Offensive Line Depth Chart Change

[RashanGary]

According to McCarthy Spitz was the most consistant player. He's had a nice off-season. There's no reason to think he's not at the top of their list still, although he's sucked ass at LG every time so I think that experiment is over. I think his best position is center and Sitton brings some size and nasty in there at RG so two positions would be upgraded if Sitton was that rare rookie ready from day one.


Wells might ultimatly prove to be more reliable than Sitton because Sitton is so young, but I think Wells days are numbered no matter what. He's slightly below average, but doesn't kill you. I think he's a big part of the reason our run game in the redzone and short yardage was so pathetic. YOu just can't have guys that weak in the run game and expect to get a push.

[Joemailman]

Not a good sign when for the most part none of us have any idea how many quality starters we have and who they are.

Or maybe it's a sign of depth. I think a guy like Colledge would be a sure-fire starter on a team like Detroit or Chicago. We're probably tougher on the Packers OL than a lot of people. Maybe we're still spoiled by those years when Wahle/Flanagan/Rivera were the best inside trio in the NFL.I heard a lot of concern about the OL this time last year, and the Packers had one of the top offenses in the NFL. Now I'm hearing the same concerns. I also think the days of Wells as the starting Center are numbered. Sitton, Spitz, and Colledge/Barbre look to be the future, and I think it's a bright future.

[bobblehead]

My hunch is this...and its only a hunch. We break camp just like we ended last season. Clifton, College, Wells, Spitz, Tauscher. I agree that spitz will be the center next year, based on what coaches have said and other factors, like sitton getting an offseason in. Babre is probably gonna get one more good offseason in to become the LG with College backing LG and LT. Wells will back up center and RG (actually spitz goes to rg and wells takes center, effectively backing up both). If Moll continues to impress now that he is healthy he probably backs up RT.

What this all means is that we keep:

Clifton, Tauscher, Wells, Spitz, Sitton, Babre, College, Moll, and Giocominni this year (unless Gio can't impress then Coston). We break camp just like last year ended barring injury ect. Next year we will really see what happens. I know they are moving everyone around right now in order to find a working combo, but every scenario leaves us with one big flaw....except the status quo which is not optimal, but best we can do this season.

[Bretsky]

Not a good sign when for the most part none of us have any idea how many quality starters we have and who they are.

Or maybe it's a sign of depth. I think a guy like Colledge would be a sure-fire starter on a team like Detroit or Chicago. We're probably tougher on the Packers OL than a lot of people. Maybe we're still spoiled by those years when Wahle/Flanagan/Rivera were the best inside trio in the NFL.I heard a lot of concern about the OL this time last year, and the Packers had one of the top offenses in the NFL. Now I'm hearing the same concerns. I also think the days of Wells as the starting Center are numbered. Sitton, Spitz, and Colledge/Barbre look to be the future, and I think it's a bright future.

We agree to disagree; I don't think Colledge is a sure fire starter on many teams. Our QB had an incredible run of good play last year while the OL struggled to figure out who to run block.

I agree we have depth; I'm just not sure how many are ready to start.

[bobblehead]

I think college is phenomenal when he is paying attention to the play at hand...its when his mind wanders to other things and a 325 lb. DL owns him that he has problems.

[RashanGary]

He's a solid zone guard if he can get his damn inconsistancies cleaned up but he's not athletic enough to play LT. He gets beat with speed. He gets beat with power. You want guys at LT who can defend speed and power both, not neither.

I think Colledge might be a long term good LG in our system, but I don't see how he can play LT. Every chance he's gotten he gets torched.

[KYPack]

I don't pay close enough attention to the interior line during the season. I just don't have time to watch 3 or 4 times but Wist did. Wist said Wells got regularly rag dolled. Then the Packers coaches came out early in the off season and said they were asking too much of him against bigger DT's. They gently said what Wist said blutly, "Wells gets rag dolled".


He might do things right, but he's just not good enough. If they think Sitton is good enough to start now and has a lot higher ceiling I could see Wells being the odd man out because he's the best he's going to be and that best is really bad in the run game and really average in the pass game.

Yeah, Wist would regularly say that and Wist was regularly wrong. Go back in the forum and look at Wist's comments. Most of the time, I'd refute his assertions. Scott is small for tht position and has short arms. But he battles his ass off and never gives up.

I've seen him hold his own against the best. There was a game against the Vikes in which Scott held the point against those fat ass Williams boys and helped keep us in the game. He kept us in with hustle and great line calls and doubling at the right time. So much so, that 'ol 4 won us the game at crunch time. Guys make those comments 'cause they assume they are true, not because they watch what's happening.

This year, it's a different story. Scott's hurt and hurt badly. An abdominal injury seriously hampers any NFL player. Multiply that by 10 for a center. I have to wonder if Scott will be effective at any time this season. We may well have to go with Spitz as the center.

[Joemailman]

Yep, Wells looked bad Saturday night. He even had 2 bad snaps in shotgun formation, and I wonder if that was due to the injury. I admire Wells for his tenacity. However, I'm thinking the line is probably better with Spitz in there.

[RashanGary]

We'll have to agree to disagree. I trust Wists opinions. He may be pessemistic and wrong on Barnett (Barnett did do a 180 when Hawk got here) but he's been right on a lot of things.


He pays attention to line play. He's not even my big source though. I'm just remembering his comments and crediting him for what I read into the coaches talk (and actions) now.


Based on how I read the situation and the tone and context of the coaches comments over the last few months I'd say they're not sold on WElls and they know what they have so I'd say what he is, isn't enough for them. He may hold his job now, but my guess is next year it will be gone if not this year (although a rookie starting when he doesn't have to is a long shot). I was dead wrong on Ruvell Martin though, so hey, maybe Wells comes out and proves me wrong. I hope he does.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Wells is not established as a starter according to McCarthy. Earlier this week McCarthy said Spitz was the best interior lineman last year.

I think you misread both of these. McCarthy has said Wells hasn't established himself, but more because he hasn't been healthy. Until he regains his health, he won't be starting. The second one is coachspeak... depending on when and how they are asked. I think after the season the coaches generally said Wells graded highest among the OL. Spitz was their most consistent OG.

[pbmax]

Its not the fairest way to judge, but Wells has had his fair share of trouble with the bigger of the two Williams. I think that was the thrust of the article JH was referring to. That they couldn't leave him alone, they had to double team, combo or wham block the galoot. The game at Lambeau had the Packers running plays they had not run often at that point of the season and they were running wide, sealing the middle from pursuit and attacking the LB or safety.

That probably works better on Pat than Kevin, who is amazingly quick.

In and of itself, that isn't a reason to replace him, unless Spitz is close to his equal or the new guard is a step up. Neither seems to be true as of now. And most of the Viking's opponents struggle with the two. And you are right, it might only be injury that forces him out now.

I still take it as a positive that Sitton forced his way into the lineup, even if he has to go back to 2nd. My only concern is the same I mentioned above, that Sitton was elevated because they didn't like their options with Colledge/Barbre.

Yeah, Wist would regularly say that and Wist was regularly wrong. Go back in the forum and look at Wist's comments. Most of the time, I'd refute his assertions. Scott is small for tht position and has short arms. But he battles his ass off and never gives up.

I've seen him hold his own against the best. There was a game against the Vikes in which Scott held the point against those fat ass Williams boys and helped keep us in the game. He kept us in with hustle and great line calls and doubling at the right time. So much so, that 'ol 4 won us the game at crunch time. Guys make those comments 'cause they assume they are true, not because they watch what's happening.

This year, it's a different story. Scott's hurt and hurt badly. An abdominal injury seriously hampers any NFL player. Multiply that by 10 for a center. I have to wonder if Scott will be effective at any time this season. We may well have to go with Spitz as the center.

[pbmax]

Article on not asking Wells to do too much, from McGinn's preseason position breakdown:

Position by Position: Offensive Line

Spitz also started three games for an injured Scott Wells and fared so well that Campen says he might be an even better center.

Pound for pound, Wells is the strongest of the group, according to Campen. He’s also committed, bright, quick and eager for any challenge. Now the Packers are looking at ways to prevent the undersized Wells from getting beaten by behemoths in the run game.

“Maybe we asked him to do too much,” Campen said. “Maybe at times reaching a 380-pound guy is not as realistic as we thought it could be. We’ve done some things that maybe we can help him out a little bit.”

[KYPack]

Its not the fairest way to judge, but Wells has had his fair share of trouble with the bigger of the two Williams. I think that was the thrust of the article JH was referring to. That they couldn't leave him alone, they had to double team, combo or wham block the galoot. The game at Lambeau had the Packers running plays they had not run often at that point of the season and they were running wide, sealing the middle from pursuit and attacking the LB or safety.

Agreed. Hell, you have to adjust with those two fatass dancing bears. My point is Wellls has never had as much troubles with 'em as the guards have had over the last 3 seasons.

Scott Wells has been our best interior lineman over those last three years. Now, it looks like his run may be over. I don't see him bouncing back with an abdominal strain. Those things keep cropping up and may screw up his entire season.

Then it's Sitton at RG, Spitz at center, and Barbre/Colledge at LG. From the looks of it, Colledge will be the LG at least in the early going.

(Has to edit this. I meant Barbre/Colledge at LG. Man, I wish we'd find a set lineup.)

[pbmax]

If his injury carries over, I think you've got it. I wonder what has held Barbre back? Is it picking up a new position? That Wonderlic score wasn't anything to swoon over. I understand that Colledge might never be a starting caliber LT, but I wish we'd hit on one of these guys on the first try instead of waiting for three years to figure it out. Barbre doesn't appear to have beaten Colledge out, but he is obviously behind Spitz and possibly Sitton. And unless he sees the field with the ones, he won't be at guard again (since he would backup Clifton at Denver with the 2s) until very late.

I just wish I knew why some lineman take so long to figure out a pro position. Clifton has been LT since he was drafted. Tauscher was always just about to move to guard except Dotson's back went out. Wahle flopped around and so did Rivera (both guard pos). Leonard Davis was a high pick but didn't flourish until he was a guard, I believe. Colledge gets moved as does Spitz. But there appears to be no question Sitton is a guard.

Its like watching chess but not knowing the rules or how the pieces should move. Looks interesting, but we're baffled anyway. Maybe we need a OLineman DNA test rather than an HGH blood test.

Hell, you have to adjust with those two fatass dancing bears. My point is Wellls has never had as much troubles with 'em as the guards have had over the last 3 seasons.

Scott Wells has been our best interior lineman over those last three years. Now, it looks like his run may be over. I don't see him bouncing back with an abdominal strain. Those things keep cropping up and may screw up his entire season.

Then it's Sitton at RG, Spitz at center, and Barbre/Colledge at RG. From the looks of it, Colledge will be the LG at least in the early going.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Re: Offensive Line Depth Chart Change

Depth chart updated 8/18 has Colledge (LG) and Spitz (RG) as the first team guards.

Oh my God, where is KY? In your face!

Also, our little debate was that you said Colledge would start over Sitton at RG. Colledge is now the starter at LG, a little topic we never argued over.

I suggested the line would be exactly the way it is now, obviously Colledge is better suited to LG and Spitz to RG.

But honestly, I don't have a strong sense of what is going to happen. I only picked Colledge because experience counts a lot.

Even though Colledge is listed as a starter for the moment, I don't think it is unthinkable that he would be a surprise cut! That's right. I wonder if his promotion to a starter is so the coaches can get a hard look at him. It's happened before that guards have had stints as starters in the preseason and been gone in September. Colledge is in his third year, and he's still floundering far too much.