they really don't have any legitimate blitzers... I just don't see how they can possibly be an elite unit.

Beyond that, you have to assume that the defense will be on the field an awful lot this coming year... and, after Favre retires, they'll be on the field even more. Very few defenses can hold up under that kind of pressure (Baltimore, SD, Pitt).

woodbuck27
05-31-2007, 09:57 AM
Don't see how they can ever have a "premier" defense b/c of the scheme... they'll never be a lights out unit that can consistently win games 6-3.

They can be good enough to look like an elite unit against the woeful dregs of the NFC North, but against good offenses, with good offensive lines, they'll continue to get drilled.

Good offensive lines will be able to shut down the pass rush of the front 4, and since the scheme is nauseatingly passive, and they really don't have any legitimate blitzers... I just don't see how they can possibly be an elite unit.

Beyond that, you have to assume that the defense will be on the field an awful lot this coming year... and, after Favre retires, they'll be on the field even more. Very few defenses can hold up under that kind of pressure (Baltimore, SD, Pitt).

You've got it right there wist43.

A decent offense that can run the ball very well is needed to rest the defense or otherwise by mid season the defense is on the field too long and gets worn down.

It WAS CLEARLY SHOWN LAST SEASON THAT WE COULDN'T RUN THE BALL WELL.

TT's response was to allow Ahman Green to depart GB and to toss his support and confidence behind RB's that virtually have no NFL experience.

Who do we have that wil pick up the short and third down's?

Before we have to be concerned over the short and goal we need to operate alot better in the Red Zone.

Didn't we lead the NFL in dropped pass's?

TT's response was to ignore the need for a solid number 2 WR and to go with the status quo or worse (losing David Martin) at the TE position.

IT WAS CLEARLY SHOWN LAST SEASON THAT OUR OFFENSE WAS HORRID IN THE RED ZONE.

TT's response was to further weaken our offense on paper. Anyone with any honesty and ability to analyse the present situation with the Packers has to see this is a fact or agree that our offense certainly appears weaker.

IT WAS CLEARLY SHOWN LAST SEASON THAT FAVRE'S PASSING AVERAGE AND OUR ABILITY TO MOVE THE BALL WAS IMPEDED BY TOO MANY DROPPED PASS'S. PASS'S THAT WERE DROPPED BECAUSE OUR OFFENSE WASN'T ASSIGNMENT SURE OR PREPARED?

TT's response is still to load up the coaching staff's responsibility to fix it.

As a Packer fan I fully realize that Mike McCarthy and his staff have alot to fix. Alot to fix and without the full support of our GM.

Today we are aware that TT has decided to sit on some $9 million dollars of CAP space that he could have otherwise used to upgrade our talent level on the offense.

NFL analysts and Packer fans are well aware that Ted Thompson for whatever reason has decided that this season our progress has to be impeded or otherwise progress on the management decisions he decided to make.

One of those decisions was not to take any aggressive approach to build off of our record of 2006.

Ted Thompson has decided to allow our already poor running game to risk a poorer outcome in 2007.

He has decided to not upgrade at WR or at the TE position.

He has decided that our secondary was just fine in 2006, when the fans see real concern with the starting SS position and nickle and dime package.

Today . . TT sits on $9 million dollars in CAP space?

HarveyWallbangers
05-31-2007, 10:54 AM
No 2nd round RB can come into the league and do well, so there's no hope for the running game. Also, there's only one defensive scheme that you can win with in the NFL.

wist43
05-31-2007, 11:20 AM
No 2nd round RB can come into the league and do well, so there's no hope for the running game. Also, there's only one defensive scheme that you can win with in the NFL.

It's the combination of what the Packers do on both sides of the ball that will make it difficult for them to win it all IMO.

For the offensive scheme to be SB calibur, they have to have an all-pro calibur QB. They don't, and the odds that they will anytime soon, are long.

The defensive scheme is weak IMO, but they are assembling some talent on that side of the ball, so they have a shot at being better than average; but, the scheme certainly isn't going to help carry them to a SB.

Put the two together, and you have pretty long odds on making it to a SB.

If they had the all-pro QB, the could get by with the passive defensive scheme they run; or, if they ran a pressure 3-4, or had 4 all-pro defensive linemen, then they could maybe get by with having a slug at QB, and then still have a shot at a SB.

But, as I said, put the two schemes together on the same team, I think you have a problem.

woodbuck27
05-31-2007, 11:24 AM
No 2nd round RB can come into the league and do well, so there's no hope for the running game. Also, there's only one defensive scheme that you can win with in the NFL.

This may have been previously posted:

http://www.packersnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070520/PKR01/705200695/1950

Posted May 20, 2007

Offense searches for a point man

By Rob Demovsky
rdemovsk@greenbaypressgazette.com

Any evidence — any bona fide, tangible proof — that the Green Bay Packers will be any more explosive on offense than last year, when they ranked 22nd in the NFL in points, is hard to find.

Coach Mike McCarthy will go with largely the same cast on offense — minus running back Ahman Green, who left in free agency.

General Manager Ted Thompson never addressed the play-making positions in free agency, though he did take a running back (Brandon Jackson) and two receivers (James Jones and David Clowney) within the first five rounds of last month's draft.

Quarterback Brett Favre is back for his 17th NFL season, but at 37, there's no telling when his skills will reach the point of significant deterioration.

Yet for some reason, McCarthy, in his second season as coach, believes he knows where points — and more of them — will be found.

"I'm going to have to show you, because you guys don't believe," McCarthy said before this weekend's minicamp.

"So, we're going to have to show you."

When Green signed with the Houston Texans, the Packers lost a four-time Pro Bowl running back who last season, even coming off a major leg injury, rushed for 1,059 yards in 14 games.

In his place, it could be running back by committee with Jackson and third-year pro Vernand Morency likely to share the bulk of the carries unless one of them flashes something special.

Thompson failed to pull off a trade for Randy Moss, meaning the top of the receiving corps is the same as last year with starters Donald Driver and Greg Jennings leading a group that also includes unprovens like Ruvell Martin and Carlyle Holiday, the underachieving Robert Ferguson and the rookies.

"The running back group, I think you'll be impressed," McCarthy said.

"I've watched the offseason program, and I'm happy with all of them, but the running back group and the receiver group are busting their (butts).

"One thing I know that's consistent with this business, if you do it right all the time, regardless of the name on your back or what people think of you outside this building, you're going to be a productive player. The efficiency of our people is definitely going to improve. The talent's young and is definitely going to improve."

The Packers also are banking on the growth and maturation of their offensive line, which last year featured rookie guards Daryn Colledge and Jason Spitz.

That inexperience up front combined with the zone blocking scheme McCarthy implemented in his first season as coach made for difficulties, especially in the running game.

The Packers averaged only 81.25 yards rushing during the first four games, and even that was skewed by a 103-yard rushing performance, most of which came in garbage time, in the Week 1 blowout loss to the Bears.

For the season, the Packers ranked 23rd in the league in rushing, averaging 103.9 yards per game.

Both Colledge and Spitz will have a full NFL offseason under their belts. According to offensive coordinator Joe Philbin, who last season was the line coach, both have gotten stronger. More importantly, Philbin believes the experience they gained last season will pay dividends.

"We weren't the best pass protecting team in the league last year, but we were pretty solid," Philbin said.

"If we can maintain that and maybe get a little better there, but we've got to get our running game cranked up. We've got to have explosive gains (and) get guys to stick it in the end zone."

Improved play by the offensive line could translate into better red-zone efficiency, which would mean more points.

The Packers were last in the NFC and second-to-last (ahead of only Oakland) in the NFL in touchdown percentage when inside the opponents' 20.

In 49 trips inside the red zone, the Packers scored just 16 touchdowns.


"We'll be better than that," receiver Donald Driver said.

But that goes back to the seemingly unanswerable question: How?

Tight end Bubba Franks said he has seen "small changes to the offense that make me feel really good about it."

"The bottom line was execution — maybe a little off on a pass, a route was cut short, a dropped ball," Favre said.

"For example, against the Rams here, we're moving the ball great, and I get the ball knocked out of my hand in the red zone. I throw a ball to Donald against Buffalo, we're moving the ball and we get down to the 1-yard line (and Favre threw an interception). It's just execution here and there.


"Mike made a point that he needs to stick to the run game a little bit more. I kind of argue against that a little bit. There's a happy medium somewhere in there, and we have to find it. Yeah inexperience plays a part of it, I'm sure. There were plays to be made, put it that way."

Comment woodbuck27:

SEE STORY CHAT in following post.

woodbuck27
05-31-2007, 11:31 AM
http://www.packersnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070520/PKR01/705200695/1950

Story Chat

Reader Comment Tue May 29, 2007 9:14 pm

"to join in a secret agreement to do an unlawful or wrongful act or an act which becomes unlawful as a result of the secret agreement <accused of conspiring to overthrow the government"

No conspiracy here, A conspiracy requires a group of people acting together. I believe it is only one person failing to do their job. That person is TT. I also would not doubt TT flat out lying that he was going to do something, and then doing nothing. We have a few examples of that already.

"You cannot quote an article in a paper / website ect. and really think this is what was talked about behind closed doors with #4 and the HC or GM.
Can you?"

I have the article, and I have TT's history. You have? squat.

"Do you really believe that #4 isn't being told what is going on and that he is as clueless as you think?
Can you? "

I believe he was lied to, based upon this site. I also believe he was lied to based upon his anger toward the Packers Management post draft. Has anyone EVER seen Favre lash out at management before? Based on Favre's history, TT's history and this article and Favres reaction, yes. I think Favre was lied to.


Reader Comment Tue May 29, 2007 11:03 am
loftyking and any other conspiracy lovers


You cannot quote an article in a paper / website ect. and really think this is what was talked about behind closed doors with #4 and the HC or GM.
Can you?

Do you really believe that #4 isn't being told what is going on and that he is as clueless as you think?
Can you?

Give #4 some credit for brains not just a right arm and big heart.

Also TT and the Packer org. just doesn't talk about what they are and are not doing. Never has and never will. accept it with a little less criticism and a touch more wait and see attitude.

I do not immed. jump to a conspiracy theory every time something isn't fully disclosed to the folks that do not have a NTK. (Need to Know)


Reader Comment Sun May 27, 2007 9:16 am

He knew from the beginning what situation he was getting into, and he decided to stick around.


http://www.packersnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/99999999/PKR/302030021/1058/PKR


"Besides the improvement he saw on the offensive line and defense as a whole, Favre's conversation with McCarthy also was encouraging, because the coach said that augmenting the skill positions on offense will be a priority this offseason, the source said."

Not true Finkelstein. He was lied to about what the Packers would do in the offseason. They did NOTHING to help the offense aside from add some rookies. In fact, the offense was made weaker by TT allowing Green to leave when we had the cap space to easily afford him, then TT wiffs on Moss.

Maybe you TT supporters want to gaslight the situation, but for those of us that follow what is going on your gaslighting just does not work.


check it out Sat May 26, 2007 3:15 pm

Packers67 - This is getting old... we love Favre, but he cannot have it both ways. He knew from the beginning what situation he was getting into, and he decided to stick around. He has also said repeatedly he does not want a trade.

So where does that leave him?

That leaves him with doing what he did last week - keeping his mouth shut about anything but being a good team leader on a young, promising team that simply needs more game reps to improve.

We all get emotional about Brett because of the player and person he has been, and we know it will be long before we see someone like him again, but emotions cloud good judgement and logic.

Would you rather the team mortgage its future and completely bottom out for years just to pull a desperate trade to try to win an extra game or two in 2007?

Come on, now - you're old enough to remember how Dan Devine wasted the middle of the 1970s on guys like John Hadl and Jim DelGaizo.

Do you think this team is a player or two away from beating the likes of the Patriots, Chargers or Colts, the top teams in the league? Again, no one has to apologize to him for how this team is being rebuilt for the long haul. He knew exactly what he was getting into.

This is the same argument over and over from the Ted-bashers, and you guys either won't accept it or don't get it, but here it is again - this team is in the process of a 4-5 year complete overhaul because of the condition it was left in my the last guy who DID go "all in" on the short term, wasting draft picks, money and precious cap space.

To anyone remotely paying attention, that has been clear from the beginning. And when you complain because Ted and Mac say they are NOT rebuilding, you have to be bright enough to understand that no one in their position would EVER say they are doing a complete overhaul, because that is a built-in excuse for accepting failure.

Now, to my original point of posting - if anyone is interested in what type of athletes Brandon Jackson, James Jones and David Clowney were in college, check out some of their highlight stuff on YouTube - real easy to find.

Obviously these are their best plays neatly put together to pimp them up, but anyone who thinks these guys could not be playmakers in the NFL should check it out. I'm no NFL scout, but there is speed, agility and talent there. Let's hope they work out.

Go Packers!

MadScientist
05-31-2007, 11:39 AM
Don't see how they can ever have a "premier" defense b/c of the scheme... they'll never be a lights out unit that can consistently win games 6-3....

Good offensive lines will be able to shut down the pass rush of the front 4, and since the scheme is nauseatingly passive, and they really don't have any legitimate blitzers... I just don't see how they can possibly be an elite unit.


I will not profess to be an expert on NFL defensive schemes, but depending on the front four to generate the rush is one of the core pieces of the Tampa-2, a very good scheme. The key is the people on the line. Will the addition of Justin Harrell (who may have been a top 10 pick before getting injured), and using Jenkins to keep KGB fresh be enough against a good line? Maybe, we'll see this season. Of course if Poppinga and Manuel are still gaping holes, it won't matter too much how good the line is.

On the other side of the ball, the skill positions won't matter too much unless the OL develops into at least an average group. They should, but we'll see.

wist43
05-31-2007, 12:11 PM
"We weren't the best pass protecting team in the league last year, but we were pretty solid," Philbin said.

-------------------

"Pretty solid"??? WOW... obviously, Mr. Philbin is delusional!!!

Did he even watch any of the games last year??? MAX PROTECT??? ALL YEAR!!! They were nothing short of horrible... I mean absolutely horrible.

I was watching the 2nd Minnesota game last night... the OL was nothing short of embarrassing. They couldn't block 4 with 7!!!!

I agree they should get better - stronger, but with improvement by leaps and bounds, that should get them to average.

WOW... Pretty solid??? And this guy is a coach???

Scott Campbell
01-05-2008, 06:00 AM
Don't see how they can ever have a "premier" defense b/c of the scheme... they'll never be a lights out unit that can consistently win games 6-3.

They can be good enough to look like an elite unit against the woeful dregs of the NFC North, but against good offenses, with good offensive lines, they'll continue to get drilled.

Good offensive lines will be able to shut down the pass rush of the front 4, and since the scheme is nauseatingly passive, and they really don't have any legitimate blitzers... I just don't see how they can possibly be an elite unit.

Beyond that, you have to assume that the defense will be on the field an awful lot this coming year... and, after Favre retires, they'll be on the field even more. Very few defenses can hold up under that kind of pressure (Baltimore, SD, Pitt).

You've got it right there wist43.

A decent offense that can run the ball very well is needed to rest the defense or otherwise by mid season the defense is on the field too long and gets worn down.

It WAS CLEARLY SHOWN LAST SEASON THAT WE COULDN'T RUN THE BALL WELL.

TT's response was to allow Ahman Green to depart GB and to toss his support and confidence behind RB's that virtually have no NFL experience.

Who do we have that wil pick up the short and third down's?

Before we have to be concerned over the short and goal we need to operate alot better in the Red Zone.

Didn't we lead the NFL in dropped pass's?

TT's response was to ignore the need for a solid number 2 WR and to go with the status quo or worse (losing David Martin) at the TE position.

IT WAS CLEARLY SHOWN LAST SEASON THAT OUR OFFENSE WAS HORRID IN THE RED ZONE.

TT's response was to further weaken our offense on paper. Anyone with any honesty and ability to analyse the present situation with the Packers has to see this is a fact or agree that our offense certainly appears weaker.

IT WAS CLEARLY SHOWN LAST SEASON THAT FAVRE'S PASSING AVERAGE AND OUR ABILITY TO MOVE THE BALL WAS IMPEDED BY TOO MANY DROPPED PASS'S. PASS'S THAT WERE DROPPED BECAUSE OUR OFFENSE WASN'T ASSIGNMENT SURE OR PREPARED?

TT's response is still to load up the coaching staff's responsibility to fix it.

As a Packer fan I fully realize that Mike McCarthy and his staff have alot to fix. Alot to fix and without the full support of our GM.

Today we are aware that TT has decided to sit on some $9 million dollars of CAP space that he could have otherwise used to upgrade our talent level on the offense.

NFL analysts and Packer fans are well aware that Ted Thompson for whatever reason has decided that this season our progress has to be impeded or otherwise progress on the management decisions he decided to make.

One of those decisions was not to take any aggressive approach to build off of our record of 2006.

Ted Thompson has decided to allow our already poor running game to risk a poorer outcome in 2007.

He has decided to not upgrade at WR or at the TE position.

He has decided that our secondary was just fine in 2006, when the fans see real concern with the starting SS position and nickle and dime package.

Today . . TT sits on $9 million dollars in CAP space?


lol.....nice.