The Skinbasket Weighs in on New Redskins Nicknames

[red]

I'm not sure. I bet if you did one of those "man in the street" kind of questionnaires and specifically asked "What does the word 'Redskin' mean to you?' more people would answer 'the football team' than 'derogatory anti-native american slur.'

what if they kept the name and changed the logo. i agree that people probably associate the term redskin with indians because of the team logo. so change that

how bout take a someone with a bad sunburn?

THE WASHINGTON REDSKINS

[Smeefers]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washing...me_controversy

History[edit]
The Washington Redskins were originally known as the Boston Braves. In 1933, co-owner George Preston Marshall changed the name to the Redskins, possibly in recognition of the then–head coach William Henry "Lone Star" Dietz, who claimed to be part Sioux. On July 6, 1933, the Boston Herald reported that "the change was made to avoid confusion with the Braves baseball team and the team that is to be coached by an Indian (Dietz)... with several Indian players."[8] Dietz's true heritage has been questioned by some scholars, citing a birth certificate and census records that his parents were white.[9] There is also the fact that, in 1933, the Boston Braves moved from Braves Field, which they shared with baseball's Boston Braves, to Fenway Park, already occupied by the Boston Red Sox. The Washington Redskins name and logo, which is a picture of a Native American, was officially registered in 1967.

Origin and meaning[edit]
Main article: Redskin (slang)
The origin of the word "redskin" is debated. Some scholars say that it was coined by early settlers in reference to the skin tone of Native Americans, while other say it referred to the color of the body paint used by certain tribes. Smithsonian Institution senior linguist and curator emeritus Ives Goddard asserts that the actual origin of the word is benign and reflects more positive aspects of early relations between Native Americans and whites.

[pbmax]

There is another story that the choice of nickname was because his wife had Native ancestors. Marshall told that version for a while, but no one seems to believe it anymore.

[Rastak]

Perhaps not as flammable as the fightin' n<censored>skins, but I think it has a history of derogatory usage beyond a simple comparable of color of skin. Yellow man, maybe, but I think closer to chink. The redskin usage is uncommon enough today that it doesn't seem at all to rise to the level of the n-word*, but I think its history is more bleak than recently memory has it. Having not done any reading on it beyond this topic, probably makes me unqualified to judge a comparison between the two.

If they approached the tribes, I wonder if any of them would take them up on some kind of offer. The Seminoles were mentioned earlier, but redskin is general enough I am not sure any tribe would want to touch it.


* At some point I will be adult enough to simply type n-word out correctly like I did chink, but something always holds me back. I think I fear Richard Pryor (or maybe Michael Richards) yelling at me from the stage.

This nails it in bold.


Richard was awesome, was it him who said in one of his jokes he and Michael Jackson were forming the ignited negro college fund?

[bobblehead]

The thread is flowing just fine so why you gotta start that shit (again)? Discuss the topic without going there or I will have to go somewhere else.

I actually thought my post was as relevant to this thread as any other. This is driven by the PC police. Not saying they are wrong in this case, just stating the obvious.

Of the white people telling Danial Snyder what to name his football team, how many are not....the term I used in hangman.

[bobblehead]

First, they couldn't have lived farther from India if they tried....aside from moving to the moon. Second they were slaughtered as a people by Europeans so they are unhappy about the ancestors of those people using their name for gain. The Cleveland Indians' logo should be Chief Sanjay and he should have on a headset mic. Calling them Indians is like calling people from Africa, Irish. It's stupid, shows the ignorance of the time, and perpetuates a pretty shitty time in our country's timeline.

Good God, where to start without pissing off Mad. You realize that the Native Americans LOOKED very much like Indians to the settlers. Just a smidgen more so than Africans look like Irish. I think that it shows ignorance in one sense, but not in the one you are implying.

Finally, if we want to play 6 degrees to what my ancestors did wrong, we can all be outraged by anything and everything. Now, I agree that Redskins is offensive, but Braves, Indians, Seminoles, blah blah. They are not.

[Teamcheez1]

Good God, where to start without pissing off Mad. You realize that the Native Americans LOOKED very much like Indians to the settlers. Just a smidgen more so than Africans look like Irish. I think that it shows ignorance in one sense, but not in the one you are implying.

Finally, if we want to play 6 degrees to what my ancestors did wrong, we can all be outraged by anything and everything. Now, I agree that Redskins is offensive, but Braves, Indians, Seminoles, blah blah. They are not.

You claim this is driven by the PC police, and then you succumb to the very argument you denigrate by claiming it is offensive. Yet, after reading the previous posts, I find that the term Redskins is more benign than I believed.

This is all about politics and the race hustlers driving the discussion. Nothing more, nothing less.

[Just Jeff]

No matter how many more casinos or bottles of booze you give them, there will always be a few rabble rousers that still want to make a name for themselves. Any capitalist injun, would be able to figure out a way to make money off of this rather than piss and moan between firewater benders.

[pbmax]

This is all about politics and the race hustlers driving the discussion. Nothing more, nothing less.

I disagree. Most of the people driving the discussion are not in politics. Recently that has begun to change. But the discussion about the team's name goes back years and wasn't jockeying for money or votes.

[Guiness]

No matter how many more casinos or bottles of booze you give them, there will always be a few rabble rousers that still want to make a name for themselves. Any capitalist injun, would be able to figure out a way to make money off of this rather than piss and moan between firewater benders.

Ignoring your inflamatory remarks, the bolded part is interesting. One of the first nations who claim some association with the name Redskins (the Navajo's?) could attempt to cash in - and given the zeal with which the NFL defends its intellectual property...

[pbmax]

Ignoring your inflamatory remarks, the bolded part is interesting. One of the first nations who claim some association with the name Redskins (the Navajo's?) could attempt to cash in - and given the zeal with which the NFL defends its intellectual property...

Interesting case as Snyder invited members of the Navajo code talkers to a game this year and received an endorsement from a group of them. The Nation affiliated with the Navajo though, disavowed the endorsement and called for the name to be changed.

[bobblehead]

You claim this is driven by the PC police, and then you succumb to the very argument you denigrate by claiming it is offensive. Yet, after reading the previous posts, I find that the term Redskins is more benign than I believed.

This is all about politics and the race hustlers driving the discussion. Nothing more, nothing less.

The fact that it is offensive, and the reasons behind people pushing for the change are 2 entirely separate issues. To admit it is in fact offensive in no way is succumbing to the argument of who is driving it. If I owned the team I would change the name....it would have nothing to do with the idiots trying to grab headlines by pushing the issue.

[mraynrand]

I would change the name if I owned the team as well. Based on the fact that it's just a football team and the purpose of the nickname was never really intended to be all that elevating to indians. Still, Indians shouldn't push so hard to change the name because every time Washington beats Dallas - well, that's historical payback.