Hawk at MLB ... after thoughts

[The Gunshooter]

Assigning Barnett at MLB was a gamble that Mike Sherman took as Barnett never played MLB in college.

In his first two years at Oregon State, Barnett was a safety. For his last two years, he played outside linebacker. OSU had a solid MLB in Richard Seigler(who played a couple of seasons in the NFL).

As a couple of posters have noted, it is too early to judge Hawk's effectiveness from just one game. I do think, however, that Barnett could be an effective outside backer, be it strong or weak side.

It has been my philosophy for years that the reason teams who play on artificial turf fade at the end of the season and have only won two super bowls out of 42 is because those teams tend to utilize smaller players. These smaller guys tend to get banged up as the season progresses and then they are no longer more agile than the bigger player who plays on grass. Once that happens the smaller guy gets mauled.

That's why Barnett is useless to me. With his reduced agilty due to age, ACL and his sizable salary, he is not part of a championship formula.

He's only 27 years old. I don't think his age is a factor at all at this point with his agility. His ACL injury will have more to say about that then anything next season. He has no history of being repeated injured so I don't see how your philosophy of injury to these types of players applies to Barnett at this point.

We'll see how he comes back from his injury but if he heals fine I think he's still a very good LB.

If you like the George Cumby type LB then you will love Barnett.

Sorry never saw him play so don't understand your reference.

http://www2.jsonline.com/packer/news/mar02/30481.asp

[vince]

We have one data point here. Barnett was a house on fire last year, and was a big part of that defense that got us to 13-3. This year, he was underwhelming. Who knows if it was the grim hand of age, minor nagging injuries, a tumultuous offseason, or what. Hopefully next year he returns to his 2007 form. Hawk has demonstrated himself as steady but unspectacular with occasional flashes at Will, and he played a good game at Mike. But one good game is not enough to determine anything. The Bears offense really wasn't on the field long enough to really get a good scouting report with Hawk at MLB.

Point taken, but Hawk appears to have good football instincts, be a more punishing run stuffer than Barnett, and appears to be fast and athletic enough to get from sideline to sideline. While one game is one game, seeing his play over the last two years leads me to believe A.J. Hawk may have the goods to get it done in the middle. In fact, he may well be better in the middle than he's been at the weakside. If that pans out, I don't know what you do with Barnett, Popp, and Chillar, but whatever you do, you may well have gotten both tougher and faster in all the right places. And as you say, we'll get plenty of opportunity to see Hawk in multiple different matchups for the rest of this year to see how he pans out.

It'll be interesting to see how everyone is used. Hopefully, everyone can stay healthy from here on out, as one more injury makes us very light at LB. Chillar's a very important guy on this defense now.

[HarveyWallbangers]

http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/article/20081117/PKR01/81117162/1058

“It’s only one game,” Packers linebackers coach Winston Moss said. “I hate to speculate. We’ll take it a game at a time, but he looked awfully good in there. He looked extremely comfortable. He did play to some of his strengths that we liked with him when we evaluated him coming out of college, so if he continues to improve on that, we’ll revisit that question maybe at the end of the year.”

After a successful debut in place of injured starter Nick Barnett, Hawk almost certainly will finish the season as the starting middle linebacker. There were some scouts who believed Hawk was more suited to play the middle after the Packers drafted him fifth overall in 2006. But the Packers had long been reluctant to move Barnett, the starter in the middle since 2003.

Hawk had no trouble getting the play calls to his teammates and seemed to excel while operating more in the box and less in coverage than he did playing the weak side.

“We’ve always thought (Hawk) had great instincts, and those instincts showed up (on Sunday),” Moss said. “When his matchup is more in the box, it allowed him to stay in the box and actually be a little bit more aggressive. When that tight end is releasing all the time and he has to get downfield and cover and has to play in space, I think he does an adequate job of that, but he is better staying around the box and playing up the field and attacking guys as opposed to playing off and reacting to the guy.”

[run pMc]

It has been my philosophy for years that the reason teams who play on artificial turf fade at the end of the season and have only won two super bowls out of 42 is because those teams tend to utilize smaller players. These smaller guys tend to get banged up as the season progresses and then they are no longer more agile than the bigger player who plays on grass. Once that happens the smaller guy gets mauled.

That's why Barnett is useless to me. With his reduced agilty due to age, ACL and his sizable salary, he is not part of a championship formula.

He's only 27 years old. I don't think his age is a factor at all at this point with his agility. His ACL injury will have more to say about that then anything next season. He has no history of being repeated injured so I don't see how your philosophy of injury to these types of players applies to Barnett at this point.

We'll see how he comes back from his injury but if he heals fine I think he's still a very good LB.

I think it's early to speculate that Barnett won't recover from the surgery and offseason rehab. He hasn't even had the surgery yet. I do think he was having an off-year, but I'm guessing the DL had a lot to do with it. I don't think his age will be a factor -- Woodson seems to be able to hang with WRs.

All players take a pounding, especially as the weather gets colder and the run game becomes more important. I wouldn't put too much stock in the turf or size as anything more than interesting theories -- TB, IND won recent Super Bowls with fast undersized LBs in the Cover 2.

As for GB switching to a 3-4, I don't see that happening. It usually requires a regime change and several years of drafting for that to take place (see: SF) and even then it's no guarantee to take root. From what I can tell TT hasn't been drafting 3-4 players, and the Sanders/Bates is a 4-3 style of defense.

[HarveyWallbangers]

All players take a pounding, especially as the weather gets colder and the run game becomes more important. I wouldn't put too much stock in the turf or size as anything more than interesting theories -- TB, IND won recent Super Bowls with fast undersized LBs in the Cover 2.

As for GB switching to a 3-4, I don't see that happening. It usually requires a regime change and several years of drafting for that to take place (see: SF) and even then it's no guarantee to take root. From what I can tell TT hasn't been drafting 3-4 players, and the Sanders/Bates is a 4-3 style of defense.

Agreed. I do get the feeling the coaches were almost waiting for something like this to happen, so they could move Hawk to the middle. If Hawk flourishes, it will be a lot easier for them to convince Barnett that a move outside is for the best.

[The Leaper]

Hawk is a natural MLB...he is playing out of position at OLB, which is why he will never be dominant there.

He looked very good in his first game at MLB against a pretty solid OL and run game. I'm guessing he only gets better from here.

[texaspackerbacker]

No way a change of scheme is gonna happen, however, I have come around to the point of view that Hawk in the middle and Barnett on the outside makes more sense.

[Joemailman]

I don't think any of us should be too surprised that Hawk was better in the run than Barnett, at least when playing against a physical-run oriented team like the Bears. It should be interesting when they play a pass-first team this coming week.

You'll probably see the nickel a lot again this week. N.O. has the #1 pass offense, but are near the bottom in rushing defense, averaging just 3.7 p/c.