Are we cut blocking or what???

[Guiness]

I re-watched the Vikings game last night, specifically looking for cut blocks on the few running plays we did run. I think I saw one thrown by Colledge, but it was a miss. Although someone else did trip over him. I watched the other games, and paid passing attention, and may have seen a half dozen or so cut blocks. I haven't watched the Washington game, so I can't comment on that.

I'm not being sarcastic here!!! I really expected to see more cut blocks, or at least attempted cut blocks, but they just don't seem to be throwing them.

[MJZiggy]

Notebook: Run Game Under Microscope


by Mike Spofford, Packers.com
posted 10/15/2007

It's becoming a familiar refrain, but Head Coach Mike McCarthy once again reiterated what the Packers' stagnant running game needs to get going, and it's not just one thing.

It's better fundamentals by the blockers, consistency in who the feature back is, and a commitment to the run game by the play-caller himself, McCarthy.

"When you don't run the football, it compounds itself and your problems are ahead," McCarthy said on Monday. "That's what we're focused on, because you want to have all your horses."

The ground game produced just 56 yards on 20 carries in Sunday's win over the Redskins. That marked the fourth time in six games the Packers rushed for fewer than 60 yards.

McCarthy said the running game will get its due evaluation during the bye week. From a schematic standpoint, the most frustrating thing for McCarthy has been seeing the same blocking mistakes made over and over. Whether it's properly cutting off the backside pursuit or effectively handling combination blocks up front, the run-blocking unit hasn't improved as the season has gone along, and that's bothersome.

"I wouldn't say we've regressed, but we have not improved in my opinion," McCarthy said. "The things that bother you more are the common mistakes.

"There are some guys who are doing things really good in certain areas, but the common mistakes we're making, that's what we need to improve on, and frankly that's coaching. And I think every football team in America goes through that during the course of the year."

McCarthy said he would look into whether featuring one runner might help develop some rhythm and consistency within that part of the offense as well. Rookies Brandon Jackson and DeShawn Wynn have gone back and forth as far as who's received the larger workload, depending on the health and productivity of each.

McCarthy also realizes the number of rushing attempts is way down, and that hasn't helped the team build a ground game. The Packers had just six rushing attempts in the first half against Washington, and even with a larger commitment to run against Chicago's cover-2 defense the week before, the offense still had just 22 runs compared to 40 pass attempts by Brett Favre.

"We need to do a better job of taking advantage of the seven-man box," McCarthy said, referring to the number of defenders near the line of scrimmage when teams play two deep safeties. "If you've got two backs in the backfield, and you cannot run the ball well against a seven-man box, you're playing uphill. And we have done that the last two weeks, really I'd say the last five quarters."

There have been a number of running plays called that have been changed to quick passes at the line of scrimmage by Favre because of the defensive alignment, but the commitment to run still needs to be there over the long haul.

"You want to be able to get in and out of the number of concepts you have in your offense so you don't become one-dimensional," McCarthy said.

Sticking with it
When asked what aspect of his team he's most pleased with, McCarthy pointed to the team's maturity and ability to overcome adversity.

That was missing during the early stages of last season, when close games at home against New Orleans and St. Louis were lost at the wire, and a bad third quarter snowballed into a blowout loss at Philadelphia, leaving the team 1-4 at the bye week.

This season a poor offensive showing against the Eagles, a failed goal-to-go from the 1-yard line against the Chargers, a late fumble at Minnesota, and a handful of missed scoring chances at the Redskins all have been overcome to register victories.

The Packers couldn't overcome their minus-4 turnover ratio against Chicago the previous week, but simply finding a way to win more often than not when everything doesn't necessarily go smoothly is a sign of growth for the NFL's youngest roster.

"That's good team football, and that's the way you have to win," McCarthy said. "It's not always going to be pretty."

That said, the message also is clear the Packers haven't played their best football yet, and that's a stride they'd like to hit as the season progresses.

"I think we're in that routine that I felt we finally hit down the stretch last year, and I actually talked about in our team meeting Saturday night," McCarthy said. "Just using the prior week's positives and negatives from the game to keep reinforcing how we need to continue to improve. Hey, we're a good football team. We're 5-1. And they don't hand out victories in this league. So we're proud of the fact of where we are."

Down to one tight end?
McCarthy said the knee injury to Bubba Franks is a sprain and it may keep the veteran tight end out for a couple of weeks.

If Franks is unable to return for the Oct. 29 game at Denver following the bye, McCarthy said the team might look to sign Ryan Krause from the practice squad. The only other tight end on the active roster is Donald Lee.

"I'm very, very pleased with the way the tight end position has performed," McCarthy said. "Now Krause has to step in if it's his opportunity, and we'll just make sure we put him in positions to be successful."

Quarterback Brett Favre had his ankle rolled up on during the game, but McCarthy said he talked to Favre Monday and he'll be fine. Defensive tackle Cullen Jenkins has a leg injury from Sunday's game, and cornerback Frank Walker has a knee injury. Both players will be tested further, but McCarthy didn't indicate that either injury was serious.

See it again
Sunday's Packers-Redskins game will be re-broadcast on NFL Network's NFL Replay feature at 9:30 p.m. (CT) Tuesday.

NFL Replay condenses the game to a 90-minute format with exclusive NFL Films material and post-game press conference sound bites.

Those interested in the Packers' NFC North rivals can see a re-broadcast of Sunday's Bears-Vikings game at 7 p.m. (CT) Tuesday.

[RashanGary]

I re-watched the Vikings game last night, specifically looking for cut blocks on the few running plays we did run. I think I saw one thrown by Colledge, but it was a miss. Although someone else did trip over him. I watched the other games, and paid passing attention, and may have seen a half dozen or so cut blocks. I haven't watched the Washington game, so I can't comment on that.

I'm not being sarcastic here!!! I really expected to see more cut blocks, or at least attempted cut blocks, but they just don't seem to be throwing them.

McCarthy thinks he's a genius. Apparently the zone scheme that has been successfull in the NFL isnt' good enough for Mike. From what I understand, McCarthy thinks cut blocks leave piles of people and get in the way. He doesn't believe in that sort of thing. Funny how it's the backside (where the cuts are supposed to be taking place) that is constantly killing our running attack. Well, it's not so funny if your a Packer fan.

[gbpackfan]

Justin,

Where the hell did you come up with that? MM is aware that the back side blocks are not working. He is doing everything possible to fix it. I think you are way off.

[MJZiggy]

McCarthy thinks he's a genius. Apparently the zone scheme that has been successfull in the NFL isnt' good enough for Mike. From what I understand, McCarthy thinks cut blocks leave piles of people and get in the way. He doesn't believe in that sort of thing. Funny how it's the backside (where the cuts are supposed to be taking place) that is constantly killing our running attack. Well, it's not so funny if your a Packer fan.

Did you not READ the article I just posted?


McCarthy said the running game will get its due evaluation during the bye week. From a schematic standpoint, the most frustrating thing for McCarthy has been seeing the same blocking mistakes made over and over. Whether it's properly cutting off the backside pursuit or effectively handling combination blocks up front, the run-blocking unit hasn't improved as the season has gone along, and that's bothersome.

[Partial]

Scott Wells said on Gary and Cliff that they are phasing it out and by the end of this season it should be gone. He said that McCarthy has never liked it, but really liked the knowledge that Jags brought to the table.

A stip Jags had to be coordinator was to run the ZBS. Mac is in the process of switching to a traditional power gap scheme.

[Joemailman]

Partial, if that's true, it's a combination of good news and bad news, in my opinion. The good news is I prefer the power gap. Never thought zone blocking was a good fit for the type of coach McCarthy is, and I always wondered why he decided to go with it. The bad news is I wonder if we have the right type of players for power gap. I realize that Flanagan and Wahle were guys whose greatest asset was their mobility, not necessarily brute strength. However, we don't seem to have anyone who is a road grader like Rivera.

This would explain at least in part why we haven't seen the kind of progress on the OL many of us expected to see this season.

[Partial]

I think the OL is struggling because we have a lot of excellent pass blockers and not enough good run blockers. Colledge certainly wasn't known for his run blocking coming out, and Clifton never was either. Wells is kind of small to hold the point, and the right guard has been a revolving door. Tauscher is solid at everything.

I suspect they'll improve. I also suspect they fatten the boys up this off-season.

[Guiness]

Agreed Partial - the personel we have may not be suited, and I don't know if they can adapt. One of the benefits of this system was supposed to be that you can use smaller, more athletic linemen. Less competition for them, and one would think it's easier to recognize athleticism then to try and guage if the fat boy in college can put on another 20lbs and make it in the NFL.

I hope all the draft picks we've spent on the OL these past 2 yrs aren't wasted because we were drafting for a different type of system.

[woodbuck27]

Scott Wells said on Gary and Cliff that they are phasing it out and by the end of this season it should be gone. He said that McCarthy has never liked it, but really liked the knowledge that Jags brought to the table.

A stip Jags had to be coordinator was to run the ZBS. Mac is in the process of switching to a traditional power gap scheme.


YES! YES!! YES!!!

[KYPack]

I've been wondering about this all year. I wonder why we even bother to "commit" to the ZBS, 'cause we aren't really running it. What we are running is some kind of hybred the coaches have cooked up. It's easier for the guys to run, but isn't the full blown Alex Gibbs style ZBS.

In order to run the ZBS, you need a zealot to be the guiding light of the whole deal. Our zealot, Jags, has moved on. We need to decide if we wanna run the power gap and this hybred or just run the power gap. The WCO is a power gap system.

I think Mac thought that the ZBS would equal instant running game and wanted both that and Jags to jump-start his offense. Now he's lost Jags. He's modified his running attack to the hybred. The problem is that we drafted all these ZBS guys that are working out about half-ass. Moll is probably a career back-up, ditto Spitz. Colledge may develop into a LG or and LT replacement for Cliffy. I think Wellsey is OK and Coston will eventually be our RG. We need one more lineman that can actually shove guys around to ever have a running game.

With Moll, Spitz, AND Colledge in there, we don't have much of a shot at running the ball. Getting one effective guy wouldn't be much of a problem.

I think the bigger problem is making the move on scrapping the ZBS and making personnel moves to have a good ground game.

[MJZiggy]

Can you scrap your system in the middle of a season? Seems to me we're stuck with it at least in part until they have the opportunity in the offseason to teach the kind of run blocking they want out of the guys...

[Partial]

I think you'll see Juice (10), Darren (10), Scott (5), Jason (10) and Tony (10) significantly heftier next year. Ideally, they will gain some strength and still be able to keep their mobility and quickness at this size.

[Carolina_Packer]

What a predicament. I never thought about what would happen if the scheme didn't take, but now that they've committed to it and are hinting at going back to a traditional scheme, do you think we will need to make personnel changes or do you think it's as "easy" as having the guards and center condition themselves to put some pounds on?

Also, if we were successfully executing the power-gap system, which if any of our current RB's would be good for that system?

I think they are definitely at the fish or cut bait stage on this scheme; not meaning scrap it in the middle of the season, which I don't see, but after the season making the decision. I say, do whatever you have to do to get the running game productive.

[Brohm]

I think our lineman will adapt fine, once they get the system sorted. They are not that much lighter than other teams or even Rivera and Wahle. Wells was drafted by Sherman so I would assume he saw something in him for his version of the power run game. Also, they all have ben reported to have a bit of a mean streak which I should translate well in a power scheme as opposed to a finesse zone scheme. Can't be mean when you're face down on the ground :oops:

[Guiness]

Bugger of a situation. Someone remind me where Jags is now? As far as whether of not we'll go ahead with the current personel, that will be interesting. One of the things scouts look for when drafting linemen is if they have the 'frame' to pack on the extra pounds needed to survive in the NFL...and they may not have been looking for that if they didn't think they needed to put on those pounds in the system they were going to use.

I'm pretty sure Coston is fine in this regard, although I have issues with him in general...

[MJZiggy]

Bugger of a situation. Someone remind me where Jags is now? As far as whether of not we'll go ahead with the current personel, that will be interesting. One of the things scouts look for when drafting linemen is if they have the 'frame' to pack on the extra pounds needed to survive in the NFL...and they may not have been looking for that if they didn't think they needed to put on those pounds in the system they were going to use.

I'm pretty sure Coston is fine in this regard, although I have issues with him in general...

Jags is the new head coach at Boston College.

[Maxie the Taxi]

This is all very disturbing to read and, frankly, doesn't make a lot of sense. If true, it leads me to believe that there was something else at play in Jags abrupt departure. Maybe a disagreement with MM? If true, it puts our drafts of running backs and linemen into question. I don't know if a stud power blocker was available when they drafted Harrell, but if there was why not draft a power offensive lineman instead of Harrell? And why look for a lower tier "one-cut" back if you're leaning away from ZBS? Why not make a stronger effort to draft Lynch or Peterson?

I'm not convinced. MM has made too much of the ZBS. It's hard to believe he's invented some type of hybrid. It will take something in black and white to convince me. Some direct quote from MM or TT.

[retailguy]

Can you scrap your system in the middle of a season? Seems to me we're stuck with it at least in part until they have the opportunity in the offseason to teach the kind of run blocking they want out of the guys...

If these guys don't know how to block in a power gap scheme they should have never been drafted. Almost everyone zone blocks sometimes, and ditto for the rest of the OL schemes.

In this case, we just have to see some evidence that they CAN run block. I don't care, at this point, HOW they run block.... but I still hate the ZBS. I really tried to like it, but I just don't.

[esoxx]

This is all very disturbing to read and, frankly, doesn't make a lot of sense. If true, it leads me to believe that there was something else at play in Jags abrupt departure. Maybe a disagreement with MM?

I don't think it was anything sinister. Jags got the chance to be head coach at a major Divison 1 school and took it. It trumps being an NFL Offensive Line coach. Big promotion.

[RashanGary]

All of our guys are 300 lbs. They're not road graders, but their size should'nt prohibit them from being average run blockers.

The coaching, the size/strength of the lineman and the quality of our backs all contribute. If we had an Adrian Peterson, our run game would look better. If we had Alex Gibbs or even Mike Sherman, our run game would look better. If we had Rivera in his prime and Hutchinson, we'd be better. We have weaknesses in every area that contributes to the run game.


I'm just hopefull that Wynn gets in a better groove after the bye and that they focus of a few things they do well, getting some form of identity. It can get better, but average is looking out of reach for this year.

[KYPack]

This is all very disturbing to read and, frankly, doesn't make a lot of sense. If true, it leads me to believe that there was something else at play in Jags abrupt departure. Maybe a disagreement with MM? If true, it puts our drafts of running backs and linemen into question. I don't know if a stud power blocker was available when they drafted Harrell, but if there was why not draft a power offensive lineman instead of Harrell? And why look for a lower tier "one-cut" back if you're leaning away from ZBS? Why not make a stronger effort to draft Lynch or Peterson?

I'm not convinced. MM has made too much of the ZBS. It's hard to believe he's invented some type of hybrid. It will take something in black and white to convince me. Some direct quote from MM or TT.

Watch tape Max.

We are still zonin' but not the radical scheme used by the Gibbs/ZBS devotees. Our lineman don't turn at a 90 degree angle to the LOS and try to hook people. They are turning at approx a 45 degree angle and shuffling down the line.

The real thing that makes everybody crazy, the backside cut blocks have been pretty much dropped from our repertoire. We don't do it, & I haven't seen it all year. We ain't making that much on the play side, the counters wouldn't be that effective anyhow. Maybe I missed it, but I haven't seen a backside cut block all season. We are running our version of the ZBS, which is far from the Gibbs systems.

Most teams in the league do this, too. KC runs a shuffling form of the zone with very little backside counters. So does Indy and others.

They have adapted what works for their scheme fromn the Gibbs ZBS. The last two zone crazy teams, Denver and ATL ain't doing shit with it anyhow.

[Carolina_Packer]

I thought this was an interesting read about zone blocking.

http://espn.go.com/ncf/columns/davie/1440703.html

[Merlin]

The ZBS can only work if you have the right chemistry of linemen. We have taken two tackles with years of gap and pulling blocking experience and tried to transform them. Clifton and Tauscher aren't small guys and they were never all that fast. Wells performed well in Flanigan's absence in that type of scheme. So Wells is more of a gap pull kind of run blocker. The trouble is we replaced our guards with smaller, quicker guys for the ZBS. That doesn't mean that they can't be good gap pull type guards, it just means they have to unlearn what they have and that remains to be seen.

I personally would like to put the ZBS to bed. It has been detrimental in our selection of running backs and put un-needed stress on the offensive line. Denver is the only team in the NFL to run this type of offense with any sustained success. Atlanta can be discounted because of Vick all those years. If you want to run the ball you need to get the biggest, badest, meanist offensive linemen possible. Then it really doesn't matter who your running back is. Ahman Green proved to be successful no matter the scheme we were running. He was not as successful in the ZBS as Morency was because Morency was used to looking for ZBS holes and not ANY hole. Green cut into whatever hole he found. Most backs can do that and Jackson seems like he would be a better fit for a conventional running game.

[4and12to12and4]

I think the OL is struggling because we have a lot of excellent pass blockers and not enough good run blockers. Colledge certainly wasn't known for his run blocking coming out, and Clifton never was either. Wells is kind of small to hold the point, and the right guard has been a revolving door. Tauscher is solid at everything.

I suspect they'll improve. I also suspect they fatten the boys up this off-season.

Good post. Our tackles are great pass protectors, but their age is starting to show in that area as well, and these young quick ends are harder for them to push around in the run game. Our interior lineman are small, and this has created the mess we have everytime we see a running back trying to figure out where the hell to go. I do believe if we continue to gradually change back to the traditional scheme these smaller, young guns CAN adjust and do well because they are very aggressive and athletic and know how to use leverage very well. I'm sick of watching them diving at peoples feet, that's not their strong suit. They need to get on their guy and use their agility and lower body strength and aggressive nature to get their guy to go where they want them to. I think they are capable, we just need to get a scheme in place and stick with it, and keep a back in there for more than two consecutive games, and we will be fine. I'm glad we are having this problem as we are leading the NFC in wins, because if we get it together and Jackson can get healthy and finish the season with at least 6 or 7 games under his belt, we will be hard to beat in the playoffs, because in the meantime, our passing game is really benefitting from this, as Brett is learning these young guys and that will ultimately help us in crunch time in postseason.

Ruvell needs to get more opportunities. He is a dynamic receiver, will fight for the ball, and I think could emerge as our number one receiver if given the chance. He has the size, speed, hands, athleticism, and tenacity to be a probowl receiver. We need to get him more touches. I like him better than Jennings. He should be our #2 with JJ playing the slot, and also give Koren a chance to prove himself and see how good he can be. We could end up having as good a receiving core as anyone in the league.

[Carolina_Packer]

As far as Mr. Martin goes, I like him too, but are you saying potentially a number 1 receiver? As far as being a number 2 right now, I'm not sure. If his talent were that undeniable, why is he still down on the depth chart? Is the coaching staff missing the boat?

[Guiness]

Good post. Our tackles are great pass protectors, but their age is starting to show in that area as well, and these young quick ends are harder for them to push around in the run game. Our interior lineman are small, and this has created the mess we have everytime we see a running back trying to figure out where the hell to go. I do believe if we continue to gradually change back to the traditional scheme these smaller, young guns CAN adjust and do well because they are very aggressive and athletic and know how to use leverage very well. I'm sick of watching them diving at peoples feet, that's not their strong suit. They need to get on their guy and use their agility and lower body strength and aggressive nature to get their guy to go where they want them to. I think they are capable, we just need to get a scheme in place and stick with it, and keep a back in there for more than two consecutive games, and we will be fine. I'm glad we are having this problem as we are leading the NFC in wins, because if we get it together and Jackson can get healthy and finish the season with at least 6 or 7 games under his belt, we will be hard to beat in the playoffs, because in the meantime, our passing game is really benefitting from this, as Brett is learning these young guys and that will ultimately help us in crunch time in postseason.

Ruvell needs to get more opportunities. He is a dynamic receiver, will fight for the ball, and I think could emerge as our number one receiver if given the chance. He has the size, speed, hands, athleticism, and tenacity to be a probowl receiver. We need to get him more touches. I like him better than Jennings. He should be our #2 with JJ playing the slot, and also give Koren a chance to prove himself and see how good he can be. We could end up having as good a receiving core as anyone in the league.

Re: being sick of them diving at people's feet
When did you see that? That was the point of my original post: I've been watching to see them dive at people's feet, and they aren't doing, and never have, as far as I can tell.

[Patler]

Colledge - 6'4" 305
Wells - 6'2" 295
Spitz - 6'3" 300
Coston - 6'3" 313
Barbre - 6'4" 300
Moll - 6'5" 304

Wahle - 6'6" 304
Flanagan - 6'5" 297
Rivera - 6'4" 307

TT hasn't drafted small linemen, he has tried to draft athletic lineman. Guys with good feet who can move. It shouldn't matter what scheme they are asked to play.

Wahle and Rivera were not good linemen in their second seasons, and Flanagan was on IR. Rivera was not yet a starter. Wahle was in his second season, but lost his starting job in his third season.

At least some of the 6 above should work out long term.

[KYPack]

Colledge - 6'4" 305
Wells - 6'2" 295
Spitz - 6'3" 300
Coston - 6'3" 313
Barbre - 6'4" 300
Moll - 6'5" 304

Wahle - 6'6" 304
Flanagan - 6'5" 297
Rivera - 6'4" 307

TT hasn't drafted small linemen, he has tried to draft athletic lineman. Guys with good feet who can move. It shouldn't matter what scheme they are asked to play.

Wahle and Rivera were not good linemen in their second seasons, and Flanagan was on IR. Rivera was not yet a starter. Wahle was in his second season, but lost his starting job in his third season.

At least some of the 6 above should work out long term.

Wahle and Rivera were terrible their first few years. Wahle was lost at LT and Rivera was one of th worst LG's I've ever seen. Then, they matured and got bigger, stronger, switched positions, etc and became the sainted characters they are now.

I think Colledge will be a good one and btw Moll & Spitz, we'll get another good one. If Barbre can develop, we will have a great line in a few seasons.

It takes time.

[Bretsky]

As far as Mr. Martin goes, I like him too, but are you saying potentially a number 1 receiver? As far as being a number 2 right now, I'm not sure. If his talent were that undeniable, why is he still down on the depth chart? Is the coaching staff missing the boat?


I like Ruvell, but talent wise IMO he's nothing more than a 4/5 WR. He doesn't get open when facing a quality CB in man to man. He had plenty of opportunities in game one with Jennings out; I was at that game and witnessed Phily on our WR's all day. The CB's were like white on rice on him. He has the height, but his route running and speed are just not good enough to be a starter

[pbmax]

I have seen the same plays KYPack has, some old Power Gap stuff and traditional center-guard traps (reminded me of the 70's Steelers, except they weren't as successful :wink: ) This is a cause for concern because as their QB likes to say, they have nothing to hang their hat on. Especially in short yardage.

The size of the lineman is just a small part of run blocking. Remember that according to coaches, the Packers current best run blocker is now on IR (Palmer). Run blocking technique requires different skills (don't make me channel my inner Christl and tell you about waist benders versus knee benders).

Clifton came into the league with a rep as a better pass blocker than run blocker, pretty typical for Left Tackles. Tauscher has never been a road grader in the run game. Each is over 30. Tausch has never been highly mobile. CLifton is great on his feet in pass blocking, but injuries to his pelvis and knee certainly have slowed him down.

Remember last year both M3 and Jags said they had as many problems with the front side blocks as the backside cut. I think both tackles are playing the front side better, but its not lights out on either side.

The youth of the interior line exacerbates the problem as it would have taken time for veterans to learn the system, but we also must wait for the youngsters to mature. And I don't believe any of the interior guys was a better run blocker in college than pass blocker with the possible exception of Spitz who was regarded equally in each area IIRC, and who might be better suited to play center.

If the Wells paraphrase is correct (I think I would have seen something elsewhere about this major change in strategy), then M3 is undoing work the his GM did. Changing horses midstream will set them back farther. Colledge and Coston might be able to do the Wahle role with time, but they have no Rivera or Flanagan and older tackles.

In the end though, M3 will need to run whatever scheme or plays works for these guys, just as Sherman launched U71 in mid-season.

[RashanGary]

I think you guys have some points.

1. The aging, less than stellar run blocking OT's

2. The young interior line

3. The smaller than average, pass pro type lineman

4. The below average RB's


They have some physical and experience limitations to overcome across the board. However, they shouldn't be as bad as they are. I think the biggest problem is the coaching staff bouncing around between schemes, never really finding an identity. Are they zone? Are they power gap? It's hard enough work to do one thing well, but this team seems to be flopping around, doing a little bit of everything and doing none of it well.

I think it's time to look at what guys did best and focus in on whatever it is they think is best. Get an identity. Get a couple bread and butter plays and just do those well first, then add wrinkles.

[Maxie the Taxi]

This is a highly interesting and informative discussion. It's hard to tell from our limited "official" information (i.e., direct quotes from coaching staff) whether ZBS is out of favor.

Apparently, some of us have noticed from the film that our OL are not making cut blocks. However, it doesn't follow from this observation that the coaching staff has abandoned "pure" ZBS scheme. Perhaps, the coaching staff realizes the limitations of the present OL group and has made adjustments pending the acquisition of better personnel and/or more intensive training.

Similarly, because one lineman says the Packer OL is going to phase out cut-blocking doesn't mean that the Packer coaches no longer believe in the Gibbs' style ZBS. Again, the coaches could just be making adjustmens to mesh with the reality of their situation to get them through this season as best they can. We'd alll expect them to do this, kinda of like a half-time adjustment to game conditions.

If indeed MM has given up on the Gibbs' style ZBS scheme, then this is huge news. Our drafts of running backs and offensive linemen, our trades and releases of running backs and linemen were all geared to the ZBS system.

I agree that "size" alone has little bearing on the discussion. However, "size" is just a shorthand. Bigger guys tend to be less athletic and more steamrollerish than smaller guys. Still, no one can deny that some big men are more athletic than others. Some big men are quick on their feet. Some are steam rollers. A 305 lb. guy could be quick or he could be a steamroller or budding steamroller. TT and MM have been emphasizing athletic, quick linemen, not the steamrollers.

They've been emphatic about their backs making one-cut. They sure didn't break their necks getting free agent backs or backs in the draft that were adept at multi-cut, broken field running, i.e., following man on man blocks.

For all these reasons, I'd be shocked if there has been a sea change in blocking philosophy among TT and the coaches. I wouldn't be shocked if they're making adjustments to suit their personnel. I would be super-shocked if the coaches came out mid-season and announced what they're really thinking in a press conference.

So all we can do as fans is sit back and speculate, just like opposing defense coordinators.