Igor Olshansky

[RashanGary]

Draft well
Negotiate good 2nd and third contracts a year early with leverage
Sprinkle UFA's and street FA's
Be right on your evaluations
Win SB

There, it's that easy. Now hit on some front seven players, Ted.

[Bretsky]

So..wait a week, let him dangle, start casual conversations, etc. etc...

right up TTT's alley

[mission]

So..wait a week, let him dangle, start casual conversations, etc. etc...

right up TTT's alley

the 'dangle' tipped you off huh

[Partial]

Ted needs to start hitting on his draft picks if he wants to completely ignore the big name free agents. This team wouldn't need Canty if the DE/DT out of Tennessee and Hawk were studs..

[pbmax]

... In Canty's case, if you believe Peter King, the Giants were NINTH on the list. You can hardly claim he "wanted" to play there more than anywhere else.

That was the agent's list and from the conversations King reports, it wasn't about where he played, it was about how much he was going to make. So Canty might have had a preferred list, but the agent seemed to be listing the top dollar destinations. The agent had also downgraded the Giants once he knew they were chasing Rocky Bernard. Once team's started to sign players, suddenly the agent was down to the Giants, Packers and Seahawks as possible destinations. The Giants went first because the offered the most per year before the trip.

There isn't much mystery here, he went where he could maximize the dollars short term. He might earn that contract, he might not.

[pbmax]

Ted needs to start hitting on his draft picks if he wants to completely ignore the big name free agents. This team wouldn't need Canty if the DE/DT out of Tennessee and Hawk were studs..

I agree that his draft hasn't lit the world on fire. However, he doesn't need to sign big name free agents. He might have to, one day, to drop more coin than value dictates to get the final pieces together.

[Partial]

Ted needs to start hitting on his draft picks if he wants to completely ignore the big name free agents. This team wouldn't need Canty if the DE/DT out of Tennessee and Hawk were studs..

I agree that his draft hasn't lit the world on fire. However, he doesn't need to sign big name free agents. He might have to, one day, to drop more coin than value dictates to get the final pieces together.

I guess big name free agents isn't the correct term. I don't care who he signs, as long as it is someone that is sufficient and can hold up against the run to play DE. We are dangerously weak at that spot, with two of the three on the roster being very injury prone and the third with a generous injury history of his own as well as some potential legal issues.

[Lurker64]

Ted needs to start hitting on his draft picks if he wants to completely ignore the big name free agents. This team wouldn't need Canty if the DE/DT out of Tennessee and Hawk were studs..

The thing is... how do we measure who the "big name" free agents are? Is it just "the best guys who are out there, regardless of how good they actually are?" or "the guys who hit free agency who are truly elite players"? Since there are a lot of years that are just a wasteland for free agency, but the best players at their positions get paid a lot even if they're not actually that great by an objective scale. Bernard Berrian and Javon Walker were compensated as though they were the fourth and fifth best WRs in the league coming out of FA last year, were they really? Absolutely not.

Its rare that a team lets a truly elite player hit free agency, and most of those guys get paid a truckload. Haynesworth was one of those guys, but Canty was not. Canty was somewhat inconsistent, he underperformed at times, and just wasn't all that productive, plus he played a non-money position in the 3-4. Canty was a guy with more talent than everybody else left at his position over the weekend, so he got talked up a fair bit. More than he deserved? Who knows.

But think about it like a General Manager here. Just due to how the cap math works, signing Canty would probably mean that they were unable to keep one of: Jennings, Colledge, Kampman, or Collins. If you were the general manager, is that choice exactly clear cut? Signing Haynesworth would probably mean that we lost two of those guys.

Personally, though I understand the defensive line needs some serious help, I'd prefer to keep the good players we already have, and fill the holes with guys who are somewhat less expensive. Olshansky will probably cost 60% of what Canty did, and is probably 90-95% as good as Canty in the 3-4 defense.

I don't want to see our GM, whoever he is, overpay for guys just because they're "needs" and "they're the best at their respective position". If we overpay for anybody, I hope it's because they're actually impact players.

I mean, if we can get Peppers for a 2nd and a 3rd, and then pay him that would be a much bigger upgrade for the defense than signing Canty. Peppers would play an impact, big money, position in the 3-4. Canty does not.

[mission]

Ted needs to start hitting on his draft picks if he wants to completely ignore the big name free agents. This team wouldn't need Canty if the DE/DT out of Tennessee and Hawk were studs..

I agree that his draft hasn't lit the world on fire. However, he doesn't need to sign big name free agents. He might have to, one day, to drop more coin than value dictates to get the final pieces together.

I guess big name free agents isn't the correct term. I don't care who he signs, as long as it is someone that is sufficient and can hold up against the run to play DE. We are dangerously weak at that spot, with two of the three on the roster being very injury prone and the third with a generous injury history of his own as well as some potential legal issues.

Hawk has nothing to do with this at all. Harrell? Sure.

[Partial]

Ted needs to start hitting on his draft picks if he wants to completely ignore the big name free agents. This team wouldn't need Canty if the DE/DT out of Tennessee and Hawk were studs..

I agree that his draft hasn't lit the world on fire. However, he doesn't need to sign big name free agents. He might have to, one day, to drop more coin than value dictates to get the final pieces together.

I guess big name free agents isn't the correct term. I don't care who he signs, as long as it is someone that is sufficient and can hold up against the run to play DE. We are dangerously weak at that spot, with two of the three on the roster being very injury prone and the third with a generous injury history of his own as well as some potential legal issues.

Hawk has nothing to do with this at all. Harrell? Sure.

Sure it does. If Hawk was playing up the his combine numbers, he could be our OLB. Instead, we've got to address that spot early and hard on the first day of the draft.

I'm not saying TT needs to hit home runs or go and sign Canty. Canty was overpaid. But we need somebody that can be a capable starter and we need them in a hurry, before they sign elsewhere.

I would love to see them add Olshansky, another 4-3 DT converted to an end (somebody cheap), and then draft Raji. We have that many holes across the DL.

[mission]

We'd still need an ILB in that case. The point is we need an LB anyway... and we need a DE.

Sooooooooo

[Bossman641]

Ted needs to start hitting on his draft picks if he wants to completely ignore the big name free agents. This team wouldn't need Canty if the DE/DT out of Tennessee and Hawk were studs..

I agree that his draft hasn't lit the world on fire. However, he doesn't need to sign big name free agents. He might have to, one day, to drop more coin than value dictates to get the final pieces together.

I guess big name free agents isn't the correct term. I don't care who he signs, as long as it is someone that is sufficient and can hold up against the run to play DE. We are dangerously weak at that spot, with two of the three on the roster being very injury prone and the third with a generous injury history of his own as well as some potential legal issues.

Hawk has nothing to do with this at all. Harrell? Sure.

Sure it does. If Hawk was playing up the his combine numbers, he could be our OLB. Instead, we've got to address that spot early and hard on the first day of the draft.

I'm not saying TT needs to hit home runs or go and sign Canty. Canty was overpaid. But we need somebody that can be a capable starter and we need them in a hurry, before they sign elsewhere.

I would love to see them add Olshansky, another 4-3 DT converted to an end (somebody cheap), and then draft Raji. We have that many holes across the DL.

No question Hawk was a disappointment this year, but I don't think he would ever fit the role of a 3-4 OLB. That's just not the type of player he is. His strengths are his overall level of play in all aspects of the game, but he's not a rush LB at all.

[Lurker64]

Sure it does. If Hawk was playing up the his combine numbers, he could be our OLB.

Even if Hawk was playing in excess of his combine numbers, I don't think he could play OLB in the 3-4, he's too small. Plus his strengths are "run support", "coverage", and not "pass rushing." 3-4 OLBs are basically just pass rushing specialists with fluid hips, which nobody, even with the hype Hawk was getting before the draft, saw Hawk as.

Guys like Shawne Merriman (6-4 272) and DeMarcus Ware (6-4 262) play the OLB spot we need to fill. Rarely guys like A.J. Hawk (6-1 248). However, Julius Peppers (6-7 283) is available via trade, and would likely fit the bill.

Your OLBs ought to be guys who can rush the passer and have fluid enough hips to cover in the flat. Hawk is an instinctive, aggressive, read-and-react, coverage and run-support backer. He's the exact sort of guy you want as ILB in the 3-4. Anyway, whether Hawk was playing inside or outside, whichever starting LB spot you didn't pencil him in at would have a hole.

[Patler]

Patler, it isn't about Canty specifically. What happened with Canty has played out in one form or another on several occasions. I think I see the beginnings of a trend.

Also, I have concerns with several articles that I've read lately. I don't share your optimistic perspective that Thompson has been clear with player agents. Free Agency is largely about the money. From time to time it is important to players to play in a certain place. In Canty's case, if you believe Peter King, the Giants were NINTH on the list. You can hardly claim he "wanted" to play there more than anywhere else.

I guess, I think I know the answer to "Why" he didn't want to visit GB. Yeah, it's speculation, yeah, I'll never prove it, but it's my view. That's what I see as concerning, not Canty specifically.

I don't disagree, the early time of FA is often about money, and the Packers have made it clear they will pay fair contracts, not excessive ones. There is no mystery, no evolving trend. It is a fact the agents and players know very well.

It doesn't bother me one bit. If that is why any FA chooses not to visit GB, so be it.

Dallas has been fairly active in FA markets the last few years. What has it gotten them? Some decent seasonal records, nothing in the playoffs, and a situation where they can't keep Canty, a young player many seem to have coveted for GB.

The "Thompson Plan" has not played out completely. It will in the next two years as the glut of young starters begin getting their second contracts. Some culling may occur at that time, but hopefully a nucleus will remain around which lesser expensive fill-ins will be assembled to make a consistently competitive team. The first piece of the puzzle appears to be Rodgers. More to come. The trade-off for signing Canty may have been losing Colledge, or Collins, maybe someone else. The cap picture (if there is one) might look very different for the Packers in 2011 than it does right now. Thompson's inactivity in FA the last few seasons might pay off in the players he can keep next year and the year after.

[wist43]

Ted needs to start hitting on his draft picks if he wants to completely ignore the big name free agents. This team wouldn't need Canty if the DE/DT out of Tennessee and Hawk were studs..

I agree that his draft hasn't lit the world on fire. However, he doesn't need to sign big name free agents. He might have to, one day, to drop more coin than value dictates to get the final pieces together.

I guess big name free agents isn't the correct term. I don't care who he signs, as long as it is someone that is sufficient and can hold up against the run to play DE. We are dangerously weak at that spot, with two of the three on the roster being very injury prone and the third with a generous injury history of his own as well as some potential legal issues.

Hawk has nothing to do with this at all. Harrell? Sure.

Sure it does. If Hawk was playing up the his combine numbers, he could be our OLB. Instead, we've got to address that spot early and hard on the first day of the draft.

I'm not saying TT needs to hit home runs or go and sign Canty. Canty was overpaid. But we need somebody that can be a capable starter and we need them in a hurry, before they sign elsewhere.

I would love to see them add Olshansky, another 4-3 DT converted to an end (somebody cheap), and then draft Raji. We have that many holes across the DL.

TT has stated that he and the coaching staff like the players they have... they're apparently quite happy with Hawk, and Harrell, and Barnett, et al...

If they really like the personnel they have... it explains at least to some extent why TT doesn't see the need to tip his toe in the water.

Most of us, and the media disagree... the defense is really substandard in terms of talent IMO.