GLIMPSE TO FUTURE--"""MANNING SOON TO SHRED A

[Bretsky]

Consider this

The current records for passing yards are 61,361
The current record for TDs is 420.
Both are held by Dan Marino. Both should be broken by Favre this season
Brett Favre owns the completions record, with 5,021.

Manning has played 9 seasons thus far
PFT's projection of Mannings stats if he plays 8 more seasons is staggering.

If Manning plays a total of 17 seasons, he is projected to finish with about:

70,995 passing yards
519 touchdowns passes
5,900 completions

Anybody else thing Manning will break them all ???

Favre should feel like Barry Bonds with AROD; I think all of football knows Manning will be there pretty soon.

[GrnBay007]

You are just a bundle of NON kool-aid posting lately. :evil:

[MJZiggy]

I"m with 007 on this one. :flm: :shtf:

[Bretsky]

Another comment

Talk about a franchise setting up a QB to Maximize his potential. Ron Wolf often commented a big regret was never giving Brett Favre enough talent on offense; the cup is more dry now than most of the Wolf years on that side.

On the other hand, consider what Payton Manning has had is marveling:

One of the Top WR's in the NFL in Marvin Harrison
One of the top #2 WR's in the NFL in Reggie Wayne
A solid #3 WR in Stokely; now they used a 1st round pick on a WR to supplant him

Edgerrin James and now Joseph Addai (both solid WR'ing RB's
A nice pass receiving TE in Dallas Clark and he also had a decent one in his prime with Pollard

A solid offensive line for several years and one that is still solid


For me, it appears Manning loves the game and his shattering of the records is inevitable.

Somehow I just hope Favre keeps the ironman consecutive start record that Manning is also chasing

[Bretsky]

You are just a bundle of NON kool-aid posting lately. :evil:


No no no; this is nothing against Favre; he's one of the greatest all time. But Mannings run is pretty amazing

[GBRulz]

I know this is incredibly rude BUT... it's time for Manning to break a leg.

[GrnBay007]

You are just a bundle of NON kool-aid posting lately. :evil:


No no no; this is nothing against Favre; he's one of the greatest all time. But Mannings run is pretty amazing

I know it's nothing against Favre. I just hate the idea of Manning getting any of Brett's records. :(

[GrnBay007]

I know this is incredibly rude BUT... it's time for Manning to break a leg.

LOL!

someone slip him some drugs so he gets busted. :twisted:

[BallHawk]

I know this is incredibly rude BUT... it's time for Manning to break a leg.

Somebody in the AFC South needs to sign Lawrence Taylor and Harry Carson. :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

[Bretsky]

You are just a bundle of NON kool-aid posting lately. :evil:


No no no; this is nothing against Favre; he's one of the greatest all time. But Mannings run is pretty amazing

I know it's nothing against Favre. I just hate the idea of Manning getting any of Brett's records. :(



Completely agree; I was just trying to add some football chatter to all the non news in Green Bay

[MJZiggy]

I thought him going out with a sprained thumb would be perfect...he just has to miss one game...

(or was that thumb broken??)

[Rastak]

I know this is incredibly rude BUT... it's time for Manning to break a leg.

Actually isn't Favre due one? His streak is pretty amazing......

[GrnBay007]

I know this is incredibly rude BUT... it's time for Manning to break a leg.

Actually isn't Favre due one? His streak is pretty amazing......

:evil:
:bs:
:butt:
:smack:
:duel:

What did you say?????

[Rastak]

I know this is incredibly rude BUT... it's time for Manning to break a leg.

Actually isn't Favre due one? His streak is pretty amazing......

:evil:
:bs:
:butt:
:smack:
:duel:

What did you say?????

Karma 007.......Karma.......

[GrnBay007]

I know this is incredibly rude BUT... it's time for Manning to break a leg.

Actually isn't Favre due one? His streak is pretty amazing......

:evil:
:bs:
:butt:
:smack:
:duel:

What did you say?????

Karma 007.......Karma.......

Rat Trap for you Dude!!!!!! :evil:



:P

[Little Whiskey]

I know this is incredibly rude BUT... it's time for Manning to break a leg.

Actually isn't Favre due one? His streak is pretty amazing......

:evil:
:bs:
:butt:
:smack:
:duel:

What did you say?????

Karma 007.......Karma.......

Rat Trap for you Dude!!!!!! :evil:



:P

I'm getting Betsy off of back window of my truck! :evil:

[Iron Mike]

Consider this

The current records for passing yards are 61,361
The current record for TDs is 420.
Both are held by Dan Marino. Both should be broken by Favre this season
Brett Favre owns the completions record, with 5,021.

Manning has played 9 seasons thus far
PFT's projection of Mannings stats if he plays 8 more seasons is staggering.

If Manning plays a total of 17 seasons, he is projected to finish with about:

70,995 passing yards
519 touchdowns passes
5,900 completions

Anybody else thing Manning will break them all ???

Favre should feel like Barry Bonds with AROD; I think all of football knows Manning will be there pretty soon.

When he does, Kenny Chesney will be SOOOOO happy!!!!

http://www.deadspin.com/sports/peytonandkennychesney.jpg

[RIPackerFan]

I think Manning has a shot - however - its a record for a reason.

First of all - take Favre's first full 16 game seasons vs. Mannings first full game seasons - only 6 TDs is the difference (that equates to less than a TD/seaons difference).

From a yardage standpoint (using the same years as above) - Manning has approx. a 240 yard/season advantage on Favre - an bigger advantage than the TDs - assuming he plays as many seasons as Favre - he may take the lead there.

To me - they are basically at the same point in both of their careers, with a slight average to Manning in yards.

However, we will see if the natural cyclical nature of the NFL does to the Colts what it did to the Packers.

Mind you - the Colts now have +20% of their cap in two players. Meanwhile, his number one weapon of choice - Harrison is on the wrong side of 34.

The NFL has a way of humbling its teams - and another 8 yrs is a lifetime in the NFL - where a team can go from the Superbowl to the 1st pick in the draft in a few years.

If the Colts do take a down-turn when Manning is 34, I can't imagine Manning enduring a 4 - 12 season - and coming back for more.

I think the reason why he won't break the record is less about his talent and more that he would retire before he plays enough seasons to beat Favre......And I think a lot of people are assuming this is Favre's last year - personally, I think he is coming back for one more after this season - but that is just a hunch.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Oh well. Somebody will break Favre's records. I hope he doesn't beat Favre's soon-to-be wins record or consecutive games streak though. Those will be the two most important ones, I think.

[Scott Campbell]

I know this is incredibly rude BUT... it's time for Manning to break a leg.

LOL!

someone slip him some drugs so he gets busted. :twisted:



That's why it's way too early to assume he will break all the records. Too much can happen in the amount of time it will take him to surpass Favre to consider it a lock. He'll have to get much closer before it becomes a foregone conclusion in my mind.

[the_idle_threat]

Manning is still young and close to his prime. Will he still produce at the same rate when he's Favre's age?

Favre has an all-world arm that has faded a bit but is still above average. Manning has never had much better than an average arm ... as he ages and loses velocity, will he produce even as well as Favre has in his later years?

[HarveyWallbangers]

Manning has a MUCH better than average arm. His arm strength is good, and his accuracy is phenomenal.

[the_idle_threat]

Manning has a MUCH better than average arm. His arm strength is good, and his accuracy is phenomenal.

I was talking arm strength, not accuracy. Nobody honestly believes he has a "laser rocket arm" except the people who write his commercials, and maybe you. :P He's a little above average now, and makes up for this relative weakness with uncanny accuracy. When his arm strength slips to a Jeff Garcia-like level, will he still be as effective? That's all I'm saying.

[Patler]

If Favre plays in 2008, it becomes much less likely that Manning will break all of the records. In fact, if Favre has a typical Favre year this year, it starts becoming less likely that Manning will play long enough to break all of the records.

Manning is already over 31 years old. At the start of his 17th season he would be 38 1/2 years old, older than Favre is now. It is by no means a given that he will complete 15 or 16 years, let alone 17. Funny things happen to athletes after they hit 35 years of age. Favre is pretty amazing for his production at his age. Kelly played 11 seasons, Aikman 12, Griese 13, Elway 15, Fouts 15. Marino played 17, but turned 38 after the start of his last season. Manning has enjoyed good health, but to assume he will be playing when he is almost 39 years old is really a bit much.

The stats they projected are simply taking his average over his first 9 seasons and applying that to 17 seasons. Particularly in TDs that is inaccurate. He had 49 the one season, but only topped 30 two other times, with 33 in 2000 and 31 last year. The other 6 seasons he had less than 30 TDs. It is more accurate to predict him to have his average over the 8 seasons not including the "anomaly" in 2004 with the 49 TD passes. You can also expect him to tail off at some point, they mostly all do.

Whenever Favre decides to retire, to break the records Manning will have to play at least about 5 seasons more. The longer Favre plays, the less likely that becomes, simply because of age.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Manning has a MUCH better than average arm. His arm strength is good, and his accuracy is phenomenal.

I was talking arm strength, not accuracy. Nobody honestly believes he has a "laser rocket arm" except the people who write his commercials, and maybe you. :P He's a little above average now, and makes up for this relative weakness with uncanny accuracy. When his arm strength slips to a Jeff Garcia-like level, will he still be as effective? That's all I'm saying.

He's got a lot more arm strength than a little above average. It's not Elway or Favre, but his arm strength is better than 90% of the QBs in the league. There's not a throw he can't make because of arm strength.

[Pacopete4]

the whole post doesnt make any sense.. of course mannings stats are gonna average out to being higher than favre.. im sure favres averaged out to be a ton more than marino when he was at the prime of his career too. you people keep forgetting favres numbers now are on the norm for good QB's. Average out his first 8 seasons he played and see how high his numbers would be projected, please people use some common sense

[GBRulz]

Manning has a MUCH better than average arm. His arm strength is good, and his accuracy is phenomenal.

He also has two Pro Bowl receivers to throw to.

[GBRulz]

I know this is incredibly rude BUT... it's time for Manning to break a leg.

Actually isn't Favre due one? His streak is pretty amazing......

Well .... you'd think that the Queens were due to win a SB by now and that's never happened :taunt:

[Merlin]

You are just a bundle of NON kool-aid posting lately. :evil:


No no no; this is nothing against Favre; he's one of the greatest all time. But Mannings run is pretty amazing

Manning has had a silver spoon in his mouth since he entered the league. Favre got the rusty one. What amazes me is that this will be Favre's 15th year as a starter and he is in better condition, has a stronger arm and is not even close to being a crybaby as Manning. Favre got his MVP's early on even though he has had spectacular seasons pretty much every year in the League regardless of the players around him, save the last two.

Can anyone argue that the Super Bowl MVP shouldn't be the guy who caused a fumble, was the closest player to recovering that fumble and the first player to RUN AWAY from the fumble? Favre would have tried to recover it but the MVP would have gone to someone else.

[GrnBay007]

I know this is incredibly rude BUT... it's time for Manning to break a leg.

Actually isn't Favre due one? His streak is pretty amazing......

Well .... you'd think that the Queens were due to win a SB by now and that's never happened :taunt:

HAAHAA http://i10.tinypic.com/5zoox0n.gifhttp://i10.tinypic.com/5zoox0n.gifHAAHAAA

[Zool]

When he does, Kenny Chesney will be SOOOOO happy!!!!

http://www.deadspin.com/sports/peytonandkennychesney.jpg

Could they be any more gay for each other?

[The Leaper]

Anybody else thing Manning will break them all ???

I don't.

Manning does not possess the raw talent of a Favre or Elway. Now that he has won a Super Bowl, he doesn't possess the desire to keep playing for year after year past his prime like Marino did.

Take Favre's stats after 9 years and project them over 17 and they will likely be closer to Manning's projection than Marino's final stats too. Manning's offensive group will start to decline in the years ahead...and his numbers will also start to decline. Manning has no mobility, so any drop off in OL play will really hurt his stats.

I think Manning's ego would prevent him from sticking around through a rebuilding period like Favre has. With the Colts primed to take a tumble in the next 3-5 years (lots of cap tied up in only a few players, loss of depth due to free agency) I don't think Peyton will be around for 8 more years.

I'm also someone who feels Favre could play another 2-3 years easily. The Packers are on the rise...a slow rise, but a rise nonetheless. He had that surgery to his ankle...which he really didn't want to do...that would suggest Favre plans on playing longer than one more year. His oldest daughter is off to college now, so she isn't a reason to retire any longer.

Manning's best shot is the yardage title...I highly doubt he breaks Favre's record for wins or TDs when all is said and done. If Manning doesn't do it, it could be awhile before we see another great QB like that with the durability and longevity to make a run at those records. Guys like Favre, Elway, Marino and Manning typically don't come along in the same generation. The NFL has been blessed.

[the_idle_threat]

[Manning's] got a lot more arm strength than a little above average. It's not Elway or Favre, but his arm strength is better than 90% of the QBs in the league. There's not a throw he can't make because of arm strength.

I am compelled to agree ... to disagree.

This is an impossible thing to rank with great accuracy, but at best, I'd place Manning at maybe the 75th percentile in arm strength. I believe it's probably lower than that---definitely not in the 90th percentile.

Keep in mind how small a sample we're looking at here. Among starters, there are only 3 quarterbacks in the league in the 90th percentile. (Perhaps I should clarify that I'm talking about starters here, since rag-armed backups who never had a chance to play in the first place hardly count or matter.) You're telling me that Peyton's arm strength is top-3 among all starters in the league? I call bullshit. There are numerous guys who are renowned for their outstanding arm strength, such as Favre, Vick, Cutler, Palmer, McNair, and even J.P. Losman.

If you read a bio on Manning, it will go on about his accuracy and his touch, and of course his ability to read defenses, audible, and manage the game. Regarding his arm, it will say what you said---that he has enough arm strength to get the job done. See the following examples:

http://www.peytonmanning18.com/bio.html
Positives: "Arm is strong enough for him to throw all the routes in the playbook."
Negatives: "Lacks a great arm. Can't throw off-balance with zip as Favre or Elway can. Needs to set his feet to zip the ball."

http://www.jockbio.com/Bios/Manning/Manning_bio.html
"Peyton’s arm strength is above average, while his accuracy is off the charts. He throws his share of wobblers, but most of his passes find their targets between the numbers and in stride."

This is not even close to the same thing as having one of the strongest arms in the league.

Easily more than half of the starting quarterbacks in the league have enough arm to make "all the throws"---as Manning does---so that statement is meaningless toward your point. If anything, it shows his arm strength is close to average, which is my point.

And it goes to the larger point: If Manning's arm is just "good enough to make all the throws" now---when he's in his prime---then wouldn't that mean that when he gets past 35 and his arm strength begins to wane, he won't even be able to make all the throws? Seems to me that he might not age as well as other guys who have more physical tools to work with.

[BF4MVP]

Records are kept so that people can break them..Manning breaking Favre's passing records does not diminish anything Favre has accomplished in his career..Not even a little bit..

[HarveyWallbangers]

You can argue all you want. Every scouting service you find will likely say that he doesn't have a cannon like Elway or Favre, but has good arm strength. It's way above average. You make him sound like a noodle arm. I'd say he's similar to a Dan Fouts--which is still better than 80% of the QBs who have played the game.

If I was to compare to baseball, Favre and Elway have 100 MPH fastballs. A guy can get by on a 90 MPH fastball. Some guys even less. Manning would have a 94-95 MPH fastball with exceptional control. That puts him great on accuracy and good on velocity.

The guy is a great QB. One of the best ever. To say he doesn't have a cannon like Favre or Elway as a flaw is just nitpicking. His arm strength is plenty good. Personally, I think if he has one flaw it's his lack of mobility, inability to throw well on the move, and shakiness when he does get rattled. If you are able to lock down his receivers a bit and get a solid pass rush, he can be rattled more than many of the top QBs. Lucky for him, he's had a great receiving, great receiving RBs, and good OL.

[the_idle_threat]

Of course, you're so dug in with the arguing that you miss the point entirely, Harv.

Let's review it one more time.

1. Manning has an above-average arm, but definitely not a cannon arm. Does this mean noodle-arm to you? It doesn't to me. Noodle-arm would be well below average, considering that even average quarterbacks in the NFL have strong enough arms to make all the throws. Noodle-arm means unable to make all the throws.

2. I'm not focusing on Manning's arm strength to somehow diminish his accomplishments or say he's inferior to Brett or any other quarterback. I'm only pointing it out as a fact that might shed light on Manning's future.

The guys who have lasted into their late 30's and put up all-time numbers, like Favre, Elway, Marino, Warren Moon, etc., were known as having outstanding arm strength, rather than just above average. Marino less so than the other three perhaps, but he was stronger than Manning in his prime. (Here is a source for that assertion: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6656792 ). Their "cannons" lost a little steam as they got up there in years, but they still had enough juice left at the end to make all the throws.

So what does that imply for a guy like Manning, who doesn't have quite as much to lose before he can't make all the throws anymore? I think he will decline at a younger age than these other guys did, which means it's no sure thing he will get all the records.

That's my point.

Rather than addressing this point, you first choose to deny the obvious, and claim that Manning in fact has a cannon arm. I had to call bullshit on that.

Then you come back and admit he doesn't have a cannon arm, but say he has plenty enough arm to be very effective today, and I'm nitpicking regarding how good he is.

This misses the point entirely---I'm not saying he's an average quarterback or anything like that---I'm just saying he has a weaker throwing arm than the other top guys historically. That's all. This only means that---even though he will rightfully be known as one of the best QBs all time (as much as I hate to say that because I think he's a total prick)---it's no sure thing that he'll be effective long enough to break all the passing records.

Do you have any comments on my actual point, or do you want to continue missing the point and arguing meaningless side issues?

[MJZiggy]

And it goes to the larger point: If Manning's arm is just "good enough to make all the throws" now---when he's in his prime---then wouldn't that mean that when he gets past 35 and his arm strength begins to wane, he won't even be able to make all the throws? Seems to me that he might not age as well as other guys who have more physical tools to work with.

You sure do know how to sweet talk a girl...

[the_idle_threat]

And it goes to the larger point: If Manning's arm is just "good enough to make all the throws" now---when he's in his prime---then wouldn't that mean that when he gets past 35 and his arm strength begins to wane, he won't even be able to make all the throws? Seems to me that he might not age as well as other guys who have more physical tools to work with.

You sure do know how to sweet talk a girl...

:idea: Yes ... yes I do. :lol:

[HarveyWallbangers]

I get your point, and it may be valid, but you are now saying this:


1. Manning has an above-average arm

When you said this before;


Manning has never had much better than an average arm

And I do know that means arm strength. I'm just saying that he has good, not great, arm strength. He'll drop off like all QBs do when they get older, but he can afford to lose a little velocity.

[b bulldog]

Mannings biggest attribute imo is above the shoulders, Brett imo does have more raw talent but Manning has much more above the shoulders and that usually gets you farther in the end. Simply put, all records are meant to be broken. Brett has done a wonderful job getting to where he is but in the end, Manning will own the records imo but he could get hurt next year and retire soon after.

[The Leaper]

Arm strength is not as important to Manning because his team plays in a dome...and in a division where poor weather will be rare to see.

I think his legs are much more of a concern. His mobility is scary bad. If the OL lapses, Manning will be forced to throw more quickly...and we saw what that did to Favre last year.

[Bretsky]

Arm strength is not as important to Manning because his team plays in a dome...and in a division where poor weather will be rare to see.

I think his legs are much more of a concern. His mobility is scary bad. If the OL lapses, Manning will be forced to throw more quickly...and we saw what that did to Favre last year.


The GM has did a wonderful job focusing on surrounding his superstar with weapons on the offensive side and quality blockers.

His #3 leaves so he used his 1st on a WR; the well oiled machine has a few more scary years ahead of him

[GrnBay007]

If the OL lapses...

He'll throw them under the bus, like he's done before.

(or maybe if he just "thinks" they lapsed) :P

[the_idle_threat]

If the OL lapses...

He'll throw them under the bus, like he's done before.



AHAHAHAHAHAA!!! LOVE IT!!! :bclap: :five: :clap: :bow:

[b bulldog]

just throwing the youth in front of the bus, right :oops:

[The Leaper]

The GM has did a wonderful job focusing on surrounding his superstar with weapons on the offensive side and quality blockers.

This is true. However, the DEFENSIVE side of the ball is what has been built up more recently...and with the monster deal that Freeney just got, you can expect more resources to move over to that side of the ball now.

That is why I think we may see Manning's OL take a downward trend in the next 3-5 years. Once a team wins a Super Bowl, it is very difficult to retain all of your key pieces...especially a team like Indy that now has a ton of cash wrapped up in just 3 players (Manning, Harrison, Freeney). Manning's lack of mobility will become a greater and greater concern as he heads toward his mid-30s.

[Merlin]

Records are kept so that people can break them..Manning breaking Favre's passing records does not diminish anything Favre has accomplished in his career..Not even a little bit..

Although I completely agree with you as do I am sure most of the Packer fans out there, Favre's accomplishments will wither the second Manning breaks his records with the rest of the fans. There is no doubt in my mind that the way Favre plays football is dying fast in the NFL. It's all about the money, the hype and the name. One great season and a player thinks he deserves it all. Any all-pro team (and Pro-Bowl) team should be based on commitment to the game and not the dollar signs.

[Jimx29]

Consider this

The current records for passing yards are 61,361
The current record for TDs is 420.
Both are held by Dan Marino. Both should be broken by Favre this season
Brett Favre owns the completions record, with 5,021.

Manning has played 9 seasons thus far
PFT's projection of Mannings stats if he plays 8 more seasons is staggering.

If Manning plays a total of 17 seasons, he is projected to finish with about:

70,995 passing yards
519 touchdowns passes
5,900 completions

Anybody else thing Manning will break them all ???

Favre should feel like Barry Bonds with AROD; I think all of football knows Manning will be there pretty soon.
What were Brett's #s after 9 years? Gotta compare apples to potatos

[woodbuck27]

I know this is incredibly rude BUT... it's time for Manning to break a leg.

Actually isn't Favre due one? His streak is pretty amazing......

Jeeeese !! Don't do that. . .please !!

Favre has enough going against him this season. . . for bad omens.

[woodbuck27]

Consider this

The current records for passing yards are 61,361
The current record for TDs is 420.
Both are held by Dan Marino. Both should be broken by Favre this season
Brett Favre owns the completions record, with 5,021.

Manning has played 9 seasons thus far
PFT's projection of Mannings stats if he plays 8 more seasons is staggering.

If Manning plays a total of 17 seasons, he is projected to finish with about:

70,995 passing yards
519 touchdowns passes
5,900 completions

Anybody else thing Manning will break them all ???

Favre should feel like Barry Bonds with AROD; I think all of football knows Manning will be there pretty soon.

Well then. Brett will simply have to play out his contract.

Let's say that he plays this and next season. Then he'll pass Marino,for sure, early next season for total yards and finish 2008 at about 65,500 total.

If. . .TT's team. . . finally catchs up with Favre and extends his career, with us through 2010. Another 6000 yards will be added to that total, to become 71,500 total yards for his career.

Brett Favre and records?

Realistically, the record that is most intriguing is his total games consecutive start streak. If he continues and into 2009.

It's his . All TIME - all position,

A record of all records? Considering he's a starting QB in the NFL.

Utterly amazing !!

That streak is the one he's most proud of. If he decides to extend that and good fortune bears with him. All things will fit to take his personal records to loftier heights. Is that moot?

Favre has said over and over. That the streak and winning and possibly another legitimate shot at a Super Bowl are his incentives to continue playing the game he loves.

What else is he going to do? He still can prove he's a top ten QB with the support he needs, but how long before frustration takes him to reality?

Maybe his competitive side and love of the game. His loyality to his fans will get him beyond that?

The other thing I look at is the fact that Favre is an NFC QB. Is the NFC as pass happy as the AFC?

The last thing is this.Brett Favre had set records in college and he said that most of or all of those were broken. That's what records are for. Given that. Who amongst Packer fans could ever not appreciate and salivate for any other like him.

The sad reality is. We will not likely enjoy that in our lifetimes.

Brett Favre simply put is very special.

P. Manning will never be anything on a football field overall as Favre is to me and many more Packer fans. :)

GO PACKERS !!

[packers11]

Favre = First 9 Years in GB...

Yards : 34,706
TDS : 255
Completions : 2,997

Mannings : 9 years in NFL

Yards : 37,586
TDS : 275
Completions : 3,131

Difference :

2,880 Yards
20 TD's
134 completions

THERE IS THE STATS FOKES... In my opinion I don't think Manning will get it, FAVRE is playing ANOTHER year which will whipe off the "difference" and more... Also Manning would have to go on this same elite pace to pass Favre...

I don't think Manning will play as long as Favre and once Harrison retires in a few years, Along with some of his O-line , he will have a tough time putting up the numbers...

[woodbuck27]

Favre = First 9 Years in GB...

Yards : 34,706
TDS : 255
Completions : 2,997

Mannings : 9 years in NFL

Yards : 37,586
TDS : 275
Completions : 3,131

Difference :

2,880 Yards
20 TD's
134 completions

THERE IS THE STATS FOKES... In my opinion I don't think Manning will get it, FAVRE is playing ANOTHER year which will whipe off the "difference" and more... Also Manning would have to go on this same elite pace to pass Favre...

I don't think Manning will play as long as Favre and once Harrison retires in a few years, Along with some of his O-line , he will have a tough time putting up the numbers...

So it would appear fr. your revelation of a stat comparison. That P.Manning is about 12 games ahead of the pace that Favre set through 9 seasons.

[packers11]

So it would appear fr. your revelation of a stat comparison. That P.Manning is about 12 games ahead of the pace that Favre set through 9 seasons.

Unless he plays as long as Favre without getting injuried I just don't see him passing most of Favre's soon to be records...

[Bretsky]

Favre = First 9 Years in GB...

Yards : 34,706
TDS : 255
Completions : 2,997

Mannings : 9 years in NFL

Yards : 37,586
TDS : 275
Completions : 3,131

Difference :

2,880 Yards
20 TD's
134 completions

THERE IS THE STATS FOKES... In my opinion I don't think Manning will get it, FAVRE is playing ANOTHER year which will whipe off the "difference" and more... Also Manning would have to go on this same elite pace to pass Favre...

I don't think Manning will play as long as Favre and once Harrison retires in a few years, Along with some of his O-line , he will have a tough time putting up the numbers...


Great info; thanks for posting. Why didn't that dang Cyberski just go find this for us instead of asking for the information :lol: :wink:


Cheers,
B

[packers11]

Great info; thanks for posting.

No problem :) ... I was wondering what the STATS were for the longest time, but I was always to lazy to look it up... I'm kind of glad I looked it up because I thought there was a bigger difference considering Manning has every weapon possible...

[4and12to12and4]

Well, we are all obvoiusly just speculating and making educated guesses on whether or not Manning has a chance to break the records that Brett should soon hold baring (god forbid) an early injury.

IMO, I think it will be very difficult for Peyton to catch Brett. Everything will have to go perfectly for him for another 8 to 9 seasons, and the greatness of Brett is his unbelievable ability to still have such a strong arm and physical presence about him at the ripe old age of 38. It is very doubtful that Manning will be able to have this same durability. He is only halfway there and is already 31. I expect him to start breaking down and losing most of his game in three years, because that is what happens to almost all players. The fact that Brett has gotten this much success this long is what makes him, in my eyes, the greatest QB in the history of the game. I don't think Manning will be able to sustain the way Brett has. It is almost superhuman the way Brett has held onto his skillset for all these years, without losing much in the process. The fact that he can rifle a 65 mph fastball at his age is unbelievable, and his uncanny ability to have eyes in the back of his head, and when tackled, be able to take the hit with minimal contact or damage. Except the first game against the Bears, when I thought he wasn't going to get up from some of those sick blows that he took. Brett is by far the TOUGHEST football player to ever put on a professional jersey, bar none. He is amazing, and Manning will have a difficult time matching his consistency for the second half of his career. I doubt he will pass him. BTW, if he doesn't, Brett could end up holding these records in a Babe Ruth or Hank Aaron sort of way. I don't see any other QB in the game today that could even come close to passing him. My belief is that Brett will have these records for decades, and go down in history as possibly the greatest of all time. If he happens to go to another Superbowl, it won't even be arguable.

Here's to Brett for three more years!!!!!!!!

Hell, he may be in the game longer than Aaron Rodgers!! Wouldn't that be cool?

[Bretsky]

Well, we are all obvoiusly just speculating and making educated guesses on whether or not Manning has a chance to break the records that Brett should soon hold baring (god forbid) an early injury.

IMO, I think it will be very difficult for Peyton to catch Brett. Everything will have to go perfectly for him for another 8 to 9 seasons, and the greatness of Brett is his unbelievable ability to still have such a strong arm and physical presence about him at the ripe old age of 38. It is very doubtful that Manning will be able to have this same durability. He is only halfway there and is already 31. I expect him to start breaking down and losing most of his game in three years, because that is what happens to almost all players. The fact that Brett has gotten this much success this long is what makes him, in my eyes, the greatest QB in the history of the game. I don't think Manning will be able to sustain the way Brett has. It is almost superhuman the way Brett has held onto his skillset for all these years, without losing much in the process. The fact that he can rifle a 65 mph fastball at his age is unbelievable, and his uncanny ability to have eyes in the back of his head, and when tackled, be able to take the hit with minimal contact or damage. Except the first game against the Bears, when I thought he wasn't going to get up from some of those sick blows that he took. Brett is by far the TOUGHEST football player to ever put on a professional jersey, bar none. He is amazing, and Manning will have a difficult time matching his consistency for the second half of his career. I doubt he will pass him. BTW, if he doesn't, Brett could end up holding these records in a Babe Ruth or Hank Aaron sort of way. I don't see any other QB in the game today that could even come close to passing him. My belief is that Brett will have these records for decades, and go down in history as possibly the greatest of all time. If he happens to go to another Superbowl, it won't even be arguable.

Here's to Brett for three more years!!!!!!!!

Hell, he may be in the game longer than Aaron Rodgers!! Wouldn't that be cool?

Three more years ?

Amen; love that idea.

[Iron Mike]

Gotta compare apples to potatos

Let's compare apples to apples:

Take #4 and put him on some of the offensive juggernaut teams that Manning has had. Where would BF's stats be then??

Take Laser Rocket Arm and put him on our NFL-E team of a few years ago. Where would Manning's stats be then?

I don't think we need Patler to figure this one out. :roll:

[Jimx29]

Favre = First 9 Years in GB...

Yards : 34,706
TDS : 255
Completions : 2,997

Mannings : 9 years in NFL

Yards : 37,586
TDS : 275
Completions : 3,131

Difference :

2,880 Yards
20 TD's
134 completions

THERE IS THE STATS FOKES... In my opinion I don't think Manning will get it, FAVRE is playing ANOTHER year which will whipe off the "difference" and more... Also Manning would have to go on this same elite pace to pass Favre...

I don't think Manning will play as long as Favre and once Harrison retires in a few years, Along with some of his O-line , he will have a tough time putting up the numbers...


Great info; thanks for posting. Why didn't that dang Cyberski just go find this for us instead of asking for the information :lol: :wink:


Cheers,
BDa bum 8-)

[Merlin]

Mannings biggest attribute imo is above the shoulders, Brett imo does have more raw talent but Manning has much more above the shoulders and that usually gets you farther in the end. Simply put, all records are meant to be broken. Brett has done a wonderful job getting to where he is but in the end, Manning will own the records imo but he could get hurt next year and retire soon after.

I disagree with that. Manning blames everyone else when things go wrong. He doesn't look at how his decisions may have effected the outcome. Many other QB's (Including Favre) look to their own mistakes first and try to correct those instead of publicly throwing their team under a bus. Manning almost lost the Colts the super bowl because of his poor decision making and his "me first" attitude.

Face it, Manning is all about Manning. He is a choke artist that takes no responsibility for his poor decision making. You are parroting the media who can't see the forest between the trees with this guy. The same media that handed him the SB MVP when it clear the Colts won despite him. The passing game didn't open up the running game and the running game didn't open up the passing game. It was a ground game all the way for the Colts that gave them the victory. Manning threw more checkdowns in one game then he threw the whole season. He got pressured early and turned into a scared little girl by dumping the ball off EARLY. He was exposed in the Super Bowl and you are smart enough to see that, yet you support that he has a brain for the game? I don't get it.

[Cheesehead Craig]

It certainly will be interesting to see how the Colts and Manning do when Marvin Harrison decides to hang it up. That guy is one of the most phenominal receivers ever. There's not a better route runner in the league and that is a huge plus for Manning. He's impossible to replace.

I feel Manning will break some of Marino's records, definately the TD one. There's simply too much talent on the Colts in the forseeable future for him to not get it. If there's been one thing he's done well, it's throwing TD's.

[The Leaper]

If there's been one thing he's done well, it's throwing TD's.

Actually, you are entirely incorrect. Sure, he had one ridiculous season where he broke Marino's record. Outside of that one, he has struggled to reach 30 TDs a year with an all-star cast. There is little reason to believe he can continue at his current pace as Harrison ages and the Colts take a future downturn.

Favre routinely tossed 30+ TDs a year throughout his career...and has proven to be far more consistent in that regard than Manning, despite a lesser supporting cast on average.

Manning has a better chance to catch the total yardage number...as he routinely puts up well over 4000 yards a year in passing, a number Favre rarely has achieved...mostly due to the inferior weather conditions in Green Bay during Nov/Dec.

When Manning gets knocked out of the game with a concussion...only to run back on the field on 4th down to throw a 30 yard laser strike for a TD...then not remember any of it afterward...then I might THINK about putting him on the same level as Favre.

Otherwise, Manning is just another whining softie.

[Cheesehead Craig]

If there's been one thing he's done well, it's throwing TD's.

Actually, you are entirely incorrect. Sure, he had one ridiculous season where he broke Marino's record. Outside of that one, he has struggled to reach 30 TDs a year with an all-star cast. There is little reason to believe he can continue at his current pace as Harrison ages and the Colts take a future downturn.

Favre routinely tossed 30+ TDs a year throughout his career...and has proven to be far more consistent in that regard than Manning, despite a lesser supporting cast on average.

Manning has a better chance to catch the total yardage number...as he routinely puts up well over 4000 yards a year in passing, a number Favre rarely has achieved...mostly due to the inferior weather conditions in Green Bay during Nov/Dec.

When Manning gets knocked out of the game with a concussion...only to run back on the field on 4th down to throw a 30 yard laser strike for a TD...then not remember any of it afterward...then I might THINK about putting him on the same level as Favre.

Otherwise, Manning is just another whining softie.
Manning has never had a season where he threw for under 26 TDs, I'd call that consistency. So I daresay I am nowhere near "entirely incorrect".

Manning goes for 6 more years at his avg of 28 TDs/yr and he'll be knocking at the door at whatever record Favre has. I don't think this is all that outrageous of a belief. It certainly will depend on Manning's health and if he just decides to hang it up before then.

I certainly am not slamming or dismissing any of Favre's accomplishments. Just voicing my opinion on a QB while not wearing green and gold glasses.

[The Leaper]

Manning goes for 6 more years at his avg of 28 TDs/yr and he'll be knocking at the door at whatever record Favre has. I don't think this is all that outrageous of a belief. It certainly will depend on Manning's health and if he just decides to hang it up before then.

I certainly am not slamming or dismissing any of Favre's accomplishments. Just voicing my opinion on a QB while not wearing green and gold glasses.

I probably didn't utilize the quote correctly to get across my point. I did not mean you were wrong in saying that Manning throws a lot of TDs. I meant you were wrong in saying he is more likely to break the TD mark (or "definately") than anything else.

I'm not biased to Favre...I'm looking at stats AS THEY ARE LIKELY TO HAPPEN and not merely just projecting numbers out as if Manning is going to keep playing as he currently is for another 6 years into his late 30s.

Manning will likely break 60,000 yards passing easily in 100 more career games (~6 seasons) which is why he is MORE LIKELY to break the yardage mark than the TD mark.

To me, Manning and Marino compare very favorably as passers. Marino's TD numbers dropped DRAMATICALLY after 10 years in the league.

Marino first 10 years: 1.95 TDs per start
Marino last 7 years: 1.43 TDs per start (26.6% decrease)

Marino's yardage numbers did not decline as dramatically.

Marino first 10 years: 265 yards per start
Marino last 7 years: 240 yards per start (9.4% decrease)

The same is likely to happen to Manning, who is in a similar position of seeing his elite WR group start to fade in the years ahead. His TD numbers are much more likely to decline based on what is likely to happen in the next 4-6 years than his yardage numbers.

That is why it is MORE LIKELY for Manning to break the yardage record of either Favre or Marino. He has a ridiculous head start...and isn't as likely to fade in that category as he could in others, as evidenced by Marino.

[Cheesehead Craig]

So Manning will keep up his yardage average for 6 yrs but not his TD avg?

You say you are using stats as they are likely to happen, but you are projecting his current yardage output for this yardage record claim in 6 years. You then state that his current TD production cannot be used for a projection as it's not "likely to happen". You cannot use the current yardage projection but not the TD projection, you can't have it both ways.

I would say that if he is going to have 4000+ yds/season as you are projecting in your argument, it's safe to say that he'll have 28 TD/season as well, which would make the TD record very much in jeapordy. I seriously doubt that he can have that many yards without the TDs to go with them.

See we're both happy. :glug:

[4and12to12and4]

Manning is gonna get injured, and be without Marvin Harrison within three years. He will NEVER catch up to Favre OR Marino, IMO. The odds of age and how most QB's eventually fade considerably once they hit 34 or 35 years old. Brett is the EXCEPTION to the rule. Manning will never do it. Too many odds against him.

Especially since, if he comes close, there are probably a few here willing to assassinate him. 8-)

[Rastak]

Manning is gonna get injured, and be without Marvin Harrison within three years. He will NEVER catch up to Favre OR Marino, IMO. The odds of age and how most QB's eventually fade considerably once they hit 34 or 35 years old. Brett is the EXCEPTION to the rule. Manning will never do it. Too many odds against him.

Especially since, if he comes close, there are probably a few here willing to assassinate him. 8-)


I would guess there are zero willing to do that....well, maybe you....I'll be the first to call the FBI...


:shock:

[the_idle_threat]

I'm too busy right now sighting in Bonds ...

:satan: :satan: :satan: :satan: :satan: :satan: :satan: :satan:

[Rastak]

I'm too busy right now sighting in Bonds ...

:satan: :satan: :satan: :satan: :satan: :satan: :satan: :satan:


Henry Aaron was the man!

Great guy, great player.....I'm not advocating going Sopranos on Barry either mind you.....

[Scott Campbell]

If Manning breaks any of Brett's records, I don't think it will diminish anything that Favre accomplished.

[Rastak]

If Manning breaks any of Brett's records, I don't think it will diminish anything that Favre accomplished.

Exactly.....Does anyone think less of Lou Brock? Babe Ruth? Lou Gehrig?
Jim Marhsall? (oh yea, a pussy punter played more games straight...BOOOOOO)

[Scott Campbell]

If Manning breaks any of Brett's records, I don't think it will diminish anything that Favre accomplished.

Exactly.....Does anyone think less of Lou Brock? Babe Ruth? Lou Gehrig?
Jim Marhsall? (oh yea, a pussy punter played more games straight...BOOOOOO)


Who's Jim Marshall?

:lol:

[Rastak]

If Manning breaks any of Brett's records, I don't think it will diminish anything that Favre accomplished.

Exactly.....Does anyone think less of Lou Brock? Babe Ruth? Lou Gehrig?
Jim Marhsall? (oh yea, a pussy punter played more games straight...BOOOOOO)


Who's Jim Marshall?

:lol:

:wink: :wink:

Somebody who played in the trenches without the benefit of refs saying

"can't hit the QB can't hit the QB"

Where's the dress guys?

[HarveyWallbangers]

Who's Jim Marshall?

:lol:

You're going the wrong way.

I started watching football just after the Vikings glory years, so I never saw Marshall. I know for a fact that he likes to drink, he likes to drink often, and he likes to drink a lot.

[Rastak]

Who's Jim Marshall?

:lol:

You're going the wrong way.

I started watching football just after the Vikings glory years, so I never saw Marshall. I know for a fact that he likes to drink, he likes to drink often, and he likes to drink a lot.


You might be confusing him with Carl Eller (drink wise) ....actually Jim Marshall was a very cool guy. Yea, he did drugs like many players in the 70's. You might want to look a bit closer. He was and is a very amazing person. He was almost killed in a hang gliding incident. He played about 270 straight games in the trenches during a very tough era. He is always remembered for the wrong way run, but keep in mind, before and after he was one of the most solid defensive ends in football. Bullshit punter aside, he is the all time iron man in football.

[HarveyWallbangers]

No, it's Marshall. I have a close friend who was a bartender at a place that Marshall frequented a lot. Eller was into drugs. Marshall just likes to drink. A lot. From all accounts, a pretty solid guy though. I'll tell you my stories the next time we meet up.
:D

[Harlan Huckleby]

The most interesting of the front four was Gary Larson, who went on to develop the Far Side cartoon series.

And Alan Page of course become a Supreme Court justice, casting the deciding vote that ended the recount in Florida in 2000.

[MadtownPacker]

I would guess there are zero willing to do that....well, maybe you....I'll be the first to call the FBI...


:shock:Keep up your snitching and you will end up like michael vick's soon to be ex-homies.

You know you would kill a pitbull for a Superbowl win in your lifetime. :lol:

[Rastak]

No, it's Marshall. I have a close friend who was a bartender at a place that Marshall frequented a lot. Eller was into drugs. Marshall just likes to drink. A lot. From all accounts, a pretty solid guy though. I'll tell you my stories the next time we meet up.
:D


That'd be cool......I saw a really rare interview on NFL network and you could tell he liked to party.

[woodbuck27]

Well, we are all obvoiusly just speculating and making educated guesses on whether or not Manning has a chance to break the records that Brett should soon hold baring (god forbid) an early injury.

IMO, I think it will be very difficult for Peyton to catch Brett. Everything will have to go perfectly for him for another 8 to 9 seasons, and the greatness of Brett is his unbelievable ability to still have such a strong arm and physical presence about him at the ripe old age of 38. It is very doubtful that Manning will be able to have this same durability. He is only halfway there and is already 31. I expect him to start breaking down and losing most of his game in three years, because that is what happens to almost all players. The fact that Brett has gotten this much success this long is what makes him, in my eyes, the greatest QB in the history of the game. I don't think Manning will be able to sustain the way Brett has. It is almost superhuman the way Brett has held onto his skillset for all these years, without losing much in the process. The fact that he can rifle a 65 mph fastball at his age is unbelievable, and his uncanny ability to have eyes in the back of his head, and when tackled, be able to take the hit with minimal contact or damage. Except the first game against the Bears, when I thought he wasn't going to get up from some of those sick blows that he took. Brett is by far the TOUGHEST football player to ever put on a professional jersey, bar none. He is amazing, and Manning will have a difficult time matching his consistency for the second half of his career. I doubt he will pass him. BTW, if he doesn't, Brett could end up holding these records in a Babe Ruth or Hank Aaron sort of way. I don't see any other QB in the game today that could even come close to passing him. My belief is that Brett will have these records for decades, and go down in history as possibly the greatest of all time. If he happens to go to another Superbowl, it won't even be arguable.

Here's to Brett for three more years!!!!!!!!

Hell, he may be in the game longer than Aaron Rodgers!! Wouldn't that be cool?

Three more years ?

Amen; love that idea.

Who do we have on board to beat Favre out?

That's a really big hahahahahaha!!

Favre's our starting QB until he decides otherwise. I even believe he will show us something special given the ingredients that TT has this season.

Ham and cheese anyone??

[Zool]

Who's Jim Marshall?

:lol:

You're going the wrong way.

I started watching football just after the Vikings glory years, so I never saw Marshall. I know for a fact that he likes to drink, he likes to drink often, and he likes to drink a lot.He must have mentored Touchdown Tommy Kramer on drinking.