Favre and 13-3

[bobblehead]

I was looking over BF's wonderful 13-3 season after Mobbs last obnoxious post.

Game 1: BF singlehandedly beat Philadelphia puttting up zero TD's. We won the game later on a second muffed punt. The special teams played really hard out of pure respect for BF...who did nothing in the game.

Game 6: BF tosses a couple picks to be the all time leader, but CWood takes a fumble to the house and picks one off. BF tossed one pick late in the third nursing a 17-14 lead. Good thing he inpired woodson so much.

Game 7: The BF inpired offense puts up a whopping 13 points in regulation mainly due to a blown coverage that JJ took 79 yards. Defense was huge late in the game stopping the broncos on 3rd and 1 to save the game. In OT BF pads his stats on a second blown coverage as Jennings takes one 75 yards to the house....we scored a whopping 19 points.

Game 8: The lowly chiefs play us tough. In the first half with a 6 point lead and time running out BF puts one right on the money to a defender and cheifs get a 7-6 lead into the half. BF does play well in the second half leading 2 TD drives, but in the last 3:05 GB scores 17 points (another pick 6 for CWood)

Game 9: the emergence of Ryan grant. Packers put 14 men in the box and shut down peterson....Rumor is that the vikes had a QB, but you wouldn't know it by all the 3 and outs.

Game 10: BF isn't the oldest guy on the field and his leadership and youth lead the team to a win. Playing against vinny, brett shows how he inspires others...twill returns a punt for a TD, Cory williams is the defensive player of the week and favre/grant stay on the field for something like 60 minutes as vinny is much like tavarius.

Game 12: Dallas...dont' wanna talk about it.

Game 13: All BF against the lowly raiders...except for blackmons 2 TD's and Grants TD.

Game 14: Bigby picks off 2 as we beat the powerhouse rams.

Game 16: Our backups beat the lions...surprise.

Now I realize that without BF we couldn't have possibly been 13-3...he singlehandedly beat so many powerhouse teams that year.

[Partial]

http://www.cracked.com/video_16786_how-not-get-kiss.html

[gex]

http://www.cracked.com/video_16786_how-not-get-kiss.html

lol

[Bretsky]

Re: Favre and 13-3

I was looking over BF's wonderful 13-3 season after Mobbs last obnoxious post.

Game 1: BF singlehandedly beat Philadelphia puttting up zero TD's. We won the game later on a second muffed punt. The special teams played really hard out of pure respect for BF...who did nothing in the game.

Game 6: BF tosses a couple picks to be the all time leader, but CWood takes a fumble to the house and picks one off. BF tossed one pick late in the third nursing a 17-14 lead. Good thing he inpired woodson so much.

Game 7: The BF inpired offense puts up a whopping 13 points in regulation mainly due to a blown coverage that JJ took 79 yards. Defense was huge late in the game stopping the broncos on 3rd and 1 to save the game. In OT BF pads his stats on a second blown coverage as Jennings takes one 75 yards to the house....we scored a whopping 19 points.

Game 8: The lowly chiefs play us tough. In the first half with a 6 point lead and time running out BF puts one right on the money to a defender and cheifs get a 7-6 lead into the half. BF does play well in the second half leading 2 TD drives, but in the last 3:05 GB scores 17 points (another pick 6 for CWood)

Game 9: the emergence of Ryan grant. Packers put 14 men in the box and shut down peterson....Rumor is that the vikes had a QB, but you wouldn't know it by all the 3 and outs.

Game 10: BF isn't the oldest guy on the field and his leadership and youth lead the team to a win. Playing against vinny, brett shows how he inspires others...twill returns a punt for a TD, Cory williams is the defensive player of the week and favre/grant stay on the field for something like 60 minutes as vinny is much like tavarius.

Game 12: Dallas...dont' wanna talk about it.

Game 13: All BF against the lowly raiders...except for blackmons 2 TD's and Grants TD.

Game 14: Bigby picks off 2 as we beat the powerhouse rams.

Game 16: Our backups beat the lions...surprise.

Now I realize that without BF we couldn't have possibly been 13-3...he singlehandedly beat so many powerhouse teams that year.

If you are going extreme the other way a good job; but lots of good games in between the bad ones and bottom line is he still led us to a great record.

I think all of these comparisons are silly

TT chose to make this decision for the long term future and in doing so risked the short term success of the Packers.

Maybe he thought AROD would be every bit as good as Favre and the offense would roll on just as well without him.

Regardless if the logic was "for the future long term interests" we just have to see how it plays out.

[Freak Out]

We were 13-3 with Favre. Enough said.

[RashanGary]

My opinion on the matter is this,

The Packers are not as good without Brett Favre. Rodgers is doing a good job and showing signs that he could develop into something really, really good but he's struggling getting his protections set and he's just not producing the way this offense used to. He's doing well, but he's not Brett Favre. Favre may have thrown picks but overall he is better at 39 than Rodgers is in his first year IMO.

That said, I don't think this team is SB bound with or without Brett Favre. The defensive and offensive lines are just not good enough. The defensive line isn't deep enough and wears down, eventually folding when it matters most and the offensive line cannot be counted on to really impose their will in the run game when it's needed most. Favre would have made us better, but I don't think it would have been enough.

At the end of the day I think the right decision was made because this team is still growing and just wasn't going to peak within Favre's window. Also, with Favre's attitude, I think a stand had to be taken. I'm glad the way things have gone. I think the Packers are going to do better down the stretch, possibly make the playoffs and will get even better as the years go on. The experience Rodgers is getting is very valuable. Overall, I think the Packers are in a good situation. I jsut don't think it's going to happen this year.

[RashanGary]

We were 13-3 with Favre. Enough said.

There are a lot of holes in that. The Jets were 10-6 with Pennington two years ago. They went 4-12 the next year. It happens. The Packers were 4-12 with Brett a couple years ago, nuff said? No, because a lot goes into each season and stating a record of one year with the QB can't really be taken as some tell all IMO.

[Bretsky]

My opinion on the matter is this,

The Packers are not as good without Brett Favre. Rodgers is doing a good job and showing signs that he could develop into something really, really good but he's struggling getting his protections set and he's just not producing the way this offense used to. He's doing well, but he's not Brett Favre. Favre may have thrown picks but overall he is better at 39 than Rodgers is in his first year IMO.

That said, I don't think this team is SB bound with or without Brett Favre. The defensive and offensive lines are just not good enough. The defensive line isn't deep enough and wears down, eventually folding when it matters most and the offensive line cannot be counted on to really impose their will in the run game when it's needed most. Favre would have made us better, but I don't think it would have been enough.

At the end of the day I think the right decision was made because this team is still growing and just wasn't going to peak within Favre's window. Also, with Favre's attitude, I think a stand had to be taken. I'm glad the way things have gone. I think the Packers are going to do better down the stretch, possibly make the playoffs and will get even better as the years go on. The experience Rodgers is getting is very valuable. Overall, I think the Packers are in a good situation. I jsut don't think it's going to happen this year.

I have complete respect for this viewpoint.

Whether I agree with TT or not, it's ok that this decision was made with the best long term interests of the Packers in mind.

I do think we had a shot at the SB if they kept him around...especially minus the injuries

But I'm fine to play the wait and see game for a couple years and I'll keep my conservative expectations

[RashanGary]

I think a big part of the decision was how Brett had acted, some of hte things he said and him not committing to the program the way McCarthy wanted him to (esspecially in the offseason). It was a tough decision. It probably didn't help immediately, but I don't think it helps to cave to a player that is stepping way out of bounds either. I think Brett made this happen by crossing lines that the team would not tolerate. Again, it's tough and it hurts a little but I think if they keep making good decisions and keep a real team oriented focus, that good things will happen.

[Bretsky]

I think a big part of the decision was how Brett had acted, some of hte things he said and him not committing to the program the way McCarthy wanted him to (esspecially in the offseason). It was a tough decision. It probably didn't help immediately, but I don't think it helps to cave to a player that is stepping way out of bounds either. I think Brett made this happen by crossing lines that the team would not tolerate.

I know we're going to disagree on this one

I think TT and possibly MM as well were perfectly fine moving on with AROD and may have underestimated the intangibes Favre added to this team in terms of making players around him better and doing the little things to win.

[bobblehead]

I think a big part of the decision was how Brett had acted, some of hte things he said and him not committing to the program the way McCarthy wanted him to (esspecially in the offseason). It was a tough decision. It probably didn't help immediately, but I don't think it helps to cave to a player that is stepping way out of bounds either. I think Brett made this happen by crossing lines that the team would not tolerate.

I know we're going to disagree on this one

I think TT and possibly MM as well were perfectly fine moving on with AROD and may have underestimated the intangibes Favre added to this team in terms of making players around him better and doing the little things to win.

See, I posted my post tongue in cheek and I was mocking that whole "intangibles" thingy. BF was very good last year, but lets not forget that other guys really stepped up...guys that BF had no impact on like blackman, woodson, ect. Last year was the right combination of BF being recharged, a weak schedule and catching teams at the right time. This year is just the opposite. BF is leading the NFL in interceptions, yet jackasses on this forum want to claim his "intangibles" are why the jets are beating a bunch of injured and crappy teams. As JH pointed out, pennington was 10-6 a couple years ago...when BF wins 10 games with the jets talk to me.

The fricking dolphins are over .500 this season and pennington is the QB, so don't tell me its all about one player. This is a team game for christs sake, but idiots like ...I won't mention names...can't seem to let go of BF. I have said it over and over, he is an all time great, thanx for the memories, but if you aren't committed to working with your teammates in the offseason don't come marching back and expecting keys to the stadium. He wasn't the franchise and he doesn't win games alone.

Is AR everything that BF is?? not at this point, we all agree, but FUCK can we not make it the topic of every stinkin thread? I called out JH on it in the past and he has seemed to really focus on football and not pushing buttons...if only certain posters on the other side could display such a high level of maturity.

[Partial]

Dude, what a crock of S. The AFC East is third most competitive division in the NFL behind the AFC South and the NFC East. We are in the worst division.

The Jets have risen up and beaten good teams... teams above .500 with some legendary coaches like BB. They've played better in the 4th quarter than in the 1st quarter, and Favre's decision making has improved week by week as he gets comfortable in the offense.

On the other hand, we've yet to beat a team with a winning record. We beat an extremely banged up Indy... they'd kill us if we played them today.. beat Minnesota and Detroit before they had game film on A-Rod, and Detroit nearly pulled the game out after pulling ahead in the 4th before their massive implosion, and beat seattle with their 3rd string quarterback... possibly the worst team in the league.

As tape of our vanilla offense becomes more available, teams are shutting us down. Our offensive production has declined big time.

Hard to argue with the directions the teams are going in as well as the records.

As for the off-season, what a load of BS. I didn't hear anyone calling for Chuck, Al, Bubba, etc heads when they opted to skip ALL of the optional off-season work and do it on their own. This is the weakest excuse ever. Plenty of players have skipped camp and played fine.

It's obvious to me that TT wanted him gone. You can't be on a multiyear rebuilding plan with a 39 year old quarterback. Right when you get the talent and start to peak, the guy could retire and you're back at square one.

TT put a lot of faith in A-Rod, both in the contract and putting his job on the line, so he must see something in him that he really likes. IMO, if the Jets succeed and A-Rod and the Packers falter over the next year or two, TT will lose his job and one of the reasons everyone will say is the mishandling of the Favre situation.

[gex]

Dude, what a crock of S. The AFC East is third most competitive division in the NFL behind the AFC South and the NFC East. We are in the worst division.

The Jets have risen up and beaten good teams... teams above .500 with some legendary coaches like BB. They've played better in the 4th quarter than in the 1st quarter, and Favre's decision making has improved week by week as he gets comfortable in the offense.

On the other hand, we've yet to beat a team with a winning record. We beat an extremely banged up Indy... they'd kill us if we played them today.. beat Minnesota and Detroit before they had game film on A-Rod, and Detroit nearly pulled the game out after pulling ahead in the 4th before their massive implosion, and beat seattle with their 3rd string quarterback... possibly the worst team in the league.

As tape of our vanilla offense becomes more available, teams are shutting us down. Our offensive production has declined big time.

Hard to argue with the directions the teams are going in as well as the records.

As for the off-season, what a load of BS. I didn't hear anyone calling for Chuck, Al, Bubba, etc heads when they opted to skip ALL of the optional off-season work and do it on their own. This is the weakest excuse ever. Plenty of players have skipped camp and played fine.

It's obvious to me that TT wanted him gone. You can't be on a multiyear rebuilding plan with a 39 year old quarterback. Right when you get the talent and start to peak, the guy could retire and you're back at square one.

TT put a lot of faith in A-Rod, both in the contract and putting his job on the line, so he must see something in him that he really likes. IMO, if the Jets succeed and A-Rod and the Packers falter over the next year or two, TT will lose his job and one of the reasons everyone will say is the mishandling of the Favre situation.

QFT

[PlantPage55]

We were 13-3 with Favre. Enough said.

Rex Grossman took the Bears to the Bowl 'nuff said?

[Fritz]

You know, Bretsky makes a good point above - one can argue that having Favre here this year may have been the best short-term chance at a Super Bowl, while keeping Arod around instead (and I'm not sure that could've happened had Favre stuck around for this year and another agonizing retirement melodrama next offseason) may be best for the long term interests of the team.

But here's the thing: we all know that a Super Bowl year requires not only talent but a lucky year in terms of injuries. With two major defenders out for the year in Jenkins and Barnett, it's entirely possible that with Favre this team might've still been unable to get to the SB.

I still think that in the long run TT made the right move after Favre retired, almost unretired, retired again and unretired.