First Impressions - Jagodzinski

[Noodle]

I don't remember Jags ever outright dissing Sherman.

You've gotta read more. Check out these articles:

http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4196/is_20050317/ai_n13243697

http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=304547

[pbmax]

I love the Cut block!!! At the same time, I think the area which a cut block is allowed should be narrowed, and in that area cut blocks from behind should be deemed illegal. I don't have a problem with cut blocks coming from straight on, or even from the side, but when a guy catches one in the back of the knees and doesn't see it coming, that just isn't right.

Nutz, that's the point Zimmerman makes. All over the field, you need to be man up (straight up, one on one) on the defender to use the block. Or at least that is the suggestion he is making for a rule change.

I can think of two instances where this occurs in the Denver offense. One is the reach block by the center or off guard where they must lunge to reach the man and by the time they get there they are at knee level. The second is the run side guard who is looking for a LB or an escaped D-Lineman, the block is used to ensure there is a cut back lane even if the guard isn't in position to drive block.

As for the idea that Atlanta didn't have this rep, Alex Gibbs was their line coach (Jags was his assistant) and the rep followed him there immediately. While I can't name you a knee that was ruined, there have been complaints lodged for the past two seasons.

And Minnesota in the Big Ten has this rep (their center was drafted by Denver) as Mason runs this scheme as well. Its one of the reasons the Badgers dislike playing the Gophers.

[The Leaper]

Opposing teams ALWAYS whine about the zone blocking scheme...because it is difficult to face. The proof is in the pudding...there is a reason the Denver and Atlanta running games have been among the best in the NFL while utilizing those schemes.

Personally, I find nothing wrong with taking advantage of every legal option available. Is it someone's fault that the NFL rulebook allows cut blocks? I see no reason to not take advantage of a very successful scheme simply because it might give your team a bad reputation. The WCO is constantly berated by opposing defenses for setting illegal screens and the like. Granted, that doesn't concern the safety of the players as much...but it is the same commonplace blabber you associate with head coaches or players, especially after a tough loss...and isn't what I'm referring to. Denver's OL has been fined numerous time by the league for illegal hits...I don't remember many fines levied to Falcon players. That is what I'm referring to. There is a difference between typical banter and actual dirty play.

The idea that the NFL is filled with a bunch of classy guys who aren't biting, clawing, and scratching for any inch...and pushing as close as possible to the line of rulebook, and even surpassing it...is ridiculous. If you don't exhaust every available means for finding an advantage...then you aren't doing your job.

[Scott Campbell]

I don't remember Jags ever outright dissing Sherman.

You've gotta read more. Check out these articles:

http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4196/is_20050317/ai_n13243697

http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=304547

Pretty underwhelming comments. What's the big deal?

[mraynrand]

One obvious advantage of the zone blocking scheme is it's reputation. If you're a D-lineman and you know you're gonna get cut-blocked, you can't help but think about it and be a little nervous about getting hurt. It's got to take away your edge if you let it get into you head.

Get ready for the criticism, for it will come to GB, just as soon as a D-lineman gets hurt - or sooner. I bet the Bears will be crying like little girls about it after they get spanked on opening day! (a little optimism there)

[Noodle]

Look, we can all beat our chests and say, tough, it's a brutal game. Also, I didn't play at college, let alone professionally, so my perspective is limited.

But even a tough guy like Cowher recognizes the distinction between what's legal and what's right (he's commenting below on an injury suffered by a Cincy guy at the hands of the Denver O-lineman George Foster):

"Steelers coach Bill Cowher told Pittsburgh media there are unwritten rules of engagement.

"A lot of it comes down to, in my mind, respect for the game and respect for the players," Cowher said. "Do unto others as you want others to do unto you. It's a physical game that we play. It's a very competitive game that we play, but within that there are certain lines that you don't go over."

That's all I'm saying. You can cut block clean, or you can cut block dirty, and clean cutting is still part of the game. But it is an inherently dangerous technique that, even if you're trying to do it right, you can end up lunging at a guy trying to make a play and crashing him from the side instead of up front.

You can call me a pussy, but if we're going to make back-side cut blocking a regular part of the scheme, then I would hope the staff stresses doing it the right way.

[Noodle]

Pretty underwhelming comments. What's the big deal?

Maybe, but then why did Jags feel the need to apologize for the "underwhelming comments" at his first press conference:
"Jagodzinski was fired following the 2003 season for what Sherman called "philosophical differences." The decision stung Jagodzinski deeply and he ripped Sherman at last year's NFL scouting combine for his communication skills and not listening to the opinions of his staff members.

Jagodzinski apologized for the remarks Sunday.

"I wanted to just mention, there was a statement made in the paper, and I wanted to formally apologize for a statement I might have made about the past," Jagodzinski said of the statements he made to Packer Plus last February. "It was made at an emotional time, they caught me at an emotional time and I do apologize for that."

If anything is underwhelming, it's the sincerety of that apology. "There was a statement made"? "[A] statement I might have made"? How hard is it to say -- "I made some comments that I want to apologize for"? And he was going through "an emotional time"? At the Combine? Fourteen months or so after he was fired? What kind of emotional trainwreck is this guy?

But I'll give him credit for making the effort.

Though I bet M3 made him do it!

[Scott Campbell]

I hear he jaywalks too. Let's string him up.

[Rastak]

I hear he jaywalks too. Let's string him up.

Link?

[Noodle]

Sorry Rastak, my link was too big and threw off the look of the board. I took it off.

And I'd never want to string a guy up for jay walking. But if I were to hear that Jags was late with his library books, well then, get a rope.

[BlueBrewer]

Sorry Rastak, my link was too big and threw off the look of the board. I took it off.

And I'd never want to string a guy up for jay walking. But if I were to hear that Jags was late with his library books, well then, get a rope.

We do still have Leo Bookman on the roster, he should take care of the overdue books.

[Rastak]

Sorry Rastak, my link was too big and threw off the look of the board. I took it off.

And I'd never want to string a guy up for jay walking. But if I were to hear that Jags was late with his library books, well then, get a rope.

We do still have Leo Bookman on the roster, he should take care of the overdue books.

That's not the same Bookman from the old 70's show Good Times is it? He'd be more only the lines of Grady Jackson.

[Noodle]

I remember Bookman -- played the super, or something, didn't he? I always thought Good Times was a solid show, notwithstanding the unfortunate "fonzification" of JJ in the show's last seasons.

Sometimes a little preachy, but man there was a lot going on in that show.

[Patler]

I once heard an NHL player say that in almost every game you are presented with a situation that you could make a totally legal hit that has a high probability of hurting someone. He said the true professional backs off making the hit to some degree, or avoids it all together. He said the "cheap players" make the hit with full force, and are then paid back in kind when the situation presents itself. As he said, with "skates, speed and boards" they are all dependent on each other for their well-being.

Thats the type of thing Cowher is talking about. Its what gives cutblocks as practiced by some a bad reputation. Its what made Sapp's hit on Clifton wrong. It wasn't illegal, but it served no purpose and was completely unnecessary.

[BlueBrewer]

I once heard an NHL player say that in almost every game you are presented with a situation that you could make a totally legal hit that has a high probability of hurting someone. He said the true professional backs off making the hit to some degree, or avoids it all together. He said the "cheap players" make the hit with full force, and are then paid back in kind when the situation presents itself. As he said, with "skates, speed and boards" they are all dependent on each other for their well-being.

Thats the type of thing Cowher is talking about. Its what gives cutblocks as practiced by some a bad reputation. Its what made Sapp's hit on Clifton wrong. It wasn't illegal, but it served no purpose and was completely unnecessary.

Huh Did you mean to reply to another thread.