at a mall store? My co worker is looking to take the plunge, dont worry I already tried to warn him off but he isnt listenting. He found a ring for the little lady at Zales Diamonds and it is about 5k. What do you think he could talk them down too?
When I asked my wife I just paid what they asked hehe. I have NO IDEA how much you can negotiate with them.
THANKS!
Swede: My expertise in this area is extensive. The essential difference between a "battleship" and an "aircraft carrier" is that an aircraft carrier requires five direct hits to sink, but it takes only four direct hits to sink a battleship.
I've taken negotiation classes - there are pretty neat tips/tricks (don't be the first to offer, don't accept the first offer, counter a few times, pull the walk-a-way, etc.). Best advice in negotiation, everything is up for negotiation and in this type of purchase (one-time, little risk of bad relationship), he should be able to either package the rings together (either her engagement, his marriage, her marriage or all three) and nudge them down quite a bit. The power is in the info available so he should read up diamonds and check other sites before committing (kinda like picking a wifeOriginally Posted by Tony Oday
BS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! picking a wife are you crazy the second you even attempt this she has all the power and you lose!
Swede: My expertise in this area is extensive. The essential difference between a "battleship" and an "aircraft carrier" is that an aircraft carrier requires five direct hits to sink, but it takes only four direct hits to sink a battleship.
Not in my case - she's tried a few times to get me down that path. I'm in a rare, wonderful place
ya for how long?hehe
I was in that wonderful place until I had a kid! now she rules the house and I just go golfing
Swede: My expertise in this area is extensive. The essential difference between a "battleship" and an "aircraft carrier" is that an aircraft carrier requires five direct hits to sink, but it takes only four direct hits to sink a battleship.
I've been with her for 3.5 yrs+. About 1.5 yrs into it, she started with the questions and the pressure - after weeks of telling her that's not what I'm down for I had to break it off. Then, I was single (kinda) for like 3 months and we (she) came to the realization that marriage isn't in the future unless kids are involved. It's by far the healthiest relationship I've been in and I'm loving it. Cheersya for how long?
I was in that wonderful place until I had a kid! now she rules the house and I just go golfing
Diamonds are for ever, but why pay the credit bill for them until your 50?
Tell your friend to stay the fuck out of the malls and look online for trade shows or whole sale diamond and jewelry shows in or around his area. I have gone down to Rosemont Illinois for the better part of 5 years buying diamonds with my buddies that are getting engaged.
I haven't gone in two years so I haven't gotten an invitation to this place. You have to bargin with these people as well, but you start out at a way lower price.
I haggled with a jewelry shop in the mall for some emerald earings and ring for my wife, and they always have a sale going so don't buy that shit just on the sale price alone. I got them to come down like another 25% on some bogus coupon the sales lady pulled out of her ass.
thanks nutz. I really have no idea on jewelry. I know on used cars take the KBB trade in value at average condition and that is more than likely what they paid for it. Mortgages well thats just what I do so I know how to get those. Jewelry I just pay the prices and thats why I came here for him. My wife already has all the jewelry that she is going to get!
Swede: My expertise in this area is extensive. The essential difference between a "battleship" and an "aircraft carrier" is that an aircraft carrier requires five direct hits to sink, but it takes only four direct hits to sink a battleship.
Take her shopping for the ring, find out exactly what kind of setting/design she likes and be certain to get the sizing proper....but DO NOT PURCHASE that ring and do not allow her to pressure you into it while she is around.
Then - you go and purchase the exact same setting/design but instead you go and get CUBIC ZERCONIA. After all, the ring is a symbol of your love for each other and your bond in the witness of God. It should not matter what it's made of. Feel free to tell her what you have done so that you are not being shady or nefarious.
Then - before you give her the ring - you sit down together and hammer out the details of the Pre-Nuptuial Agreement to protect everything you have up until the day of the wedding.
A couple of points here:
If she demands a diamond - she is not the right woman.
If she refuses to sign a pre-nup - she is not the right woman.
The right woman will have your best interests at heart.
"Everyone's born anarchist and atheist until people start lying to them" ~ wise philosopher
Nothing says "I love you" like a big screen TV. A diamond ring is very sweet. But think of the two of you, curled-up on your couch, watching some romatic movie on a cold winter's night. That's quality time. Is this purchase negotiable?
HOFer
Captain - you are obviously single and destined to stay that way.
Tony,
Here is what I know. Gold/Precious Stones are at least priced at triple keystone. What this means, is that if the jeweler paid $100, then he will sell it for $300. Silver is priced typically at 5 times keystone. Paid $100 then sell for $500. Silver prices are actually quite high right now, so the margin to the end consumer may be suffering a bit, but it is probably no lower than 4 times keystone for non-sale merchandise.
Ok. The larger the jewelry store, the larger the markup. Mall stores and overhead are EXTREMELY expensive. Zales typically offers lower quality stones at the same price as a local jewelers quality stones. Jewelers are like loan sharks. You don't really know if you can trust them, most of the time you cannot. Zales, located in the center court of a decent mall probably pays about $15,000 a month in rent, plus a percentage of sales above a certain "target" amount. When you look at it that way, combined with the sales person who probably works on "straight commission" - good sales person, bad deals, or on a "base salary plus commission" - crummy sales person with little experience & no authority to make deals, getting a "good price" at the mall is going to be difficult.
My advice to your "friend" is to skip the mall store in favor of a small town jeweler that has been in his small town location since time began. Have him talk with his mother, grandmother, aunt, next door neighbor or a friend for a referral. He'll pay about the same or just slightly more than the mall store, get better service and some basis to believe he got what he paid for.
Negotiation is just that, negotiation. It is almost pointless in my opinion, because how do you know that you're getting the stone you think you're getting? Can you look at it and see that it is the clarity/color that you think it is? What keeps the jeweler from swapping the stone in the back room? In my experience, 50 years in business in the same location keeps the jeweler from doing that, and not much else.
Finally, a 50% off sale in the jewelry business approximates the mark up that you pay for most other consumer goods in the marketplace. A 50% off sale is a gimmick designed to move inventory that is becoming stale.
Hope this helps, PM me with details if you wish, and I'll help you further.
Ha ha - here is a lady's opinion - although I use the term loosely, 'cause not many of my lady friends see it my way.
Actually, I agree with the Captain. If a ring is that important to her, let her pick it out. You can surprise her with the proposal and all, but then lose the male ego and let her pick out the one she wants.
Personally, I would like Harlan's route - please buy me an HD TV with NFL Sunday ticket. But I'm sure I am in a 5% or less minority of women. Yes, I would like to have a diamond ring, but I would be prouder if I could afford to buy it for myself. Yes, I know I am young and naive...
Tell your buddy I'll sell him mine. I'm not using it anymore.
*nodsnodsnods*
Yep. I bought a single stone in White Plains, NY from a diamond merchant from the diamond district in NYC who was selling lesser-quality stones out of his house.
In 1988, I bought a 44-point single stone (that's close to 1/2 carat, BTW) for $350.00. It had a few inclusions, but whose getting out a loupe to look for them?? Do the math yourself and figure out how much it's worth today.
You can ALWAYS purchase a single stone for yourself and then pay a jeweler to mount it in a setting of your choice--at significant $ savings.
Heh.......get ahold of his fiancee, 'cuz I have a wedding ring she could get on the cheap.Tell your buddy I'll sell him mine. I'm not using it anymore.
thanks for the help the keystone thing actually made sense. He'll love it and yes it is for a friend I have been married for 3 years already I just didnt have anyone to ask this stuff. I just paid what they asked
Swede: My expertise in this area is extensive. The essential difference between a "battleship" and an "aircraft carrier" is that an aircraft carrier requires five direct hits to sink, but it takes only four direct hits to sink a battleship.
Thanks FC you seem to be anything but young and naive-
Retailguy -
If by "single and destined to remain that way" you mean that I'm not legally bound to a woman and if we decide to part ways I'm not on the hook for half my money - then you are absolutely correct.
I am a hopeless romantic when it comes to the ladies - exhibiting qualities of a proper gentleman provided she exhibits the ladylike class to warrant such treatment. More than half of all marriages end in divorce, and if you have any friends who are divorced or married for longer than 2 years, you'll see that there are more unhappy couples as a result of marriage.
I prefer to go against the norm and find ladies that are ok with this type of forward thinking. I'll cite Gene Simmons of Kiss for being an example here. He has been with the same woman for around 20 years with no marriage, no wedding ring, and no legal bond. The things that keep them together are the things that marriages are supposed to be about; trust, faith, desire, love, fun, support, encouragement, etc.etc. - which are the exact things I look for in a relationship with a woman.
How many jokes have you heard about what women and men become after marriage? Why do you think they're funny?
Because they are based in truth.
A few cliche's to live by:
"We learn from the past that people seldom learn from the past"
"Insanity is doing the same thing over and over agin and expecting different results"
Regards,
The Captain
"Everyone's born anarchist and atheist until people start lying to them" ~ wise philosopher
HOFer
Should Gene Simmons and his lady ever split, she will get half of everything as they have been together a long time. Have you ever heard of common law marriage? I can tell you will all confidence that piece of paper or no, Gene Simmons is married as are you if you've been living with your current SO for more than 8 years. You just didn't get the cake.I prefer to go against the norm and find ladies that are ok with this type of forward thinking. I'll cite Gene Simmons of Kiss for being an example here. He has been with the same woman for around 20 years with no marriage, no wedding ring, and no legal bond. The things that keep them together are the things that marriages are supposed to be about; trust, faith, desire, love, fun, support, encouragement, etc.etc. - which are the exact things I look for in a relationship with a woman.
"Greatness is not an act... but a habit.Greatness is not an act... but a habit." -Greg Jennings
Correct to a point MJZiggy- There are only 10 states that recognize common law as of today, but it depends largely on what state you reside in, and how you go about conducting yourselves socially and legally. Hence the original reference to the pre-nuptuial.
Check out this link for some facts and myths regarding common law marriage: http://www.unmarried.org/common.html
Here's the bare bones of the deal - I do not want to be with a woman who is in it for my money. I'm no millionaire, but I have a great job with a major software company, a condo in the Juanita Country Club, and I can afford to do fun things like book an all expenses paid vacation to fly to Green Bay for a home game.
I've had this discussion many times with friends and acquaintances. If a woman is in love with me and is truly committed to being with me for who I am and not what I have - then that makes conventional marriage irrelevant.
Cheers!
"Everyone's born anarchist and atheist until people start lying to them" ~ wise philosopher
My advice? DONT BUY HER SHIT!!!
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