JS-""WYNN disputes IR Move""

[Bretsky]

Notes: Wynn disputes IR move
He wants second opinion on injury
By TOM SILVERSTEIN
tsilverstein@journalsentinel.com
Posted: Nov. 8, 2007
Green Bay - Rookie running back DeShawn Wynn said he thinks the nerve injury in his neck and shoulder isn't serious enough for the Green Bay Packers to have put him on injured reserve, but there's not much he can do about it.

Wynn said he disagreed with the doctor's assessment that it would take him until late in the season to recover from the injury, and felt like he could play even as early as this weekend or the next. Wynn plans to get a second opinion on the injury, which the club must pay for under the collective bargaining agreement.

"I didn't feel like it (was season-ending), but I'm no doctor," Wynn said Thursday. "We have such a good year going and when you start it you want to be a part of it until the end. But you have to take it like it is."

Wynn was injured on his only carry of the game against the Denver Broncos on Oct. 29 and did not return. His backup, Ryan Grant, took over and gained 104 yards in 22 carries, prompting coach Mike McCarthy to declare him the starter immediately after the game.

Given Wynn had gone through a series of conditions that kept him off the field, including illness, cramps, thigh and hand injuries, it's logical to think the Packers decided to shut him down and let him work on strengthening his body for next season. Wynn has been attending meetings regularly and is being encouraged to hit the weights as soon as he's healthy.

Asked if he thought the Packers sidelined him because of his many ailments, Wynn said, "You play with injuries, a lot of people in here play with injuries. I don't know."

As a result of landing on injured reserve, Wynn must take a reduced salary for the final nine weeks of the season.

A seventh-round pick, Wynn was forced to accept split salaries in the first two years of the contract, which means if he gets hurt he would receive two-thirds of his base salary.

In this case, his salary will drop from $285,000 to $190,000 during the time that he is on injured reserve. Wynn could file a grievance if he feels the Packers put him on injured reserve prematurely, but it would be for his outright release and not to get his full salary.


Status quo
McCarthy said that he had one-on-one discussions with the guards who are involved in an open competition this week to let them know he's not pleased with their play.

"This is something that has been going on for a couple weeks," McCarthy said.

In practice, McCarthy had Junius Coston, Jason Spitz and Daryn Colledge split snaps at the two guard positions for a second straight day. Coston practiced well, according to offensive coordinator Joe Philbin, but McCarthy said his injured ankle wore down at the end of the workout and his status this week was still up in the air.

McCarthy said he would know more about Coston today. As for the starters, McCarthy will make a decision after he views all the practice tape.


High regard
Minnesota nose tackle Pat Williams has been a parked double-wide in the Packers' rushing lanes each of the last three games, and the coaches have taken time to address their inability to block him.

The Packers aren't alone in not being able to run against the Vikings, who rank No. 2 in the league in the run and have one of the top two tackle tandems in the NFL with Pat and Kevin Williams.

"We've sat down as a staff and watched every run we've run against those guys in the three games since coach McCarthy came here," Philbin said.

"Pat has been a disruptive player. We've addressed it and taken it into account in our scheme and obviously notified our players of our concern of what he's done on the field. And Kevin Williams, obviously, is a heck of a player, too."

Road to recovery
Cornerback Will Blackmon ran on the sideline during practice, but it's still uncertain whether he'll return this season.
Blackmon, who broke his foot in practice five weeks ago, is able to put increased pressure on the foot each week, but before he's cleared to practice medical tests will have to show that he can hold up under the strain.

"He's better this week than he was last week and that's all you can hope for," McCarthy said. "As long as he's making progress we'll keep moving forward. We scanned it Tuesday and he made progress. A lot of it has to do with how he feels."


Short yardage
The Packers added receiver Koren Robinson to the injury report with a sore knee, but he took part in a limited portion of practice.
Vikings receiver Sydney Rice (hamstring) did not practice after having limited participation Wednesday.
Safety Aaron Rouse took part in most of the full pads practice after being sitting out most of it the day before.
Defensive tackle Corey Williams (knee) appeared close to full strength.

[Carolina_Packer]

It is interesting to note that they shut Wynn down as fast as Roger Goodell destroyed the Spygate evidence, which makes it seem somewhat fishy. Also, you have Blackmon with a much more severe injury who has not been IR'd in 5 weeks. It makes you wonder what the reasoning is behind both. Seems on the surface they should have IR'd Blackmon and tried to rehab Wynn. Perhaps this was kind of a final straw this year for Wynn. Funny that Wynn said something like, "you play through injuries"...um, really? Because it seems like you were out of the line-up every other series due to injury. We're not saying you're not tough, we're just saying...

[Bretsky]

It is interesting to note that they shut Wynn down as fast as Roger Goodell destroyed the Spygate evidence, which makes it seem somewhat fishy. Also, you have Blackmon with a much more severe injury who has not been IR'd in 5 weeks. It makes you wonder what the reasoning is behind both. Seems on the surface they should have IR'd Blackmon and tried to rehab Wynn. Perhaps this was kind of a final straw this year for Wynn. Funny that Wynn said something like, "you play through injuries"...um, really? Because it seems like you were out of the line-up every other series due to injury. We're not saying you're not tough, we're just saying...

Some in here noted they could have been frustrated with Wynn's lack of toughness and attitude and this may have been a message as well.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Some in here noted they could have been frustrated with Wynn's lack of toughness and attitude and this may have been a message as well.

These are smug people who know nothing about Wynn's toughness, much less about his attitude. Wynn came in with a bad reputation from college, which gave those who enjoy this sort of thing an excuse to pounce.

Wynn did not miss playing time with injuries he could have played with. He made a good effort to play the last preseason game with no practice and earn a job. And if you look at the other running backs, they have been injured regularly also.

(Many, although not all, of the people dogging Wynn said that Randy Moss was sure to be a cancer this season. Different issue, familiar smugness.)


Given Wynn had gone through a series of conditions that kept him off the field, including illness, cramps, thigh and hand injuries, it's logical to think the Packers decided to shut him down and let him work on strengthening his body for next season.
I can believe he was not ready to play in the NFL, like Justin HArrell. The virus that kept him out last summer is NOTHING he can control, that was his primary "injury". The cramps - I think that was related to poor conditioning. The other minor injuries are just the usual minor setbacks all the backs have.

[Maxie the Taxi]

Nevertheless, Harlan, Wynn is in the same doghouse now as he was most of his time in college.

I suspect it's all about the money...which means it's all about Wynn. I don't think the word "Team" is in his vocabulary. Just my opinion.

[Tarlam!]

HH, I am on record with you as being a Wynn-guy, so "United we stand"!

I am not as vocal as you, cause you're doing such a great job without me!!

We're gonna look plenty sheepish if the guy is a bust, though. :roll:

On the other hand, only two people outside his immediate family will be able to claim "They knew it all along" when he is inducted.

[MJZiggy]

I'm not off the Wynn Wagon yet, Tar. I'm hoping this little adventure pisses him off to the point that he gets himself in killer condition and blows everyone's expectations right out of the water.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Nevertheless, Harlan, Wynn is in the same doghouse now as he was most of his time in college.

McCarthy went out of his way to say Wynn did a good job, and he is NOT in any doghouse. Maybe its BS, but why assume the worst?


I don't think the word "Team" is in his vocabulary.

I've only read postive things about him. There is no evidence to suggest he had a bad attitude.

This is not Walter Payton we're dealing with here, this is a 7th round draft pick. If he had a bad attitude, the Packers would just cut him loose.

[RashanGary]

I like Wynns talent. I thikn it's very possible that he can grow up and be a harder worker than he was in college "allegedly".


I'm going to see how the off season goes. If we read about Wynn "transforming" his body in the off season, I'll start to get my hopes up.

Right now he's a talented player who hasn't reached his potential. We'll see how it develops. I really hope he pans out because I think him reaching his potential can go a long way toward giving ARod a happy beginning to his career.

Jennings, Jones, a TE, an Oline in it's prime and a RB. That's what I hope Rodgers gets. I know it's a lot, but I think young QB's need that to build confidence (like big ben)

[Maxie the Taxi]

Nevertheless, Harlan, Wynn is in the same doghouse now as he was most of his time in college.

McCarthy went out of his way to say Wynn did a good job, and he is NOT in any doghouse. Maybe its BS, but why assume the worst?


I don't think the word "Team" is in his vocabulary.

I've only read postive things about him. There is no evidence to suggest he had a bad attitude.

This is not Walter Payton we're dealing with here, this is a 7th round draft pick. If he had a bad attitude, the Packers would just cut him loose.

Yup, I don't really know, so I shouldn't speculate. I'm just going on his history with the Gators. And his history there wasn't that of the consummate team player like, say, Ryan Grant's was at Notre Dame.

[Harlan Huckleby]

We're gonna look plenty sheepish if the guy is a bust, though. :roll:

A couple months ago, there was a thread that listed (thanks to my infallible memory :D ) all the running backs in Green Bay the last 30 years. It was a :shock: to see how many wannabees have passed through Lambeau. Names that were once so familar and promising. "Chris Darkins" - he's fast, gonna be good. "Jessie Clark". On and on.

Almost every running back is a dud. They last about 2 or 3 years in the league. Grant, Morency, Wynn, Jackson are all likely going to be nothings. For every Dorsey Levens, you get about 10 Darrell Thompsons. . That's my cheery thought for today.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Yup, I don't really know, so I shouldn't speculate. I'm just going on his history with the Gators. And his history there wasn't that of the consummate team player like, say, Ryan Grant's was at Notre Dame.

Well, Ryan Grant has a better chance of having a good attitude and being successful because of his college track record. (that's why he is a 6th round rather than 7th. :) )

I just believe in giving players a fresh start, and not assuming anything without evidence. Seems to have worked with Randy Moss :wink:

[Merlin]

I am not all that surprised. They shut down Herron when his injury was no where near as badn as Morency's. I believe Herron's was a knee scope and out for 3 weeks and Morency missed 6-8 weeks with a patella injury which he is still hampered by.

Maybe this is just a sign of things to come for the Packers. Maybe they are looking towards next season and bringing in other talent to look at during the regular season. Besides Grant though, I don't think we have signed another RB have we? The Wynn move doesn't make any sense with Jackson being banged up and not playing very well and Morency being banged up.

[MadScientist]

Almost every running back is a dud. They last about 2 or 3 years in the league. Grant, Morency, Wynn, Jackson are all likely going to be nothings. For every Dorsey Levens, you get about 10 Darrell Thompsons. . That's my cheery thought for today.
Well we have 4 Darrell Thompsons on the roster now, plus a few others reciently (Gado, Fischer, Davenport, etc), so we should be due for a Levens pretty soon.

[Maxie the Taxi]

Yup, I don't really know, so I shouldn't speculate. I'm just going on his history with the Gators. And his history there wasn't that of the consummate team player like, say, Ryan Grant's was at Notre Dame.

Well, Ryan Grant has a better chance of having a good attitude and being successful because of his college track record. (that's why he is a 6th round rather than 7th. :) )

I just believe in giving players a fresh start, and not assuming anything without evidence. Seems to have worked with Randy Moss :wink:

Moss and TO are cut from the same cloth. As long as they're winning and getting the ball, no problem. If that changes, watch out. They just happen to be on teams where it might not change to much. :)

[Harlan Huckleby]

Well we have 4 Darrell Thompsons on the roster now, plus a few others reciently (Gado, Fischer, Davenport, etc), so we should be due for a Levens pretty soon.

Davenport was a good player in Green Bay who was injured too much. Now he is a good player for Pittsburgh. I'd say Davenport has beat the odds and is having a fine career. One of current 4 mighty midgets could still make it. But they better get another strong candidate next year.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Moss and TO are cut from the same cloth. As long as they're winning and getting the ball, no problem. If that changes, watch out. They just happen to be on teams where it might not change to much. :)

I'd take either of them on the packers.

[mraynrand]

I'd take either of them on the packers. what a shock. The moral relativist strikes again. Standards, what standards. Maybe you could get Denver to cut T Henry so the Pack could reel in that sterling character too.

[Merlin]

I wrote about Moss in the pre-season and what I said then stands now:

If the guy is winning, he isn't a problem.

Not so sure about Owens though, he seemed to whine no matter what.

[Partial]

I wrote about Moss in the pre-season and what I said then stands now:

If the guy is winning, he isn't a problem.

Not so sure about Owens though, he seemed to whine no matter what.

I dunno, Owens is just a bitch in the media. He worked out with Romo every day this off-season to make sure his spirits didn't get down after last years playoff loss. He also called him and talked to him daily.

[Zool]

I wrote about Moss in the pre-season and what I said then stands now:

If the guy is winning, he isn't a problem.

Not so sure about Owens though, he seemed to whine no matter what.

I dunno, Owens is just a bitch in the media. He worked out with Romo every day this off-season to make sure his spirits didn't get down after last years playoff loss. He also called him and talked to him daily.

Does your crush on the NFC East know no boundaries?

[Bretsky]

Some in here noted they could have been frustrated with Wynn's lack of toughness and attitude and this may have been a message as well.

These are smug people who know nothing about Wynn's toughness, much less about his attitude. Wynn came in with a bad reputation from college, which gave those who enjoy this sort of thing an excuse to pounce.

Wynn did not miss playing time with injuries he could have played with. He made a good effort to play the last preseason game with no practice and earn a job. And if you look at the other running backs, they have been injured regularly also.

(Many, although not all, of the people dogging Wynn said that Randy Moss was sure to be a cancer this season. Different issue, familiar smugness.)


Given Wynn had gone through a series of conditions that kept him off the field, including illness, cramps, thigh and hand injuries, it's logical to think the Packers decided to shut him down and let him work on strengthening his body for next season.
I can believe he was not ready to play in the NFL, like Justin HArrell. The virus that kept him out last summer is NOTHING he can control, that was his primary "injury". The cramps - I think that was related to poor conditioning. The other minor injuries are just the usual minor setbacks all the backs have.


Well, you know nothing about Wynn's toughness and attitude either so those smug people could be brilliant for all you know :lol:

[Bretsky]

Nevertheless, Harlan, Wynn is in the same doghouse now as he was most of his time in college.

I suspect it's all about the money...which means it's all about Wynn. I don't think the word "Team" is in his vocabulary. Just my opinion.


Stop using all of that circumstantial past :wink:

[Bretsky]

Yup, I don't really know, so I shouldn't speculate. I'm just going on his history with the Gators. And his history there wasn't that of the consummate team player like, say, Ryan Grant's was at Notre Dame.

Well, Ryan Grant has a better chance of having a good attitude and being successful because of his college track record. (that's why he is a 6th round rather than 7th. :) )

I just believe in giving players a fresh start, and not assuming anything without evidence. Seems to have worked with Randy Moss :wink:


maybe it's his lack of a negative track record in college that makes Grant more appealing :?:

[Bretsky]

Well we have 4 Darrell Thompsons on the roster now, plus a few others reciently (Gado, Fischer, Davenport, etc), so we should be due for a Levens pretty soon.

Davenport was a good player in Green Bay who was injured too much. Now he is a good player for Pittsburgh. I'd say Davenport has beat the odds and is having a fine career. One of current 4 mighty midgets could still make it. But they better get another strong candidate next year.

I still like Da Crapper

[Carolina_Packer]

Well we have 4 Darrell Thompsons on the roster now, plus a few others reciently (Gado, Fischer, Davenport, etc), so we should be due for a Levens pretty soon.

Davenport was a good player in Green Bay who was injured too much. Now he is a good player for Pittsburgh. I'd say Davenport has beat the odds and is having a fine career. One of current 4 mighty midgets could still make it. But they better get another strong candidate next year.

I still like Da Crapper

Bretsky, I've always been partial to 'Davenpoop'

So, since we're talking about Wynn next year, what are his chances of making the club? Better than average if he comes back in great shape?

We're 7-1 now. Let's say we make it to 12-4. That means we'll probably be drafting in the low to mid-20's depending on how we did in the playoffs. So, what position do you see being addressed there in the first round and how does the RB crop look? Who would you target?

I'd be thinking CB or RB.

[oregonpackfan]

Wynn is probably not aware of the severity of a nerve injury to the neck and shoulder area.

Years ago, I tore the brachial plexus nerve in the back of my neck leading to my right shoulder. After hours of painful muscle spasms, I lost 90 % muscle control in my right arm. I did not have the strength to brush my teeth or shave (I am right-handed).

The neurologist who treated me said the torn nerve would heal at just a millimeter a day. It took about 5 months to get complete use of my right arm.

I don't know the full extent of Wynn's nerve injury. I just know it was a long recovery for me.

[Bretsky]

Well we have 4 Darrell Thompsons on the roster now, plus a few others reciently (Gado, Fischer, Davenport, etc), so we should be due for a Levens pretty soon.

Davenport was a good player in Green Bay who was injured too much. Now he is a good player for Pittsburgh. I'd say Davenport has beat the odds and is having a fine career. One of current 4 mighty midgets could still make it. But they better get another strong candidate next year.

I still like Da Crapper

Bretsky, I've always been partial to 'Davenpoop'

So, since we're talking about Wynn next year, what are his chances of making the club? Better than average if he comes back in great shape?

We're 7-1 now. Let's say we make it to 12-4. That means we'll probably be drafting in the low to mid-20's depending on how we did in the playoffs. So, what position do you see being addressed there in the first round and how does the RB crop look? Who would you target?

I'd be thinking CB or RB.


I think it's 50-50 for Wynn.

GB will probably draft a RB high again or maybe even sign one via free agency. Wait, what the H am I saying. We'll draft one high again.

Jackson and Grant are going to make the team; probably Vern Too and the FB.

Wynn will be fighting for his life for a roster spot IMO

[Partial]

I wrote about Moss in the pre-season and what I said then stands now:

If the guy is winning, he isn't a problem.

Not so sure about Owens though, he seemed to whine no matter what.

I dunno, Owens is just a bitch in the media. He worked out with Romo every day this off-season to make sure his spirits didn't get down after last years playoff loss. He also called him and talked to him daily.

Does your crush on the NFC East know no boundaries?

What man-crush?

[b bulldog]

He will struggle to be on next years roster

[Tyrone Bigguns]

I'd take either of them on the packers. what a shock. The moral relativist strikes again. Standards, what standards. Maybe you could get Denver to cut T Henry so the Pack could reel in that sterling character too.

And you'd prefer the high moral guys that Starr had. Yep, i can wrap those winning seasons under Starr around me like a warm blanket. :roll:

The NFL isn't about sterling character. It is about winning. It is a business. Business, as you have mentioned many times isn't about ethics.

[mraynrand]

I'd take either of them on the packers. what a shock. The moral relativist strikes again. Standards, what standards. Maybe you could get Denver to cut T Henry so the Pack could reel in that sterling character too.

And you'd prefer the high moral guys that Starr had. Yep, i can wrap those winning seasons under Starr around me like a warm blanket. :roll:

The NFL isn't about sterling character. It is about winning. It is a business. Business, as you have mentioned many times isn't about ethics.

Nice try. Just because you want to win, doesn't mean you have to put up with poor characters. And selecting for good character without regard to any other factor will get you exactly that - good character guys - who may or may not be good players. But here's the amazing leap you can take (follow carefully here, Ty, I'll go real slow for you) - You can select guys that are good players AND have good character - or at least have that as your aim. I would argue that winning and good business fare better with better characters than bad. And who knows, maybe you can turn around a bad sort. But that doesn't mean you have to embrace bad characters just to win, and you don't have to ignore bad behavior or make excuses. For example, Mark Chumura's behavior was unacceptable (even if he was found innocent of criminal charges) and I would put Moss and T Henry in the same category. I'm guessing that you have a line somewhere that you would draw, and I'd be willing to bet you'd have better reasoning than our morally confused HH. Also, it's interesting but typical that you didn't understand my point about business and ethics - the bigger the business, the more impersonal, the more ethics-free it tends to be (other than the 'economic ethic' of capitalism). Nevertheless, that doesn't prevent some businesses from being 'ethical' as a good business practice - like NBC and Subaru trying to appeal to the Green crowd and other conservationist/environmental stewards who see environmental conservation as a moral goal.

[Scott Campbell]

Business, as you have mentioned many times isn't about ethics.


Well maybe not where your concerned. I'm old school.

[Scott Campbell]

If he had a bad attitude, the Packers would just cut him loose.


Or put him on IR over some bogus hangnail.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Ayn, you've made quite a rousing speech about character. But you forget one detail: Wynn hasn't exhibited any bad character. Neither did Herron when they put him on IR.

Those of you who enjoy believing that Wynn is a bad actor will just do so.
He might be a bad egg for all I know. Who knows what evil lurks within the hearts of men.

[Harlan Huckleby]

If he had a bad attitude, the Packers would just cut him loose.


Or put him on IR over some bogus hangnail.

Rookies can just be cut. Injury settlement is little obstacle, and a non-issue if he recovers quickly.

McCarthy said at his last press conference that he is optimistic about Wynn's future in GB. There is zero reason for him to lie if his true intention is to get rid of him. And there is zero reason for TT to put Wynn on IR if he doesn't want him on the team.

[Guiness]

I tend to agree with OPF's guess that he is hurt worse than he knows.

I just doesn't add up any other way. If it was an attitude problem that the Packers decided was untenable, they'd just cut bait on a 7th round pick.

We're aren't exactly solid at RB, and he WAS the starter 2 weeks ago. Although I'm sure they're happy with what they've seen in Grant, but I'm also guessing they're not 100% convinced he's the long term solution.

Even if you think the Packers are doing this to give him a year to get in shape for the NFL, it doesn't make sense. You do that with a developmental player, who you can afford to do without because you have depth at the position. And you talk to him about it first.

Sorry conspiracy theorists, I'm guessing he's actually hurt.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Business, as you have mentioned many times isn't about ethics.


Well maybe not where your concerned. I'm old school.

You are addressing the wrong guy. Rand said business doesn't have ethics/morality.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

I'd take either of them on the packers. what a shock. The moral relativist strikes again. Standards, what standards. Maybe you could get Denver to cut T Henry so the Pack could reel in that sterling character too.

And you'd prefer the high moral guys that Starr had. Yep, i can wrap those winning seasons under Starr around me like a warm blanket. :roll:

The NFL isn't about sterling character. It is about winning. It is a business. Business, as you have mentioned many times isn't about ethics.

Nice try. Just because you want to win, doesn't mean you have to put up with poor characters. And selecting for good character without regard to any other factor will get you exactly that - good character guys - who may or may not be good players. But here's the amazing leap you can take (follow carefully here, Ty, I'll go real slow for you) - You can select guys that are good players AND have good character - or at least have that as your aim. I would argue that winning and good business fare better with better characters than bad. And who knows, maybe you can turn around a bad sort. But that doesn't mean you have to embrace bad characters just to win, and you don't have to ignore bad behavior or make excuses. For example, Mark Chumura's behavior was unacceptable (even if he was found innocent of criminal charges) and I would put Moss and T Henry in the same category. I'm guessing that you have a line somewhere that you would draw, and I'd be willing to bet you'd have better reasoning than our morally confused HH. Also, it's interesting but typical that you didn't understand my point about business and ethics - the bigger the business, the more impersonal, the more ethics-free it tends to be (other than the 'economic ethic' of capitalism). Nevertheless, that doesn't prevent some businesses from being 'ethical' as a good business practice - like NBC and Subaru trying to appeal to the Green crowd and other conservationist/environmental stewards who see environmental conservation as a moral goal.

Get a grip. These guys are football players. Very few a good characters. If we followed your draft strategy, well, we would be in the basement year in and year out. Your being ridiculous.

Sorry, but you are contradicting your previous statements about business. You said business doesn't have morality. Football is a business. It is about the bottom line..which is winning and making money. And, now, according to your defintion...football only mirrors what you have said. You are pining for the days when the football biz was small. Now that it has grown, it is more impersonal/ethics free.

THAT IS THE ONLY CONCERN OF THE BUSINESS. If a player breaks the law or skirts it then they become a detriment to those stated goals..ie, chewy.

Guess, you feel that our SB win was tarnished..as Favre wasn't exactly a high character guy (vicodin, alcohol, philandering, etc.), Chewy, Wayne Simmons, Rison, etc.

Pretty sure that drinking the night before the super bowl as Max did, isn't exactly a high character move. I can't believe the packers didn't cut Paul Horning...gambling and breaking stated NFL rules doesn't seem like a high character thing to do. Yet, he is revered. Must be quite a moral dilemma for you.

Must be nice to live above us all. Might wanna consider walking among the plebes sometime. You might get a bit dirty, but you might also learn about being HUMAN.

[the_idle_threat]

Must be nice to live above us all. Might wanna consider walking among the plebes sometime. You might get a bit dirty, but you might also learn about being HUMAN.

Irony alert!!!