Jason Spitz dishes on the ZBS....

[Iron Mike]

On today's Inside Lambeau....http://images.packers.com/images/multimedia/inside_lambeau_175.gif


Asked by Burke Griffin to defend the cut-blocking scheme installed last year, his response:

"Well, the defense is allowed to grab our jerseys and pull us down, so this kind of makes it fair."

I wonder what the Williams brothers are gonna say about it this year:

http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=529759

[Jimx29]

They can read?

[Terry]

They seemed particularly petty to me considering that McCarthy had paid them such a high compliment just a few days before.

[KYPack]

Now you are starting to see why the creator of the ZBS, Alex Gibbs, had all those Denver lineman sworn to a vow of silence to everybody (media, opponents) when they got the ZBS going.

All our division rivals will bitch at us and there is nothing to be gained by replying. It will take some time, but our OLinmean will gather the wagons and make no comments eventually here.

[KYPack]

Now you are starting to see why the creator of the ZBS, Alex Gibbs, had all those Denver lineman sworn to a vow of silence to everybody (media, opponents) when they got the ZBS going.

All our division rivals will bitch at us and there is nothing to be gained by replying. It will take some time, but our OLinmean will gather the wagons and make no comments eventually here.

Well, didn't take long to be proved wrong. A blurb from the AP I read this morning says NFL lineman (& all players) HAVE to talk to the media.

That is by order of the new Reichsfuhrer Godell's office.

Anybody else think Roger G. is pushing it a bit?

Either way, the war of words in the NFL North will now commence.

[Scott Campbell]

Anybody else think Roger G. is pushing it a bit?



Yeah. He's more David Stern than Tags so far. As long as he doesn't suspend Peyton Manning and Marvin Harrison for a playoff game, I'll be ok with it. This conduct thing was getting way out of hand, and the NFL had to come down hard on players for a while - at least until things stabalize. Then I hope he lets up a bit. But for now, there is still a message to be sent.

[SkinBasket]

Anybody else think Roger G. is pushing it a bit?



Yeah. He's more David Stern than Tags so far. As long as he doesn't suspend Peyton Manning and Marvin Harrison for a playoff game, I'll be ok with it. This conduct thing was getting way out of hand, and the NFL had to come down hard on players for a while - at least until things stabalize. Then I hope he lets up a bit. But for now, there is still a message to be sent.

Right. God forbid he run the NFL like the multi-billion dollar machine it is instead of some back-alley gangsta-rap pick up game, which Stern tried, and is now trying to undo. It's his job to protect the integrity and marketability of the league, not worry about the feelings of the players (who have benefited greatly from the continued integrity and marketability of the league). That's what they have a union for.

[RashanGary]

Nice description of the NBA skinbasket. I agree. Everything is set up for easy dunks and dribble dribble shoot basketball.

You watch adn you go "Give it to Lebron, give it to Lebron" and all you want them to do is give it to Lebron so he can dribble around defenders who can't play defense because of the idiotic NBA rules and then Lebron either dunks it or jacks up an off balanced mid range shot after dribbling. There is no strategy, no teamwork, just give it to a guy and play one on one. That is what they want. They want dunks and flash. It's a horrible league and there is no wonder fewer and few poeple watch.

[Partial]

Nice description of the NBA skinbasket. I agree. Everything is set up for easy dunks and dribble dribble shoot basketball.

You watch adn you go "Give it to Lebron, give it to Lebron" and all you want them to do is give it to Lebron so he can dribble around defenders who can't play defense because of the idiotic NBA rules and then Lebron either dunks it or jacks up an off balanced mid range shot after dribbling. There is no strategy, no teamwork, just give it to a guy and play one on one. That is what they want. They want dunks and flash. It's a horrible league and there is no wonder fewer and few poeple watch.

This is completely untrue.

[Zool]

Nice description of the NBA skinbasket. I agree. Everything is set up for easy dunks and dribble dribble shoot basketball.

You watch adn you go "Give it to Lebron, give it to Lebron" and all you want them to do is give it to Lebron so he can dribble around defenders who can't play defense because of the idiotic NBA rules and then Lebron either dunks it or jacks up an off balanced mid range shot after dribbling. There is no strategy, no teamwork, just give it to a guy and play one on one. That is what they want. They want dunks and flash. It's a horrible league and there is no wonder fewer and few poeple watch.

This is completely untrue.
Actually its very much true. Iso plays are a way of life in the NBA. There are teams that dont run Iso's obviously, but they are in the minority.

What makes the sports shows highlights?

A) Perfectly executed bounce pass for a layup

B) A PF or C playing great D on a pick and roll

c) Dunk

I watched SportsCenter earlier this year and they had a "Shaq Dunk-o-Meter" counting the amount of dunks he had in a game.

[Partial]

Nice description of the NBA skinbasket. I agree. Everything is set up for easy dunks and dribble dribble shoot basketball.

You watch adn you go "Give it to Lebron, give it to Lebron" and all you want them to do is give it to Lebron so he can dribble around defenders who can't play defense because of the idiotic NBA rules and then Lebron either dunks it or jacks up an off balanced mid range shot after dribbling. There is no strategy, no teamwork, just give it to a guy and play one on one. That is what they want. They want dunks and flash. It's a horrible league and there is no wonder fewer and few poeple watch.

This is completely untrue.
Actually its very much true. Iso plays are a way of life in the NBA. There are teams that dont run Iso's obviously, but they are in the minority.

What makes the sports shows highlights?

A) Perfectly executed bounce pass for a layup

B) A PF or C playing great D on a pick and roll

c) Dunk

I watched SportsCenter earlier this year and they had a "Shaq Dunk-o-Meter" counting the amount of dunks he had in a game.

Same with football. All the big plays and big hits are shown the same way. I don't understand what the difference is.

Stern is actually a damn good comissioner. Basketball has kept its nose pretty clean up until this ref thing. Unfortunately, its not like the NBA could go public or do anything with it once they found out because they had to cooperate and bust the chump.

[Zool]

Basketball has kept its nose pretty clean up until this ref thing. Unfortunately, its not like the NBA could go public or do anything with it once they found out because they had to cooperate and bust the chump.

Artest. The Palace.
The Jail Blazers

The viewers of the NBA have dropped off substantially in the last 5 years.

[packrat]

Dribble, dribble, dunk? More like travel, travel, dunk. Since when does one bounce every three steps equal a dribble?

[Zool]

Dribble, dribble, dunk? More like travel, travel, dunk. Since when does one bounce every three steps equal a dribble?Since the ABA started.

[SkinBasket]

Stern is actually a damn good comissioner. Basketball has kept its nose pretty clean up until this ref thing. Unfortunately, its not like the NBA could go public or do anything with it once they found out because they had to cooperate and bust the chump.

It was under Stern that the NBA went from a sports league to an idolatry puppet show with Jordan as the Sun God. The NBA helped make the Legend of Jordan what it is today, and he in turn helped the NBA attract more fans, sponsorships, and better stadium deals. In return, Jordan could take that extra step every now and again. That push off wasn't called if the jersey was a Bulls #23 and it was the lowly Jazz they were playing. What stutter step or foot slide? That's simply Jordan's "move." The "game" became about one player, and the NBA rode that horse until he retired, then retired, and retired again.

Since then, it's been a constant search for the new NBA deity, with each potential candidate receiving the benefit of the doubt from officials. The NBA counters that their officials do their best and the speed of the game is simply so amazing that they can't possibly catch every travel, every shove, every hook - only the ones by players who obviously didn't have enough "star power" to have those infractions covered by their amazing skill sets.

The rules of the game were already ambiguous and ethereal at best before the betting scandal. Now they're simply more meaningless than ever. It's not about good basketball anymore, it's about the one player who, with a little help from his commish and his stripped friends, can "control" a game - delivering the very product that Stern has worked so hard to craft over his tenure. A product, that according to TV ratings, sports fans have become tired of.

[Zool]

Stern is actually a damn good comissioner. Basketball has kept its nose pretty clean up until this ref thing. Unfortunately, its not like the NBA could go public or do anything with it once they found out because they had to cooperate and bust the chump.

It was under Stern that the NBA went from a sports league to an idolatry puppet show with Jordan as the Sun God. The NBA helped make the Legend of Jordan what it is today, and he in turn helped the NBA attract more fans, sponsorships, and better stadium deals. In return, Jordan could take that extra step every now and again. That push off wasn't called if the jersey was a Bulls #23 and it was the lowly Jazz they were playing. What stutter step or foot slide? That's simply Jordan's "move." The "game" became about one player, and the NBA rode that horse until he retired, then retired, and retired again.

Since then, it's been a constant search for the new NBA deity, with each potential candidate receiving the benefit of the doubt from officials. The NBA counters that their officials do their best and the speed of the game is simply so amazing that they can't possibly catch every travel, every shove, every hook - only the ones by players who obviously didn't have enough "star power" to have those infractions covered by their amazing skill sets.

The rules of the game were already ambiguous and ethereal at best before the betting scandal. Now they're simply more meaningless than ever. It's not about good basketball anymore, it's about the one player who, with a little help from his commish and his stripped friends, can "control" a game - delivering the very product that Stern has worked so hard to craft over his tenure. A product, that according to TV ratings, sports fans have become tired of.
Dwayne Wade, Game 3, 2006 finals. Watch that game and the phantom calls. He took over that game.

[Partial]

Basketball has kept its nose pretty clean up until this ref thing. Unfortunately, its not like the NBA could go public or do anything with it once they found out because they had to cooperate and bust the chump.

Artest. The Palace.
The Jail Blazers

The viewers of the NBA have dropped off substantially in the last 5 years.

I agree, its because Jordan left. The last truly great finals was Jazz against Bulls.

[SkinBasket]

I agree, its because Jordan left. The last truly great finals was Jazz against Bulls.

Yes, it was "truely great" watching Jordan shove his defender to the court before hitting his Cindarella shot. Real great stuff.

[cheesner]

Basketball has kept its nose pretty clean up until this ref thing. Unfortunately, its not like the NBA could go public or do anything with it once they found out because they had to cooperate and bust the chump.

Artest. The Palace.
The Jail Blazers

The viewers of the NBA have dropped off substantially in the last 5 years.Las Vegas was pushing hard to get an NBA team. Our Mayor was leading the effort and had most of the casinos in town supporting the plan. After the all-star game, several of the casinos withdrew their support. Why? There were more fights and altercations during that weekend than any other in Vegas history. So many thugs and hoodlums were in town for the event, there were too many negative incidents.

[J-Rok]

Wow, you must've lost a lot of money on that game to be so bitter.

The guy was already falling by the time Jordan touched him...

[Bossman641]

I know this topic is moving completely off topic but Stern has started to lose it some over the past few years. He allowed the NBA to become what it has, and now he is trying to reverse the damage with coverups like the dress code rule, what a joke. There need to be MAJOR changes to the important things; officiating that has become an absolute mess, playoffs that are much more exciting in the 1st round then the Finals, the stupid "players coming off the bench rule" that completely ruined the Suns-Spurs series.

[SkinBasket]

Wow, you must've lost a lot of money on that game to be so bitter.

The guy was already falling by the time Jordan touched him...


Surprising notion given your location. :roll:

[Jerry Tagge]

Wow, you must've lost a lot of money on that game to be so bitter.

The guy was already falling by the time Jordan touched him...


Surprising notion given your location. :roll:
Ask him if he thought Jordan was falling when Reggie Miller pushed off on him in game 6 of the Eastern finals that year to win the game.

Bulls fans are still whining about the no-call on Jordan getting pushed off but have convenient excuses when Jordan does it.

[Bossman641]

Wow, you must've lost a lot of money on that game to be so bitter.

The guy was already falling by the time Jordan touched him...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-WULyz1-OQc&mode=related&search=

Come on, I'm as big a Jordan fan as anyone but there's no question he pushed him. It was a nice cross and pullback so he would have gotten a shot off anyways, but Russell would have been a hell of a lot closer than 5 feet.

[Partial]

Well, we all know that Refs are perfect and never make bad calls or miss a call..

http://packers.scout.com/2/595207.html
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/nfl/1998/playoffs/news/1999/01/03/49ers_first/
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs05/news/story?id=2294309
http://www.thefootballgod.com/superbowl_team3.htm

Never.



The fact of the matter is this. Good, popular players always get the benefit of the doubt in any sport. That's why quarterbacks are babied like no other because if a quarterback is good he is almost always the face of a franchise and they don't want to lose a star.

[Zool]

Well, we all know that Refs are perfect and never make bad calls or miss a call..

http://packers.scout.com/2/595207.html
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/nfl/1998/playoffs/news/1999/01/03/49ers_first/
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs05/news/story?id=2294309
http://www.thefootballgod.com/superbowl_team3.htm

Never.



The fact of the matter is this. Good, popular players always get the benefit of the doubt in any sport. That's why quarterbacks are babied like no other because if a quarterback is good he is almost always the face of a franchise and they don't want to lose a star.
You cant possibly be defending NBA refs. I just refuse to believe it. I assume you are merely stirring the pot just to stir the pot. Thats the only logical explanation.

[PackerBlues]

Sorry to interrupt and go back to the original topic, but when GB faced Denver in the Super Bowl, didnt our D Linemen complain because Denver's O'line was using the same blocking scheme that our O-line uses now?

[Partial]

Well, we all know that Refs are perfect and never make bad calls or miss a call..

http://packers.scout.com/2/595207.html
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/nfl/1998/playoffs/news/1999/01/03/49ers_first/
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs05/news/story?id=2294309
http://www.thefootballgod.com/superbowl_team3.htm

Never.



The fact of the matter is this. Good, popular players always get the benefit of the doubt in any sport. That's why quarterbacks are babied like no other because if a quarterback is good he is almost always the face of a franchise and they don't want to lose a star.
You cant possibly be defending NBA refs. I just refuse to believe it. I assume you are merely stirring the pot just to stir the pot. Thats the only logical explanation.

It happens in every sport, not just basketball is the point I am implying. The Jordan call is iffy because contact is allowed and people push off on every single play. That one just happened to occur on a critical possession.

[Scott Campbell]

Well, we all know that Refs are perfect and never make bad calls or miss a call..

http://packers.scout.com/2/595207.html
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/nfl/1998/playoffs/news/1999/01/03/49ers_first/
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs05/news/story?id=2294309
http://www.thefootballgod.com/superbowl_team3.htm

Never.



The fact of the matter is this. Good, popular players always get the benefit of the doubt in any sport. That's why quarterbacks are babied like no other because if a quarterback is good he is almost always the face of a franchise and they don't want to lose a star.
You cant possibly be defending NBA refs. I just refuse to believe it. I assume you are merely stirring the pot just to stir the pot. Thats the only logical explanation.

It happens in every sport, not just basketball is the point I am implying. The Jordan call is iffy because contact is allowed and people push off on every single play. That one just happened to occur on a critical possession.


It was as blatant a push off as you'll ever see. And yes, I'm bitter about the non call. Game 7 should have been one for the ages.

Though I think the Suns have more to gripe about after Stern handed San Antonio the series this year by suspending Amare.

[Partial]

Well, we all know that Refs are perfect and never make bad calls or miss a call..

http://packers.scout.com/2/595207.html
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/nfl/1998/playoffs/news/1999/01/03/49ers_first/
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs05/news/story?id=2294309
http://www.thefootballgod.com/superbowl_team3.htm

Never.



The fact of the matter is this. Good, popular players always get the benefit of the doubt in any sport. That's why quarterbacks are babied like no other because if a quarterback is good he is almost always the face of a franchise and they don't want to lose a star.
You cant possibly be defending NBA refs. I just refuse to believe it. I assume you are merely stirring the pot just to stir the pot. Thats the only logical explanation.

It happens in every sport, not just basketball is the point I am implying. The Jordan call is iffy because contact is allowed and people push off on every single play. That one just happened to occur on a critical possession.


It was as blatant a push off as you'll ever see. And yes, I'm bitter about the non call. Game 7 should have been one for the ages.

Though I think the Suns have more to gripe about after Stern handed San Antonio the series this year by suspending Amare.

Right, I agree that it is crappy, but it happens all the time in every single sport. Be it an incorrect call or favoritism towards a fan favorite, I think it could be argued that at least one "fishy" moment involving the refs happens in just about every game.

[Bretsky]

Sorry to interrupt and go back to the original topic, but when GB faced Denver in the Super Bowl, didnt our D Linemen complain because Denver's O'line was using the same blocking scheme that our O-line uses now?


Yes