Sean Taylor Dies after shooting

[Chubbyhubby]

Redskins safety Taylor dead at 24 after being shot in his home
Nov. 27, 2007
CBSSports.com wire reports





MIAMI -- Washington Redskins safety Sean Taylor died early Tuesday, a day after he was shot at home by what police say was an intruder. He was 24.

Family friend Richard Sharpstein said Taylor's father told him the news around 5:30 a.m.

"His father called and said he was with Christ and he cried and thanked me," said Sharpstein, Taylor's former lawyer. "It's a tremendously sad and unnecessary event. He was a wonderful, humble, talented young man, and had a huge life in front of him. Obviously God had other plans."

He said Taylor died early Tuesday at Jackson Memorial Hospital in Miami, where he had been airlifted after the shooting early Monday.

Doctors had been encouraged late Monday when Taylor squeezed a nurse's hand, according to Vinny Cerrato, the Redskins' vice president of football operations. But Sharpstein said he was told Taylor never regained consciousness after being transported to the hospital and that he wasn't sure how he had squeezed the nurse's hand.

"Maybe he was trying to say goodbye or something," Sharpstein said.

Taylor was shot early Monday in the upper leg, damaging an artery and causing significant blood loss.

"According to a preliminary investigation, it appears that the victim was shot inside the home by an intruder," Miami-Dade County police said in a statement.

But police were still investigating the attack, which came just eight days after an intruder was reported at Taylor's home. Officers were dispatched about 1:45 a.m. Monday after Taylor's girlfriend called 911.

Sharpstein said Taylor's girlfriend told him the couple was awakened by loud noises, and Taylor grabbed a machete he keeps in the bedroom for protection. Someone then broke through the bedroom door and fired two shots, one missing and one hitting Taylor, Sharpstein said. Taylor's 1-year-old daughter, Jackie, was also in the house, but neither she nor Taylor's girlfriend were injured.

Police found signs of forced entry, but have not determined if they were caused Monday, or the previous burglary.

The shooting happened in the pale yellow house he bought two years ago in the Miami suburb of Palmetto Bay. Eight days before the attack someone pried open a front window, rifled through drawers and left a kitchen knife on a bed at Taylor's home, according to police.

"They're really sifting through that incident and today's incident," Miami-Dade Detective Mario Rachid said, "to see if there's any correlation."

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Born April 1, 1983, Taylor starred as a running back and defensive back at Gulliver Preparatory School in Miami. His father, Pedro Taylor, is police chief of Florida City.

A private man with a small inner circle, Taylor rarely granted interviews. But, behind the scenes, Taylor was described as personable and smart -- an emerging locker room leader.

Especially since the birth of his daughter.

"From the first day I met him, from then to now, it's just like night and day," Redskins receiver James Thrash said. "He's really got his head on his shoulders and has been doing really well as far as just being a man. It's been awesome to see that growth."

An All-American at the University of Miami, Taylor was drafted by the Redskins as the fifth overall selection in 2004. Coach Joe Gibbs called it "one of the most researched things" he'd ever done, but the problems soon began. Taylor fired his agent, then skipped part of the NFL's mandatory rookie symposium, drawing a $25,000 fine. Driving home late from a party during the season, he was pulled over and charged with drunken driving. The case was dismissed in court, but by then it had become a months-long distraction for the team.

Taylor also was fined at least seven times for late hits, uniform violations and other infractions over his first three seasons, including a $17,000 penalty for spitting in the face of Tampa Bay running back Michael Pittman during a playoff game in January 2006.

Meanwhile, Taylor endured a yearlong legal battle after he was accused in 2005 of brandishing a gun at a man during a fight over allegedly stolen all-terrain vehicles near Taylor's home. He eventually pleaded no contest to two misdemeanors and was sentenced to 18 months' probation.

Taylor said the end of the assault case was like "a gray cloud" being lifted. It was also around the time that Jackie was born, and teammates noticed a change.

"It's hard to expect a man to grow up overnight," said Redskins teammate and close friend Clinton Portis, who also played with Taylor at the University of Miami. "But ever since he had his child, it was like a new Sean, and everybody around here knew it. He was always smiling, always happy, always talking about his child."

On the field, Taylor's play was often erratic. Assistant coach Gregg Williams frequently called Taylor the best athlete he'd ever coached, but nearly every big play was mitigated by a blown assignment. Taylor led the NFL in missed tackles in 2006 yet made the Pro Bowl because of his reputation as one of the hardest hitters in the league.

This year, however, Taylor was allowed to play a true free safety position, using his speed and power to chase down passes and crush would-be receivers. His five interceptions tie for the league lead in the NFC, even though he missed the last two games because of a sprained knee.

"I just take this job very seriously," Taylor said in a rare group interview during training camp. "It's almost like, you play a kid's game for a king's ransom. And if you don't take it serious enough, eventually one day you're going to say, 'Oh, I could have done this, I could have done that.'

"So I just say, 'I'm healthy right now, I'm going into my fourth year, and why not do the best that I can?' And that's whatever it is, whether it's eating right or training myself right, whether it's studying harder, whatever I can do to better myself."

His hard work was well-noted.

"He loved football. He felt like that's what he was made to do," Gibbs said. "And I think what I've noticed over the last year and a half ... is he matured. I think his baby had a huge impact on him. There was a real growing up in his life."

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My prayers are for his family and the Redskins

[MTPackerfan]

that is terrible news. How sad. :(

[FritzDontBlitz]

We were actually discussing - well, more like heatedly debating - this in another thread since it happened yesterday:

http://www.packerrats.com/ratchat/viewtopic.php?t=9725

[oregonpackfan]

Tragic is the first word I can think of in describing this incident.

[MJZiggy]

Funny, stupid is the first word that comes to my mind. Tragic is a plane crash or falling off a cliff. This is some idiot with a gun. Things like this should never happen.

[The Leaper]

Funny, stupid is the first word that comes to my mind. Tragic is a plane crash or falling off a cliff. This is some idiot with a gun. Things like this should never happen.

Well, it is tragic for Taylor and his family...especially that little child. It isn't every day that you wake up at 2am to someone busting into your bedroom looking to shoot you.

The person responsible for this is more than stupid...they are evil. Like that Ivy League prof who admitted to killing his wife over NOTHING, just a petty argument over travel arrangements. I can understand some killings, even if I could never condone them. This is simply senseless.

[MJZiggy]

The person responsible for this is more than stupid...they are evil.

Agreed absolutely.

[BF4MVP]

Terrible, terrible news. My prayers go out to Sean and his family. From what I have read about him, even though he had his problems, he was improving as a person and was definitely coming into his own as a football player. He had a good life and a good career ahead of him..It's terrible that someone took it away from him.

[packers11]

I'm speechless... thats such bad luck... Getting shot in the leg is usually not a serious case, but I guess the bullet did a lot of damage to the artery...

R.I.P. one of the best safety's today will be missed...

[Tyrone Bigguns]

I'm speechless... thats such bad luck... Getting shot in the leg is usually not a serious case, but I guess the bullet did a lot of damage to the artery...

R.I.P. one of the best safety's today will be missed...

Your femoral artery is your main artery of the leg.

Any time you hit an artery your life is in danger.

[LL2]

It's a shame that this happened to someone so young with so much life ahead. It's also a shame this happens all over the country to innocent people that have so much life to live, like Baby Grace, every day.

[OS PA]

This is just a horrible situation. It was really sad to read the ESPN article that talked about the leading cause of death in young black males being homicide.

[FritzDontBlitz]

Very nice sig, os pa.

[OS PA]

Very nice sig, os pa.

I'm borrowing it from Packfan_n_Md :(

[Tarlam!]

First that kid in Denver, now this. I am absolutely devestated for the families.

Obviously, at least to me, these were not random shootings.

It seems impossible for these outstanding athletes to leave their roots behind. Pure speculation and no facts to support my opinion.

[MateoInMex]

I was a big fan of Sean Taylor. He was a helluva football player, he loved to hit people on the field.

I was hoping the Packers or Dolphins would have had a chance at drafting him when he came out.

Hopefully the thug(s) that did this will be brought to justice. Having read that Taylor's home had experienced problems with burglars and home invaders before, it was unclear (at least when I read the stories) if he had some type of security service.

One of the questions asked by Trey Wingo to John Clayton from ESPN NFL LIVE was if the league has incorporated home security issues to NFL players during training sessions.

It should be addressed. Recently there seems to have been a rise in reported robberies involving pro athletes. Antoine Walker, Eddy Curry and even Stephon Marbury I believe.

Once some athletes become stars in pro sports, they immediately become targets. This happened at his home, not a club after a brawl. And it wasn't the first time.

It's a sad story.

[GBRulz]

First that kid in Denver, now this. I am absolutely devestated for the families.

Obviously, at least to me, these were not random shootings.

It seems impossible for these outstanding athletes to leave their roots behind. Pure speculation and no facts to support my opinion.

My thoughts exactly.

[Tarlam!]

wrong thread

[MateoInMex]

Tarlam,

Just curious of what you meant by the being unable to leave roots behind comment. (were you referring to Taylor's other run-ins with the law or just this specific incident?)

Like myself, I have no idea other than the police are saying it's a homicide from a home invasion.

I'm sure the police are immediately looking at any suspects that have targeted his home before.

[Tarlam!]

Tarlam,

Just curious of what you meant by the being unable to leave roots behind comment.

Well, it's the "milleau". These kids, especially African-Americans grow up in the 'hood. It follows them around.

The Deion Sanders of the world, or the Reggie Bushes are seemingly rare.

In no way do I suggest fault with the athlete.

[MateoInMex]

Gotcha.

Although he has had some personal problems in the past, he has had trouble with people trying to break into his home before. The other thread on here mentioned a 2005 incident with some ATV's, and not even 10 days ago, his GF called police to report a burglary.


It seems that someone was continuously targeting Sean Taylor. Those incidents jump out at me, makes me wonder with Taylor's fame and noteriety if there was adequate security at his home.

[Charles Woodson]

My theory has changed a decent amount

I do think that he was targeted. The sad thing though is that he had changed alot. All i hear is that when his daughter was born, he became a better person. It is tragic for anyone to die, but especially some one who was such an amazing football player. This is what i found on his legal troubles.



Legal trouble
DUI arrest

On October 27, 2004, Taylor was arrested at 2:45am for allegedly driving under the influence of alcohol following a birthday party for former Redskins' receiver Rod Gardner.[10] A Fairfax County, Virginia judge later acquitted Taylor of the charges in March 2005, after viewing a videotape of Taylor's roadside sobriety tests that, according to the judge, failed to demonstrate obvious intoxication. Taylor was, however, convicted for refusing to take a blood alcohol test requested of him by a Virginia state police officer.[11] However, when this case was heard on appeal in March 2005, Taylor was acquitted of refusing to take a BAC test, due to lack of probable cause for the request.[12]
Missing 2005 Redskins mini-camp

In May, 2005, Taylor, seeking a new contract with the Redskins, was the only Redskin who refused to appear for a Redskins' training mini-camp. Redskins coach Joe Gibbs acknowledged that the Redskins had had no contact with Taylor since he returned to Miami in January, 2005, and that he had failed to return repeated phone calls to him by Gibbs and other Redskins' coaching staff. Despite his legal and other difficulties, though, Gibbs has defended the drafting of Taylor, calling the preparation that went into his selection one of the "most researched things in the history of sports".[citation needed]

Taylor's agent was fellow University of Miami alumnus Drew Rosenhaus, widely considered one of the most aggressive agents then representing NFL players.[13] Rosenhaus represented Taylor in his efforts to renegotiate his Redskins' contract up until his death.[citation needed]
Arrested for armed assault

Events:

* On June 3, 2005, Taylor was named publicly as a "person of interest" by Miami-Dade County police in regard to a Miami assault case involving firearms, and was being sought for questioning. "We need to speak to him, we don't know if he's a victim, witness or suspect," Miami-Dade police spokesman Mary Walters said. Taylor allegedly was present at, and possibly involved in, an incident on June 1, 2005 in Miami, in which bullets allegedly were fired into a stolen vehicle. [citation needed]

* On June 5, 2005, ESPN and The Miami Herald both reported that Taylor, accompanied by his lawyer, surrendered to Miami-Dade police at approximately 10pm ET on June 4 at Miami's Cutler Ridge district police station, where he was transported to Miami's Turner Guilford Knight correctional facility. He was charged with aggravated assault with a firearm, a felony, and misdemeanor battery.[citation needed]

* On June 5, Miami-Dade police issued a statement indicating that Taylor had been arrested for aggravated assault with a firearm (a felony) and battery (a misdemeanor), for allegedly pointing a gun at a person over a dispute over two ATVs that Taylor claimed were stolen.[citation needed] Taylor then allegedly left the scene, but returned shortly and punched one person.[citation needed]

* The Associated Press reported on June 5 that Taylor was held in detention at Miami's Turner Gilford Knight correctional facility and released the evening of June 4 after posting bond of $16,500. The Miami-Dade County Clerk's Office announced that Taylor would soon be officially arraigned on the charges.[citation needed]

* The Washington Post reported on March 3, 2006 that Taylor's trial has been postponed until April 10, 2006. Days before that date, the trial was moved back once more, this time by a week, because of conflicts with Passover and Easter celebrations.[citation needed]

Plea agreement and resolution

On January 28, 2006, the Miami-Dade County prosecutor announced that he was filing new charges against Taylor, which would have increased his potential maximum jail time from 16 years to 46 years.[citation needed]

The new charges include increasing his felony assault charges from one to three, which reflects the allegation that, on June 1, 2005, he brandished a firearm at three individuals who Taylor believed stole two all-terrain vehicles from him.[citation needed]

The trial was again postponed on April 17, 2006 (to May 8, 2006), after the prosecutor in the case asked the presiding judge to be removed from the case. The County prosecutor's request for removal from the case came as Taylor's defense lawyers argued that the prosecutor was using the case to promote his side-work as a disc jockey in South Beach. Defense lawyers for Taylor entered a motion for the case's complete dismissal, due to prosecutorial misconduct.[citation needed]

On May 8, 2006, the prosecution requested and received another extension of the case, citing the new prosecutor assigned to the case and a need for additional preparation time. The trial was scheduled to begin July 10, 2006 in Miami but on June 2, 2006 the charges against Taylor were dropped as part of a negotiated plea bargain. Taylor donated his time to various charities and made $1,000 donations to 10 southern Florida schools in scholarships and, in exchange, will avoid jail time and a felony record.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Tarlam,

Just curious of what you meant by the being unable to leave roots behind comment.

Well, it's the "milleau". These kids, especially African-Americans grow up in the 'hood. It follows them around.

The Deion Sanders of the world, or the Reggie Bushes are seemingly rare.

In no way do I suggest fault with the athlete.

It is kinda funny you would say Deion as he grew up in a the country ghetto.

Taylor's father is chief of police and went to private school.

Why do you (not you specifically) think people think Taylor grew up in a hood?

[MateoInMex]

Yea,

Although there are thousands of home invasions anywhere in the country in any given year, I'm not sure I agree with Tarlam's violence follows people from the 'hood comment.

It looks more and more that Taylor was a target, not because of the color of his skin, or where he was from, but because he was famous w/money.



d;o)

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Yea,

Although there are thousands of home invasions anywhere in the country in any given year, I'm not sure I agree with Tarlam's violence follows people from the 'hood comment.

It looks more and more that Taylor was a target, not because of the color of his skin, or where he was from, but because he was famous w/money.



d;o)

I agree with that. They might not even have known it was him. Decent house in decent neighborhood.

And, if they did know it was him, might have thought he was not in town as he shoulda been playing for the skins. Unless they really pay attention to what is going on.

[FritzDontBlitz]

In the Miami Herald's article about this tragedy there seems to be some discrepancy about who's vehicle was actually shot at and by whom. The article posted to this thread suggests, based on the chronological order of the events it reported (not the poster of the article, the article itself) that Taylor is the one who did the shooting. Yet, if you read the article from today's Miami-Herald, you will find this paragraph:


ASSAULT CASE

He was arrested in June 2005 on felony charges of waving a gun at people he believed had stolen his all-terrain vehicle. He later pleaded no contest to misdemeanor assault and battery. Sharpstein said Taylor was the victim and that he should not have been charged.

After the plea, Ryan Lee Hill, a member of the group that Taylor had allegedly accosted, sued Taylor. In the suit, which is pending, Hill claimed Taylor hit him repeatedly in a fight and brandished a gun at him, and said he had lost wages and had medical bills because of injuries.

''Totally garbage and untrue,'' Sharpstein said Monday of Hill's account.

After the fight, Taylor, friend Michael McFarlane and a man named Charles Caughman went to McFarlane's house in West Perrine, according to court records of the incident. Soon afterward, a silver car pulled up to McFarlane's house and someone opened fire, peppering Taylor's GMC Yukon Denali with bullets. Police found 27 bullet casings outside, and at least 15 shots hit Taylor's car. No one was hit, and the shooting remains unsolved.

McFarlane has since moved out of the small ranch home on Southwest 104th Avenue. The current renter on Monday showed a visitor bullet holes that remain over a front window.

http://www.miamiherald.com/606/story/322222.html

The Miami-Herald article states that the SUV shot at was in fact Taylor's.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

In the Miami Herald's article about this tragedy there seems to be some discrepancy about who's vehicle was actually shot at and by whom. The article posted to this thread suggests, based on the chronological order of the events it reported (not the poster of the article, the article itself) that Taylor is the one who did the shooting. Yet, if you read the article from today's Miami-Herald, you will find this paragraph:


ASSAULT CASE

He was arrested in June 2005 on felony charges of waving a gun at people he believed had stolen his all-terrain vehicle. He later pleaded no contest to misdemeanor assault and battery. Sharpstein said Taylor was the victim and that he should not have been charged.

After the plea, Ryan Lee Hill, a member of the group that Taylor had allegedly accosted, sued Taylor. In the suit, which is pending, Hill claimed Taylor hit him repeatedly in a fight and brandished a gun at him, and said he had lost wages and had medical bills because of injuries.

''Totally garbage and untrue,'' Sharpstein said Monday of Hill's account.

After the fight, Taylor, friend Michael McFarlane and a man named Charles Caughman went to McFarlane's house in West Perrine, according to court records of the incident. Soon afterward, a silver car pulled up to McFarlane's house and someone opened fire, peppering Taylor's GMC Yukon Denali with bullets. Police found 27 bullet casings outside, and at least 15 shots hit Taylor's car. No one was hit, and the shooting remains unsolved.

McFarlane has since moved out of the small ranch home on Southwest 104th Avenue. The current renter on Monday showed a visitor bullet holes that remain over a front window.

http://www.miamiherald.com/606/story/322222.html

The Miami-Herald article states that the SUV shot at was in fact Taylor's.

I'd always heard it was his, but driven/used by a friend.

[Charles Woodson]

Tarlam,

Just curious of what you meant by the being unable to leave roots behind comment.

Well, it's the "milleau". These kids, especially African-Americans grow up in the 'hood. It follows them around.

The Deion Sanders of the world, or the Reggie Bushes are seemingly rare.

In no way do I suggest fault with the athlete.

It is kinda funny you would say Deion as he grew up in a the country ghetto.

Taylor's father is chief of police and went to private school.

Why do you (not you specifically) think people think Taylor grew up in a hood?

Alright granted Gulliver is not the hood, it is far from a good school... They recruit all of there athletes(even though its illegal in Florida), they use to be a rival school of mine, but have gone up a few classes. But back to the main subject. Gulliver is far from good. Drugs, achohal, the normal. Last year some kids were expelled because they were selling drugs to kids at different schools. Killian on the other hand is a bad school in general. Its a large very large school (i think its public but not sure) But honestly i dont remember why this has anything to do with it. The answer is that Taylor may not have grown up in the hood, but he may have been hanging around with those type of people

[Bossman641]

Such a sad story. It is just crazy to think that 6-7 weeks ago he was all over the field at Lambeau. He had really stepped up his game this year and, from everything I've read, had really become a better person as well. What a shame.

[DannoMac21]

This is a real shame. It bothered me all day today. I went to bed last night thinking he was going to be fine. So sad.

But I do think this is fishy in some kind of way. Why would he get "robbed" but they didn't take anything. Obviously the knife placed in his bed 8 days before was some kind of "warning". Maybe the girlfriend had something to do with it? I just think it's weird.

[wpony]

this sounds like it was a home invasion pure and simple a very terrible tragedy , what I don't understand is why a machete its like the old joke of being so dumb some one would bring a knife to a gun fight if he thought he was in such danger why didn't he have gun instead of a knife it sounds like the guys were not there to kill him but he ran down there and chased them with it and they fired back at him if he had just hollered from, the bed room that he had called the police he would probably be here today.
the NFL lost a great safety but even worst a infant lost a father RIP.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Tarlam,

Just curious of what you meant by the being unable to leave roots behind comment.

Well, it's the "milleau". These kids, especially African-Americans grow up in the 'hood. It follows them around.

The Deion Sanders of the world, or the Reggie Bushes are seemingly rare.

In no way do I suggest fault with the athlete.

It is kinda funny you would say Deion as he grew up in a the country ghetto.

Taylor's father is chief of police and went to private school.

Why do you (not you specifically) think people think Taylor grew up in a hood?

Alright granted Gulliver is not the hood, it is far from a good school... They recruit all of there athletes(even though its illegal in Florida), they use to be a rival school of mine, but have gone up a few classes. But back to the main subject. Gulliver is far from good. Drugs, achohal, the normal. Last year some kids were expelled because they were selling drugs to kids at different schools. Killian on the other hand is a bad school in general. Its a large very large school (i think its public but not sure) But honestly i dont remember why this has anything to do with it. The answer is that Taylor may not have grown up in the hood, but he may have been hanging around with those type of people


Gulliver sounds like just about every other school in america. Drugs, alcohol, etc. I attended a suburban miltown school that had a drug/alcohol rep and we were also considered a top academic as well. Often drugs/al are found at the best schools. Rich kids love to party.

My thought wasn't that it was the greatest, but that it was far from being a ghetto school. Also, it is the automatic mindset that a black athlete lived/grew up in the ghetto.

Almost all private schools recruit. Even some public schools as well.

[Rastak]

this sounds like it was a home invasion pure and simple a very terrible tragedy , what I don't understand is why a machete its like the old joke of being so dumb some one would bring a knife to a gun fight if he thought he was in such danger why didn't he have gun instead of a knife it sounds like the guys were not there to kill him but he ran down there and chased them with it and they fired back at him if he had just hollered from, the bed room that he had called the police he would probably be here today.
the NFL lost a great safety but even worst a infant lost a father RIP.


Acording to his girlfriend he didn't confront the intruder with the knife. He locked the door, then grabbed the knife as a weapon of last resort....they kicked in the door then he was gunned down. I didn;t hear any account whatsoever he chased anyone anywhere. He was murdered in cold blood if what we hear is true.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

this sounds like it was a home invasion pure and simple a very terrible tragedy , what I don't understand is why a machete its like the old joke of being so dumb some one would bring a knife to a gun fight if he thought he was in such danger why didn't he have gun instead of a knife it sounds like the guys were not there to kill him but he ran down there and chased them with it and they fired back at him if he had just hollered from, the bed room that he had called the police he would probably be here today.
the NFL lost a great safety but even worst a infant lost a father RIP.


Acording to his girlfriend he didn't confront the intruder with the knife. He locked the door, then grabbed the knife as a weapon of last resort....they kicked in the door then he was gunned down. I didn;t hear any account whatsoever he chased anyone anywhere. He was murdered in cold blood if what we hear is true.

well, then it sounds even more like he was targeted. Sad.

Guns: prolly cause he had problems with them in the past (brandishing). So, maybe he was trying to fly right and not have any guns at all.

[The Leaper]

What I don't understand is why you would sleep with a machete...but refuse to turn on your security alarm.

I know they mentioned he had relatives coming in and out frequently...but can't you give them the code? Were his relatives too dumb to operate a security system?

Something so simple as that...it is truly puzzling.

[Rastak]

What I don't understand is why you would sleep with a machete...but refuse to turn on your security alarm.

I know they mentioned he had relatives coming in and out frequently...but can't you give them the code? Were his relatives too dumb to operate a security system?

Something so simple as that...it is truly puzzling.


His girl friend said he grabbed it from under his bed. Police said the security system was turned off. Very strange given the odd break-in a week before. Very strange, very sad.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

What I don't understand is why you would sleep with a machete...but refuse to turn on your security alarm.

I know they mentioned he had relatives coming in and out frequently...but can't you give them the code? Were his relatives too dumb to operate a security system?

Something so simple as that...it is truly puzzling.

Machete: He didn't sleep with it. It was under/near his bed. Same as having a gun in your night table. Or a bat in the room.

Code: Many people don't activate them when they are home. Surprising? I dunno know. Think how many people have their cars stolen by quickly running in and leaving the keys in the ignition.

Maybe the relative forget.

[Rastak]

What I don't understand is why you would sleep with a machete...but refuse to turn on your security alarm.

I know they mentioned he had relatives coming in and out frequently...but can't you give them the code? Were his relatives too dumb to operate a security system?

Something so simple as that...it is truly puzzling.

Machete: He didn't sleep with it. It was under/near his bed. Same as having a gun in your night table. Or a bat in the room.

Code: Many people don't activate them when they are home. Surprising? I dunno know. Think how many people have their cars stolen by quickly running in and leaving the keys in the ignition.

Maybe the relative forget.


I NEVER EVER EVER do that. But yea, remmember when Jim Fassel had his car stolen doing that then he called his cell phone which he left on the front seat and the dude mocked him. Funny as hell....unlike the story this thread is about.

[Rastak]

Take it for what it's worth but Antrel Rolle seems to think he knows who did it......I heard the same theory on NFL Network during discussions between Deion Sanders and Jamie Dukes.



ANTREL ROLLE SAYS TAYLOR WAS KILLED BY FORMER FRIEND by Michael David Smith

We noted yesterday that there is talk in league circles that Redskins safety Sean Taylor was murdered by a former friend.

Today Cardinals cornerback Antrel Rolle, who has known Taylor since they were small children and who played with Taylor at the University of Miami, said that is his belief.

"This was not the first incident," Rolle said, per the Associated Press. "They've been targeting him for three years now."

"They say it was a burglary. It absolutely was not a burglary," Rolle continued. "Down South, where we're from, there were many people talking to Sean, a lot of jealousy, a lot of angry people.

"Sean, he had a large group of friends, and he no longer hung out with those friends, so you never know where this came from."

Rolle's suspicion seems to contradict what Miami police spokesman Robert Parker said today. Parker said police believe Taylor's killing was "more like a random event," adding, "We have no reason to think this was anything other than a burglary or a robbery involving an intruder."

[The Leaper]

Code: Many people don't activate them when they are home. Surprising? I dunno know.

I agree that wouldn't be surprising normally...people get lazy. However, as Ras mentioned, in the context of the house just being broken into the previous week, it is very surprising. With that fresh in your mind, how can you sleep without knowing that alarm is active?

[MJZiggy]

I thought I read something about them having house guests that hadn't come in yet.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Code: Many people don't activate them when they are home. Surprising? I dunno know.

I agree that wouldn't be surprising normally...people get lazy. However, as Ras mentioned, in the context of the house just being broken into the previous week, it is very surprising. With that fresh in your mind, how can you sleep without knowing that alarm is active?

That is a good point. Somebody told me the knife from the previous breakin was left on his pillow. That would have me sleeping in the closet..or moving outta town.

What i can't figure out is if it was a hit as rolle suggests, then why only one bullet in him. I'd think they'd tap him a few times to make sure.

Yet, the police say it wasn't a targetted attack, just a burglary.

[Partial]

Agreed on the 1 bullet thing. If it was a hit their would be:

A) More bullets
B) In the chest

[Freak Out]

I heard he was shot twice in the leg.....like someone was sending a message?

[packers11]

I heard he was shot twice in the leg.....like someone was sending a message?

Ya thats what I was thinking too when I heard it... If he intended to kill Taylor he would have unloaded, but shooting someone in the leg means a) he didn't want to kill him b) he has a really bad shot...

Ill go with option a... (there is no proof, this is just what I think)...

[MadtownPacker]

Hey Bigguns...

Your lil biotch ass crying about racism and all that other who-hah BS was for nothing. A. Rolle from the cardinals was on NFLN saying that this was NO BURGLARY and there where several haters after Taylor. He even went so far as to say Taylor was "scared" when he was down in Miami. This is a guy who knows him from Miami.

Im sure you will come back with some long weak ass rant but the truth is coming out. You trying to belittle others opinions and trying to make them look like racist was pretty pathetic in hindsight. Taylor was in with some bad folks. I believe he was trying to change but I can tell you from personal experience that sometimes people wont let you change. They want to hold others back and I think that was the case here.

Now be a man and admit you where wrong.

[GrnBay007]

FloridaToday.com....

He was arrested in June 2005 on felony charges of waving a gun at people he believed had stolen his all-terrain vehicle. He later pleaded no contest to misdemeanor assault and battery. Sharpstein said Taylor was the victim and that he should not have been charged. After the plea, Ryan Lee Hill, a member of the group that Taylor had allegedly accosted, sued Taylor. In the suit, which is pending, Hill claimed Taylor hit him repeatedly in a fight and brandished a gun at him, and said he had lost wages and had medical bills because of injuries. "Totally garbage and untrue," Sharpstein said Monday of Hill's account. After the fight, Taylor, friend Michael McFarlane and a man named Charles Caughman went to McFarlane's house in West Perrine, according to court records of the incident. Soon afterward, a silver car pulled up to McFarlane's house and someone opened fire, peppering Taylor's GMC Yukon Denali with bullets. Police found 27 bullet casings outside, and at least 15 shots hit Taylor's car. No one was hit, and the shooting remains unsolved. McFarlane has since moved out of the small ranch home on Southwest 104th Avenue. The current renter on Monday showed a visitor bullet holes that remain over a front window.

Taylor's cousin, Florida State University safety Anthony Leon, said Taylor was trying to shed some troublemaking friends he had grown up with. Leon, who said he spent his morning crying and praying in his dorm room, said Taylor had "started to calm down." "He's been trying to stay away from bad company -- especially for his daughter's sake," Leon said. "Sean wasn't a bad guy at all. He's got his personality on the football field and off it. All he was trying to do was protect his family. And they shot him."

[HarveyWallbangers]

Kind of strange that Taylor hung with the wrong crowd, but his Dad was a police chief.

[MJZiggy]

I think it's the same concept as preachers' kids being the wildest...

[HarveyWallbangers]

I think it's the same concept as preachers' kids being the wildest...

That's the stereotype, but generally I don't think that's necessarily the case. See Michael Redd and many others.

[MJZiggy]

I don't know that it's necessarily a stereotype as it's not attributed broadly and incorrectly, but I think the concept is that if they are gonna rebel, they have something strict to rebel against so they really do it. The ones that don't rebel, just don't.

[GrnBay007]

I guess you never know and can't predict. Look at different stories you've heard from some NFL players that Dad was in prison and Mom was a drug addict and they grew up and are living what many consider to be the American dream and very productive, law-abiding citizens. Goes to show you it's not wise to judge based on one's family. I have a friend that is a probation officer and he was a great father when his kids were growing up...always attending all the school functions, coached them in baseball, took his boys on camping/fishing trips and now when his son is a Senior in HS the kid is in all kinds of trouble. I feel bad for the guy. He feels like a failure as a father and I don't believe that's the case at all. Sometimes "the apple doesn't fall far from the tree" doesn't always apply.

[wpony]

If this is true that it is a former friend I hope he gets the maximum they can give him, The loss here is devastating and will affect lives for years to come if there is any truth to this his wife should move to a safe place maybe in another state. the focus should focus on protecting her and finding the killer even if there is any truth to this.

[The Leaper]

What i can't figure out is if it was a hit as rolle suggests, then why only one bullet in him. I'd think they'd tap him a few times to make sure.

Well, if it was a former friend who wanted to send a message...it was likely that they might not have been looking to flat out kill him. I wouldn't expect this to be a professional hit. I was thinking it was more like some thugs who weren't happy Taylor wanted out of their buddy system...the kind who pump 15 shots into an SUV and can't hit anything.

[The Leaper]

Yet, the police say it wasn't a targetted attack, just a burglary.

This surprises me too. How do the police know with CERTAINTY at this point either way? Do they know who did it? Do they know if that person had ties to Taylor?

It seems odd that people in charge are making pronouncements like that before they have anyone in custody.

[Fritz]

Well, don't forget that at times the police deliberately feed mis-information to the public in order to help move the investigation along.

[GBRulz]

I went out to lunch today with one of my best friends, who is dating a guy that is very good friends with a couple of the players (Packers). The talk in the locker room is that in the past, Sean was messing around with someone's wife and this hit was to send a message, not kill him. Judging by the general area of where the bullet hit, it kind of does make sense.

Take this however you want, but I believe my friend and her bf when they told me that Bubba's exact words were "nigger sleeps with another niggers wife, nigger gets shot."

[Freak Out]

I went out to lunch today with one of my best friends, who is dating a guy that is very good friends with a couple of the players (Packers). The talk in the locker room is that in the past, Sean was messing around with someone's wife and this hit was to send a message, not kill him. Judging by the general area of where the bullet hit, it kind of does make sense.

Take this however you want, but I believe my friend and her bf when they told me that Bubba's exact words were "nigger sleeps with another niggers wife, nigger gets shot."

Damn.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Hey Bigguns...

Your lil biotch ass crying about racism and all that other who-hah BS was for nothing. A. Rolle from the cardinals was on NFLN saying that this was NO BURGLARY and there where several haters after Taylor. He even went so far as to say Taylor was "scared" when he was down in Miami. This is a guy who knows him from Miami.

Im sure you will come back with some long weak ass rant but the truth is coming out. You trying to belittle others opinions and trying to make them look like racist was pretty pathetic in hindsight. Taylor was in with some bad folks. I believe he was trying to change but I can tell you from personal experience that sometimes people wont let you change. They want to hold others back and I think that was the case here.

Now be a man and admit you where wrong.

If you saw Rolle's interview, he said it was former "friends" that he was distancing himself from. rolle didn't say one thing about him being involved in anything nefarious.

rolle, at this point is the only one saying this. Where are the rest of the people saying this.

But, are you going to believe Rolle who hasn't been in contact with him much, by his own admission, or Ryan Clark his best friend or the po po.

My point was that let the truth come out. Why leap to judgement. And, if rolle is wrong...you are going to look like a fool for this rant.

And, as i pointed out, if it was a hit, why only one shot...that isn't what thugs who wanna take you out do. One shot hardly is a death certainty.

And, if he felt he was in danger, why would he be in miami after someone left a knife on the bed? Was the knife left there by accident? Or was it a message? If it was a message, why didn't act scared and put himself outta danger?

All i ever said, was let's wait for more information.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Well, don't forget that at times the police deliberately feed mis-information to the public in order to help move the investigation along.

I rarely have heard of misinformation..usually they withhold key information. that way they let people incriminate themselves or those that give them "private" info can be vetted.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Mad,

Will you be apologizing if the 3 suspects being detained (and, i'm not saying they did it because the po po grab people all the time) are found to have committed the crime strictly because Taylor was rich.

Targetted because he is rich. That ain't the same as targetted cause he was involved in bad activities.

[MadtownPacker]

Shut the hell up man. Read Taylor's mother's comments. She aint buying it, why should we?


Taylor's mother on Thursday said she has her own ideas about the death of her son but prefers to keep them to herself and let the police investigation play out.

"It's very hard to say," said Donna Junor. "But I have some thoughts in my mind."

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Shut the hell up man. Read Taylor's mother's comments. She aint buying it, why should we?


Taylor's mother on Thursday said she has her own ideas about the death of her son but prefers to keep them to herself and let the police investigation play out.

"It's very hard to say," said Donna Junor. "But I have some thoughts in my mind."

Oh, now taylor's mom is your source.

Why should we..because they are the police. I see, we should be rolle, thousands of miles away and who hasn't had contact in quite awhile and his mom. Make me laugh.

Well, now they have 4 arrested. And, they have more than ONE confession. All tween the ages of 18-21. Not expecting him to be home.

Again, I ask, will you be apologizing and admitting I was right to withhold judgement of the man. IF THESE FOUR DID IT. Again, i repeat, this could all be trumped up by the police...often they rush to arrest people when they are under pressure.

And, for the rest of the junior dectectives...this is why you don't rush to judgement.

Who is going to man up and admit they rushed to judgement?

[MadtownPacker]

Oh, now taylor's mom is your source.

Why should we..because they are the police. I see, we should be rolle, thousands of miles away and who hasn't had contact in quite awhile and his mom. Make me laugh.

Well, now they have 4 arrested. And, they have more than ONE confession. All tween the ages of 18-21. Not expecting him to be home.

Again, I ask, will you be apologizing and admitting I was right to withhold judgement of the man. IF THESE FOUR DID IT. Again, i repeat, this could all be trumped up by the police...often they rush to arrest people when they are under pressure.

And, for the rest of the junior dectectives...this is why you don't rush to judgement.

Who is going to man up and admit they rushed to judgement?Sorry puto but I have yet to meet a cop I can really trust. They are just a legalized gang in many cases. When I was growing up and one of the homies got into some shit, his Momma always knew the truth way before the cops did. We knew to ask her about it.

As for apologizing to you, why the hell would I do that? Holding judgement is YOUR choice but it doesn't make you RIGHT. It just means you where too much a lil bitch to put your opinion out there for fear you might be WRONG. Guess not being right would kill you huh? Typical of your type of person.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Oh, now taylor's mom is your source.

Why should we..because they are the police. I see, we should be rolle, thousands of miles away and who hasn't had contact in quite awhile and his mom. Make me laugh.

Well, now they have 4 arrested. And, they have more than ONE confession. All tween the ages of 18-21. Not expecting him to be home.

Again, I ask, will you be apologizing and admitting I was right to withhold judgement of the man. IF THESE FOUR DID IT. Again, i repeat, this could all be trumped up by the police...often they rush to arrest people when they are under pressure.

And, for the rest of the junior dectectives...this is why you don't rush to judgement.

Who is going to man up and admit they rushed to judgement?Sorry puto but I have yet to meet a cop I can really trust. They are just a legalized gang in many cases. When I was growing up and one of the homies got into some shit, his Momma always knew the truth way before the cops did. We knew to ask her about it.

As for apologizing to you, why the hell would I do that? Holding judgement is YOUR choice but it doesn't make you RIGHT. It just means you where too much a lil bitch to put your opinion out there for fear you might be WRONG. Guess not being right would kill you huh? Typical of your type of person.

I agree on the police.

I did put my opinion out there. I put out that those calling him a thug and saying his death was a related to his past behavior was reprehensible and way premature. I never thought he was a bad guy at all. DUI and not being a good employee doesn't make him a thug in my book. Brandishing a gun...again, not thug. Not smart, but in miami/the south, carrying a gun is pretty common.

The fact remains that I was right. I was right about him, and i was right not to speculate, and right not to play junior detective, right not to think that I could figure things out based on scant information. And, those that did, some of there assumptions were very racially based. Assuming he was a thug. From the ghetto. Doing bad things. Yet, none of those were true.

You've seen my posts..you think i'm afraid to put my ass on the line. Get serious.

And, i was right about the internet, etc. Madtown, you will notice that i don't comment on things i don't know about. Discussions of chipsets, cars, stereos, how to build things, hdtv's, etc...I know nothing about..so i say nothing. But, you can bet when i speak on something i have a bit of knowledge or experience in that realm. I'm not saying i'm always right, but i'm not just wildly speculating. If you or others don't like that or the tone i take..well, i could say to bad..or i can work on that. But, you best listen and give pause.

I don't have a problem with you not manning up..you just piled on. Perhaps, next time you will hesitate to do so, especially in regards to me. And, you won't be so quick to base your assumptions on some idiot like Rolle or his mom. Mom. LOL. Have the time mom's think their son's are angels..and have no idea of what is really going on.

[GrnBay007]

I did put my opinion out there. I put out that those calling him a thug and saying his death was a related to his past behavior was reprehensible and way premature. I never thought he was a bad guy at all. DUI and not being a good employee doesn't make him a thug in my book. Brandishing a gun...again, not thug. Not smart, but in miami/the south, carrying a gun is pretty common.

LOL I'm sorry, how many people carry a handgun for protection ONLY?? Some, sure..but they are usually involved in law enforcement. Thugs, or wanna be thugs carry handguns.




The fact remains that I was right. I was right about him, and i was right not to speculate, and right not to play junior detective, right not to think that I could figure things out based on scant information. And, those that did, some of there assumptions were very racially based. Assuming he was a thug. From the ghetto. Doing bad things. Yet, none of those were true.

I'm glad you feel you were right about so much. But guess what.....even you will never know all the details so to state you were RIGHT in all your statements and speculations is BS. I know someone that took a wrap for armed robbery because of gang affiliation. He was guilty of the crime but surely could have gotten a "deal" with a plea bargain had he talked. The point is nobody knows all the details and to go on and on about how right you are is silly.

And, last but not least.....I saw nothing in anyone's opinion, speculation or anything else that was racially based. If you saw that, you were reading into stuff.

[MOBB DEEP]

soooooo many folks have NO CLUE!!! pretty good 007

[MOBB DEEP]

I think it's the same concept as preachers' kids being the wildest...

That's the stereotype, but generally I don't think that's necessarily the case. See Michael Redd and many others.



i know right...??!!

[MadtownPacker]

Mobb where you been player????

Preach on!!! :D

[The Leaper]

At this point, it appears this is the result of some highly inexperienced kids trying to rob a rich guy. Some things still don't add up to me, and hopefully the truth eventually comes to light. If these guys were certain no one was home, why were the phone lines cut? That doesn't add up. Who informed them Taylor was "rich"? What precisely was the conversation in that instance? Did someone try to get these kids to rob him on purpose? What about the prior robbery? Does that have any connection with these 4 guys who have been arrested?

It doesn't seem he was targeted personally at this point, although he does seem to have been targeted for being a rich guy who wasn't home a lot. There still be a whole lot more that comes out about this. Hopefully, it will tie up some of the loose ends.

[MadtownPacker]

I just don't get why some kids would break down his door to put a bullet in him. No $$$ to be made doing that.

Unless that is what they where really getting paid for. :?: And of course they aint gonna say that once caught if they like breathing. So much easier to confess it was a robbery gone bad.

[KYPack]

At this point, it appears this is the result of some highly inexperienced kids trying to rob a rich guy. Some things still don't add up to me, and hopefully the truth eventually comes to light. If these guys were certain no one was home, why were the phone lines cut? That doesn't add up. Who informed them Taylor was "rich"? What precisely was the conversation in that instance? Did someone try to get these kids to rob him on purpose? What about the prior robbery? Does that have any connection with these 4 guys who have been arrested?

It doesn't seem he was targeted personally at this point, although he does seem to have been targeted for being a rich guy who wasn't home a lot. There still be a whole lot more that comes out about this. Hopefully, it will tie up some of the loose ends.

Taylor's sister tossed a party at the place a few weeks ago. Evidently, some of the kids that robbed the joint knew Taylor's sister and the scuttlebutt from the party was the genisis of the heist.

I think it really was a tragic fuck-up.

Some of the facts that came out early made me think it was payback, but i think that idea is wrong, now.

These youngbloods are just plain runni' wild.

[MadtownPacker]

The fact remains that I was right. I was right about him, and i was right not to speculate, and right not to play junior detective, right not to think that I could figure things out based on scant information. And, those that did, some of there assumptions were very racially based. Assuming he was a thug. From the ghetto. Doing bad things. Yet, none of those were true.

You've seen my posts..you think i'm afraid to put my ass on the line. Get serious.

And, i was right about the internet, etc. Madtown, you will notice that i don't comment on things i don't know about. Discussions of chipsets, cars, stereos, how to build things, hdtv's, etc...I know nothing about..so i say nothing. But, you can bet when i speak on something i have a bit of knowledge or experience in that realm. I'm not saying i'm always right, but i'm not just wildly speculating. If you or others don't like that or the tone i take..well, i could say to bad..or i can work on that. But, you best listen and give pause.

I don't have a problem with you not manning up..you just piled on. Perhaps, next time you will hesitate to do so, especially in regards to me. And, you won't be so quick to base your assumptions on some idiot like Rolle or his mom. Mom. LOL. Have the time mom's think their son's are angels..and have no idea of what is really going on.Sorry that people based things on their assumptions. Maybe next time I can just post "100% agree" while quoting your post and we won't have that problem.

When all is said and done I might say you where right but no one is avoiding "manning up". Looking like you are right. But if that changes you might consider "manning up" yourself.

Save the "piling on" cry. Comes off like you displaying weakness. Then I will lose respect for you like I have for Harlan. If the situations applies I will do the same thing that I did this time regardless of if it is you or not.

[Scott Campbell]

Then I will lose respect for you like I have for Harlan.


You had respect for Harlan?

[Jimx29]

To honor slain Taylor, Redskins use 10 men on first Bills play


http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-rememberingtaylor&prov=ap&type=lgns

[packers11]

To honor slain Taylor, Redskins use 10 men on first Bills play


http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-rememberingtaylor&prov=ap&type=lgns

Yea I saw that, to bad the stupid Bills ran right to were Taylor was "supposed" to be... They should have done a draw, or a short pass... I thought it was pretty classless of the Bills...

On the other hand, that was very nice of the Redskins to do that... It probably meant a lot to the family...

[Pacopete4]

see.. thats where ur wrong, the bills are out there fighting for the playoffs as are the skins.. yes, a player died and its horrible that its happened.. but those bills still have to play the game

[MJZiggy]

To honor slain Taylor, Redskins use 10 men on first Bills play


http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-rememberingtaylor&prov=ap&type=lgns

Yea I saw that, to bad the stupid Bills ran right to were Taylor was "supposed" to be... They should have done a draw, or a short pass... I thought it was pretty classless of the Bills...

On the other hand, that was very nice of the Redskins to do that... It probably meant a lot to the family...

http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d804b87d0

[Tyrone Bigguns]

I did put my opinion out there. I put out that those calling him a thug and saying his death was a related to his past behavior was reprehensible and way premature. I never thought he was a bad guy at all. DUI and not being a good employee doesn't make him a thug in my book. Brandishing a gun...again, not thug. Not smart, but in miami/the south, carrying a gun is pretty common.

LOL I'm sorry, how many people carry a handgun for protection ONLY?? Some, sure..but they are usually involved in law enforcement. Thugs, or wanna be thugs carry handguns.




The fact remains that I was right. I was right about him, and i was right not to speculate, and right not to play junior detective, right not to think that I could figure things out based on scant information. And, those that did, some of there assumptions were very racially based. Assuming he was a thug. From the ghetto. Doing bad things. Yet, none of those were true.

I'm glad you feel you were right about so much. But guess what.....even you will never know all the details so to state you were RIGHT in all your statements and speculations is BS. I know someone that took a wrap for armed robbery because of gang affiliation. He was guilty of the crime but surely could have gotten a "deal" with a plea bargain had he talked. The point is nobody knows all the details and to go on and on about how right you are is silly.

And, last but not least.....I saw nothing in anyone's opinion, speculation or anything else that was racially based. If you saw that, you were reading into stuff.

You are kidding yourself about carrying a gun. In the south, it is more common to have one than not. I was always looked upon strangely that I didn't have one..even at my house.

My ex-wife grandfather always had one in his car. Just to "show" people that he was serious.

Thugs: wrong. plenty of people carry guns. Ask the NRA.

Right: I never went on. Mad and others piled on when i said he wasn't a thug, that we had no proof of his wrong doing, etc.

You saw: That doesn't mean anything. Often white people aren't even aware of the prejudice/racial overtones that they are giving off. I talk with good folks all the time who casually say things like, "he tried to jew me down." Yet, they don't think there is anything wrong with that statement..and, don't really have a negative feeling about jews. yet, that is a very poor thing to state, perpetuates a negative stereotype, etc.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

The fact remains that I was right. I was right about him, and i was right not to speculate, and right not to play junior detective, right not to think that I could figure things out based on scant information. And, those that did, some of there assumptions were very racially based. Assuming he was a thug. From the ghetto. Doing bad things. Yet, none of those were true.

You've seen my posts..you think i'm afraid to put my ass on the line. Get serious.

And, i was right about the internet, etc. Madtown, you will notice that i don't comment on things i don't know about. Discussions of chipsets, cars, stereos, how to build things, hdtv's, etc...I know nothing about..so i say nothing. But, you can bet when i speak on something i have a bit of knowledge or experience in that realm. I'm not saying i'm always right, but i'm not just wildly speculating. If you or others don't like that or the tone i take..well, i could say to bad..or i can work on that. But, you best listen and give pause.

I don't have a problem with you not manning up..you just piled on. Perhaps, next time you will hesitate to do so, especially in regards to me. And, you won't be so quick to base your assumptions on some idiot like Rolle or his mom. Mom. LOL. Have the time mom's think their son's are angels..and have no idea of what is really going on.Sorry that people based things on their assumptions. Maybe next time I can just post "100% agree" while quoting your post and we won't have that problem.

When all is said and done I might say you where right but no one is avoiding "manning up". Looking like you are right. But if that changes you might consider "manning up" yourself.

Save the "piling on" cry. Comes off like you displaying weakness. Then I will lose respect for you like I have for Harlan. If the situations applies I will do the same thing that I did this time regardless of if it is you or not.

Perhaps people should think about their assumptions and why they have them. That is my point. Most of their assumptions were way off.

Manning up: Be glad to. As you have read, i'm more than willing to accept that the police have rushed and arrested 4 black men. Wow. that is shocking..guess they couldn't finds some illegal mexicans to blame. I have very little trust in them as well.

Piling on: I'm not saying i'm weak. I'm forgiving you as you didn't initiate. I'm just advising that you think before you pile on. Wouldn't want you to lose any more credibility..if that is possible.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

At this point, it appears this is the result of some highly inexperienced kids trying to rob a rich guy. Some things still don't add up to me, and hopefully the truth eventually comes to light. If these guys were certain no one was home, why were the phone lines cut? That doesn't add up. Who informed them Taylor was "rich"? What precisely was the conversation in that instance? Did someone try to get these kids to rob him on purpose? What about the prior robbery? Does that have any connection with these 4 guys who have been arrested?

It doesn't seem he was targeted personally at this point, although he does seem to have been targeted for being a rich guy who wasn't home a lot. There still be a whole lot more that comes out about this. Hopefully, it will tie up some of the loose ends.

Leaper,

I think by now you've prolly read more, and have answered some of your questions.

But, i posted this in another thread, thought this might give you something to think about.

But, let me give you a scenario that could lead up to the crime. Let's say 3 of them know about Taylor's pad. They are out, smoking/drinking/etc..who knows. They run into a 4th person. They are driving around, they are near Taylor's neighborhood, they start talking about Taylor's sweet pad. Now, those 3 may have not even been thinking about a crime. The 4th guy, who is more in tune with committing crimes..or just thinking about it..starts inquiring about the pad..and before you know it has talked about how easy it is to rob it. Voila. Robbery ensues.

All this tragedy can start with practically nothing.

[the_idle_threat]

You are kidding yourself about carrying a gun. In the south, it is more common to have one than not. I was always looked upon strangely that I didn't have one..even at my house.

My ex-wife grandfather always had one in his car. Just to "show" people that he was serious.

Thugs: wrong. plenty of people carry guns. Ask the NRA.


Tyrone is right about this one. Plenty of ordinary people---many of them NRA members---carry a gun or have one in the car for protection, at least occasionally. :whist:

In states where concealed carry licenses are available, people get them so that the possession is legal. Where concealed carry licenses are not available (like in Wisconsin) people carry anyway, or put one under the car seat anyway, if they're going to be in dangerous places. Certain areas of Milwaukee---some not far from where I live---qualify as such "dangerous places."

The old cliche goes: "I'd rather be judged by twelve than carried by six."

And in several instances I can recall here in Wisconsin, otherwise law-abiding people have used illegally-concealed handguns to defend themselves and they were not charged at all by the D.A.

In one recent case, a pizza delivery driver actually was charged by the Milwaukee D.A. for violating the statewide concealed carry ban. After shooting an armed robber in self defense, he was told it was a justified shooting, but got a warning that he should stop carrying a gun so that he could be a sitting duck for future criminals, er I mean so that he would be in compliance with the law. He complied, and was promptly robbed a second time. The armed criminal beat him up pretty bad. He started carrying again, and was robbed at gunpoint a third time. He shot the criminal. The D.A. ruled it a justified shooting, but charged him this time under the concealed carry law, because a warning had already been given. The judge threw out the charges because the driver "clearly" needed the gun for self defense. The D.A. didn't appeal.

[Badgerinmaine]

To honor slain Taylor, Redskins use 10 men on first Bills play


http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-rememberingtaylor&prov=ap&type=lgns

I've never seen anything like that before, and I thought it was a classy thing for the Redskins to do.