JS Packers Blog

[Freak Out]

Justin Harrell hurt? Could be put on IR? B-Jack done?

http://blogs.jsonline.com/packers/archive/2007/10/25/broncos-week-thursday-practice-report.aspx

[Partial]

Boy, those first two picks are looking brutal right now. Who knows how they'll turn out, I have faith in Harrell becoming a great player, but my faith is fading. They both should be solid contributors by this time of the year, and should not get the rookie pass.

I would be interested in knowing whether they think they have more in Morency, Wynn and Grant than Jackson. If so, that is not a good sign.

[Carolina_Packer]

Boy, those first two picks are looking brutal right now. Who knows how they'll turn out, I have faith in Harrell becoming a great player, but my faith is fading. They both should be solid contributors by this time of the year, and should not get the rookie pass.

How about the injury pass? I typically agree with what you say on this forum, but perhaps not about this. If players are hurt and can't play, then they can't perform and contribute. That doesn't mean they are bad players, just players with bad luck. The blog never mentioned anything about Jackson going on IR, but did for Harrell. They might just IR Harrell to free a roster spot, and because they don't need him now.

I don't have DVR's of the game and all that to watch them back, plus, I'm not sure I'd know what I was looking for like some of you, but there seems to be some who say it's the O-line not properly run blocking and some who say it's the running backs dancing at the line of scrimmage and not hitting the hole with authority. Others might say it's a combo. If you took our backs and put them behind an offense line that was skilled at run blocking, I bet they would be more productive. Perhaps our backs do dance, but perhaps there is no clear running lane, unless your vision is special and perhaps our running backs don't have that special vision. McCarthy keeps saying it's a technique/execution issue. I'm not sure if he's talking mostly about the line or the backs.

[MJZiggy]

Even if they DO think that they have more in Morency, Wynn and Grant, IMO that's still OK. You don't hit on every high pick just because they were picked high. What their faith in the other running backs means to me is that they did a GREAT job drafting Wynn and picking up Grant rather than that they did a poor job with Jackson who may heal up and be a good back yet.

[retailguy]

Even if they DO think that they have more in Morency, Wynn and Grant, IMO that's still OK. You don't hit on every high pick just because they were picked high. What their faith in the other running backs means to me is that they did a GREAT job drafting Wynn and picking up Grant rather than that they did a poor job with Jackson who may heal up and be a good back yet.

Is this the "he can do no wrong" defense? :wink:

[Freak Out]

The blog never mentioned anything about Jackson going on IR, but did for Harrell. They might just IR Harrell to free a roster spot, and because they don't need him now.


What got me was that BJ practiced...but only with the practice squad and might be inactive for the Monday game.

[Partial]

That's fair. I think our rushing problem is a combination of both the OL and the backs, paired with a lack of toughness and a lack of technique. From all accounts we hear from coaches, Colledge likes to hit and get nasty. He cannot seem to run block to save his life, though.

As for Harrell going on IR, I would say its kind of a cop out but it is slightly more acceptable since we have so much depth at the position. I remember two years ago when Shawn Merriman looked terrible through the first 8 weeks or so and Peter King called him out in a MMQB article saying he was a bust. From that point on, he played like a man on a mission and started to become the player he is today. I had hopes that we'd see Harrell in the lineup by the start of the season, then half-way-through. Hopefully, they don't put him on the IR so he can get some in-game experience at his new weight and adjust to the speed of the NFL, and if we're very lucky get some playoff experience as well.

The Jackson portion of this story is more interesting to me. He's clearly healthy now and will remain inactive despite Morency and Wynn not being at 100%. That is kind of a scary thought when you're half way through the season. I wish I knew exactly why he is inactive. Is it that the coaches think he is that bad? Or do they really see something in Grant, Wynn or Morency? Or why is it exactly? I have a very hard time believing that they think all three have more potential than BJack. I guess we'll see come Monday who is lacing up, because right now its all speculation.

[MJZiggy]

Even if they DO think that they have more in Morency, Wynn and Grant, IMO that's still OK. You don't hit on every high pick just because they were picked high. What their faith in the other running backs means to me is that they did a GREAT job drafting Wynn and picking up Grant rather than that they did a poor job with Jackson who may heal up and be a good back yet.

Is this the "he can do no wrong" defense? :wink:

No, this is looking at player acquisition as a whole instead of focusing on what round someone was drafted in. I think once you're drafted, that number should go away and your performance on the field should be what you're judged on thereafter. If Wynn and Grant both sucked and Jackson was doing great, I wouldn't care why. I just want SOMEBODY to do SOMETHING. Don't care much which.

[Partial]

Even if they DO think that they have more in Morency, Wynn and Grant, IMO that's still OK. You don't hit on every high pick just because they were picked high. What their faith in the other running backs means to me is that they did a GREAT job drafting Wynn and picking up Grant rather than that they did a poor job with Jackson who may heal up and be a good back yet.

Or they just did an unusually awful job at fortifying the position during the off-season. No way should Jackson not be playing. That is a major, major concern.

[MJZiggy]

I thought Wynn's ypc average was better than everyone was making it out to be...

[Carolina_Packer]

Even if they DO think that they have more in Morency, Wynn and Grant, IMO that's still OK. You don't hit on every high pick just because they were picked high. What their faith in the other running backs means to me is that they did a GREAT job drafting Wynn and picking up Grant rather than that they did a poor job with Jackson who may heal up and be a good back yet.

Or they just did an unusually awful job at fortifying the position during the off-season. No way should Jackson not be playing. That is a major, major concern.

I guess it's all a roll of the dice as to whether you've done enough. If any of these guys had come out and had 500-700 yards right now and been an important, contributing part of the offense, we'd think they were fine, and wouldn't be thinking about the offseason.

I still maintain that it's not just this off-season, but the last few years the position has been left to chance a little bit. We drafted A-Rod to succeed Favre, perhaps drafted Harrell in case we decided not to re-sign Corey Williams (which I think we should), but who did we draft from either the 2005 or 2006 draft to replace Ahman Green (eventually)? Nobody. We went out and got some prospects, but nobody that was going to be that every down back. We added a lot of parts this year when AG didn't re-sign with us, but really where was the contingency planning in case he did't re-sign? We should have been sitting on a RB who was drafted in 2005 who was sitting waiting to take over the load. Maybe that's just me. That's not to dis the current crew, just saying you have to give a RB a longer development cycle with the offense, and you have to draft guys long enough to give yourself chances to succeed at a position over time. I'm not saying draft a RB first round until you hit on one, but two drafts in a row from 2005, 2006 we come up empty and I think it's showing now. We are asking young, inexperienced guys to be good right now.

[MJZiggy]

Don't forget we also needed to draft an o-line, corners to replace the old farts that are tearing WRs to pieces but still, some WR help for DD and a safety. Draft another RB and you sacrifice one of the other positions. Morency or Jackson work out and it's a moot point.

[Fred's Slacks]

Don't forget we also needed to draft an o-line, corners to replace the old farts that are tearing WRs to pieces but still, some WR help for DD and a safety. Draft another RB and you sacrifice one of the other positions. Morency or Jackson work out and it's a moot point.


This is a good point, obviously you can't draft every position every year. It all goes back to the BPA style of drafting. You just keep taking the BPA because you can never be sure which position will wind up being the need. Anyway you do it, you're going to have holes especially in the early years. At least this way you have a better chance of hitting on your picks.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Morency, Grant, and Wynn all have ypc at 4 or higher. I think a part of the problem is the head coach's playcalling. We're 5-1 though, so it's hard to second guess too much.

[Partial]

Don't forget we also needed to draft an o-line, corners to replace the old farts that are tearing WRs to pieces but still, some WR help for DD and a safety. Draft another RB and you sacrifice one of the other positions. Morency or Jackson work out and it's a moot point.


This is a good point, obviously you can't draft every position every year. It all goes back to the BPA style of drafting. You just keep taking the BPA because you can never be sure which position will wind up being the need. Anyway you do it, you're going to have holes especially in the early years. At least this way you have a better chance of hitting on your picks.

Agreed. I think he made the right move taking a shot at Jackson to fortify the position, I am just not sure that Jackson will turn out to be the player TT hoped he would. Can't win 'em all.

[Harlan Huckleby]

What their faith in the other running backs means to me is that they did a GREAT job drafting Wynn and picking up Grant rather than that they did a poor job with Jackson who may heal up and be a good back yet.

You give Ted candy in his stocking for moves that work out, but no lump of coal for high draft picks that look gimpy. "Maybe he'll behave better next year."

You are one generous santa!

[MJZiggy]

I'm simply looking at the performance of the draft (or in this case, group) as a whole without worrying about what round the parts came from. I don't care as long as SOMEBODY is performing. And they are. Not all picks, or FA acquisitions for that matter, work out

[Guiness]

I can't figure out what TT was thinking with the RB situation. Of course, that's probably the way he wants it!

My biggest beef is that he didn't get one of the mid-range FA RB's out there...Henry, Brown, etc. Those guys didn't get big dollars. That points to the thinking that he thought he had his feature back in Morency (which would also explain why he let Green walk). But then he went and spent two of his draft picks, including one premium one, on RBs...which says he thought a replacement was needed. It's a head scratcher for me.

[HarveyWallbangers]

My biggest beef is that he didn't get one of the mid-range FA RB's out there...Henry, Brown, etc. Those guys didn't get big dollars. That points to the thinking that he thought he had his feature back in Morency (which would also explain why he let Green walk). But then he went and spent two of his draft picks, including one premium one, on RBs...which says he thought a replacement was needed. It's a head scratcher for me.

Henry got big dollars. Now, he's likely going to get suspended for a year. Brown had one great game, three crappy ones, and now he's injured again. Ahman has been injured, and hasn't done much when he's been in there.

[Carolina_Packer]

I can't figure out what TT was thinking with the RB situation. Of course, that's probably the way he wants it!

My biggest beef is that he didn't get one of the mid-range FA RB's out there...Henry, Brown, etc. Those guys didn't get big dollars. That points to the thinking that he thought he had his feature back in Morency (which would also explain why he let Green walk). But then he went and spent two of his draft picks, including one premium one, on RBs...which says he thought a replacement was needed. It's a head scratcher for me.

I think he was beginning to turn his attention to RB in last year's draft as a reaction to AG not being re-signed. I always think of BPA and drafting for need as two separate circles that overlap, and never comletely. Was Jackson the BPA in the 2nd round last year? Hmm...Did the Pack have a need for a RB? Yes. Before the draft you had Morency and some raw prospects, so you almost had to address the need in the draft. Again, my point being, you draft Jennings in the 2nd round 2006, and then go after Cory "Gunslinger" Rodgers who busts, and you see someone like Jerious Norwood go to the Falcons in the same round (after Cory Rodgers) when they already have Warrick Dunn. I'm not saying Norwood is awesome, but on a good team, I think he could show some skills. In 2005, and no offense to Terence Murphy, but how cool would it be to have Frank Gore about now? That's the sort of prospecting I'm talking about.

I know you can't address every need, but having a guy like Frank Gore, or possibly Jerious Norwood on a good team, could really spark and offense. I love Gore's determination. I know, woulda, coulda, shoulda. The point is, sprinkle in a talent or two at such an important position as RB and don't be so reactive to bringing in 3 guys in one year. Frank Gore as a Packer in his third year now...whoa!

[MJZiggy]

You'll drive yourself nuts doing that...

[Carolina_Packer]

You'll drive yourself nuts doing that...

You're absolutely right. Nothing anyone can do about it now. I would be a terrible GM for many reasons, including obsessing over picks I could have made. :) The only thing the current regime can do is re-evaluate their approach when it comes to RB, or other positions of need when you look down the road for the team. I agree with others who keep hitting on CB as a need. Sure, we have great CB's, but they are not young anymore, and we need to improve the overall depth. So far we've found serviceable guys through undrafted free agency, and had a little bad luck with draft picks lately. I can see CB being addressed next year. They need more quality depth.

[run pMc]

Wonder if they had BJ on the scout team just to get back into the swing of things and to at least get some carries after sitting out a few weeks.
I wouldn't call Harrell or Jackson a bust yet. They're rookies who haven't played enough. Not every rookie sets the league on fire.
I'd rather TT not put Harrell on IR, I'd think that would make him even more rusty after missing last year.

Thinking about who they could have drafted after the fact is a maddening and futile exercise. The draft is a crapshoot.