Jordy Nelson observations

[Tarlam!]

Not sure if this video was posted: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HPaU-yrSVWY&NR=1

Gotta see it, the kid is adorable.

[run pMc]

The comparison about the SEC being tougher than the Big 12 does'nt quite ring true when it comes to WR's. I mean when you compare conferences, Western Michigan ain't exactly LSU North and jennings is doing ok.

Not sure I follow you here; AFAIK W Mich is in the MAC, and IIRC Jennings set records at the school. He was very productive and consistent over his college career. I think he had a couple of 1000 yd seasons or something like that.
As for SEC vs. Big 12, I think that plenty of good WR's (and players in general) come out of the Big 12, but IMHO the SEC is a tougher conference from top to bottom. Think of all the CB's that are drafted out of the SEC...Bowe had to line up against them. I concede that these days the best teams in the mid-major conferences can give teams in the BCS conferences a real fight, but there's a reason small-school prospects rarely get drafted high. Whether that's right or not is probably a good topic to start on a separate thread.

Regardless of the competition, I think TT is looking at production, and as we've seen posted, Nelson had a very productive college career.

Re: the available WR's at #36, I would have thought hard about Sweed. I'm split on Manningham, he can get separation and has some skills, but he disappeared a few times and the whole thing about lying to personnel (to their faces!) about smoking pot is a bad sign. Kelly acted like a douchebag at his pro day, Avery is good but seemed like a reach. Hmmm...honestly, I would have looked at a different roster spot than WR.

[Packnut]

WR's

The comparison about the SEC being tougher than the Big 12 does'nt quite ring true when it comes to WR's. I mean when you compare conferences, Western Michigan ain't exactly LSU North and jennings is doing ok.

Not sure I follow you here; AFAIK W Mich is in the MAC, and IIRC Jennings set records at the school. He was very productive and consistent over his college career. I think he had a couple of 1000 yd seasons or something like that.
As for SEC vs. Big 12, I think that plenty of good WR's (and players in general) come out of the Big 12, but IMHO the SEC is a tougher conference from top to bottom. Think of all the CB's that are drafted out of the SEC...Bowe had to line up against them. I concede that these days the best teams in the mid-major conferences can give teams in the BCS conferences a real fight, but there's a reason small-school prospects rarely get drafted high. Whether that's right or not is probably a good topic to start on a separate thread.

Regardless of the competition, I think TT is looking at production, and as we've seen posted, Nelson had a very productive college career.

Re: the available WR's at #36, I would have thought hard about Sweed. I'm split on Manningham, he can get separation and has some skills, but he disappeared a few times and the whole thing about lying to personnel (to their faces!) about smoking pot is a bad sign. Kelly acted like a douchebag at his pro day, Avery is good but seemed like a reach. Hmmm...honestly, I would have looked at a different roster spot than WR.

What I'm saying is the conference arguement has no weight when it comes to the WR position due to the myriad of factors in determining how good a WR really is.

First off, some QB's make WR's better than they really are. We've seen proof of this with certain WR's from USC for example. The KS QB ain't exactly a household name.

Second the "guy on the other side" also plays a role. Tougher to double if the D has to defend both wideouts equally. Nelson was the main passing focus on almost every team he faced.

Third, the NFL has a history of WR's from small programs who faced inferior talent and still excelled in the NFL, (Rice for example), so therefore what conference a WR played in is'nt one of the over-riding factors to determine his success.

To say Nelson's accomplishments don't count as much because he played in the Big 12 as compared to the SEC is just ridiculous. I use Jennings as an example because he played in the MAC yet is having tremendous success as a pro. There is a valid comparison because when Jennings played against tougher non-conference opponents from big programs, he still excelled.

I just don't comprehend the conference debate. The SEC is filled with teams of inferior talent. Good Lord, Miss and Vandy don't exactly scare anyone for example. Texas and Nebraska ain't exactly cup-cake programs.

[Joemailman]

Re: Nelson

IMO, the 2 biggest mistakes people make when analyzing a college player are his season stats and his 40 time.

The NFL is full of guys who had bad 40 times and have proven that measuring stick to be pure and total BS. Discussing Nelson's 40 time is a waste of space.

Indeed. If I had been worried about his speed before, I would have stopped worrying after seeing the film clip of him blowing past Aqib Talib. Some guys are as fast in full football gear as they are in shorts and a t-shirt. He looks like one of those guys. The most important speed question with a WR is how fast can they avoid a jam at the line of scrimmage and get 15 yards downfield. Playing against Al Harris and Charles Woddson every day should be a good barometer.

[KYPack]

Re: Nelson

IMO, the 2 biggest mistakes people make when analyzing a college player are his season stats and his 40 time.

The NFL is full of guys who had bad 40 times and have proven that measuring stick to be pure and total BS. Discussing Nelson's 40 time is a waste of space.

Indeed. If I had been worried about his speed before, I would have stopped worrying after seeing the film clip of him blowing past Aqib Talib. Some guys are as fast in full football gear as they are in shorts and a t-shirt. He looks like one of those guys. The most important speed question with a WR is how fast can they avoid a jam at the line of scrimmage and get 15 yards downfield. Playing against Al Harris and Charles Woddson every day should be a good barometer.

This post should be saved and chipped into granite.

40 times are so overrated.

If you timed the starting corners and WR's in the NFL right now, you'd be shocked at how fast some of 'em run a 40. Actually, it's how slow they are that would shock you. It's experience that teaches you when to apply your burst and break open on a route precisely and on rhythmn. Corners need to read WR's and know when to bump a guy with your hip and disrupt his route. Also, when to make your break on the ball.

Smokin' 40's are but a small indicator of a guys talent. Speed helps, but man, it's just another club in your bag, not the whole game.

Still teams make crucial draft errors based on fast 40's.

Think the Vikings would like a do-over on their #1 pick, Troy Williamson?

A fast 40 was ALL that kid had.

[TennesseePackerBacker]

Ok here goes...

You can in no way compare Bowe's collegiate career to Nelson's for just some of the following reasons.

1. Bowe had Flynn and Russell throwing to him throughout his career, can anyone tell me who was throwing to Jordy Nelson?

2. Who lined up opposite of Nelson? Bowe never got close to catching 122, and he never had a team focusing to take him out like teams did with Nelson last year. Don't forget the Early Doucet's and Craig Davis's taking attention off of Bowe; Nelson wasn't so lucky.

Honestly, I guess Nelson has really grown on me after looking him up online and the little I saw him last year(Against Aub., Tex.)

Ted hasn't missed on a reciever yet, and I think this is his best of the bunch. We'll be talking about Nelson right up there with Jennings in a year or two.

[Patler]

Ted hasn't missed on a reciever yet, and I think this is his best of the bunch. We'll be talking about Nelson right up there with Jennings in a year or two.

Yup, that Cory Rodgers has made TT look like a genius!!
(Just kidding! )

Seriously, I knew little to nothing about Nelson, but watching his highlights several things standout:

Regardless of what his stopwatch times are, he plays the game faster than most of the others on the field with him. He continually ran away from DBs.

He sure sets up and follows blockers well in the open field, both as a receiver and as a return man.

Catching is effortless for him. He catches passes that are high, low, in front and behind.

He does something that I also see in Jennings, and have mentioned it about Jennings in the past. He is making his first move, running or cutting as he catches the ball. Receivers that do that can elude a DB who seems to have good coverage, and pick up YAC when most receivers would be tackled as they caught the ball.

For a big guy, he looks pretty fluid.

[TennesseePackerBacker]

Ted hasn't missed on a reciever yet, and I think this is his best of the bunch. We'll be talking about Nelson right up there with Jennings in a year or two.

Yup, that Cory Rodgers has made TT look like a genius!!
(Just kidding! )

Ok, I should have said early round picks(1-3). He has taken flyers on guys in the later rounds, just like he did with Swain(sp?) this year.

[Packnut]

Re: Nelson

IMO, the 2 biggest mistakes people make when analyzing a college player are his season stats and his 40 time.

The NFL is full of guys who had bad 40 times and have proven that measuring stick to be pure and total BS. Discussing Nelson's 40 time is a waste of space.

Indeed. If I had been worried about his speed before, I would have stopped worrying after seeing the film clip of him blowing past Aqib Talib. Some guys are as fast in full football gear as they are in shorts and a t-shirt. He looks like one of those guys. The most important speed question with a WR is how fast can they avoid a jam at the line of scrimmage and get 15 yards downfield. Playing against Al Harris and Charles Woddson every day should be a good barometer.

This post should be saved and chipped into granite.

40 times are so overrated.

If you timed the starting corners and WR's in the NFL right now, you'd be shocked at how fast some of 'em run a 40. Actually, it's how slow they are that would shock you. It's experience that teaches you when to apply your burst and break open on a route precisely and on rhythmn. Corners need to read WR's and know when to bump a guy with your hip and disrupt his route. Also, when to make your break on the ball.

Smokin' 40's are but a small indicator of a guys talent. Speed helps, but man, it's just another club in your bag, not the whole game.

Still teams make crucial draft errors based on fast 40's.

Think the Vikings would like a do-over on their #1 pick, Troy Williamson?

A fast 40 was ALL that kid had.

For the life of me, I'll never understand why scouts and GM's get so caught up in the 40 thing. It just boggles the mind...........

Your Williamson comment had me chuckling. Pefect example of "speed gone wrong"!

[The Leaper]

I had Thomas, Kelly and Hardy ahead of Nelson...so I would've probably taken Kelly at #36.

I didn't really look at WRs too closely though. Nelson wasn't even on my radar for most of this season. Now that I look at it, I should've put Nelson ahead of Hardy on my draft board. Hardy's size and red zone potential were intriguing to me, but Nelson is the total package.

[Patler]

Ted hasn't missed on a reciever yet, and I think this is his best of the bunch. We'll be talking about Nelson right up there with Jennings in a year or two.

Yup, that Cory Rodgers has made TT look like a genius!!
(Just kidding! )

Ok, I should have said early round picks(1-3). He has taken flyers on guys in the later rounds, just like he did with Swain(sp?) this year.

I don't think Cory Rodgers was picked at all for his ability as a WR, he was a hope as a return man completely. I think they knew his skills as a receiver were very, very raw. Rodgers just turned out to be a bad pick. It happens.

So many fans have complained in past years about TT ignoring the offense. Obviously they can't this year. But he has now invested three second round picks and one third in wide receivers. So far, so good.

[KYPack]

Ted hasn't missed on a reciever yet, and I think this is his best of the bunch. We'll be talking about Nelson right up there with Jennings in a year or two.

Yup, that Cory Rodgers has made TT look like a genius!!
(Just kidding! )

Ok, I should have said early round picks(1-3). He has taken flyers on guys in the later rounds, just like he did with Swain(sp?) this year.

I don't think Cory Rodgers was picked at all for his ability as a WR, he was a hope as a return man completely. I think they knew his skills as a receiver were very, very raw. Rodgers just turned out to be a bad pick. It happens.

So many fans have complained in past years about TT ignoring the offense. Obviously they can't this year. But he has now invested three second round picks and one third in wide receivers. So far, so good.

Cory Rodgers was selected for his return skills only. He was an awful pass reciever. When they cut him, somebody posted video of him dropping 3-4 punts in college.

They hoped they could reform the guy, but the pro's magnified his weaknesses. He was a 4, you are gambling down there. I liked the fact that TT cut the guy. I thought TT erred the year before by not giving up quicker on Whitticker.

When the guy makes a bad pick, he gets it fixed.

[Lurker64]

The stories of Craig Bragg and David Clowney aren't much more encouraging than that of Corey Rodgers, but so far Thompson is batting pretty well on the first day WRs. I'd rather he hit on the higher picked WRs and miss on the lower picked ones than vice versa.

[Patler]

The stories of Craig Bragg and David Clowney aren't much more encouraging than that of Corey Rodgers, but so far Thompson is batting pretty well on the first day WRs. I'd rather he hit on the higher picked WRs and miss on the lower picked ones than vice versa.

I wouldn't throw Clowney in there with Bragg and Rodgers just yet. He was on the Packers' practice squad, where they expected he would spend his first year even when they drafted him, and the Jets signed him. He's still with the Jets.

[Lurker64]

I wouldn't throw Clowney in there with Bragg and Rodgers just yet. He was on the Packers' practice squad, where they expected he would spend his first year even when they drafted him, and the Jets signed him. He's still with the Jets.

Maybe I'm just a little bitter in that I expected a little more of him when we drafted him, but he was embarrassingly raw. His route running was abysmal and I was personally hoping for more. I guess I shouldn't expect anything from Thompson's late round WR pickups, but maybe Brett Swain will knock my socks off.