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motife
12-18-2007, 09:31 PM
Super Mario, others get Pro Bowl cold shoulder
By Len Pasquarelli

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=pasquarelli_len&id=3160443

Twenty months ago, on the evening in which the Houston Texans chose defensive end Mario Williams over tailback Reggie Bush with the first overall selection in the 2006 draft, I suggested the franchise should think about turning over such critical decisions to Mr. Magoo, who might actually demonstrate a little more foresight.

But on Tuesday night, with the taste of crow still fresh on my palate, I find myself wondering just who in the league, and in the voting public, are really the most nearsighted. Because during a year in which Blooper Mario has transformed into Super Mario, collecting the second-most sacks (13) in the league, the Texans' second-year end ranks among the most notable Pro Bowl oversights.

Place the emerging star right up there with Green Bay cornerback Charles Woodson, who is enjoying a defensive player of the year kind of season; running back Fred Taylor of the Jacksonville Jaguars; and Pittsburgh's 3-4 inside linebacker James Farrior among the guys who have a legitimate beef over not being chosen for the conference all-star squads that were announced Tuesday.

To be sure, the annual Pro Bowl vote has always been a popularity contest -- this old hack has been around long enough to have witnessed players visiting opponents' locker rooms after games to lobby for votes and barter for trips "across the water," as the hippest players now say -- and the interactive age has made it considerably more so. But at a time when there is so much data available on players that we all suffer from information overload, it's difficult to believe that not enough people paid attention to Williams.

Although this has become a day when it's fashionable to parse the Pro Bowl rosters and make knee-jerk reactions to the selections, I'm not fond of using the term snub to describe worthy players not chosen for a game that many of them consider meaningless anyway. Roster limits always mean that deserving players are going to be excluded. And it is difficult to argue that most of the players elected don't belong.

Plus, given the salary levels in the league, even players making the minimums can afford a vacation to Hawaii, so it's not as if they are going to miss out on the opportunity to visit the islands.

But in contract negotiations, teams generically refer to Pro Bowl selections as honors for a reason. And while some players come up with reasons to eschew appearing in the game, it still means something to win a Pro Bowl invitation. It certainly would've meant something to Williams' reputation to add Pro Bowler to his résumé, especially after a rookie season in which so many people, yours truly included, viewed him as a bust.

For the most part, the people who do the Pro Bowl voting get things right. This year, they got it wrong, especially as it pertains to Williams, who is coming off a dominant 3½-sack performance in Thursday win over Denver.

Other oversights:

• Choosing cornerback Al Harris of Green Bay, one of the NFL's best pure coverage players and the kind of physical edge player in the secondary every team would love to have, was an inspired selection. The 10-year veteran has been slighted for way too long. But Harris, one-half of the NFL's best tandem, is only the second-best cornerback on his own team.

Woodson, a gifted two-way defender, is having a brilliant year. He supports the run as well as any cornerback in the NFL, has four interceptions and 10 passes defensed, and also returns punts. Terence Newman of Dallas is a superb player, but he missed two full games and four starts because of a knee injury.

Taylor is the 18th-leading rusher in NFL history and, at age 31, is having one of his best seasons. And the guy has never been to a Pro Bowl game. In fact, the Jaguars' star is the only player among the top 49 rushers in NFL history never to appear in a Pro Bowl contest.

Taylor is averaging 5.1 yards per carry, second best in the league among runners with more than 200 carries, and tops in his conference. If he had as many carries as Pittsburgh's Willie Parker, he would lead the league in rushing by more than 300 yards.

• Taylor isn't the only deserving Jacksonville player not going to the game. In fact, it wasn't exactly a good year for the three Florida-based teams, as they combined to send just one player, Miami defensive end Jason Taylor, to Hawaii. The Jaguars and the Bucs have 19 victories between them, and zero Pro Bowl players. Hard to figure why a pair of Bucs defenders -- strong safety Jermaine Phillips and middle linebacker Barrett Ruud -- didn't merit more consideration. Or why Jags left guard Vince Manuwai, a powerful in-line blocker, wasn't picked.

• On the subject of guards, Cleveland's Eric Steinbach, Chris Snee of the New York Giants and Jahri Evans of New Orleans probably deserved Pro Bowl nods. Evans is the best player on a Saints line that has surrendered the fewest sacks in the NFL. Steinbach helps form one of the best left sides in the league, and the Browns are averaging nearly five yards per carry on plays that are run behind him.

• One of my pet peeves remains that the Pro Bowl balloting should differentiate between left and right offensive tackles, because they are truly disparate positions. Once again all six tackles chosen for the game play the left side.

Yes, it has been a brutal season for right tackles league-wide, and the position definitely is a problem area in general in the NFL right now. But Jordan Gross of Carolina has been a bright spot in the Panthers' otherwise dismal season, having surrendered only one sack, and probably deserves a nod.

And if the voters are going to choose all left tackles, at least pick guys who are having good seasons. Jonathan Ogden of Baltimore is going to the Hall of Fame, but he shouldn't be going to an 11th Pro Bowl, given that a chronic toe problem has dropped his performance level. Michael Roos of Tennessee or Cleveland rookie Joe Thomas would have been a better selection.

• All three of the outside linebackers on the AFC squad, and four of the six overall, play in 3-4 fronts. And all of them are very deserving of their selections. But the voters once again ignored 3-4 inside 'backers, most notably Farrior, who has 84 tackles and a career-best six sacks, but who remains excellent in pass coverage as well. And there are no pure 3-4 defensive ends, either, meaning that Darnell Dockett of Arizona, a former 4-3 tackle, was shut out.

• A Steelers defender who did make the AFC squad, but who probably would concede he has not had the production of past years, is strong safety Troy Polamalu, who has missed time because of a knee injury. Arguably a better pick would have been Kerry Rhodes of the New York Jets. And on the NFC side, O.J. Atogwe of St. Louis, who is second in the NFL with seven interceptions, merited stronger support.

Patler
12-19-2007, 07:31 AM
Mario Williams was not an oversight.

Through the first nine games he had 23 tackles and 4 sacks. That's not a Pro Bowl performance. They had their bye in week 10 and he has since come back a different player. In the five games since the bye he has 30 tackles and 9 sacks, far exceeding his performance in the first nine games.

He certainly wasn't on the fan's radar before their voting ended, nor probably even the coaches or players who faced him the first nine weeks. His impressive numbers have come too recently to have merited consideration before the votes ended.

He'll be there next year if the last 5 games truly show the type of player he is.

Badgerinmaine
12-19-2007, 07:58 AM
I was listening to the national Mike and Mike in the Morning show on ESPN radio today; Mike Golic (an old d-lineman himself) thought Williams was the worst omission from the Pro Bowl (Mike Greenberg chose Fred Taylor).

Patler
12-19-2007, 08:48 AM
I was listening to the national Mike and Mike in the Morning show on ESPN radio today; Mike Golic (an old d-lineman himself) thought Williams was the worst omission from the Pro Bowl (Mike Greenberg chose Fred Taylor).

If you look at stats and performance as of right now, I might agree. But if you look at when he achieved it, too much occurred after fans voted. Players and coaches who played him the first nine games were likely not impressed, so they wouldn't vote for him either. It was simply a matter of timing. He has had 20 tackles and 7 sacks in just the last 3 games. I'm not sure when fan voting ended, and its not like they all voted the last day either.

On December 1, after 11 games, he had 33 tackles and 6 sacks. Is that a Pro Bowl performance? That is basically the time period he was evaluated on, not the last three games.

If he had not had 3.5 sacks in the last game, which was after all voting was done, I wonder if anyone would even be mentioning him. He had 9.5 sacks going into that game, which was good, but not outstanding.

His last 5 games have been outstanding, but it probably came too late to impact the voting. Pretty impressive, though. He could be a headache for O-linemen for years.

Patler
12-19-2007, 08:51 AM
This brings up another question, why do they end voting so early? It would seem you could let the players vote the last week of the season, and let fan voting end after the last game. When the season is only 16 games, it would seem they would want to include as much of it as possible.

Williams would have had a much better chance in a couple weeks, I think.

packinpatland
12-19-2007, 10:20 AM
I asked this same question on another post.
I'm no fan of Urlacher, but he had a great game against the Vikes..........but it was after the voting.
I also think it's a distraction of sorts......why not wait till all the games in regular season are over?

MJZiggy
12-19-2007, 10:27 AM
The only reason I can think of is that they need that much time to make arrangements for the players to be there--to find out who's going and who's decided not to and make flight, hotel and car arrangements etc. Then again, you'd think that the few weeks between the first week of January and the 2nd week of February would be long enough to do that...

packers11
12-19-2007, 10:59 AM
My Snubs :

Urlacher or Barnett > Willis ... : Wtf he only has a lot of tackles because that defense is so poor, don't get me wrong, hes great for a rookie, but he isn't even playing close to Barnett's level...

Woodson > Newman ... Sure, you can say that Harris covers the #1 receiver, but we all know what happened when Woodson was out with an injury... This guy is playing the best football and Newman has been out for 3-4 games... My guess is that its very hard for two players on the same team on the SAME position to get in...

Anyone > Jason Taylor ... He is having an average season at DE and on a team with 1 friken win... I don't get the logic...

Fred Taylor > Addai ... Hes average 4.9 yards a carry and is a force in the backfield...


I can understand why Woodson is a reserve, but I am still lost on Barnett...

Spaulding
12-19-2007, 11:09 AM
Goes back to the fact that most sports fans which love almost everything about football (i.e. each game meaning something, mostly played outdoors, salary caps, revenue sharing, etc.) show apathy to the Pro Bowl.

When you really think about it, what is good about the Pro Bowl? Unless a player has incentives in their contract or are concerned about their valued perception, it's a week in a nice place that they can afford to do anytime they like in the off season. Not to mention a potential beating to their bodies when they likely haven't played in a while.

A better bet would be let the most informed people (coaches and players) decide and also possibly have each player sponsor a fan (hopefully a child) and then bring them and their family to Hawaii to watch. Imagine the thrill that would bring to somebody that would otherwise potentially never make it to Hawaii let alone being in the presence of their favorite player.

ND72
12-19-2007, 11:14 AM
Pro bowl becomes a fraternity. Once you're in, you're kind of locked there unless you do nothing (Urlacher). Barnett was the biggest snub in the NFC, my opinion, 2nd would be Woodson, and 3rd would be Jennings. Trying not to be the "homer" but seriously. woodson is our best CB, but not going, Jennings has 12 td's...remember when Franks made it only because of his TD's? and Nick Barnett is the top MLB in the NFC this year, no question. Tutupu, in my opinion, isn't all that great, and Willis has numbers cause of his team...but I LOVE Willis, so I won't complain too hard there, but he is a rookie, should give props to the vet first.

packers11
12-19-2007, 11:22 AM
the only reason I care a little about the probowl is because when its all said and done, thats what a lot of people base ones career off of...

"This guy went to 5 probowls, blah blah blah" or the fans/media use it to grade a player... "The guy hasn't even made a probowl yet" or "hes not a probowl type of player"

Other than that, the whole thing is meaningless to me... In my opinion it does not show the best players in each conference, its very obvious the voting system is very flawed when a team in your division that you crushed 34-0 has twice as many players going...

Some other article brought this up : Based on that those numbers...

Partial
12-19-2007, 11:47 AM
My Snubs :

Urlacher or Barnett > Willis ... : Wtf he only has a lot of tackles because that defense is so poor, don't get me wrong, hes great for a rookie, but he isn't even playing close to Barnett's level...

Woodson > Newman ... Sure, you can say that Harris covers the #1 receiver, but we all know what happened when Woodson was out with an injury... This guy is playing the best football and Newman has been out for 3-4 games... My guess is that its very hard for two players on the same team on the SAME position to get in...

Anyone > Jason Taylor ... He is having an average season at DE and on a team with 1 friken win... I don't get the logic...

Fred Taylor > Addai ... Hes average 4.9 yards a carry and is a force in the backfield...


I can understand why Woodson is a reserve, but I am still lost on Barnett...

The only one of those I disagree with is Newman over Chuck.

K-town
12-19-2007, 01:16 PM
By the time players bail with minor injuries, anyone who's still upright gets to go to Honolulu. But certain names needed to be on the original list. These 10 guys have me fired up:

Wes Welker, WR, Patriots - Welker deserves serious MVP consideration, let alone a Pro Bowl berth. Just when teams think they have the Patriots stopped, Welker makes a catch and keeps drives going. I'm sure all of New England's opponents voted him in.
Fred Taylor, RB, Jaguars - Finally, Taylor was ready to get the Pro Bowl monkey off his back. And they stiffed him, even though he ranks sixth in the NFL with 1,091 rushing yards and averages 5.1 yards per carry. Joseph Addai is OK, but the Colts' offensive machine runs with or without him.
Gary Brackett, LB, Colts - Brackett has four interceptions and is the leader of the second-best defense in the NFL.
Kellen Winslow, TE, Browns - Winslow's numbers are identical to Tony Gonzalez' (both have 971 yards and five touchdowns), but Winslow has made a bigger impact on a team that's actually going to the playoffs.
Mario Williams, DE, Texans - Williams ranks second in the NFL with 13.5 sacks. I understand Jason Taylor gets in on reputation, but no Dolphin belong on this list.
Derrick Brooks, LB, Buccaneers - People forget about Brooks because he's old, but he, and teammate Barrett Ruud have been great this year and one of the two deserved the nod. Niners rookie Patrick Willis made it for racking up a bunch of tackles, but c'mon, was San Francisco that hard to run on?
Nnamdi Asomugha, CB, Raiders - You don't hear anything about him, because no one throws to him. But he's a bona fide shut-down corner who's probably better than the AFC guys who made it.
Nick Barnett, LB, Packers - The Packers' defense is great and every time you watch them you hear Barnett's name seemingly every play.
Charles Woodson, CB, Packers - Like Barnett, Woodson deserves a ton of credit for Green Bay's defensive success.
Plaxico Burress, WR, Giants - His numbers are below other receivers because he's been limited by an ankle injury. But he's carried the Giants offensively and had a much bigger impact on the standings than someone like St. Louis' Torry Holt or Arizona's Larry Fitzgerald. The Saints' Marques Colston deserves consideration as well.

edit: Here's the link
http://www.fannation.com/blogs/post/92075