Packers' weakness: Transition to 3-4

[Gunakor]

I would hope to see something, yes. But given that this is brand new to alot of guys, I don't set my expectations too high. Sure, better than last year I'd hope, but probably not quite as good as the year before. Not yet anyway.

And even if I did, I certainly wouldn't hold TT responsible if it fails this year. TT went with a proven guy who runs a proven scheme. Then he drafted 2 players that proven guy wanted for his scheme, giving up quite a bit to get both of them. If this defense fails us again this year, it isn't due to lack of effort on TT's part to get it fixed. Now if it fails this year and continues to fail in coming years, with Thompson making the same bold moves every year to try and get it fixed, then I'd feel a lot differently. But I'm happy with his effort this year regardless.

[retailguy]

If this defense fails us again this year, it isn't due to lack of effort on TT's part to get it fixed. Now if it fails this year and continues to fail in coming years, with Thompson making the same bold moves every year to try and get it fixed, then I'd feel a lot differently. But I'm happy with his effort this year regardless.

Sherman never had lack of effort. He had a lack of results. Effort should be a given. I'm looking for results. This year.

[falco]

Bottom line is if our personnel is not a good fit for the 3-4, we should at least be running a hybrid between the two offenses until we can complete the transition... which is what I fully expect to do.

I don't think anyone should be making excuses that poor performance is due to the change.

[Partial]

Personnel will be fine imo. They need to add another veteran DE for depth. This team is built to win now!!!

[The Leaper]

The article makes little sense to me. If the 3-4 is such a questionable scheme for most teams, why are the teams who are perennial title contenders running it?

I also disagree that the Packer defense was dominating 2 years ago. The defense looked good because the offense was virtually unstoppable behind Favre and Grant clicking on all cylinders. When the defense had to carry it's share, it was embarrassed by the Giants.

Kampman WAS an elite DE. I don't think he is anymore after seeing him last year. He rarely was around the QB last year...granted, some of that was just the defense doubling him, but he also had some difficulty getting to the QB straight up on some guys. I think he's trending downhill...and the Packers have nothing behind him in terms of dynamic pass rushers off the edge. Those are ESSENTIAL in a 4-3.

Personally, I think the roster fits a 3-4 scheme better now. Jenkins and Harrell are more 3-4 DEs than 4-3 DEs or DTs. I know Kampman will work his ass off...and could prolong his career with a move to 3-4 OLB. We have an interesting array of LBs to work with now.

The burden is on the def coaching staff to get this group on the same page. The last crew couldn't get that done.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Bottom line is if our personnel is not a good fit for the 3-4, we should at least be running a hybrid between the two offenses until we can complete the transition... which is what I fully expect to do.

I don't think anyone should be making excuses that poor performance is due to the change.

I think would could argue that our personnal is a good fit for the 4-3. The only starters who are questionable fits are Barnett and Harris. If you want to throw Kampman in there, so be it. I think it will be proven wrong--as he fits what most teams look for in their pass rushing OLB in a 3-4 and I know he'll work hard to succeed in the transition. I worry about Barnett recovering from his injury more than anything. I think Harris is going to have a hard time if they ask him to play a lot of zone. However, he's closing on his mid-30's, so now is probably a good time to make a transition at that spot.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Here's an interesting take on Cullen Jenkins which was posted in Sporting News by RealScouts. They rank him as the 18th best DE in the game--which puts him in the top 1/3 of starting DEs.

18. Cullen Jenkins, Packers. Jenkins has the size, strength and experience inside to excel in the Packers' new 3-4 scheme. He has a nice array of pass-rush moves, is a sure tackler in the run game and has the agility to make plays on the perimeter.

[SnakeLH2006]

The main problem I have with the article is that they know very little about football and pretty much just glombed info from other articles to form an opinion.

Calling a 4-3 traditional is an easy way to spot it.

That's about how Snake viewed it too. The "cool kids" what is this guy writing this shit in his mom's basement trying to get website hits for his High School?

Either way, he praised Hawk who has underwhelmed in his 4-3 role and bashed others who excelled? What?

Snake's Take:

What did we have in our 2008 6-10 season, the 25 ranked D or something? So if we change it to a 3-4 with a proven coach in Capers with top-flight assistants we suddenly get worse? This guy is a moron. Maybe we struggle early, but with the lapse of talent on our poor DL and the influx of talented LB's we suddenly have made for the 3-4, there's no reason this D should be worse at worst? No? If anything, those LB's will be the difference makers over the next 2 seasons as Hawk progresses, Clay contributes, Barnett recovers, and Kampy acclimates. BJ will be a force by year 2 and make them all better.....as long as Mission doesn't get him stoned in training camp!

[falco]

I remember watching Cullen Jenkins destroy guys when healthy. I mean physically obliterate o-lineman. I sure hope he can do that this year, especially in this system.

[Fritz]

My point, Retail, is not whether TT should get another year, or two, or whether he was honest about expectations. My point is simply that most people here seem to think that the brass will give TT two more seasons to show that he's the man - that is to say, to produce results.

[Bretsky]

With our powder puff schedule next year I expect the playoffs. If we get bounced in round one that will still be progress that I'll be content with.

[Partial]

With our powerder puff schedule next year I expect the playoffs. If we get bounced in round one that will still be progress that I'll be content with.

I expect this as well.

[pbmax]

With our powerder puff schedule next year I expect the playoffs. If we get bounced in round one that will still be progress that I'll be content with.

Schedules are funny things, they look one way based on last year's records and much different midway through a current season. Even the tough tail end of the Packer's season will look different by week 6.

As for the Packers schedule, the Vikings and Bears also have it soft, which makes the division harder to win and also complicates the wild card.

As I said earlier, if McCarthy hired a coach to be 3-4, I think its a bad basis for a hire. If McCarthy knew he needed a different coach and hired the best guy he could summon who was also running multiple fronts, then I am encouraged by his decision making approach. But in either event, I like the Capers hire. The decision on a coach should not be made because of personnel or the front. You need the best guy, not the best fit.

For a while I though it a lock that Thompson would get one more coach of M3 doesn't pan out. But in two years Thompson will have been here six full years. If McCarthy and the team struggle enough to merit a coach's dismissal in two more years, then Thompson would likely be in trouble as well if he has just one playoff visit in six years.

Much would depend on Thompson's relationship with Murphy and the Exec Committee. But to get a chance to hire a second head coach, Thompson might need to be willing to dump McCarthy after this year. There are a lot of veteran, capable coaches available. I don't think he does that. If he was still unconvinced about M3, then he wouldn't have given his a five year deal like his own.

He's got two years, possibly three if Murphy is totally on board.

[HarveyWallbangers]

With our powerder puff schedule next year I expect the playoffs. If we get bounced in round one that will still be progress that I'll be content with.

I expect this as well.

I expect they'll contend for the playoffs, as well. However, there are two many variables for me to make a blanket statement that Thompson and McCarthy should be fired if they don't. I suspect that they'll get two years to prove their worth.

BTW, I have faith in those guys. I believe barring a rash of injuries to key players, they'll turn 6-10 back into 10-6.

[Gunakor]

If this defense fails us again this year, it isn't due to lack of effort on TT's part to get it fixed. Now if it fails this year and continues to fail in coming years, with Thompson making the same bold moves every year to try and get it fixed, then I'd feel a lot differently. But I'm happy with his effort this year regardless.

Sherman never had lack of effort. He had a lack of results. Effort should be a given. I'm looking for results. This year.

Caught sleeping in the stands at the scouting combine...

Nah, never had lack of effort. Just a lack of results.