Ted Thompson and the Favre Situation

[cheesner]

Are we forgetting Thompson was named Executive of the Year?

Sure, let's give him a pass on it all then

Give him a pass on what?

On putting a team together that is:

1. The NFL's youngest
2. Considerable cap space
3. Went 13-3
4. Is very deep
5. Is loaded with great young talent.


No sense in giving credit where credit is due

[mraynrand]

Funny, as yet I have to see any media starting any of the Favre threads on this website. Unless some of the rats are in the press....

[MJZiggy]

Give him a pass on what?

On putting a team together that is:

1. The NFL's youngest
2. Considerable cap space
3. Went 13-3
4. Is very deep
5. Is loaded with great young talent.


No sense in giving credit where credit is due[/quote]

Well, damn him straight to hell for all that!!

[Packerarcher]

Are we forgetting Thompson was named Executive of the Year?

Who gives a shit what he was named. If he pressured one of the greatest QB's ever into early retirement,then he should be named Jack Ass of the year. Bottom line is if Brett wants to come back LET HIM,he is the Packers best chance of going to the Super Bowl. Besides Rodgers will get hurt before game 5 anyway the guy is a puss,plus he hates the GB fans.

[vince]

It isn't Thompson's role to make Favre's decisions for him. He's a big boy and this isn't Pop Warner football. To assert that TT making him feel unwanted should be any consideration is nothing less than a joke - especially at this level. The TEAM was paying him more than $11 million to play. He was under contract to earn more than $12.5 million for the next two years if he wanted to play. But he made the decision not to play - not TT.

If TT wanted Brett out that bad, he had every opportunity to trade or release him. He didn't do that. Absent that, whether Brett returns or not is not TT's decision to make. It's Brett's. And he made it - based on his unwillingness to commit to the TEAM preparing through the offseason and beyond to give his best effort.

PackerTimer said it well when he said,

Does your boss continually pat you on the back and ask if you'll be back tomorrow? Mine doesn't. I figure until they ask me to leave or I decide to leave I keep showing up and doing my job. I don't need my worth validated on a daily basis.

Favre was given ample time (once again) to determine if he wanted to return. If his decision was going to be to play, he was told that he owes it to the TEAM, his TEAMmates and the fans to get himself ready to give 100% for the season to overcome another year of aging, and to earn the $12.5 million the franchise would be paying him, to maximize the opportunity for TEAM success. He decided that was too much to give. After all he's gien this franchise and us fans, that's a decision we all should be able to respect.

As the offseason continued, the TEAM made important personnel decisions, the coaches planned for how to best prepare for this season, mini-camps, practice sessions, and the entire TEAM worked together on offseason workout programs designed to get them all to the next level, all without Favre, who decided that kind of TEAM commitment was no longer in him.

Now, when the TEAM results of all the offseason's hard work are on the brink of being tested and shown off to the world, Favre wants to re-enter the scene and bear the fruits of the work - without having been a part of the TEAM commitment to excellence.

Brett should be thanking God for how blessed he's been to have had the opportunities he's had, not whining about how he doesn't feel welcome and getting his family, friends and agent to express his feelings for him in public. Brett is a great player, and I have the utmost respect for his past TEAM commitments and contributions, but his high maintenance has finally become too much to overcome.

Here's an article that expresses the opposite argument. In my opinion, everyone of these are highly dubious arguments, and I can't help but say, so what? with every assertion, although I do think it's funny that the writer accuses everyone involved of acting like a bunch of women.

http://packergeeks.wordpress.com/2008/07/03/ted-thompson-wanted-favre-out/

Ted Thompson wanted Favre out

Here it is. Steve and I have been speculating about this really ever since the 2006 season ended. We have reached the conclusion that by his actions (or inactions), his words and even his non-verbals (counselor-speak), TT has made it relatively clear to fans and I’m sure Favre, that he was actually NOT indifferent to Favre’s retirement decision (which was the public impression he conveyed), but that he just didn’t want Favre on the team anymore, period. We have been monitoring this scenario the whole off-season like most NFL fans with a suspicious eye cast toward TT. Following is our argument.

Prior to Favre’s retirement, TT responded to a reporter wondering if TT had encouraged Favre to come back by saying something to the effect of: Favre is a 38 year old man, he can make his own decisions. TT handled this reporter’s question in a dismissive fashion.

Mike McCarthy never spoke inclusively of TT whenever alluding to efforts to encourage Favre to come back. On a good number of occasions, MM was clear that he wanted Favre to come back, but MM never indicated “we” or never mentioned TT when referring to Favre (that I am aware of).

TT being extra clear once Favre did retire that Rodgers is the guy. Sure, this is a logical thing to say considering he was back-up last year and has learned now for 3 years behind Favre etc. But it was interesting that this was simply declared by TT right after Favre retired when the modern-day response for coaches/GMs to any talk of who will start is “it’s an open competition” etc.

TT’s handling of the locker situation - wanting a clear, tangible reminder to all that Favre is done.

TT making sure Favre’s retirement ceremony would take place as soon as possible - the first game of the season.

TT drafting 2 QBs in the draft. For a guy who “never drafts for need”, this appears to be an extra obvious message to Favre that the team is attempting to move on.

TT’s non-verbals during the whole retirement announcement process. I got a fairly strong sense that he simply was not that INTO the whole retirement, tribute, adoration period like most of the rest of the football world.

The straight comments from Favre’s family and agent that it was clear the Packers didn’t want him back. They said it then and they’ve said it as recently as yesterday (WISN news and FOX 6 both carried phone conversations with family members indicating the Packers didn’t do enough to convince Favre that he was wanted back). Given that McCarthy is on record stating he and Clements tried hard to convince Favre, when Favre and family members say “the Packers” didn’t do enough, clearly, this leaves only one person in a position power for them to be referring to: TT.

Rodgers is TT’s guy. TT drafted him and has pushed for Rodgers to succeed and one day be the guy.

The fact that Jason Wilde and many other writers are pointing out that the Packers likely won’t take Favre back. How Favre’s potential return is handled is something that is determined by TT ultimately and so when these writers state that they have inside sources indicating Favre’s return would not be welcomed by the Packers, what they are saying essentially is that TT does not want him back. Period.

I know there are those of you out there who may be frustrated that I am posting this and seemingly siding with Favre. That’s not quite true. While I wouldn’t be averse to Favre returning because I think he could lead this team to the Super Bowl, and while I do think TT has not wanted Favre on the team for a while now, I do think Favre has handled this situation poorly. A quiet part of me hopes that what he said today, that this is all just a rumor, is true so that he can preserve his well-deserved legacy and the Packers can move forward with an exciting young QB.

Both sides have handled this poorly. Both sides, in fact, are meta-messaging. What is meta-messaging? Well, frankly, it is a method of communication often exhibited by females. (Sorry female packergeeks readers, I’m just regurgitating info I learned from a communication seminar once…given by a female). The basic premise is that women, for whatever reason, sometimes do not communicate directly what is it they want or what it is they are thinking. For example, if your wife wants to stop at the ice cream shop she won’t say, “let’s stop there and get ice cream”. Instead, she says, as you drive by, “boy it’s sure crowded there, perfect summer night, those people seem to be enjoying themselves”. A few blocks later, the husband, who as usual was not being a good listener, realizes maybe his wife meant she wanted ice cream. When he asks if this is the case, his wife responds, pouting, “no, it’s too late now anyway”. Then wife is mad and husband is frustrated.

Anyway, my point is this: both TT and Favre are meta-messaging and we as fans are left to devour internet rumors and speculation in hopes of uncovering the truth. If either would just come out and say what’s really going on, maybe this whole thing could move forward in a more constructive way. But both sides are afraid to say something likely because they don’t want to look bad in the eyes of NFL/Packer fans. Problem is, this growing uncertainty re the truth is fostering some pretty strong reactions from fans - just listen to any sports talk radio station.

Here’s my best effort at the real truth here: after Favre’s poor 2005 season, TT wanted Favre out. Then due to the excitement generated by the strong finish at the end of the 2006 season, TT decided for PR reasons that he shouldn’t push Favre out like he had been planning to do, but instead gave barely noticeable support to a Favre return. Then, after the 2007 season, TT had further resolved to get Favre out (though it’s hard to imagine why a GM would want to usher out the 4th rated passer who took his team to the NFC Championship game). Throughout the off-season, TT did his best to dodge public questions re his stance on Favre’s return for 2008. But the truth is, he has wanted him out for a while now and when Favre finally decided to retire, TT moved swiftly (as we’ve pointed out above) to move on. Now, I suspect that Favre is actually just putting out feelers to see how a possible return would be received by the team/fans. I wonder a bit if he is intentionally trying to put pressure on the fans to put pressure on TT and the team to welcome him back. I don’t suspect he is itching to play elsewhere (as it seems only really crappy teams have major QB needs).

Either way, this situation is just not sitting well with me or really, any of the fans who have weighed in on this. (Oh, and by the way, read this from Rob Demovsky today - our guess is you’ll see more and more articles like this as it all shakes out).

[vince]

Here's a USA Today piece, written by Rob Demovsky with contributions by Pete Dougherty and Mike Vandermause on the subject.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/packers/2008-07-02-favre-retirement_N.htm

Inside Favre's decision making: Rift with Packers GM a factor
Brett Favre's apparent desire to return to the NFL shouldn't come as a major surprise considering what has transpired over the last five months.
Although Green Bay Packers spokesman Jeff Blumb said "the Packers have no reaction" to ESPN's report that Favre has an "itch" to come out of retirement and play for the team again, multiple people with knowledge of the situation confirmed to the Green Bay Press-Gazette that Favre has inquired about returning to the Packers.

According to those with knowledge, Favre was wishy-washy about retiring in the weeks following the Packers' loss to the New York Giants in the NFC Championship Game. Like the previous two offseasons, Favre told coach Mike McCarthy and general manager Ted Thompson that he was thinking about quitting. The two previous years, McCarthy or Thompson — and sometimes both — made strong attempts to talk Favre out of it.

This year, things were different, according to those with information about the team's relationship with Favre. Thompson hardly communicated with the quarterback in the offseason, which upset Favre, but McCarthy maintained regular contact with him. In March, when Favre told the Packers he was planning to quit, they made little or no effort to talk him out of it. So on March 4, he announced his retirement and two days later held a tearful farewell news conference at Lambeau Field.

However, doubt about his decision persisted. Thompson visited Favre at his Hattiesburg, Miss., home in May and, according to those with information about the meeting, Favre would have un-retired at that point had Thompson asked him to come back. But Thompson never broached the subject with him.

About two weeks ago, Favre called McCarthy to express his desire to return, but Favre was rebuffed. The Packers are reluctant to take Favre back for several reasons: They're concerned how it would affect Aaron Rodgers, Favre's replacement. They have already gone through an entire offseason preparing Rodgers, and they've adjusted the offense to suit his strengths.

All offseason, the Packers have done everything possible to try to move on from the Favre era. They chose the regular-season opener on Sept. 8 against Minnesota to retire his jersey. Time and again, McCarthy and Thompson have publicly backed Rodgers as their starting quarterback.

According to another person with knowledge, Favre's agent, Bus Cook, made repeated attempts to contact Thompson in the last few weeks, but Thompson did not return his calls. Cook did not return a message left at his office on Wednesday but told ESPN, "As far I know, right now, Brett Favre is retired and until he tells me something different, that's what it is."

Both McCarthy and Thompson were on vacation and could not be reached.

If Favre continues to express a desire to play and the Packers don't change their stance, it's unclear how strongly Favre would push for the team to trade him or release him. The quarterback is currently on the reserve-retired list. He is under contract through 2010, and the Packers would retain his rights for three seasons at the point in which he decided to return.

Favre's only response on Wednesday was a brief text message to the Biloxi (Miss.) Sun-Herald. When asked by the paper about the report about him wanting to return, Favre said, "It's all rumor." When asked about a possible media firestorm, Favre said, "No reason for it."

Packers cornerback Al Harris told ESPN that, "I've talked to Brett, and I know he has the itch to come back and play. If he will or not, I don't know. But I know he's feeling (like) he wants to play."

One of Favre's best friends from his playing days, former Packers center Frank Winters, said he spoke to Favre on Wednesday morning but claimed Favre made no mention of a possible return. When asked if he would be surprised if Favre decided to come back, Winters said: "Nothing surprises me in professional sports."

"Look at Michael Jordan," Winters continued. "He's taken a couple, three or four years (off), and came back. You never know. He may get bored with what he's doing. He may come back. He may not. He may just say, 'You know what, enough's enough. I just want to hang out and relax.' Last I talked to him, right now, it seems like he's had enough, and he's done and he's just going to sit back and enjoy and relax."

Favre's next scheduled appearance in Green Bay is on July 19 to present Winters for induction into the Packers Hall of Fame. It's unclear whether Wednesday's news will affect Favre's status for that event or any future appearances in town, including his jersey retirement ceremony.

[Bretsky]

Are we forgetting Thompson was named Executive of the Year?

Sure, let's give him a pass on it all then

Give him a pass on what?

"it all"

Everything.....cuz he's Exec of the Year

We should not question anything and just assume it's all good. That is the underlying message I often receive (not from you for the record)

[Pugger]

Good lord. Why in the h3ll would an NFL GM want to run a sure fire first ballot HOF QB out of town who lead the team to the brink of the SB just weeks before??!! I don't believe any of this for a moment!

Brett may have been miffed or disappointed that TT didn't get moss last summer but I'm sure his attitude changed once he began to play with the recievers and players TT surrounded him with! I read somewhere that MM and TT told Brett to take his time to decide. Some fans blast for TT cuz he didn't beg Brett to come back. If Brett needs to have TT or someone else plead with him to return maybe it is indeed time for Brett to call it a career.

[Bretsky]

AROD is his boy.

I think this statement is bunk. You could argue Ryan Grant is his boy, too, but as we all know, Grant still doesn't have a contract signed. And the number of vets that he has re-signed also make your statement thin, B.

I don't think TT is an egomaniac. If A-Rod doesn't pan out, he's gone. But he'll get a fair shake. What more should we fans expect of our GM?

TT has never claimed any credit for turning the franchise around from a cap nightmare full of overpaid has-beens and wannabe's. He always, ALWAYS talks in the "we" form and he has readily, though respectfully admitted screw ups along the way. I say respectfully, cause if a player hasn't panned out, TT has NEVER had an ill word about the player.

The way I view TT might be naive, but I think he's trying to do his job. I think he treats everyone of the players with the same level of respect and doesn't have favourites. He doesn't pamper anyone. He wants players that will give their all on the practice field, locker room and on Sundays.

And, he's damned right to do so, IMHO. Why? It would be damned impossible for M3 to bench a "Brett Favre".

You all know I admire Favre's Seattle performance - brilliant.

But I would have loved to have seen a hungry A-Rod in the 4th quarter against the Giants when it was absolutely clear to anyone that Favre was looking tired and cold all game long.

TT is handling his job better than 31 other GMs IMHO.

We just have to respectfully agree to disagree Tarlem; I have no proof....but I think TT was fine with Favre bowing out two years ago and more then fine with Favre bowing out this year. A lot of this is based off of the media and ESPN radio and what they have consistently reported over the past couple years. TT is IMO very hight on Rodgers; he was TT's 1st first round draft pick. TT IMO wants to move on. Today's article just posted by Vince..honestly...has a lot of my views in it. I'm not condemning TT for how he feels. He's our GM and can do with Favre how he pleases. It seems with this one there are not many in the middle ground. Either they are strongly for TT and are fine with him letting Favre go or they feel strongly TT should let Favre back. I don't blame either party. But I do think TT wants to sail his sea with AROD.

[Bretsky]

Here's a USA Today piece, written by Rob Demovsky with contributions by Pete Dougherty and Mike Vandermause on the subject.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/packers/2008-07-02-favre-retirement_N.htm

Inside Favre's decision making: Rift with Packers GM a factor
Brett Favre's apparent desire to return to the NFL shouldn't come as a major surprise considering what has transpired over the last five months.
Although Green Bay Packers spokesman Jeff Blumb said "the Packers have no reaction" to ESPN's report that Favre has an "itch" to come out of retirement and play for the team again, multiple people with knowledge of the situation confirmed to the Green Bay Press-Gazette that Favre has inquired about returning to the Packers.

According to those with knowledge, Favre was wishy-washy about retiring in the weeks following the Packers' loss to the New York Giants in the NFC Championship Game. Like the previous two offseasons, Favre told coach Mike McCarthy and general manager Ted Thompson that he was thinking about quitting. The two previous years, McCarthy or Thompson — and sometimes both — made strong attempts to talk Favre out of it.

This year, things were different, according to those with information about the team's relationship with Favre. Thompson hardly communicated with the quarterback in the offseason, which upset Favre, but McCarthy maintained regular contact with him. In March, when Favre told the Packers he was planning to quit, they made little or no effort to talk him out of it. So on March 4, he announced his retirement and two days later held a tearful farewell news conference at Lambeau Field.

However, doubt about his decision persisted. Thompson visited Favre at his Hattiesburg, Miss., home in May and, according to those with information about the meeting, Favre would have un-retired at that point had Thompson asked him to come back. But Thompson never broached the subject with him.

About two weeks ago, Favre called McCarthy to express his desire to return, but Favre was rebuffed. The Packers are reluctant to take Favre back for several reasons: They're concerned how it would affect Aaron Rodgers, Favre's replacement. They have already gone through an entire offseason preparing Rodgers, and they've adjusted the offense to suit his strengths.

All offseason, the Packers have done everything possible to try to move on from the Favre era. They chose the regular-season opener on Sept. 8 against Minnesota to retire his jersey. Time and again, McCarthy and Thompson have publicly backed Rodgers as their starting quarterback.

According to another person with knowledge, Favre's agent, Bus Cook, made repeated attempts to contact Thompson in the last few weeks, but Thompson did not return his calls. Cook did not return a message left at his office on Wednesday but told ESPN, "As far I know, right now, Brett Favre is retired and until he tells me something different, that's what it is."

Both McCarthy and Thompson were on vacation and could not be reached.

If Favre continues to express a desire to play and the Packers don't change their stance, it's unclear how strongly Favre would push for the team to trade him or release him. The quarterback is currently on the reserve-retired list. He is under contract through 2010, and the Packers would retain his rights for three seasons at the point in which he decided to return.

Favre's only response on Wednesday was a brief text message to the Biloxi (Miss.) Sun-Herald. When asked by the paper about the report about him wanting to return, Favre said, "It's all rumor." When asked about a possible media firestorm, Favre said, "No reason for it."

Packers cornerback Al Harris told ESPN that, "I've talked to Brett, and I know he has the itch to come back and play. If he will or not, I don't know. But I know he's feeling (like) he wants to play."

One of Favre's best friends from his playing days, former Packers center Frank Winters, said he spoke to Favre on Wednesday morning but claimed Favre made no mention of a possible return. When asked if he would be surprised if Favre decided to come back, Winters said: "Nothing surprises me in professional sports."

"Look at Michael Jordan," Winters continued. "He's taken a couple, three or four years (off), and came back. You never know. He may get bored with what he's doing. He may come back. He may not. He may just say, 'You know what, enough's enough. I just want to hang out and relax.' Last I talked to him, right now, it seems like he's had enough, and he's done and he's just going to sit back and enjoy and relax."

Favre's next scheduled appearance in Green Bay is on July 19 to present Winters for induction into the Packers Hall of Fame. It's unclear whether Wednesday's news will affect Favre's status for that event or any future appearances in town, including his jersey retirement ceremony.

Not surprised at any of this

[The Shadow]

If there is any substance to any of this, it would appear that Favre may have gone to the well once too often with the prima donna stuff, and had his bluff called by a strong GM.

[GrnBay007]

If there is any substance to any of this, it would appear that Favre may have gone to the well once too often with the prima donna stuff, and had his bluff called by a strong GM.

Is that strong GB ready for a huge blast by the media AND fans if there is any substance to this?

[The Shadow]

If there is any substance to any of this, it would appear that Favre may have gone to the well once too often with the prima donna stuff, and had his bluff called by a strong GM.

Is that strong GB ready for a huge blast by the media AND fans if there is any substance to this?

Well, I think the GM you'd want would be the guy who doesn't let fan/media reaction get in the way of what's best for the team.

[GrnBay007]

If there is any substance to any of this, it would appear that Favre may have gone to the well once too often with the prima donna stuff, and had his bluff called by a strong GM.

Is that strong GB ready for a huge blast by the media AND fans if there is any substance to this?

Well, I think the GM you'd want would be the guy who doesn't let fan/media reaction get in the way of what's best for the team.

True. Unless it really is all about ego.

[Scott Campbell]

If there is any substance to any of this, it would appear that Favre may have gone to the well once too often with the prima donna stuff, and had his bluff called by a strong GM.

Is that strong GB ready for a huge blast by the media AND fans if there is any substance to this?

Well, I think the GM you'd want would be the guy who doesn't let fan/media reaction get in the way of what's best for the team.

True. Unless it really is all about ego.

Are you talking about Brett's, or Ted's?