Harrell - again.....

[RashanGary]

Well, if Harrell didn't understand the importance of hard work in the offseason it's nice to see that he gets it now.

Maybe the back wasn't his "fault" per se, but the way things have unravelled it certainly looks to everyone involved (including him) that it was at least partially.


I'm leaning toward him being a lazy bastard and never getting his damn head on straight but maybe this disaster is a blessing in disguise. Maybe he's not going to be perpetually injured and will bounce back to healthy the way Blackmon did after two years on the bench. Blackmon was a 4th rounder and Harrell a 1st so the perception and criticism is much different. Still, maybe he can come around and become a player. Maybe he comes in, works his butt off in the offseason and vows to never be in anything but exceptional shape again. Maybe he's a lazy bastard, never works hard and just flames out but there is that last shred of hope. We'll see. I really hope the best for him. Just having him bounce back and become a player would mean a lot to this defense.

[KYPack]

Does it occur to anybody that maybe Ryan pickett has the right idea--just lay low and heal up in the off-season?

I don't know if Harrell was lifting weights or what he was doing when he hurt his back, but it's safe to say it wouldn't have happened sitting around watching TV. Back in the day, when players didn't do all this off-season training, it seems to me there was a lot less injuries.

Some guys maybe need it--somebody trying to bulk up or whatever, but I'm convinced most players would be better off just giving their bodies a rest. That is especially true for somebody coming off an injury.

The impression I got was Harrell is a little lazy. He did absolutely nothing after the Giants game. Then when he came back to GB for the off-season weight training, he blew out his back. Harrell was to work out on his own down in Tenn, before returning to the team monitored weight work.

Instead, all Harrell did was lift forkfulls of Mom's sweet potato pie into his face. The coaches should have made sure his was fit enough to lift heavy, but they didn't & he didn't do his work and boom the kid's back was blown out.

At least there is a little truth in these latest articles. This kid is hurt and if he doesn't bounce back by pre-season next year, he is done. He actually showed some flashes last season, but he's now a shadow of that. IR him and see if he heals. Two operations and all this time and the back is still bad? That's sounds like he's done to me.

[Guiness]

Does it occur to anybody that maybe Ryan pickett has the right idea--just lay low and heal up in the off-season?

I don't know if Harrell was lifting weights or what he was doing when he hurt his back, but it's safe to say it wouldn't have happened sitting around watching TV. Back in the day, when players didn't do all this off-season training, it seems to me there was a lot less injuries.

Some guys maybe need it--somebody trying to bulk up or whatever, but I'm convinced most players would be better off just giving their bodies a rest. That is especially true for somebody coming off an injury.

While you do have to let your body recuperate from the pounding of the season, my interpretation of what went wrong for him is that he did nothing all offseason, then when he got back to GB, tried to play 'catch up' and hurt himself.

Taking it easy a bit is good, but you have to stay in some kind of shape.

[Guiness]

Who is Nevin McCaskill?

We just picked him up? I didn't know we had a roster spot open.

Tausch.

Um, I totally missed that! Was there even a thread here on it?

I'll admit I get somewhat lazy with PR - I often don't look much elsewhere for going ons, because for the most part, this forum is a better source of info and opinions then anywhere else!

[denverYooper]

Does it occur to anybody that maybe Ryan pickett has the right idea--just lay low and heal up in the off-season?

I don't know if Harrell was lifting weights or what he was doing when he hurt his back, but it's safe to say it wouldn't have happened sitting around watching TV. Back in the day, when players didn't do all this off-season training, it seems to me there was a lot less injuries.

Some guys maybe need it--somebody trying to bulk up or whatever, but I'm convinced most players would be better off just giving their bodies a rest. That is especially true for somebody coming off an injury.

While you do have to let your body recuperate from the pounding of the season, my interpretation of what went wrong for him is that he did nothing all offseason, then when he got back to GB, tried to play 'catch up' and hurt himself.

Taking it easy a bit is good, but you have to stay in some kind of shape.

Yeah. Maybe they'll get a personal trainer for him in the offseason. Seems like it might be a good investment.

[Freak Out]

I just wish people would maybe stop thinking that the internet is their personal place to say whatever stupid fucking thing popped into their head.

It's not?

[Patler]

I think the story of Harrell doing nothing "all off season" has been blown way out of proportion to what really happened.

He was back in Green Bay on March 17 at the start of the off-season voluntary training and conditioning program, and hurt himself in one of the first few days of the program. He played his last game on January 20. With the post season physical checkouts, etc. he had about 7 weeks away from Green Bay. Yes he gained some weight, how many times have we heard the same thing about others of the 320 lb DTs? Should he have tried to keep it in check? Sure he should have, but its not like he sloughed off and skipped all the voluntary training, ballooning in weight all off season.

If he was lazy, he would have skipped the voluntary program as we have seen some others do in the past. Harrell was in Green Bay for day 1 of the voluntary training, in the middle of March.

He made a mistake. He probably figured he had plenty of time to get in shape between March and September. I suspect he has learned from it.

[RashanGary]

He made a mistake. He probably figured he had plenty of time to get in shape between March and September. I suspect he has learned from it.

I'd like to give him the benfit of the doubt as well, but there was one other thing that makes me think he's prone to making this a pattern.

In the beginning of the season they had him on one of the lockerroom interviews. During that interview they asked questions about him not staying in shape possibly leading to his back injury adn he said something like, "A lot of guys don't work out like they should in the offseason and they don't get back injuries. I don't think I could prevent a back injury"

He came off as a guy who thought everything he did was just fine. I'm hoping now he realizes how bad he's going to be scritinized if he comes into voluntary workouts out of shape again. He's had every opportunity to learn his lesson now. If he doesn't do everything possible this offseason that is strictly on him. I'm holding out some hope that the "gets it" but I'm not as sure that it's OK if he's, "just like other fat DT's" as you are.

[Patler]

He made a mistake. He probably figured he had plenty of time to get in shape between March and September. I suspect he has learned from it.

I'd like to give him the benfit of the doubt as well, but there was one other thing that makes me think he's prone to making this a pattern.

In the beginning of the season they had him on one of the lockerroom interviews. During that interview they asked questions about him not staying in shape possibly leading to his back injury adn he said something like, "A lot of guys don't work out like they should in the offseason and they don't get back injuries. I don't think I could prevent a back injury"

He came off as a guy who thought everything he did was just fine. I'm hoping now he realizes how bad he's going to be scritinized if he comes into voluntary workouts out of shape again. He's had every opportunity to learn his lesson now. If he doesn't do everything possible this offseason that is strictly on him. I'm holding out some hope that the "gets it" but I'm not as sure that it's OK if he's, "just like other fat DT's" as you are.

He took SEVEN (7) weeks off and was back in Green Bay the middle of March to begin preparing for the 2008 season. He could have skipped that. Most of the time they tell the players to do nothing at all for a few weeks, as a recuperation period, to let their bodies heal. The only thing he did was to gain some weight, as many, many of the really big guys do in the off season.

Personally, I doubt those seven weeks had anything to do with his disc problem. It just made for a good story because he was injured. I would also bet there were other players that did little or no lifting for much of those seven weeks, and I bet there were others who gained weight. Heck, there were some who didn't even come for the off season conditioning program.

We put up with Cletidus Hunt forgoing some sizable bonuses to skip the off-season stuff because it wasn't mandatory. Here we have a guy in Harrell that was there for day 1 of the voluntary conditioning camp, and we get all over him because he put a few pounds on his 320 pound body.

I think it is a better sounding story than it is in substance.

[GBRulz]

It's almost tempting to create the "Official Justin Harrell injury thread" but here we go again......

http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/article/20081219/PKR01/812200407/1058/PKR01

Notebook: Harrell suffers another setback with back injury

By Pete Dougherty • pdougher@greenbaypressgazette.com • December 19, 2008

The Green Bay Packers got more discouraging injury news Friday about 2007 first-round draft pick Justin Harrell's sore back and hip.

Harrell, who has missed eight games this season because of the injury that dates to March, was unable to practice after participating fully in the first practice of the week Thursday.

Coach Mike McCarthy has ruled him out for Monday night's game at Chicago while the team's medical staff tries to get a handle on the injury, which stems from a herniated disc in Harrell's lower back that's been operated on twice this year.

"It's getting worse, it's not getting better," McCarthy said. "We're going to put him, once again, in the rehab mind-set and take it throughout the weekend and see if there's a chance for Detroit (in the regular-season finale)."

The Packers' biggest concern has to be that the injury could limit Harrell's work this offseason — his growth as a player has been slowed because he's missed that crucial conditioning and technique training the past two offseasons because of injuries. McCarthy said the team's medical staff wants to see how Harrell's back responds to more rehabilitation, and he didn't know whether Harrell will need another surgery in the offseason.

"I hope not," McCarthy said.

But the hip and back injuries almost certainly are related. Harrell has said the pain in his hip has been a symptom since he first injured his back while working out in early March. A second surgery during training camp eased that pain. He missed the first seven games while recovering, but the pain returned after he'd played two games. The Packers finally held him out last week, and will again this week.

"Most of the pain is in the hip, which could be related to the initial injury," McCarthy said. "That's really what we need to find out. He's really just had a setback the last couple practices, so we're going to be smart with him this week."
Wynn likely will go

There's a good chance halfback DeShawn Wynn will be active for a second straight game because of injuries to halfback Brandon Jackson (wrist) and fullback Korey Hall (knee).

Both Jackson and Hall were listed as questionable (50 percent chance of playing), though Jackson appears to have a much better shot at playing Monday night. Regardless, with only starting halfback Ryan Grant and fullback John Kuhn healthy, the Packers probably will have to activate Wynn even if Jackson plays Monday night.

Jackson tried a new wrist brace in practice Friday.

"The threat of carrying the football properly is one of the biggest concerns (with Jackson)," McCarthy said.

After Harrell, Jackson and Hall, the Packers have no other players in danger of missing the game.
Bears update

Chicago has two players who might miss Monday night's game because of injuries: halfback Matt Forte (toe) and receiver Marty Booker (ribs). Both are listed as questionable.
Closed doors

With Monday's forecast for Chicago calling for a high of only 8 degrees and low of 2, McCarthy has his team practicing inside The Don Hutson Center this week because the outdoor practice fields are frozen and covered with snow. He also did not open the large docking doors to let in some cold air, which is his custom.

"We live in this weather," McCarthy said. "We're comfortable with the fact it'll be cold. I don't think the temperature is the factor playing outside from my experience and the way we prepare a team. The things you need to prepare for are really the wind and things like that. Just with our situation as far as our field and so forth, that's why we're still inside."

[Joemailman]

The return of the back injury is really bad news. Harrell has had lower back problems going back to high school. It now looks like 2 surgeries this year couldn't fix it. It's starting to look like he was damaged goods when the Packers drafted him. Maybe he can make a Mike Flanagan-like comeback, but it's getting hard to be optimistic.

[MJZiggy]

I think they should put him on IR in hopes that he can heal it by OTA's...It's becoming obvious it's not healed enough. Needs more strength to hold up against the kind of forces he puts on it.

[KYPack]

Zig, I think he's done.

I'm going thru the herniated disc tango myself right now.

There are several surgeries they can do. They did the ones that try to fix the hernia and heal the disc. Sometimes, those work, sometimes they don't.

If those procedures fail, they replace the disc. They put a thing about the size of an erector set in your back and they shore up and virtually replace the disc's.

Once they do the more radical surgery, your football career is over. Harrell may get cut again with the less evasive procedure &/or get physical therapy. He's young, multiple surgeries may work. But man, I doubt it.

One way or the other, yeah, IR him. 8 more days of football ain't gonna help him one bit.

[Rastak]

Zig, I think he's done.

I'm going thru the herniated disc tango myself right now.

There are several surgeries they can do. They did the ones that try to fix the hernia and heal the disc. Sometimes, those work, sometimes they don't.

If those procedures fail, they replace the disc. They put a thing about the size of an erector set in your back and they shore up and virtually replace the disc's.

Once they do the more radical surgery, your football career is over. Harrell may get cut again with the less evasive procedure &/or get physical therapy. He's young, multiple surgeries may work. But man, I doubt it.

One way or the other, yeah, IR him. 8 more days of football ain't gonna help him one bit.

Yea, he may very well be done. That hip problem sounds like the sciatic nerve, which probably directly relates to gis back. Kind of a by product of the real problem. Not sure if you've had any issues (KY) like that with the sciatic nerve but it will knock you right to the ground the pain is so intense.

[KYPack]

I hurt my back a lot over the years, always in the same area of the lower back. I played rugby for 15 seasons, after "retiring" from semi-pro football. I had a real wicked fall skiing out west and a couple dings in rugger where they had to lug me off the field.

I was up in Wisconsin in the middle of winter and helped my brother move some heavy furniture and appliances about 2 months after rugby was over. We lifted a real big couch and when we put that beast in the truck, I felt a "whump" in my lower back.

I cleverly then jumped in my car to drive back to KY. My back started killing me about an hour into the trip. The spasms took over South of Milwaukee. The pain was getting more intense as we puttered down 65.

In W Lafayette Indiana, I got out of the car in a gas station to use the john. My back gave out & I got knocked right to the ground, the pain was so intense. I also couldn't move my legs. I was carried to the bathroom, then carried back to the car. We pulled into a liquor store. I bought a fifth of bourbon, which I used for medicinal purposes. For about a month, I was knocking back bourbon at a scary rate. Pain pills, shots, nothing relieved the pain, but Kentucky bourbon. Fortunately, I live in Kentucky, so I had a great supply of the stuff.

That episode started a 25 year odyssey of back doctors, surgeons, physical therapy (I suspended Bourbon therapy after while to stay outta Betty Ford). I finally ran into a great PT facility and it's working. I may beat the knife yet.

If Harrell makes it, it'll be a miracle.