Article--The Plan is Coming Together

[MJZiggy]

Enjoy it folks

by vince

Ted Thompson is definitely not your ordinary GM. He’s not only unconventional; he’s downright frustrating for many fans to support. Thompson seems to be completely unfazed by the enormity of Brett Favre’s final run at a championship before he ends his unbelievable. . .Read more (www.packerrats.com)

[MadtownPacker]

Excellent eval of the team. Facts cant be denied, this team is built to be good for a long time.

[Carolina_Packer]

Vince, well done. I thought I was reading something on Packer Plus. You break it down well. It's balanced in that you are not chugging the kool-aid; you know what needs to be done yet, yet you give credit where credit is due.

This is a fun time to be a fan. The ONLY thing I wish, and have before, is that this plan was unfolding right after Ron Wolf left back in 2001 when Brett was a younger player. Can you imagine where we'd be if we had hired TT then and he had begun to do his thing to build the team? I think a lot of folks had a problem with HOF QB and rebuilding with young guys not being a recipe for success, and I have to say I had my doubts as well.

Hopefully, the young guys can keep growing each week, win or lose and that we can keep up the success, fix our running game and keep the pedal to the metal.

[Badgepack]

The articles written by our own posters are very impressive. Coming from someone who has a hard time writing a couple sentence reply every now and again, props to vince, nutz, nd72, and all the rest.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Well-written.

[Merlin]

Very well written Vince. Although I am not a Thompson supporter and I believe that a lot of the things he gets credit for have nothing to do with him, you make a good argument. You won't convince me of most of what you attributed to him but that's okay we can agree to disagree. (And before any of you mean spirited people who do nothing but call people names jump on your bandwagon about the facts, most of the facts listed are not attributable to Thompson, thus my disagreement).

[vince]

Merlin,

Thanks for your kind words. I am curious what - specifically, you think is not attributable to Thompson.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Thompson has taken more than his share of abuse. He's the man at the top. Rightly or wrongly, he (and to a lesser extent McCarthy) gets the blame when things aren't go well and the credit when they are. So, give the man his credit.

[Oscar]

Great read Vince. :glug:

[The Shadow]

Nicely done.

[RashanGary]

Bravo!!

[Joemailman]

What a lot of TT's detractors cant seem to come to grips with is that TT is really really confident is his ability to judge talent. So when he doesn't sign free agents, it's not that he's cheap or asleep, it's just that he believes the guys that he has brought in are better than the free agents from other teams. Time will tell if he is right, but he's looking fairly good right now.

[BallHawk]

Great article, Vince.

[Carolina_Packer]

What a lot of TT's detractors cant seem to come to grips with is that TT is really really confident is his ability to judge talent. So when he doesn't sign free agents, it's not that he's cheap or asleep, it's just that he believes the guys that he has brought in are better than the free agents from other teams. Time will tell if he is right, but he's looking fairly good right now.

Maybe that just makes him better prepared than a lot of other GM's. If he is able to find guys under the radar that fit the system who become well-known players in the system, he has succeeded from that standpoint. It's easy to pull a Steinbrenner and throw bags of money at a high profile free-agent, and TT is not going to do that (as Vince alludes to in his article).

[Partial]

Definitely one of my favorite posters on the board. Vince, what a well-written article.

Don't be surprised to see Bobby McGinn or one of the other beat writers to steal your ideas and have it end up in this weekend's MJS.

[vince]

Thanks guys for reading the article and your reviews. Your contributions to the board are much appreciated also.

I'm a little surprised actually, that there's been only one (token) critic here. I guess the Chargers game was quite a statement game from that standpoint.

[oregonpackfan]

Vince,

I agree with the other posters that your article was written in a professional manner.

Thompson's views and positions reflect the adage, "It's lonely at the top."
Few people are going to support everything, or even the majority, of every decisions you make. Sometimes a GM does not know the merits of a decision until several years later.

I do believe TT has a vision for the Packers and has a well-defined plan for success. That does not mean I necessarily agree with every decision he makes, but that I think he does have established reasons for his decisions.

[packinpatland]

Very good analysis Vince.

Being a GM has to be a bit like being a parent. You may get credit when your kids do well, and may get blamed when they don't. You steer them in the right direction, give them the support they need to be successful, but ultimately it's up to them to apply themselves, work hard, do the right thing.

[Merlin]

Merlin,

Thanks for your kind words. I am curious what - specifically, you think is not attributable to Thompson.

I don't attribute straightening out the cap entirely on Thompson. His philosophies are different then Sherman's and they cost us more then they gained us by going into seasons 10 M under the cap two years in a row. Tough decisions needed to be made and I am sure anyone who had the job would have worked through them because they really have no choice in the matter. Sure it's nice to have space but we only have space because we have a boatload of rookie contracts that will come due in a few years. That's when it will all backfire. I believe in a few years with Thompson's philosophies we will become the farm team of the NFL. We will not be able to keep everyone that we have developed because of various reasons. It's ridiculous to believe that these players will be faithful to Thompson and sign a lesser contract to stay in Green Bay because he gave them a shot. It simply doesn't work that way in the NFL and Thompson has shown no empathy for loyalty. We will retain some players sure, but the ones that are let go will be replaced with the draft, continuing the cycle. It's a philosophy that has some serious flaws in it.

The team playing at the level it is right now is partially attributable to Thompson but not entirely and surely not mostly. He hired a coach who has been the major reason the team is successful. Other then that, Thompson has been 50/50 in judging draft talent. Three first round picks, one starter, one perennial bench warmer and one that has yet to be on the game day roster. When you claim to pick the BPA, you are supposed to be picking the best player, not the one your ego says you want. He has failed miserably there. Although he has found gems in the later rounds so have all other teams. Mainly because the ratio of first round successes to busts is so high vs taking a player in a later round. Face it, most of the starters in the NFL were not first or second round picks. Nothing special there accept ineptness in the first round. If you add in the FA signings he has made, most of them weren't even stop gap players and didn't make the roster and some that did were horrible. His judge of talent in FA is about 10/90.

Finally, when you have a coach and a veteran legend QB leading a young team, that speaks volumes towards bringing and inexperienced team together. Take Favre out of the equation and tell me that we would be 3-0. It's no secret that Thompson wanted Favre to retire. He prepared for it by drafting a QB no other team would touch, gave that QB every opportunity to succeed (and as of yet has not), let the offense dwindle down and replaced them with rookies. Nothing says "I want you here" more then taking away all of the skill players and putting in rookies. Defense may win championships but your offense has to have a running game and we don't have that, not even close. Favre can't put the ball up 50 times a game and expect to go to the super bowl. Unless of course every backfield in the NFL stinks and our defense scores every game or puts us on the one and we don't pass it four times.

Thompson get's credit for some things, but certainly not the success of the team. If anything, the team is successful despite Thompson.

[The Leaper]

Sure it's nice to have space but we only have space because we have a boatload of rookie contracts that will come due in a few years. That's when it will all backfire. I believe in a few years with Thompson's philosophies we will become the farm team of the NFL.

Very poor logic IMO. Baseball differs greatly from football because teams are allowed to spend whatever they want with no hard cap, and revenues from TV vary greatly from market to market and are not shared. What team in the NFL in the last 15 years has been reduced to being a "farm team"? There isn't one. The parity and competiveness between all 32 teams is precisely why the NFL is the country's favorite sport.


We will retain some players sure, but the ones that are let go will be replaced with the draft, continuing the cycle. It's a philosophy that has some serious flaws in it.

What holes? All teams build through the draft. That has always been true in the NFL, and never more so than during the era of free agency in the last 15 years.

The philosophy has no serious flaw. It is the EXACT philosophy used to develop every Super Bowl team in the modern era. The reason Green Bay struggled the last few years was a direct result of Sherman's lack of emphasis on building through the draft, which led to a period where the team had very few young players stepping in and making new contributions to the team, especially when older guys started to falter or got injured.


Other then that, Thompson has been 50/50 in judging draft talent.

Hitting half your picks...especially when you are someone who values those picks and seeks to acquire 10 or more each year...is actually a pretty good achievement. The fact you feel otherwise shows how out of touch you are. Please name for us the NFL GMs that regularly find successful starters with more than 50% of their draft picks.


Three first round picks, one starter, one perennial bench warmer and one that has yet to be on the game day roster. When you claim to pick the BPA, you are supposed to be picking the best player, not the one your ego says you want. He has failed miserably there.

So did Ron Wolf...who is widely hailed in the world of football as a virtual genius in terms of managing an NFL roster. His first round picks were often rather disasterous for Green Bay...so why aren't you critical of Wolf as well?

[Brohm]

I do not agree that TT wanted Brett to retire. TT wanted him to make up his mind. He drafted Rodgers for a couple of resaons: 1. Farve was getting older and in some cases the drop can be quick 2. Farve had made comments about retiring, Rodgers was insurance if he did 3. Many thought he was the BPA.

Also, hiring the right head coach is just as important as drafting the talent. He should get credit for that. There are teams that have loads of talent but get shorted due to poor coaching...a lot of SD fans are claiming that right now :P

I think someone already mentioned Wolf's wiffs in the first round (and to be honest it's a bit early yet to call them wiffs for TT. Rodgers will be our starter in a few years [then we'll see how good he is], and Harrel was TT's BPA pick, though at a position we are stacked at so we will have to wait and see).

[vince]

I don't attribute straightening out the cap entirely on Thompson.
Who then, would you attribute it to?


His philosophies are different then Sherman's and they cost us more then they gained us by going into seasons 10 M under the cap two years in a row. Tough decisions needed to be made and I am sure anyone who had the job would have worked through them because they really have no choice in the matter. Sure it's nice to have space but we only have space because we have a boatload of rookie contracts that will come due in a few years. That's when it will all backfire.

I believe in a few years with Thompson's philosophies we will become the farm team of the NFL. We will not be able to keep everyone that we have developed because of various reasons. It's ridiculous to believe that these players will be faithful to Thompson and sign a lesser contract to stay in Green Bay because he gave them a shot. It simply doesn't work that way in the NFL and Thompson has shown no empathy for loyalty.

We will retain some players sure, but the ones that are let go will be replaced with the draft, continuing the cycle. It's a philosophy that has some serious flaws in it.
Not only won't it backfire, but if Thompson manages the cap the way he has thus far, it places a PREMIUM on his methods! Best case scenario...the team has so many talented players that some of them (even better, many of them) will be overvalued by other teams. That's when you need a depth of quality younger talent that is ready to step in and take over.

But before that, Merlin, a GM has to recognize the talent and sign the right players at a time when he can be signed at a value. Thompson has demonstrated that he is interested in signing his own value players BEFORE they go to the free agent market. Based on the proven performances of the group of Packers that he's taken this tact with, I'd say there's little doubt he'll continue to do this successfully.

What's more, based on what I've seen thus far, I see no reason to doubt his ability to draft quality talent (much of it is already on the team) to step in for players that choose to test the free agent market. Apparently, you don't think his draft picks will pan out. We'll just have to see how that turns out.


The team playing at the level it is right now is partially attributable to Thompson but not entirely and surely not mostly. He hired a coach who has been the major reason the team is successful.
Thompson hired McCarthy. McCarthy is doing a good job coaching. Good job Thompson and good job McCarthy. Thompson gets credit for seeing the qualities in McCarthy that he felt would contribute to a successful team. That's the way it works Merlin. Are you suggesting that Thompson should BE the coach too?


When you claim to pick the BPA, you are supposed to be picking the best player, not the one your ego says you want. He has failed miserably there. Although he has found gems in the later rounds so have all other teams. Mainly because the ratio of first round successes to busts is so high vs taking a player in a later round. Face it, most of the starters in the NFL were not first or second round picks. Nothing special there accept ineptness in the first round.
Merlin, if Thompson has done no better than any other GM in the draft, why is it that the Packers more loaded with young talent than any other team in the league? They are the youngest team in the league, and they are one of the toughest teams in the league thus far, no?


If you add in the FA signings he has made, most of them weren't even stop gap players and didn't make the roster and some that did were horrible. His judge of talent in FA is about 10/90.
The contributing free agents that Thompson signed are listed in the article. There are 10 of them. I'm interested to see the list of 90 free agents that he has signed that he's missed on. Good luck with that.


It's no secret that Thompson wanted Favre to retire. He prepared for it by drafting a QB no other team would touch, gave that QB every opportunity to succeed (and as of yet has not), let the offense dwindle down and replaced them with rookies. Nothing says "I want you here" more then taking away all of the skill players and putting in rookies. Defense may win championships but your offense has to have a running game and we don't have that, not even close. Favre can't put the ball up 50 times a game and expect to go to the super bowl. Unless of course every backfield in the NFL stinks and our defense scores every game or puts us on the one and we don't pass it four times.
Merlin, your hatred for Aaron Rodgers does not qualify as verification that Thompson wanted Favre to retire. The offensive line and running game can be questioned, but to say that Thompson has purposely sabotaged these areas to get rid of Favre is crazy talk. I contend that the receiving corps is SOLID. Nothing thus far indicates otherwise.

If Thompson didn't want Favre on the team, HE'D GET RID OF HIM. He has that power Merlin. That's why they call him GM. The completely unsubstantiated conspiracy theory that Thompson wants Favre off the team is nothing short of ridiculous.


Thompson get's credit for some things, but certainly not the success of the team. If anything, the team is successful despite Thompson.
Huh? Yeah, this team is successful IN SPITE of Mike McCarthy, who Thompson hired, and IN SPITE of the players on the team that Thompson has been responsible for signing, drafting, re-signing, and retaining. That just isn't logical. The coaches and players are the reason the team is successful and the GM is the reason each of them is in place.

[RashanGary]

Great post, Vince. I'm an esspecially big fan of drafting well and using the value markets.

I say there are three markets

1. The UFA market - This market is high demand, low supply. A bunch of teams fight over a few talented players and the highest bidder wins

2. The restricted market - This market lowers the demand by taking teams out of the bidding by making opposing teams give up draft picks. The player is forced to sign a fair deal or risk injury during another season in the violent NFL

3. The I want mine early market - There is no demand on this market. The player simply wants to get paid early and has to give up his shot at UFA and the HUGE payday for a fair deal now and some security.

Thompson believes in scowering all low risk talent pools, constantly having a rotating pool of talent. Guys like Bigby, Bush, Jon Ryan, Bodiford and Muir are decent players and they are practically free of charge. You miss on a few, but there is no loss. You just keep bringing them in until you hit on one. He then works hard on getting his draft board right and finding the best talent available. Over time, he has so much young talent that HE FOUND that it becomes easy to stay in the 2nd two markets and pretty soon a disgusting excess of talent builds because his $$ is going farther tahn everyone elses. We are just in the beginning stages of what should be a great 5 years in GB and that is largely due to Ted Thompson. When Brett is gone, any success will be entirely due to Ted Thompson.

[RashanGary]

This is an artical on TT with quotes from Bob Harlan. It just feels good to see this team grow. TT isn't really a socially gifted guy. He doesn't say the right thing. That said, I love his focus, his patients and his resolve for doing the right thing even if he had to take a couple short term lumps. Bob Harlan really seems to bite his tongue when he talks about Mike Sherman. I still think the turning point of this whole organization was the firing of Mike Sherman the GM and the hiring of Ted Thompson.


Mike Vandermause column: Harlan enjoying the Packers' climb


By Mike Vandermause

Bob Harlan's telephone hasn't been ringing much these days.


"Extremely quiet," the Packers' chairman said on Tuesday.


With the Green Bay Packers enjoying their best start in six years, fans have no reason to complain.


Well, there was one notable exception. A Packers backer left Harlan a message from a Philadelphia bar during the season opener against the Eagles.


"He called me at halftime when the score was 10-10," said Harlan with a chuckle, "and said to me, 'You've got to sit Brett Favre down and bring in a new quarterback. He's too old to play.' "


The fan didn't leave a name or number, and it's just as well. Even if he didn't fall off his bar stool, he should be feeling sheepish for giving up on Favre, who has turned back the clock 10 years and has looked like an MVP candidate the last two weeks.


Favre's perpetual skills, a defensive resurgence, an infusion of youth and a coaching staff that is getting the most out of its talent have contributed to a reversal of fortunes for the Packers.


This was a team saddled with a 4-8 record last December, better than just four teams in the NFL. Now, the Packers are one of only five clubs with a 3-0 record.


Harlan credits General Manager Ted Thompson and coach Mike McCarthy for sparking the turnaround.


After an offseason of discontent in which Thompson was criticized for not doing enough to improve the roster, Harlan has noticed a change in sentiment.


"I'm getting letters now thanking me for hiring Ted Thompson," Harlan said. "Ted has a plan. … He sticks to it, and we're getting results."


Harlan also can't help noticing McCarthy's positive influence, which has fostered team confidence and harmony. McCarthy was one of seven NFL head coaches hired following the 2005 season, and on the strength of seven consecutive victories, is tied with the New York Jets' Eric Mangini for the best record among them at 11-8.


"He's molding this team the way he wants it to be," Harlan said. "I can see the change being around the players. I see the change when we get on the plane and travel."


It's no coincidence Favre is playing well under McCarthy, according to Harlan. Favre threw 29 interceptions in a disastrous 4-12 season in 2005 under the previous regime. That offseason, Harlan spoke with former Packers coach Mike Holmgren, who molded Favre into an MVP quarterback in the 1990s.


Holmgren told Harlan several close Packers' losses could have gone the other way if Favre had been kept under control.


"I think Mike McCarthy does that," Harlan said. "Brett and he have a wonderful relationship."


Although the Packers have opened with victories over three 2006 playoff teams, Harlan is keeping a lid on expectations.


"I'd like to see us take another step this year, whatever that step is," he said. "To be in contention and have a winning record, that would be another major step. For being the youngest team in the league, that speaks well for your future."


The future could be now for the Packers, based on the competition in the NFC. They have leap-frogged past the Eagles, Giants and Saints in the NFC pecking order, and until further notice, must be considered among the four or five best teams in the conference.


It's been a remarkable climb up the NFL ladder for a team considered a doormat just 10 months ago.

[b bulldog]

I love the climb towards a championship until playoffs come around and you lose a nailbiter. I could skip that portion of it.

[The Shadow]

Vince : nice job!
It's so very clear that Ted Thompson's work is paying huge dividends now with a team poised for longterm success.
Some folk's blind hatred of TT prevents them - even with their noses being rubbed in the evidence - from acknowledging it.
.................................................. ................................................
Give me a T!
Give me a T!
Give me a T!

What's that spell?

Disaster.......................................... .................................................
Please keep the 'disasters' coming!

[Merlin]

Who then, would you attribute it to?

Please read what I wrote AGAIN. Any GM could have straightened it out, including Sherman. Giving someone props for doing their job is irresponsible.


Not only won't it backfire, but if Thompson manages the cap the way he has thus far, it places a PREMIUM on his methods! Best case scenario...the team has so many talented players that some of them (even better, many of them) will be overvalued by other teams. That's when you need a depth of quality younger talent that is ready to step in and take over.
But before that, Merlin, a GM has to recognize the talent and sign the right players at a time when he can be signed at a value. Thompson has demonstrated that he is interested in signing his own value players BEFORE they go to the free agent market. Based on the proven performances of the group of Packers that he's taken this tact with, I'd say there's little doubt he'll continue to do this successfully.

What's more, based on what I've seen thus far, I see no reason to doubt his ability to draft quality talent (much of it is already on the team) to step in for players that choose to test the free agent market. Apparently, you don't think his draft picks will pan out. We'll just have to see how that turns out.

Take off the blinders. You can’t have quality young depth if you are replacing veterans with rookies. 4 year starter leaves, he drafts a rookie to replace. How is that depth? AND, where is our depth? The reality is we have depth on our defensive line. Other then that, where do we have depth? How many more years do you think it will take to attain that depth? It will take more years then the contracts the young players have right now last. Sure, your players will have value, but those are your starters and you have zero depth behind them. You can only keep a 53 man roster and last time I checked, there are 25 starters on a team. So you are saying that we lose 10 starters because of contracts and we can replace them easily with this “depth”? His methods are far from being a premium because he is not a good judge of talent. Singing him praises for the people that are a success and not scrutinizing for the ones that are failures is naïve. He has signed more failures then successes and that’s the bottom line for judging talent. Not recognizing the team’s weaknesses is also a big black mark against him. Just because those people make the roster does not mean that they were the best option for the team. In some cases they were the only option because Thompson is so confident in himself. More times then not that confidence has backfired.


Thompson hired McCarthy. McCarthy is doing a good job coaching. Good job Thompson and good job McCarthy. Thompson gets credit for seeing the qualities in McCarthy that he felt would contribute to a successful team. That's the way it works Merlin. Are you suggesting that Thompson should BE the coach too?

I hired someone, they were a super star. Do I get the credit? No and neither should Thompson. He gets credit once again for doing his job as anyone would who hires good people. McCarthy could have been a bust and still may be one. After looking at the candidates that Thompson interviewed, it was obvious that he wanted someone who didn’t have the experience to question the GM or make a power move. Sherman was going to be fired regardless of the outcome of the 2005 season for those very reasons. Thompson came into Green Bay with a “his way” reputation. Holmgren and Thompson could not have worked together much longer, that is a fact. Is Holmgren a worse judge of talent, coach or GM candidate? No, certainly not. Seattle had to lose one of them eventually and it wasn’t going to be Holmgren.


Merlin, if Thompson has done no better than any other GM in the draft, why is it that the Packers more loaded with young talent than any other team in the league? They are the youngest team in the league, and they are one of the toughest teams in the league thus far, no?

We are 12-20 the past two seasons because we are “loaded” with young talent. This isn’t our year and it never will be our year as long as we are “loaded” with young inexperienced players. This is the problem with his philosophy. A concept you can’t seem to grasp. As far as being tough, how to you grade that? The NFL’s dead average defense is “tough”? That’s a personal opinion based off of personal bias. Donald Driver is tough, Bret Favre is tough, other then that, what benchmark are you using?


The contributing free agents that Thompson signed are listed in the article. There are 10 of them. I'm interested to see the list of 90 free agents that he has signed that he's missed on. Good luck with that.

Sorry, I guess I should have been clearer since obviously math isn’t your strong suit. 10% of the time he makes the right move. 90% of the time he is way off base. Our starting free agents are who again? Bigby? He doesn’t really count since he has been on and off the team, more designated as a stop gap in Thompson’s opinion. Picket can’t be counted either because we had Jackson and the replacement there was even. Although Picket is younger and less injury prone, we had a player at that position and as it seems, a lot of players at that position. John Ryan? Nope, we needed a punter and he was basically an undrafted rookie. Woodson? Oh that’s right, Ryan Grant and Shawn Boddiford (for the second time now). So we have one starter and some backups. So you want me to list the 10% and the 90% now? I didn’t think so. He can’t judge FA talent, period.


Merlin, your hatred for Aaron Rodgers does not qualify as verification that Thompson wanted Favre to retire. The offensive line and running game can be questioned, but to say that Thompson has purposely sabotaged these areas to get rid of Favre is crazy talk. I contend that the receiving corps is SOLID. Nothing thus far indicates otherwise.

If Thompson didn't want Favre on the team, HE'D GET RID OF HIM. He has that power Merlin. That's why they call him GM. The completely unsubstantiated conspiracy theory that Thompson wants Favre off the team is nothing short of ridiculous.


Hatred for Aaron Rodgers? I don’t hate anyone. It is clear that Rodgers is not the answer and never will be. To take a QB that no one else wanted is a clear sign of what the intentions are. Rodgers had nothing going for him coming in and has shown nothing since he has been here. You do not strip down the offense in hopes your new young QB will be a super star. You strip the offense when you want your old QB to leave. It’s pretty black and white. It isn’t sabotage, it’s called forcing the guy you want to retire to retire early. Thompson DOES NOT HAVE THE BALLS to get rid of Favre. Your obvious bias towards Thompsons has blinded you from all reality. For the past two years, Thompson has done everything but ask Favre to leave. Is that part of his plan to? To have no offense? You make no argument that is creditable to the contrary. Our WR corps is not solid. They look good so far. The end of the season will determine that, not three games. Favre has basically made this his team again. Thompson now more then ever can ill afford to push Favre out. He won’t be trying to any longer because without Favre, Thompson looks like an idiot. So go ahead and show me how we would be 3-0 without Favre with the current offense with Rodgers under center. We wouldn’t be and I guarantee you that if Favre had hung em up after 2005 that our offense would be stacked all in an effort to make Rodgers succeed.


Huh? Yeah, this team is successful IN SPITE of Mike McCarthy, who Thompson hired, and IN SPITE of the players on the team that Thompson has been responsible for signing, drafting, re-signing, and retaining. That just isn't logical. The coaches and players are the reason the team is successful and the GM is the reason each of them is in place.

The GM is the reason the people on the team are there, this is undeniably true. BUT the team is successful despite the missteps, poor philosophy and unwillingness to recognize that there is more then a defensive line to a team. In other words, the team is successful despite the ineptness of Ted Thompson, his poor judge of talent, his lack of knowledge of how many different positions there are on a team, especially offense and his unwillingness to recognize that although youth is a good thing, you can’t keep replacing veterans with youth, it will backfire in the end.

It's obvious that anyone who only recognizes the good things Thompson has done and ignores all of the negative ones is going to have rose colored glasses on. I seem to remember everyone slamming Sherman for everything, including his coaching. I don't remember anyone saying he was responsible for the Packers success during his tenure. His successes in signing free agents or draft picks. People only talk about Sherman in the negative. To me, his only knock was not winning in the playoffs. Sure, he has made some mistakes as a GM with players and the cap but no one seems to remember the positive. One could argue that Thompson is mismanaging the cap by not using it to put the best team possible on the field. But no, that isn't the case because his "philosophy" is so sound. Right. Funny how the tides turn when another GM makes more mistakes, has less success all of a sudden is a guru. Since Thompson is obviously responsible for everything and he deserves all of this praise, what is his record again? Oh yeah, 15-20 with many embarrassing losses that the Packers haven't seen the likes of in 20-30 years. How many times has his team gone to the play offs? Oh that's right, No playoff games and this comes from being in the weakest division in weaker conference in the NFL. It's one thing to be excited as we all are. It's completely another to sing praise to someone who has accomplished so little in 2+ seasons. It's all about the "W" and it doesn't matter how you get them. Two years of being a joke does not make up for 3 games of success at the beginning of a season. Can we go 16-0? Sure, anything is possible. Can we win the Super Bowl? Sure, anything is possible. Is it all because of Ted Thompson, hardly.

[Merlin]

Vince : nice job!
It's so very clear that Ted Thompson's work is paying huge dividends now with a team poised for longterm success.
Some folk's blind hatred of TT prevents them - even with their noses being rubbed in the evidence - from acknowledging it.
.................................................. ................................................
Give me a T!
Give me a T!
Give me a T!

What's that spell?

Disaster.......................................... .................................................
Please keep the 'disasters' coming!

Yuck it up glass house boy. Keep throwing those rocks.

[The Leaper]

Any GM could have straightened it out, including Sherman. Giving someone props for doing their job is irresponsible.

Claiming that credit should be discounted because anyone can do it is just as irresponsible. The fact of the matter is that not just anyone can do it...there are numerous teams in the NFL with a rather poor cap situation despite the huge bump they got in cap space from the last TV deal.


Take off the blinders. You can’t have quality young depth if you are replacing veterans with rookies. 4 year starter leaves, he drafts a rookie to replace. How is that depth? AND, where is our depth? The reality is we have depth on our defensive line. Other then that, where do we have depth? How many more years do you think it will take to attain that depth?

Merlin, you conveniently fail to point out the lack of depth right now is DIRECTLY ATTRIBUTED TO SHERMAN. As you point out, a 4 year guy starting to come into his own is the key...and those kind of guys are exactly what we've been missing because of Sherman's lack of value placed on retaining draft picks. 4 year guys on the roster right now would still be Sherman's boys...how many of them are there?

Despite being saddled with a team that had no depth...and few young kids on the roster who could provide depth going forward...Thompson has been able to do a reasonable job in the 3 years he's had to build the team.

The idea isn't to lose a guy and then draft his replacement. The idea is to continue drafting guys well ahead of time that are ready to step in if needed. Thompson will only continue to strengthen the depth on the roster by bringing in 10 more guys every year from the draft to push all 53 spots on the roster.

Up until now, Thompson has been barely able to replace the young talent that should have already been in place if Sherman had done his job correctly. Going forward, Thompson's strategy will serve to produce great depth across the board.

Your notion that you can't give a guy credit for doing his job is ridiculous. I now understand why you are so upset and miserable all the time...no one ever gives you the credit you deserve, so you are merely pissed off when others do get credit.

[Zool]

:beat:

This horse is really starting to stink now. Its all bloated and rigor mortis set in a looooooong time ago.

[cheesner]

Please read what I wrote AGAIN. Any GM could have straightened it out, including Sherman. Giving someone props for doing their job is irresponsible.
Bud, your posts in this thread are rather strange. To contort your views so you don't have to admit you were wrong is just looking silly.


Take off the blinders. You can’t have quality young depth if you are replacing veterans with rookies. 4 year starter leaves, he drafts a rookie to replace. How is that depth? AND, where is our depth?
You complain that we have 10M in cap space, then you complain that we won't be able to keep our rookies who have developed. You see, we will use the cap space to sign the rookies who have developed. I would have thought that was obvious. He has already resigned Jenkins, Barnett, and Kampman. Three rising stars.


I hired someone, they were a super star. Do I get the credit? No and neither should Thompson. He gets credit once again for doing his job as anyone would who hires good people. McCarthy could have been a bust and still may be one. After looking at the candidates that Thompson interviewed, it was obvious that he wanted someone who didn’t have the experience to question the GM or make a power move.
If it was easy, then why isn't every team as successful? TT has assembled some talent, and from what I can see, the Packers have improved as much in these 3 years as any team in the NFL. Seeing how TT is in direct competition for a finite amount of talent out there, doesn't that say that TT is doing better than most GMs?


We are 12-20 the past two seasons because we are “loaded” with young talent.
We were 4-12, then we were 8-8, now we are 3-0 "loaded" with young talent. You allude to excellent math skills, you must realize these numbers are improving, right?



Bigby? He doesn’t really count since he has been on and off the team, more designated as a stop gap in Thompson’s opinion. So it just isn't that TT has to bring in talent, but how he brings in the talent is important to you. That makes sense to you?


You do not strip down the offense in hopes your new young QB will be a super star.

Before TTs first 2 drafts, he did not know if Brett was going to play or not. You expect him to plan his future around a player that may never step on the field again? That would be really foolish.



In other words, the team is successful despite the ineptness of Ted Thompson, his poor judge of talent, his lack of knowledge of how many different positions there are on a team, especially offense and his unwillingness to recognize that although youth is a good thing, you can’t keep replacing veterans with youth, it will backfire in the end.
He is not just replacing veterans with youth. He is replacing good players with potentially GREAT players.

It appears that a lot of that potential is starting to translate into production.
That is to say, TT is doing an excellent job.

[MJZiggy]

Thanks, cheesner, you saved me soooooo much typing... :D