Defensive depth chart pre-draft

[Patler]

Bishop as a rush LB??? You guys are kidding, right???

I figured the thought was so very laughable that even the homers on this board wouldn't make that leap... good Lord.

I'm not so sure. One of the knocks against Bishop was his tendency toward an unrestrained, aggressive style of play. It can kill him in pass coverage. We saw over-pursuit from him many times. Sometimes, those guys find a home rushing in the 3-4. It can tend to focus their natural style into a single task.

I'm not suggesting he will be successful; none of us know. But it wouldn't necessarily be the most shocking thing if it did turn out for him.

[Waldo]

One thing you guys have to remember. A 3-4 OLB fundamentally is still a linebacker, not a lineman. The DE's do a lot of the heavy lifting typically required of an end.

[Bretsky]

TT and MM have been saying they're set at every starter position... and, with MM saying he thinks Desmond Bishop can rush the passer for an OLB position, well...

it's obvious, we have absolutely no needs on that side of the ball

Which positions would you say we are not set at with regards to starters? DE, of course, but only because of pending legal issues with Jolly and durability concerns with Jenkins and Harrell. Yet, you can't judge your starters even before OTA's start figuring that they'll surely be injured, thus needing replacement. There's certainly enough talent there to field legitimate starters if everyone is healthy and out of jail, and that's how you evaluate it.

I say we need a new NT, but I'm apparently in the minority there. I just don't like Ryan Pickett there at all, and would rather we draft/sign somebody bigger, stronger, younger and more durable.

Maybe an outside linebacker to compliment Kampman, but that's not a given either. Jeremy Thompson is moving to OLB as well, and he could flourish there same as Kampman could.

These are all things you have to consider when stating specifically that MM and TT are wrong in their assesment of the defense. We need depth on defense, just like any other team does, but I don't think we need new starters as badly as you make it seem.

I would not be at all disappointed if 80% of this draft focused on defense; I don't think we're incredibly weak anywhere but with the exception of CB I'm not sure I'd consider anything a strength either.

[KYPack]

Bishop probably can't be the chase ILB. But he's perfect as a Jack (or Ted, whatever you call the thump guy inside).
OLB is a gig he coiuld do right, also.
You gotta rememer. Kevin Greene is on this staff. Kevin eyes will light up when he sees Bishop. Kevin can teach him a trick or two and free his mind to just play. Bishop isn't a cover guy and never will be one. he isn't wired that way.

But he is a plugger and will be a real good one.

[sharpe1027]

Re: Defensive depth chart pre-draft

Posted this a few months ago.

I updated it with the new additions and poster thoughts.

DEFENSIVE DEPTH CHART

LDE
Johnny Jolly
Justin Harrell


NT
Ryan Pickett
Fred Bledsoe
A Toribio
Brian Soi

Wouldn't it make sense for either or both of Jolly and Harrell to backup the NT position?

[Lurker64]

Re: Defensive depth chart pre-draft

Wouldn't it make sense for either or both of Jolly and Harrell to backup the NT position?

Neither guy is ever going to be a full time starting NT, but I think if Pickett has to come out for a series, Harrell's the guy that takes his place, but he's not going to be able to do it for a whole game, so that doesn't really play into the depth chart.

[wist43]

Lurker and KY have it right... Bishop is a plugger, and that's about it. If he were anything more than that, he would have been a higher draft choice - the guy can't run, he's stiff, relatively unathletic... he is what he is, a 6th round draft choice, who plays like a 6th round draft choice.

And I don't care if Kevin Greene, Lawrence Taylor, Dick Butkus, and Ray Nitschke were all coaching him... they can't make him any faster, or taller, or give him longer arms... they guy will never be a rush OLB.

And that was my point... it's ridiculous to even entertain the idea - and, as I said, I can only hope that MM is just doing the media dance, and doesn't really believe that nonsense - coz if he does??? We're completely screwed on defense.

[Lurker64]

And that was my point... it's ridiculous to even entertain the idea - and, as I said, I can only hope that MM is just doing the media dance, and doesn't really believe that nonsense - coz if he does??? We're completely screwed on defense.

I secretly suspect that MM really has very little to do with the defense, other than hiring the staff. I would suspect that Dom has mostly complete autonomy when it comes to the defense, and really I wouldn't be totally surprised if Dom lines up Bishop outside once or twice. It doesn't make sense, but a lot of the advantages of the 3-4 defense is that you can send a lot of guys from a lot of different directions. To keep the offense guessing, and sometimes you do something that doesn't make a lot of sense, just to throw the offense off. I mean, I've seen New England line up in 0-8-3 fronts on Rushing downs, which isn't something that you'd want to do more than once or twice, but it sure confuses the blocking assignments.

I mean, Capers was one of the men who came up with the Zone Blitz, the basic principle of which involves dropping a defensive lineman into coverage; something which, in and of itself, seems ridiculous. But it works.

[wist43]

And that was my point... it's ridiculous to even entertain the idea - and, as I said, I can only hope that MM is just doing the media dance, and doesn't really believe that nonsense - coz if he does??? We're completely screwed on defense.

I secretly suspect that MM really has very little to do with the defense, other than hiring the staff. I would suspect that Dom has mostly complete autonomy when it comes to the defense, and really I wouldn't be totally surprised if Dom lines up Bishop outside once or twice. It doesn't make sense, but a lot of the advantages of the 3-4 defense is that you can send a lot of guys from a lot of different directions. To keep the offense guessing, and sometimes you do something that doesn't make a lot of sense, just to throw the offense off. I mean, I've seen New England line up in 0-8-3 fronts on Rushing downs, which isn't something that you'd want to do more than once or twice, but it sure confuses the blocking assignments.

I mean, Capers was one of the men who came up with the Zone Blitz, the basic principle of which involves dropping a defensive lineman into coverage; something which, in and of itself, seems ridiculous. But it works.

Creating confusion is one of the principle reasons I've been an advocate of a 3-4; showing multiple fronts, delayed blitzes, zone blitzes, et al... The scheme in and of itself should allow even a slug like Bishop to come free every once in a while.

That said, there is no substitute for talent... and, even if Capers is able to stop the bleeding on the defensive side of the ball, and at least field an average unit, without an infusion of some top flight 3-4 personnel, i.e. a maniac rush OLB, a stud NT, and an upgrade at DE, they're going to continue to struggle.

Bottom line, their front 7 is the very definition of pedestrian.