Manuel To Be Cut

[HarveyWallbangers]

I was going to say to be traded or cut, but we all know that nobody is going to give something up for him.


Team trying to trade Manuel
By TOM SILVERSTEIN

Green Bay - In an attempt to salvage something of their free agent swing and miss on veteran Marquand Manuel, the Green Bay Packers have been offering the safety in a trade.

Two National Football League team officials said the Packers had made it known that Manuel is one of the players they are willing to trade before the deadline for trimming rosters to 53 comes later today. A third source familiar with the player and the team said there were strong indications the Packers were talking with other teams about Manuel.

If the Packers do strike a trade, it's unlikely it will be for anything more than a low-round pick, and it very well could be on the condition that Manuel spend a minimum number of weeks on the roster. If the Packers don't reach a deal, there's no reason to think they'll keep Manuel on their 53-man roster, given his fall from starter last year to backup this year.

Manuel, 28, lost his starting job to former "street" free agent Atari Bigby midway through camp and didn't even play Thursday night in the exhibition finale against the Tennessee Titans. Instead of playing Manuel as a backup, the Packers took a long look at second-year pros Tyrone Culver and Charlie Peprah, who are competing for the fourth safety job behind Nick Collins, Bigby and rookie Aaron Rouse.

A number of teams have safety issues around the NFL, but it's questionable whether any of them will give up a pick to assure themselves of obtaining Manuel. If the Packers release Manuel, he will become a free agent, eligible to negotiate with any team of his choosing.

Any team that trades for Manuel will absorb his $1.26 million base salary this year and base salaries of $1.56 million in 2008, $1.86 million in '09 and $2.16 million in '10. It would be obligated to pay the '07 base salary only if Manuel was on the roster the first day of the regular season.

Among the teams that might have interest in a safety are Houston, Jacksonville, Buffalo, Carolina and Miami. The Seattle Seahawks, who attempted to re-sign Manuel before he left for a five-year, $10 million deal in Green Bay, have since upgraded their safety position and probably aren't interested anymore.

Should the Packers go with Collins, Bigby, Rouse and either Peprah or Culver, they're going to have a grand total of five years of experience at the position. Manuel is in his sixth year in the NFL.

General manager Ted Thompson signed Manuel before last season in hopes of filling a safety position that had fallen apart since the release of Darren Sharper in 2005. Manuel had directed the secondary for the NFC champion Seahawks and was brought in to quarterback a diverse unit featuring two veteran cornerbacks and a promising young safety.

However, he missed most of training camp with a calf injury, rubbed cornerbacks Al Harris and Charles Woodson the wrong way, proved incapable of handling the many man-to-man coverage assignments safeties must carry out in the Packers' defense and missed far too many tackles.

In training camp, Bigby proved far more athletic and equally sound in his assignments, earning the starting job after the second exhibition game. Bigby is far from a finished product, but the Packers are convinced they will be a better defense with his speed and tackling ability in the lineup.

No word yet: The Packers did not announce any cuts or trades, leaving a number of players in limbo heading into the final cutdown deadline today.

Among those waiting to hear something are kickers Dave Rayner and Mason Crosby, who have been engaged in a heated battle for one roster spot.

Crosby stumbled a little bit by missing a 52-yard attempt against Tennessee, but the way the ball exploded off his foot and traveled well out of the end zone, it was evident he has a legitimate shot of hitting from beyond 50 any time he's on the field.

"I hit that ball well," Crosby said. "Just with the wind and all that stuff, I just misjudged it a little bit and put it a little left. For a second, I thought I had it. It was coming back a little bit. I couldn't tell what the wind was doing. It seemed calm on the field but when the ball got up there it started moving."

Strange feeling: Bigby went to the same high school as Manuel (Miami Senior High) and the two are friends, so it has not been a normal battle for a starting spot between the two.

"Sometimes it feels like a business, but when it comes down to it at night, before I go to bed, it is weird," said Bigby, 25. "I'm against somebody that's so close to me. We came from the same background. Our struggles are somewhat the same."

[Merlin]

If no one trades for him, that wouldn't be a shock. 3T is about the only person in the NFL who thinks the guy is a starter. Although he may be good in spot duty and as a backup, I can't see anyone paying that kind of money for that position on a team.

[BallHawk]

Charlie Peprah gets the backup gig?

[HarveyWallbangers]

I think so.

[BallHawk]

When are the cuts announced?

[HarveyWallbangers]

Officially? I think tomorrow.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Mike Bell might get cut.

Arizona cut their 3rd round draft pick, LB Buster Davis. That's very unusual. He must have sucked.

[BallHawk]

Arizona cut their 3rd round draft pick, LB Buster Davis. That's very unusual. He must have sucked.

Can't say I'm surprised. The guy's small.

[BallHawk]

Mike Bell might get cut.

I was hoping Selvin Young would get cut, but it looks like he's going to stick.

I'd like to see Mike Bell in Green and Gold.

[Joemailman]

Are they having a Final Cuts party at the Lambeau Atrium?

[Merlin]

Speculation has it that Culver is going to (per packersnews.com and Mike V.). I thought Culver was better then Peporah? I can't say either way because I didn't watch either of them very closely.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Culver is going to what... get cut?

[Merlin]

That's what Mike V. thinks. Again, I don't really have an opinion based on the pre-season. I thought he did okay last year.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I thought Peprah looked more talented. I'd like to see Culver and Dendy go. They both are limited athletically. I thought Peprah and Walker have outplayed them in the preseason games. Of course, I don't see practice.

[Merlin]

Walker is a joke and you are right, Dendy is missing something out there. I know Peporah rocks on Madden, why I have no idea.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Why do you think Walker is a joke? Seriously. He's played well in the preseason. Next to Bush, he's probably played better in the games than any other corner.

[Merlin]

From what I remember he isn't very fast. Once he loses a step on a guy, that's it, he is burned. Kind of reminds me of Manual in that respect so I am probably a little more biased against him because of Manual. Without Manual screwing everything up, I wouldn't be so critical on the rest of them. So you are probably right and I am probably way out there with this call.

[Joemailman]

I thought Culver had a poor preseason. Got beat deep by a Tight End in one game. I like Peprah. I also like Frank Walker. Has the physical ability to play tight bump coverage. He could be useful if anything ever happened to Al Harris.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Actually, Walker is pretty fast. His biggest problem with the Giants was that he was overaggressive. I haven't seen that this preseason.

[Merlin]

If you say it's so then I believe you. Again, I only watched him a few plays. I watched Bigby and Manual mostly. I was one of the lon Bogby supporters after the Steelers game when most people wanted him cut.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I think Demovsky is pretty spot on with how I feel. Actually, it's not just close, but it's exactly what I think it will be. Havner might not want to buy a house yet though. I could see them replacing him also.


Rob Demovsky's version of the 53

Quarterbacks (2)
Brett Favre
Aaron Rodgers

Running backs (6)
Brandon Jackson
Vernand Morency
Noah Herron
Korey Hall
Corey White
A RB to be named later, either via trade or waivers

Receivers (5)
Donald Driver
Greg Jennings
James Jones
Ruvell Martin
Carlyle Holiday

Tight ends (3)
Donald Lee
Bubba Franks
A TE to be named later, either via trade or waivers

Offensive line (9)
Chad Clifton
Mark Tauscher
Scott Wells
Jason Spitz
Daryn Colledge
Allen Barbre
Tony Moll
Junius Coston
Tyson Walter

Defensive line (10)
Aaron Kampman
Cullen Jenkins
Ryan Pickett
Corey Williams
KGB
Colin Cole
Johnny Jolly
Michael Montgomery
Justin Harrell
Larry Birdine

Linebackers (6)
A.J. Hawk
Nick Barnett
Brady Poppinga
Desmond Bishop
Tracy White
Spencer Havner

Defensive backs (9)
Al Harris
Charles Woodson
Atari Bigby
Nick Collins
Aaron Rouse
Charlie Peprah
Will Blackmon
Jarrett Bush
Frank Walker

Specialits (3)
Rob Davis
Jon Ryan
Mason Crosby

Notes: The openings for another RB and TE are based on the fact that the 53-man roster for Week 1 rarely includes 53 players who were in camp with the Packers. Last year, Ted Thompson kept only 50 of his own players and added from waivers (Bush, Peprah and Tony Palmer). ... The Packers could keep only five running backs and choose to add a third quarterback or a fourth tight end. ... Birdine may have edged out Jason Hunter in the final week. ... Patrick Dendy goes from being the nickel guy at the start of camp to being cut. ... There's no chance they keep two kickers and probably only keep Dave Rayner if they get a trade offer for Crosby that they can't refuse.

[Merlin]

What about Rouse? I haven't heard much about him accept bitching.

[Partial]

Arizona cut their 3rd round draft pick, LB Buster Davis. That's very unusual. He must have sucked.

Can't say I'm surprised. The guy's small.

You're from Florida, though. You've seen the guy and he hits like a hammer and is very instinctive. He might just be hurt or something. He looked good in college.

[HarveyWallbangers]

What about Rouse? I haven't heard much about him accept bitching.

Not sure what you mean by this. I think Rouse is a long-term project. They think they have something with the guy, but it will take time. He played a lot of LB in college, and hasn't had to cover a lot. I think they hope he'll be a good special teams player this year.

[Merlin]

That's what I wanted to know Harve. People I know have done nothing but bitch about the guy and I never really watched but a few plays after I heard stuff the first time.

[Partial]

That's what I wanted to know Harve. People I know have done nothing but bitch about the guy and I never really watched but a few plays after I heard stuff the first time.

He's been pretty invisible. When considering how inexperienced in coverage he is, that is not necessarily a bad thing. Invisible is solid. Visible can be great or bad.

[Merlin]

Well Manual became invisible and look how much it helped him :oops: :oops:

[Bretsky]

Actually, Walker is pretty fast. His biggest problem with the Giants was that he was overaggressive. I haven't seen that this preseason.


He also had problems playing the ball as a Giant; similar to Carroll. Have not seen that weakness as of yet

[Merlin]

Cool, great info. I now feel smarter which is saying a lot because after reading some posts I somehow feel dumber, if that's possible :huh:

[Partial]

I think Demovsky is pretty spot on with how I feel. Actually, it's not just close, but it's exactly what I think it will be. Havner might not want to buy a house yet though. I could see them replacing him also.


Rob Demovsky's version of the 53

Quarterbacks (2)
Brett Favre
Aaron Rodgers

Running backs (6)
Brandon Jackson
Vernand Morency
Noah Herron FREE AGENT
Korey Hall
Corey White FREE AGENT
A RB to be named later, either via trade or waivers

Receivers (5)
Donald Driver
Greg Jennings
James Jones
Ruvell Martin FREE AGENT
Carlyle Holiday FREE AGENT

Tight ends (3)
Donald Lee FREE AGENT
Bubba Franks
A TE to be named later, either via trade or waivers

Offensive line (9)
Chad Clifton
Mark Tauscher
Scott Wells
Jason Spitz
Daryn Colledge
Allen Barbre
Tony Moll
Junius Coston
Tyson Walter FREE AGENT

Defensive line (10)
Aaron Kampman
Cullen Jenkins
Ryan Pickett FREE AGENT
Corey Williams
KGB
Colin Cole
Johnny Jolly
Michael Montgomery
Justin Harrell
Larry Birdine FREE AGENT

Linebackers (6)
A.J. Hawk
Nick Barnett
Brady Poppinga
Desmond Bishop
Tracy White FREE AGENT
Spencer Havner FREE AGENT

Defensive backs (9)
Al Harris
Charles Woodson FREE AGENT
Atari Bigby FREE AGENT
Nick Collins
Aaron Rouse
Charlie Peprah FREE AGENT
Will Blackmon
Jarrett Bush FREE AGENT
Frank Walker FREE AGENT

Specialits (3)
Rob Davis
Jon Ryan FREE AGENT
Mason Crosby

Notes: The openings for another RB and TE are based on the fact that the 53-man roster for Week 1 rarely includes 53 players who were in camp with the Packers. Last year, Ted Thompson kept only 50 of his own players and added from waivers (Bush, Peprah and Tony Palmer). ... The Packers could keep only five running backs and choose to add a third quarterback or a fourth tight end. ... Birdine may have edged out Jason Hunter in the final week. ... Patrick Dendy goes from being the nickel guy at the start of camp to being cut. ... There's no chance they keep two kickers and probably only keep Dave Rayner if they get a trade offer for Crosby that they can't refuse.


Just felt the need to point that out so Bretsky can change that darn sig

[Merlin]

I don't think all of those are 3T's FA's though. And certainly only one that I know of was signed this season, Walker.

[MJZiggy]

Wait a second...wouldn't you think that any free agent that makes the team is a "legitimate free agent?" So all we need are two to make the team...

[Partial]

I don't think all of those are 3T's FA's though. And certainly only one that I know of was signed this season, Walker.

I am fairly confident those were all signed in TT's tenure. Colin Cole has been here four years now I believe. He was the only I was unsure about.

Most of those guys were undrafted free agents that were cut from other teams. I believe Bush was from the Panthers, Prepah from the Giants, and so on and so fourth.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I think all of the ones he listed were signed by Thompson. Maybe one that I missed wasn't.

[Merlin]

I thought Herron was a Sherman deal. Maybe it's just that he was the coach at the time. And hasn't Donald Lee been around a long time to? I can't remember who our TE's were since Franks, Lee and Martin.

[esoxx]

I still think Muir will make this team.

[Partial]

I thought Herron was a Sherman deal. Maybe it's just that he was the coach at the time. And hasn't Donald Lee been around a long time to? I can't remember who our TE's were since Franks, Lee and Martin.

Lee came two years ago when Sherman was the coach and TT was the GM.

[Merlin]

Wait a second...wouldn't you think that any free agent that makes the team is a "legitimate free agent?" So all we need are two to make the team...

Unfortunately, a lot of those listed are young players who took take time to develop. It would be nice to sprinkle in some good veterans that can play. Picket and Woodson were great pickups, we need 2 or 3 like that on offense.

[MadtownPacker]

I thought Culver had a poor preseason. Got beat deep by a Tight End in one game.Yup, that sealed his fate even if he hadn't got hurt. Too damn bad, I wanted a Fresno St guy to be on the roster. :?

[Fred's Slacks]

I still think Muir will make this team.

I agree. Although 6 DTs is too much. I was thinking they would shop Cole to see if they can get anything in a trade to make room for Muir.

As for Walker, I think he was on the bubble but he secured his roster spot against TN. He had tight coverage all night and almost made a great interception on a the deep ball to Moulds. He showed good body control and a nice closing burst. Dendy was a nice fill in last year, but I am glad we'll have more athletic corner depth this year.

[Bretsky]

I still think Muir will make this team.

I agree. Although 6 DTs is too much. I was thinking they would shop Cole to see if they can get anything in a trade to make room for Muir.

As for Walker, I think he was on the bubble but he secured his roster spot against TN. He had tight coverage all night and almost made a great interception on a the deep ball to Moulds. He showed good body control and a nice closing burst. Dendy was a nice fill in last year, but I am glad we'll have more athletic corner depth this year.


They need to find a way to keep Muir; it sounds like he's outplayed Harrell in TC.

[Packnut]

I started calling for this sob's head after the Berrian fiasco in game 1 last season. I bitched about him all season and what did I hear? Give him time, he's recovering from an injury, he's learning a new system. Sorry my friends, but slow is slow and stupid is stupid. You can get away with a saftey being one of them but not BOTH!

Here is my :

I TOLD YA SO!


Damn, it's hard work being right so much.............

[MadtownPacker]

I started calling for this sob's head after the Berrian fiasco in game 1 last season. I bitched about him all season and what did I hear? Give him time, he's recovering from an injury, he's learning a new system. Sorry my friends, but slow is slow and stupid is stupid. You can get away with a saftey being one of them but not BOTH!

Here is my :

I TOLD YA SO!


Damn, it's hard work being right so much.............
I thought you said he wouldn't get cut cuz he was one of the GM's handpicked players?

[Packnut]

I started calling for this sob's head after the Berrian fiasco in game 1 last season. I bitched about him all season and what did I hear? Give him time, he's recovering from an injury, he's learning a new system. Sorry my friends, but slow is slow and stupid is stupid. You can get away with a saftey being one of them but not BOTH!

Here is my :

I TOLD YA SO!


Damn, it's hard work being right so much.............
I thought you said he wouldn't get cut cuz he was one of the GM's handpicked players?

I said that LAST SEASON

[Packnut]

And also for the record, I never once blamed Teddy for signing him and I won't do so now.You can't be perfect in FA. What matters is you take your best shot, not refuse to swing at all.........

[vince]

More revisionist history from the nut.

You and practically everyone else on this and every other Packer board in existence called for Manuel's head last year. This offseason, you predicted that there was NO WAY Thompson would cut Manuel.

Way to go nut! I sure hope you apply for the GM job when Thompson is fired! You are always right about everything! Sure you are.

Get a clue nut.

[MadtownPacker]

I aint gonna lie P-Nut, I do recall you saying it wasn't gonna happen. It is great news either way and I will knock down a shot of some Cuervo to celebrate his release. :alc:

[RashanGary]

http://www.packerrats.com/ratchat/posting.php?mode=quote&p=134420



No, because IF you had paid attention to what MM and TT have said, both stated that he was not to blame for the blown or poor coverages. Teddy even went out of his way to explain how coming to a new city and new system is difficult for a player and also used the getting over an injury excuse for Manuel. One thing about Thompson is that he believes what he says.

MM also is on record defending Manuel. He's also #1 on the depth chart meaning someone has to BEAT HIM OUT, for the starting spot. They have a good chunk of cash invested in Manuel and are not going to give up on him after 1 season.




Damn, it's hard work being right so much.............

Only in that tard safe heaven that you call a mind, packnut. Only in your mind.

[RashanGary]

Not only did they give up on a guy that they had a mid level investment in but they gave up on him in favor of a guy they had nothing invested in.

There is a phrase for guys like packnut.

Big mouth, small brain.

[PackerBlues]

I dont know that anyone was overly concerned about Manual last year. The team was bad in so many areas last year, that singling out manual, at least for the first part of the year, didnt seem right.

As soon as our Defense started coming together late last year, manuals poor play stood out more. Hopefully, Bigby will help shore up the weak link in our Defense, and it will be as dominating as we all hope.

In the meantime, we have so many good Defensive players with potential looking to be cut, with no real hope of trading them for draft picks or for an extra offensive weapon or two.

Wishful thinking, but it would be nice if the NFL would allow teams to hold on to these guys that are obviously worth keeping on a "trade roster". It sickens me to know that these guys are worth something, and yet most teams out there interested in them, know that they will be waived anyway, and that they can simply snag them after the cuts are made. I have no doubt that we could get some late draft picks out of a few of these guys, but the way the system works now, they simply get cut, and the team that cuts them gets nothing out of there investment in them.

[RashanGary]

We'll see how it goes PB. I hate to drag TT into every conversation, but he seems like a somewhat flexible GM. I could see him keeping and extra guy here and going thin there if he thinks one guy is talented and the other can be scooped up at any time on the waiver wire.

There is a little box that rosters usually are painted into but it doesn't mean they have to be exactly that way. I don't see Muir cut. Birdine maybe becuase Hunter is so good on ST's but I could see the Packers keeping 6 DT's this year and two kickers so they can wait for a trade. It's not like you can't find a Zac Alcorn or a Spencer Havner on the FA list at any time during the season.

I think we're going to see a somewhat unconventional roster today. Hopefully the gamble (hopeing for a trade) pays off.

We can always put a TE, LB and QB or two on the PS and use them as emergency in the season until we find a trade for one of our talented guys at a glut position.

[PackerBlues]

ya, I can see Thompson picking up a TE off waivers. I have heard that the Seahawks have an over abundance, and that they may be thin on depth at DT. I would expect Thompson to find some talent to add to the team from other teams cuts anyway, and would be suprised if he didnt. But then, Thompson has suprised us all before.

[MJZiggy]

But with Bigby starting and Manuel cut, wouldn't they need another safety more than a TE if Bubba can continue his resurrection?

[KYPack]

ya, I can see Thompson picking up a TE off waivers. I have heard that the Seahawks have an over abundance, and that they may be thin on depth at DT. I would expect Thompson to find some talent to add to the team from other teams cuts anyway, and would be suprised if he didnt. But then, Thompson has suprised us all before.

The Rams have 4 good ones, also.

The word is they might keep 'em all & go w/no fullback on the roster.

Dominck Byrd is reportedly the guy on the bubble. A 3rd round pick with good speed and hands, he has been erratic. He's as good if not better than Lee. I'd trade Cole for him straight up and keep all our good young DLineman. Cole is about what he's gonna be and our young dudes like Muir have a lot more potential.

That's a good way for the GM's to save face. You trade a guy you're gonna cut fior a guy the other team is gonna cut. Looks like you at least got something for the pick.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I don't know that you can say Byrd is better than Lee, 3rd pick or not. He hasn't shown anything. He's short and I believe he's weak as a blocker. Not that they couldn't bring just about anybody in an upgrade the 3rd TE spot, but I'm not ready to crown Dominique Byrd a starter on this team.