Hawk a bust?

[KYPack]

In a word, no.

He's not been the defensive superstar we hoped for, but he's a good hand on the field. He gets the job done and knows what to do.

Look at AJ Hawk compared with other 1st rnd LB's from that year:

COMPARING THE NUMBERS
Linebackers selected in the first round of the 2006 NFL draft and their career statistics:
Pick Player Team Solo tackles Sacks Int. Fum. recov. TD
5 A.J. Hawk G.B. 227 7.5 3 0 0
9 Ernie Sims Det. 249 2.5 1 0 0
13 Kamerion Wimbley Cle. 135 20 1 0 0
17 Chad Greenway Minn. 164 5.5 2 1 1
18 Bobby Carpenter Dallas 35 1.5 0 0 0
22 Manny Lawson S.F. 88 5.5 1 0 0

Hawk has improved every season and is very comparable, if not better than Greenway and Sims.

Who would you rather have at LB for the Pack?

AJ Hawk or Barbi Carpenter?

[Zool]

Greenway might end up being better. He did miss an entire season with an injury. I'm excited to see the shackles off Hawk for the first time. I wonder if he'll look better now that he's not just contain and funnel?

[hoosier]

Re: Hawk a bust?

In a word, no.

He's not been the defensive superstar we hoped for, but he's a good hand on the field. He gets the job done and knows what to do.

Look at AJ Hawk compared with other 1st rnd LB's from that year:

COMPARING THE NUMBERS
Linebackers selected in the first round of the 2006 NFL draft and their career statistics:
Pick Player Team Solo tackles Sacks Int. Fum. recov. TD
5 A.J. Hawk G.B. 227 7.5 3 0 0
9 Ernie Sims Det. 249 2.5 1 0 0
13 Kamerion Wimbley Cle. 135 20 1 0 0
17 Chad Greenway Minn. 164 5.5 2 1 1
18 Bobby Carpenter Dallas 35 1.5 0 0 0
22 Manny Lawson S.F. 88 5.5 1 0 0

Hawk has improved every season and is very comparable, if not better than Greenway and Sims.

Who would you rather have at LB for the Pack?

AJ Hawk or Barbi Carpenter?

DeMeco Ryans.

I don't think anyone can seriously argue that Hawk is a bust. That's just hyperbole. But you could make the argument that he has been somewhat of a disappointment based on his draft position (you could probably argue that about most of the top 10 from 2006, excepting Mario) and that he compares poorly with other LBs who have been high draft picks in recent years (Mayo, Willis, Ware, Merriman, Vilma, Suggs). Of course there are others who came with very high expectations and have done worse so far--Vernon Gholston for instance.

I'm willing to give Hawk some benefit of the doubt based on the idea that the Sanders system wasn't designed to feature his best skills or the WLB position. But I think it would be unrealistic at this point to expect him to emerge as an entirely different player. What we've seen so far is probably more or less what we're going to get.

[KYPack]

Re: Hawk a bust?

DeMeco Ryans.

I don't think anyone can seriously argue that Hawk is a bust. That's just hyperbole. But you could make the argument that he has been somewhat of a disappointment based on his draft position (you could probably argue that about most of the top 10 from 2006, excepting Mario) and that he compares poorly with other LBs who have been high draft picks in recent years (Mayo, Willis, Ware, Merriman, Vilma, Suggs). Of course there are others who came with very high expectations and have done worse so far--Vernon Gholston for instance.

I'm willing to give Hawk some benefit of the doubt based on the idea that the Sanders system wasn't designed to feature his best skills or the WLB position. But I think it would be unrealistic at this point to expect him to emerge as an entirely different player. What we've seen so far is probably more or less what we're going to get.

Absolutely. Ryans is the superstar LB from that class. Those high number 2 picks often turn into real bonus cards and Ryans is proof of that. Hawk did show me a lot by just getting on the field last season. He played well for playing hurt.

I can't wait to see Hawk play under Capers. Sanders non-system system really handicapped a lot of players, Hawk among 'em.

[MOBB DEEP]

sorry KY but im not sold on hawk AT ALL

im not in to calling pro athletes busts but i just dont think he has "it" irregardless of numbers or comparisons to his peer group

if he doesnt do much better in 3-4 i think he will go down as a disappointment

[ND72]

Couple things to remember...In Vanilla Bob's defense, Hawk's job was not to tackle as an OLB, his job was to force the RB to turn the corner so the MLB could make the tackle. Yes, I know he ended up playing MLB last season, but our DL was horrible. It's amazing how good LB's become when the DL in front of them is solid. Also, as far as rushing the passer goes, does anyone remember how Bob would blitz? He'd have the LB walk up to the line, showing blitz, and then go...real genius. Hawk is back playing the position he pretty much played now in college in our 3-4 defense, as he was a Middle/Outside Backer, like he'll play now. Nobody truly knows how injured he was last season, as I read that he could barely breath most days, but still played every game, and practice almost all practices.

[Bossman641]

Not a bust, definitely a disappointment though. This has to be the year for him to prove he is a playmaker. It was a real let down for him to be basically invincible (except for the 1st game) after moving to the MLB spot last year.

[ND72]

Not a bust, definitely a disappointment though. This has to be the year for him to prove he is a playmaker. It was a real let down for him to be basically invincible (except for the 1st game) after moving to the MLB spot last year.

did you mean invisible? or invincible?

[Waldo]

I remember prior to the draft, there was the big question.

There was the safe pick, Hawk, that most thought didn't have a real high ceiling. Brian Noble if you will. Reliable and consistent, but probably not a HOF player. Good workouts across the board, but not legendary good at any one thing. Thought to have near zero bust potential.

Then there was super Mario. Eye popping workout warrior. Moderate college production. Important position. But a lot weren't sold since he didn't really "break out" until very late in his college career.

Bush, who almost everybody agreed was the greatest thing ever. A faster more shifty Brian Westbrook. Would revolutionize the RB position. We had no chance at him.

The LT, Ferguson. Chances are we didn't have a shot. He had everything that you looked for in a top 5 LT. But we had Clifton and no need.

The TE. Best TE workouts ever, by a good margin. He had more HOF potential than anybody in the draft. WR speed, TE size, lineman strength, decent production. Downside was a non-premium pick.

Then the S, Huff. Would be the fastest S on the stopwatch in the NFL. Not the best player though and kinda raw, plus we had Collins, who was a very similar player.

Ngata was mentioned on occasion, but #5 and #5 money was seen as too high for a slow plugger DT that wasn't a QB sacking threat. His workouts were great though.

I followed that draft very close. I'd say overall fan sentiment, 2 weeks out, was:

37% Hawk
28% Mario
25% Davis
8% Ngata
2% Other (Huff, Ferguson)

With the ridiculously poor state of our LB corps, the recent busts and fact that a bust at #5 is near tragic, most people said "so what" to HOF potential and wanted the safe guy that didn't have a super high ceiling. That was widely understood about Hawk. He had no special greatness making traits, but was reliably well above average at everything, and absolutely loved the game. Its funny how many people have seemingly changed their view on this now years later after the draft because he was the "#5" pick, when a few years ago most were content with a starting ready guy that probably wasn't going to suck, even at #5. Still looking at that god awful draft though, he was one of the better players to come out of the first round.

[mraynrand]

Hawk ain't done yet. Best play so far was the pass defensed on Gonzales late in the game at K.C. in 2007. Showed range, speed, flexibility. People have pointed out that he was injured last year. This is true, and I think he was hurt worse than let on. I watched him run out of the tunnel before that ATL game. His stride was reduced at least 25% - it looked painful. I've seen old men with walkers that moved better. The groin, the chest, it adds up. Maybe never a superstar, but I think he'll be a very good starter, hopefully for years and years - maybe even score a pro bowl or two.

[Tarlam!]

Good review, Waldo, but IIRC, most around here including myself were overjoyed with the Hawk pick. Furthermore, I recall he was hailed as being the answer at LB.

In that regard I somewhat have a different view on how high his ceiling was perceived to be.

Right now, mark me down for blaming Vanilla Bob's defense on the Hawk mediocrity.

[Kiwon]

It will be interesting to see the difference in Hawk's performance and stats going from the 4-3 to the 3-4.

[Bossman641]

Not a bust, definitely a disappointment though. This has to be the year for him to prove he is a playmaker. It was a real let down for him to be basically invincible (except for the 1st game) after moving to the MLB spot last year.

did you mean invisible? or invincible?

Oops, ya invisible

Sliding to the middle was his shot to play the Barnett role and be the one to have everything funneled to him. It didn't work out that way. A weak DL in front of him and various injuries resulted in a very mediocre performance.

If our DL rotation is as strong as it looks like it should be, I expect big years from all the linebackers.

[Scott Campbell]

I don't remember him missing a bunch of tackles and blowing assignments. I think he's working out fine.

[KYPack]

Couple things to remember...In Vanilla Bob's defense, Hawk's job was not to tackle as an OLB, his job was to force the RB to turn the corner so the MLB could make the tackle. Yes, I know he ended up playing MLB last season, but our DL was horrible. It's amazing how good LB's become when the DL in front of them is solid. Also, as far as rushing the passer goes, does anyone remember how Bob would blitz? He'd have the LB walk up to the line, showing blitz, and then go...real genius. Hawk is back playing the position he pretty much played now in college in our 3-4 defense, as he was a Middle/Outside Backer, like he'll play now. Nobody truly knows how injured he was last season, as I read that he could barely breath most days, but still played every game, and practice almost all practices.

100%

Sanders defense was way too easy to read. In the Capers world, the LB's will be all over the place, but their initial technique won't "tip" anything. Sometimes both the middle backer will blitz in a cross, called the "Fire X". The LB's have a great deal more flexibility and Don's fire zones will be perfect for quick guys like Hawk and Barnett.

Say what you will about AJ's performance to date, he sure has replaced (and made everybody forget) Robert Thomas.