Doom and Gloom @ Packerrats

[retailguy]

RG, If we end this season with a winning record, I'm expecting you to buy the custard...I'm just sayin.

Happy to do that. Storheims is gone, so we'll hafta find another place, but I'd show up for that.

Maybe we can meet in old St Lou and go to Ted Drewe's? and if they don't end up with a winning record, then you're buying, and I'm taking some home too.

Storheim's? Gone?

http://www.teddrewes.com/Drewes.asp

I'd have to tack it onto the end of another trip. Do they have custard in Kentucky?

Store closing article reprinted from the Press Gazette.

http://ms-my.facebook.com/topic.php?uid=71544908504&topic=8103

Kentucky, I guess so, if you're going to Louisville:

http://www.manta.com/company/mmjgv79

http://www.menupix.com/louisville/restaurants/1703279/Twysters-Frozen-Custard-Louisville-KY

[Fritz]

Look, RG, I get the frustration. I do. The team so far has struggled in many areas, and after the preseason that's a bit of a surprise. In hindsight we ought to have seen that the preseason was not a good measure - all that vanilla game plan stuff while Dom was trying to install the defense and thus blitzing and whatnot. But that's hindsight. I got caught up in it all, too, and I'm not happy with the o-line play. But I think it'll get better.

This is year five of the Ted regime, and there was a crap year, a year of improvement, a stellar year, and a slide back. So last year weighs heavily, and for those of us who felt it was an anamoly in a climb toward success, this year's early struggles have not been so daunting as they have for you.

And if the Packer stay healthy but can do no better than 8-8, then it's time to question whether MM is the right coach and whether TT is the right GM. But why so bitter now? God, I didn't see this during the Sherman years and that guy never even got the Pack to the NFC championship game.

Nobody liked last year. But prior to that, it was a steady improvement. Can't you give it til the end of the year, or at least to the part of the year where it's clearly hopeless? Why are so many people writing this team off three games in? Three games in with a 2-1 record? Why?

[retailguy]

Re: Doom and Gloom @ Packerrats

I would prefer Colledge slide back to Guard, so I am hoping its Clifton or if necessary, Levi Jones. But McCarthy doesn't seem to agree with me.

Well, we can't sign Levi Jones. He's old and washed up. Also, then we'd have to cut one of these young guys who have "great potential". We can't do that because then one of the other 31 teams will swipe him, just like Carolina swiped Sutton.

Just face it, we don't have room for all these old guys.

[retailguy]

Look, RG, I get the frustration. I do. The team so far has struggled in many areas, and after the preseason that's a bit of a surprise. In hindsight we ought to have seen that the preseason was not a good measure - all that vanilla game plan stuff while Dom was trying to install the defense and thus blitzing and whatnot. But that's hindsight. I got caught up in it all, too, and I'm not happy with the o-line play. But I think it'll get better.

This is year five of the Ted regime, and there was a crap year, a year of improvement, a stellar year, and a slide back. So last year weighs heavily, and for those of us who felt it was an anamoly in a climb toward success, this year's early struggles have not been so daunting as they have for you.

And if the Packer stay healthy but can do no better than 8-8, then it's time to question whether MM is the right coach and whether TT is the right GM. But why so bitter now? God, I didn't see this during the Sherman years and that guy never even got the Pack to the NFC championship game.

Nobody liked last year. But prior to that, it was a steady improvement. Can't you give it til the end of the year, or at least to the part of the year where it's clearly hopeless? Why are so many people writing this team off three games in? Three games in with a 2-1 record? Why?

Where did I say I've given up? I said I don't like what I've seen RIGHT NOW.

Can they improve? Sure. Will they? Don't know.

But the crap they trotted out the 1st three games really wasn't very good. We got two wins in spite of that. I'm grateful for those, and will watch to see if they get hot. Haven't seen that so far.

[Fritz]

Re: Doom and Gloom @ Packerrats

I would prefer Colledge slide back to Guard, so I am hoping its Clifton or if necessary, Levi Jones. But McCarthy doesn't seem to agree with me.

Well, we can't sign Levi Jones. He's old and washed up. Also, then we'd have to cut one of these young guys who have "great potential". We can't do that because then one of the other 31 teams will swipe him, just like Carolina swiped Sutton.

Just face it, we don't have room for all these old guys.

This is the stuff I'm talking about. You're so bitter that...the Packers didn't keep Sutton?

That they didn't re-sign Mark Tauscher?

Man, what are you gonna do if this team gels and plays well? What's going to happen to your bitterness toward TT?

If the team sucks, what will you do? Wallow in your self-righteousness?

It's just all so strangely bizarre and surprising.

I keep saying - yes, if the team stays healthy and finishes badly, then it's time to think about canning MM. Maybe TT too. I won't apologize for the guy if this team stays healthy and plays badly. It means he didn't estimate the talent he put together correctly. Maybe he's not the guy.

But the organization has not stayed the course too long. It was 4-12, 8-8, then 13-3 before the slide back. It would've been foolish to shitcan the whole thing after last season. It would've been very Al Davis-like.

[retailguy]

Re: Doom and Gloom @ Packerrats

This is the stuff I'm talking about. You're so bitter that...the Packers didn't keep Sutton?

Fritz, it was SARCASM. I thought Sutton was useless. I was illustrating that we're so protective of these young guys with "potential" that we sacrifice the present by not having adequate backup talent who can play NOW.

That they didn't re-sign Mark Tauscher?

Tauscher got hurt, it happens. The real crime is that we didn't find someone with experience to FILL IN while the young guys learned.

Man, what are you gonna do if this team gels and plays well? What's going to happen to your bitterness toward TT?

If the team sucks, what will you do? Wallow in your self-righteousness?

It's just all so strangely bizarre and surprising.

I admitted that I was wrong in 2007 and if I had to, I'd do it again. But, consistently, I've talked about the line since 2005, and quite frankly Fritz, I'm tired of talking about it, but I'm more tired waiting for it to change. It hasn't.

They'll probably play better towards the end of the year, again. But, so what?

I don't wallow in self righteousness. I'm just a fan. I will enjoy watching some of these fools here, explain it all away again. But I get no joy of any kind from Packer losses.

I keep saying - yes, if the team stays healthy and finishes badly, then it's time to think about canning MM. Maybe TT too. I won't apologize for the guy if this team stays healthy and plays badly. It means he didn't estimate the talent he put together correctly. Maybe he's not the guy.

So, what if the team "puts it together" and wins the last 5 games and finishes 7-9 or 8-8, and absolutely lights it up? Do you try again? Do you try it "just one more time?" Not an easy question.

But the organization has not stayed the course too long. It was 4-12, 8-8, then 13-3 before the slide back. It would've been foolish to shitcan the whole thing after last season. It would've been very Al Davis-like.

I think the "problems" in the front office are relatively minor. Quite honestly, if we had some talent, even back-up talent that could play now, especially on the lines, we'd be in better shape.

I think Ted's a great talent evaluator. I also think he "over estimates" young guys ability to play "sooner" rather than later. I think he "under values" the "career backup" player in the NFL.

We've got experienced starters and virtually "no experience" young guys. Not much in between. I think that is the problem.

I'm unsure about McCarthy. Maybe the blame is there? I don't know. Something is causing the teams to consistently start off slow. I don't pretend to know what that is.

Contrary to popular belief, I do not "hate" Ted Thompson. I think, for the most part, he's done a good job. But I see flaws. He is certainly not perfect. What worries me, is that he seems unwilling to address those weaknesses. We simply try the same thing again the next year.

[Pugger]

A lot of Packer fans are all resigned to the 'fact' that the Pack is gonna lose. If the queens continue to play like they have been and our offense gets out if its funk anything can happen. We all thought that Cincy game would be like the Ram game was last week but the Bengels were a tad better than we thought. Almost all of the 'experts' are picking the queens. Maybe on paper they are better, especially on their D line as opposed to our O line. But MN's O line is nothing to write home about. If Jenkins, Jolly, Raji and Kampy can get in the backfield and harrass His Highness BF will do what he almost always does in big games = throw the ball up for grabs and into the waiting arms of Al and Woody.

[Bretsky]

A lot of Packer fans are all resigned to the 'fact' that the Pack is gonna lose. If the queens continue to play like they have been and our offense gets out if its funk anything can happen. We all thought that Cincy game would be like the Ram game was last week but the Bengels were a tad better than we thought. Almost all of the 'experts' are picking the queens. Maybe on paper they are better, especially on their D line as opposed to our O line. But MN's O line is nothing to write home about. If Jenkins, Jolly, Raji and Kampy can get in the backfield and harrass His Highness BF will do what he almost always does in big games = throw the ball up for grabs and into the waiting arms of Al and Woody.

I think we'll win; just a gut feeling

[Rastak]

A lot of Packer fans are all resigned to the 'fact' that the Pack is gonna lose. If the queens continue to play like they have been and our offense gets out if its funk anything can happen. We all thought that Cincy game would be like the Ram game was last week but the Bengels were a tad better than we thought. Almost all of the 'experts' are picking the queens. Maybe on paper they are better, especially on their D line as opposed to our O line. But MN's O line is nothing to write home about. If Jenkins, Jolly, Raji and Kampy can get in the backfield and harrass His Highness BF will do what he almost always does in big games = throw the ball up for grabs and into the waiting arms of Al and Woody.

I think we'll win; just a gut feeling

My gut tells me the opposite. But I will say, the Vikings have not been consistent so anything can happen.

[MJZiggy]

That's why our guts are all confused.

[Cleft Crusty]

The Packers got it handed to them at Minnesota early in the 1996 season - at full strength. It happens. Losing in Minnesota might be painful to Packer fans (but not as painful as a colonoscopy, I can tell you), but it's long-term implications for the season are not that huge, barring injury. In Divisional play in the NFL, you have to hold serve. Winning on the road - especially against a good team that matches up well against you - is pure gravy.

[Fritz]

Cleft you are a wise guy, but I think given the near-panic permeating the press and the forum here (reflecting, I'm guessing, the general feeling in GB), if the Packers lose big and bad, it could have a long term effect.

[pbmax]

A thread about Doom and Gloom seems an appropriate place to mention that McGinn's atricle in Packers Insider (you have to pay; that's garbage and should go right in the can) with some interesting tidbits about the Departed last year. Seems he and M3 did not just have a pleasant chat.

The article covers the principals and the pressure they are under in this game. Thompson for youth, M3 for lack of progress since Giants playoff loss, Zygi for a stadium deal, Chilly for engineering Favreapoolza 2009 and being 1-5 versus the Packers. And Rodgers for not wanting to be swept under Favre again.

[Fritz]

By "departed" I take it you don't mean V-Bob, right?

And yes, I think the pressure on all of them is intense. I'm glad I'm not an NFL coach or GM.

I would like to have been a star wide receiver, however.