Ranking the WRs and TEs, team-by-team(foxsports)

[SD GB fan]

the ranking includes TE's right? maybe they think highly of our TE corp.

[wist43]

the ranking includes TE's right? maybe they think highly of our TE corp.

I'm high on Lee... Franks is very average. Martin is a tease. Overall, Green Bay's TE's are better than average... if only they would utilize the position as a staple of the offense.

[MJZiggy]

the ranking includes TE's right? maybe they think highly of our TE corp.

I'm high on Lee... Franks is very average. Martin is a tease. Overall, Green Bay's TE's are better than average... if only they would utilize the position as a staple of the offense.

Supposedly going back to the true WCO, they will utilize TE's more.

[Bretsky]

Re: Ranking the WRs and TEs, team-by-team(foxsports)

23. Miami

Chris Chambers is a hard player to evaluate. He hints at greatness but appears hampered by poor quarterbacking. His statistics, both advanced and traditional, have never been impressive. He has had an above-average DVOA only once since his rookie season, and last year was the first time he ever gained over 1,000 yards. He is inconsistent and catches a low percentage of passes intended for him. Chambers gained 460 yards in one three-game stretch and never gained 100 in any other game. Despite his obvious talent, he will need to show more to be considered a top receiver.

Bretsky;

I expected a vehement protest from you on the evaluation I quoted above!

YES, THAT WAS PURE CRAP; I honestly believe had the Packers chosen Chris Chambers over Robert the Fraud Ferguson Brett Favre would have had a go to guy and Pro Bowl WR for many years now. Green Bay might have drafted Ed Reed instead of Javon Walker the year after the Ferguson draft, and Green Bay might very well have had another Super Bowl Title.
A lot to chew on there.

The author hit the nail right on with the poor QBing. Chambers showed flashes of excellence from day 1 in the Dolphin Camp. But he's had pathetic QB after pathetic QB throwing him the ball.

Regarding the catching of a low % of passes intended for him, see point above. One of the greatest QB's of the game threw 29 INT's last year, many of them due to players inability to get open. It works both ways. When the ball is bouncing in front of you or thrown over your head it's hard for Chambers to make a play.

Chambers has offered up some incredible catches and highlight reels. The problem is, to be consistent you also have to have a consistent QB.

Chris Chambers would have had many 1,000 yard seasons and I'd even go a step further. He'd be an annual Pro Bowler with Brett Favre as his QB, and he'd be considered one of the top 10 HANDS DOWN if the Packers hadn't made the worst drafting mistake in the history of Green Bay (because the pick was SO DAM OBVIOUS) by trading up in round two and picking The Fraud Ferguson.

Dammit Patler, I thought I'd avoid getting bent out of shape..........but here I go again.

Cheers,
Bretsky

[Patler]

Shamrockfan, throw in the tape of the 2nd Lions game from last year and just watch Poppinga - that was the game he blew his knee out.

He got the start in that game, and showed speed, athleticism, instincts, and toughness... I think Poppinga has very good upside. Last year he was, hands down, the toughest LB Green Bay had - on a team that was sorely lacking toughness.

Hopefully his knee will come around sooner rather than later; but, realisitically I expect he'll start the season on the PUP list... I liked Poppinga coming out, and he hasn't done anything to dissuade me from that opinion. I think the guy has a chance to be a player.

Poppinga has some speed and defintely toughness. Some athleticism. Linebacker instincts? No, not anything special yet, at least not in the passing game. Not yet, anyway. Unfortunately, with all his injury time last year, he isn't all that much ahead of where he was last year, experience-wise. I am looking forward to see what he can become, but I'm not going to get all excited about him yet. Just as I am not yet all excited about Hawk or any other rooki. At least with Hawk we have the advantage of having seen him play linebacker for years. We have very little history with Poppinga.

[Patler]

Re: Ranking the WRs and TEs, team-by-team(foxsports)

23. Miami

Chris Chambers is a hard player to evaluate. He hints at greatness but appears hampered by poor quarterbacking. His statistics, both advanced and traditional, have never been impressive. He has had an above-average DVOA only once since his rookie season, and last year was the first time he ever gained over 1,000 yards. He is inconsistent and catches a low percentage of passes intended for him. Chambers gained 460 yards in one three-game stretch and never gained 100 in any other game. Despite his obvious talent, he will need to show more to be considered a top receiver.

Bretsky;

I expected a vehement protest from you on the evaluation I quoted above!

YES, THAT WAS PURE CRAP; I honestly believe had the Packers chosen Chris Chambers over Robert the Fraud Ferguson Brett Favre would have had a go to guy and Pro Bowl WR for many years now. Green Bay might have drafted Ed Reed instead of Javon Walker the year after the Ferguson draft, and Green Bay might very well have had another Super Bowl Title.
A lot to chew on there.

The author hit the nail right on with the poor QBing. Chambers showed flashes of excellence from day 1 in the Dolphin Camp. But he's had pathetic QB after pathetic QB throwing him the ball.

Regarding the catching of a low % of passes intended for him, see point above. One of the greatest QB's of the game threw 29 INT's last year, many of them due to players inability to get open. It works both ways. When the ball is bouncing in front of you or thrown over your head it's hard for Chambers to make a play.

Chambers has offered up some incredible catches and highlight reels. The problem is, to be consistent you also have to have a consistent QB.

Chris Chambers would have had many 1,000 yard seasons and I'd even go a step further. He'd be an annual Pro Bowler with Brett Favre as his QB, and he'd be considered one of the top 10 HANDS DOWN if the Packers hadn't made the worst drafting mistake in the history of Green Bay (because the pick was SO DAM OBVIOUS) by trading up in round two and picking The Fraud Ferguson.

Dammit Patler, I thought I'd avoid getting bent out of shape..........but here I go again.

Cheers,
Bretsky

Phew! Things ARE right with the world. You had me worried for a minute there, Bretsky!

[Bossman641]

Shamrockfan, throw in the tape of the 2nd Lions game from last year and just watch Poppinga - that was the game he blew his knee out.

He got the start in that game, and showed speed, athleticism, instincts, and toughness... I think Poppinga has very good upside. Last year he was, hands down, the toughest LB Green Bay had - on a team that was sorely lacking toughness.

Hopefully his knee will come around sooner rather than later; but, realisitically I expect he'll start the season on the PUP list... I liked Poppinga coming out, and he hasn't done anything to dissuade me from that opinion. I think the guy has a chance to be a player.

Poppinga has some speed and defintely toughness. Some athleticism. Linebacker instincts? No, not anything special yet, at least not in the passing game. Not yet, anyway. Unfortunately, with all his injury time last year, he isn't all that much ahead of where he was last year, experience-wise. I am looking forward to see what he can become, but I'm not going to get all excited about him yet. Just as I am not yet all excited about Hawk or any other rooki. At least with Hawk we have the advantage of having seen him play linebacker for years. We have very little history with Poppinga.

I'm with you Sham. Poppinga played pretty well when he was used as a rush LB but other than that he didn't show much instincts or coverage ability in the passing game.

[Mazzin]

I love him, but isn't he 26 or 27 a little behind the curve due to his leaving the country?

[wist43]

Of all the areas of ability needed to play the LB position, coverage is last on my list. Give me a LB, that has/can 1. Instincts 2. Tackle 3. Take on and shed 4. Pursuit 5. Hit (deliver fumble causing hits) 6. Blitz 7. Hold the point 8. Cover. If matchup problems in coverage exist, deal with it with your game plan/scheme.

I would think that most of you would be sick and tired of the "11 corners" defense - LB's that are drag down tacklers, and can't deliver a fumble causing hit to save their lives... I perfer a much more physical, much tougher brand of defense.

There's a reason why the Packers defense has been, heretofor, considered soft and weak. Drafting guys like Barnett, Lenon, Campbell, et al, i.e. small and fast, but at the same time, being unable to take on blocks, blitz, or deliver turnover causing hits.

That's not to say that a smallish LB can't excel and be very tough (Al Wilson, Zach Thomas, et al), but I don't think anyone would argue that Barnett is "tough". The next bone jarring hit he delivers will be his first.

I'm very encouraged to see TT rebuilding the defense with tough, physical LB's and Safties. Hawk, Hodge (who is undersized but 10 times tougher than Barnett), Poppinga, Manuel, and Collins.