Packers worktout punters today

[red]

the thing that bothers me most is that it looks like they did very little research on him before they cut ryan and signed him.

right after we signed him i went to a couple redskins boards, and they were all happy as a pig in shit to get rid of him. they listed all the problems with him that we have been seeing since we signed him

and the kicker is, that ryan had a better net average between the 2. the number that is most important

I'd love to see this stat. My memory of Ryan is that between the 20s was when he was likely to shank or line drive it setting up a big return. It was when he was closer to the fifty or opposing ground, when he tried to sky one, that he would hit a 54 or 60 yard punt right into the endzone.

I liked Ryan's attitude, tackling and running ability though, so I am open to the opposing numbers.

heres the career stats from nfl.com

frost

http://www.nfl.com/players/derrickfrost/profile?id=FRO666178

ryan

http://www.nfl.com/players/jonryan/profile?id=RYA229481

frosts career net average is 36.5, ryans is 36.8

and as bad as frost has looked this year, he is having the best season stat wise of his career. and ryan stat wise is having his worst year. so the net #'s are a little bit closer now then they were when the change was made

hope thats what you were looking for

[Pacopete4]

TT was an idiot for releasing Ryan and now Karma is kicking TT's ass. I love it.

Strange comment for a Packer fan, in my opinion. Do you despise TT so much that you take pleasure out of the team struggling just so he looks bad???

I don't despise TT. But I thought it was extremly moronic to release Ryan 6 days beofre the opener after not giving him any competition in camp. Thats why I am glad this particular move blew up in his face.

what a troll

[MJZiggy]

Frost had his last shank right in front of me and, quite frankly, I could have done that myself.

[red]

i think we need a video clip of ziggy punting a ball

[cpk1994]

I don't despise TT. But I thought it was extremly moronic to release Ryan 6 days beofre the opener after not giving him any competition in camp. Thats why I am glad this particular move blew up in his face.

Why is that moronic?
-few teams took extra punters, kickers or snappers into training camp because of the lower roster #s allowed.
- Stock apparently knew Frost and thought he was an upgrade.
- Frost wasn't available until Washington released him in the last cutdown.
- TT may not have cut Ryan for just "anybody", he wanted an improvement.

If TT was moronic, what about Seattle who cut Plackermaier a week into the season and then signed Ryan?

Even if you are right and it was "moronic"; why are you, as a supposed Packer fan, glad to see it blow up in his face? I would think you would want the Packers to succeed, and would hope that you are proven wrong and TT right!

Becuase I hated the move. Cutting Ryan was a huge mistake. Also, so what if few teams took extra punters into practice? If TT was really disillusioned with Ryan he should have brought someone in with the hopes that that might push Ryan harder. Or if you were that disilusioned, why not just cut him earlier? Leading Ryan on through all of camp and then pulling the rug out from under him right before the opener was completely bush league. For those reasons is why I am gald this blew up in his face.

[SkinBasket]

I don't despise TT. But I thought it was extremly moronic to release Ryan 6 days beofre the opener after not giving him any competition in camp. Thats why I am glad this particular move blew up in his face.

Why is that moronic?
-few teams took extra punters, kickers or snappers into training camp because of the lower roster #s allowed.
- Stock apparently knew Frost and thought he was an upgrade.
- Frost wasn't available until Washington released him in the last cutdown.
- TT may not have cut Ryan for just "anybody", he wanted an improvement.

If TT was moronic, what about Seattle who cut Plackermaier a week into the season and then signed Ryan?

Even if you are right and it was "moronic"; why are you, as a supposed Packer fan, glad to see it blow up in his face? I would think you would want the Packers to succeed, and would hope that you are proven wrong and TT right!

Becuase I hated the move. Cutting Ryan was a huge mistake. Also, so what if few teams took extra punters into practice? If TT was really disillusioned with Ryan he should have brought someone in with the hopes that that might push Ryan harder. Or if you were that disilusioned, why not just cut him earlier? Leading Ryan on through all of camp and then pulling the rug out from under him right before the opener was completely bush league. For those reasons is why I am gald this blew up in his face.

He already explained this to you once. See the red highlights above.

I happen to think you're wrong, so I hope your life explodes in your face and you get fired from your job. I think that's fair.

[Patler]

Becuase I hated the move. Cutting Ryan was a huge mistake. Also, so what if few teams took extra punters into practice? If TT was really disillusioned with Ryan he should have brought someone in with the hopes that that might push Ryan harder. Or if you were that disilusioned, why not just cut him earlier? Leading Ryan on through all of camp and then pulling the rug out from under him right before the opener was completely bush league. For those reasons is why I am gald this blew up in his face.

Cutting Ryan was a huge mistake? I don't think so. The guy was a marginally adequate punter at best. He may still develop into a good one, punters sometimes take time, but it was clear that the Packers were not satisfied with the rate of his development.

I assume no one was available during TC who they thought was better than Ryan, or they would have brought him in. The had DeBauche until just before camp then released him. They were probably satisfied with Ryan over everyone available until Frost became available. They thought Frost was better, so made the move. That's the way it works in pro sports.

Pulling the rug out from under Ryan? That is what happens every year on every team. What about all the other players who were released on the final cutdown? What about Tracy White who was released yesterday? What about Seattle cutting Plackermaier after their first game? Every marginal pro athlete faces that every year. They are on the team until the team needs someone else, or finds someone they think is just a bit better. TT didn't do anything different than any other GM does when faced with the same situation. They take the player they think is better.

[KYPack]

Becuase I hated the move. Cutting Ryan was a huge mistake. Also, so what if few teams took extra punters into practice? If TT was really disillusioned with Ryan he should have brought someone in with the hopes that that might push Ryan harder. Or if you were that disilusioned, why not just cut him earlier? Leading Ryan on through all of camp and then pulling the rug out from under him right before the opener was completely bush league. For those reasons is why I am gald this blew up in his face.

Cutting Ryan was a huge mistake? I don't think so. The guy was a marginally adequate punter at best. He may still develop into a good one, punters sometimes take time, but it was clear that the Packers were not satisfied with the rate of his development.

I assume no one was available during TC who they thought was better than Ryan, or they would have brought him in. The had DeBauche until just before camp then released him. They were probably satisfied with Ryan over everyone available until Frost became available. They thought Frost was better, so made the move. That's the way it works in pro sports.

Pulling the rug out from under Ryan? That is what happens every year on every team. What about all the other players who were released on the final cutdown? What about Tracy White who was released yesterday? What about Seattle cutting Plackermaier after their first game? Every marginal pro athlete faces that every year. They are on the team until the team needs someone else, or finds someone they think is just a bit better. TT didn't do anything different than any other GM does when faced with the same situation. They take the player they think is better.

Ryan was more trouble than he was worth.

When they signed him, he was a three step punter. They worked with him and converted him to a two step for the quicker release. But he would revert or make a skip, then two step kick. That's a big issue. Te would also hit liners when the rush was strong. His first season, he was at the bottom for net average, due to his tendency to hit the low kick when rushed.

His one big thing that drew his fans was his ability to drive a super long kick from time to time. The coaches don't like that shit. Sure it looks cool, but you get long returns from long kicks, they go far beyond the gunners and the rest of the cover team.

Ryan was above hitting the odd shank here and there, either.

Frost doesn't look to be the answer either, but they'll find a guy. They are out there.

[mraynrand]

Is Sean Vendetta still available?

[Carolina_Packer]

How about B.J. Sander? He's had plenty of time to rest his leg.

[Patler]

Is Sean Vendetta still available?

I think there is an issue of the veterans minimum salary exceeding the allowable income for his Social Security payments if he signs too early. He won't be available until later in the season.

[Pacopete4]

isnt it weird that many bitch about the kicker positions as "non football players" but when theyre team doesnt have a good one, they bitch and moan about the situation..

[Patler]

isnt it weird that many bitch about the kicker positions as "non football players" but when theyre team doesnt have a good one, they bitch and moan about the situation..

I think it is more the other players that bitch about the kicker positions being "non-players"!

Alex Karras used to have a hilarious schtick about kickers. Of course he played when the foreign soccer-style kickers first came into the league, and the country was very receptive to ethnic stereotype humor at the time. Probably wouldn't be so well received today!!!

[Pacopete4]

isnt it weird that many bitch about the kicker positions as "non football players" but when theyre team doesnt have a good one, they bitch and moan about the situation..

I think it is more the other players that bitch about the kicker positions being "non-players"!

Alex Karras used to have a hilarious schtick about kickers. Of course he played when the foreign soccer-style kickers first came into the league, and the country was very receptive to ethnic stereotype humor at the time. Probably wouldn't be so well received today!!!

Patler I respect ur opinion a ton... who out there is a good a punter that we should be looking at?

[Patler]

Patler I respect ur opinion a ton... who out there is a good a punter that we should be looking at?

Thanks. To be honest, I can't think of one. Personally I think the quality of punters is down even among those that teams are currently using. There isn't a surplus of established guys looking for work. The unemployed ones are literally the BJ Sanders type.

I think what you hope for is finding one who finally puts it all together, or a rookie without a proven track record that is worth the risk. It is not uncommon for punters to bounce around for several years before finally "getting it". Ironically, that could even be a guy like Sanders, who was decent in college but has not translated that to the pros.

The Packers are probably taking the best approach of bringing in a bunch for tryouts and picking who they like.

Frost seemed like an established veteran who would be an upgrade over Ryan. SO far he has been no worse and no better than Ryan. He may still settle down and be what they hoped he would.