I'm saying it...FIRE M3

[rbaloha1]

Premature at this juncture. However concerned about the breakdowns, miscommunications, penalties and dropped passes.

With that said, should the Packers have another losing season it may be time to go in another direction.

[pbmax]

Coaches in the NFL get a looooooooong leash.

Not in a mans world; Premier League, Seria A, La Primera Division and even NBA.

I think it's the parity of the NFL that keeps the McCarthy's in the seat.

I'd like to see some figures on this. But remember, Ray Rhodes got only one year and he was 8-8. Bill Cowher got forever and it took a decade for him to stop having alternating good and bad seasons. Paid off pretty handsomely.

[pbmax]

Can some one who recorded this game please watch it again and note on how many plays Favre had 7-10 sec. to throw with not even the smell of a defensive lineman in his face. I recall about 4-5 plays and on some of them Favre was pump faking and the defensive lineman were letting up or turning around to run downfield.
I get the feeling from SC's 100th post about Favre having all day, that he is trying to rewrite the history of the game.
I didn't dvr the game, so I may be wrong and he could of taken a nap back there, but thought that was about 4-5 plays.

gex, 7-10 seconds is a league worst level rush. When announcers are telling you the QB has all day, he usually has 5 seconds. For most 3-5 step drops, coaches want 4 seconds.

[Scott Campbell]

Based on the post game comments Charles Woodson made about Favre I'm guessing they probably went into the game believing Favre didn't have enough left in him to whip the ball around like that.

I don't see it that way. They expected some pressure from the pass rush to yield some int opportunities. But their line kept him clean, and he picked them apart like most QB's would.

You can't let guys just stand around back there forever.

Can some one who recorded this game please watch it again and note on how many plays Favre had 7-10 sec. to throw with not even the smell of a defensive lineman in his face. I recall about 4-5 plays and on some of them Favre was pump faking and the defensive lineman were letting up or turning around to run downfield.
I get the feeling from SC's 100th post about Favre having all day, that he is trying to rewrite the history of the game.
I didn't dvr the game, so I may be wrong and he could of taken a nap back there, but thought that was about 4-5 plays.

Our pass rush was invisible. Guys with red jerseys see more pressure.

[Bossman641]

Based on the post game comments Charles Woodson made about Favre I'm guessing they probably went into the game believing Favre didn't have enough left in him to whip the ball around like that.

I don't see it that way. They expected some pressure from the pass rush to yield some int opportunities. But their line kept him clean, and he picked them apart like most QB's would.

You can't let guys just stand around back there forever.

Can some one who recorded this game please watch it again and note on how many plays Favre had 7-10 sec. to throw with not even the smell of a defensive lineman in his face. I recall about 4-5 plays and on some of them Favre was pump faking and the defensive lineman were letting up or turning around to run downfield.
I get the feeling from SC's 100th post about Favre having all day, that he is trying to rewrite the history of the game.
I didn't dvr the game, so I may be wrong and he could of taken a nap back there, but thought that was about 4-5 plays.

Gex, he wasn't sitting back in the pocket for 7 seconds play after play. The point is, that even when he was only back there for 4-5 seconds he didn't have to worry about stepping up in the pocket, avoiding tacklers, or throwing from awkward positions to avoid hits. He was completely comfortable in the pocket.

[pbmax]

Based on the post game comments Charles Woodson made about Favre I'm guessing they probably went into the game believing Favre didn't have enough left in him to whip the ball around like that.

I don't see it that way. They expected some pressure from the pass rush to yield some int opportunities. But their line kept him clean, and he picked them apart like most QB's would.

You can't let guys just stand around back there forever.

The 49ers sent a lot of guys in the first half of their game, and Favre made them pay for their blitzing. They backed off the blitz in the second half and it worked better. I think the Packers thought they could do the same. Play good coverage and generate pressure with 3 or 4 up front. It was stunning that they were unable to generate pressure. Some of it was crappy individual effort, but some of it was focus on the run and screen, and several really poorly conceived schemes. The 7 second drop back had only three guys bringing pressure - and Kampman's 'pressure' was delayed several seconds in as he first dropped into coverage. On several plays you had lineman stopping their pass rush looking to cover running backs either because they were looking for screens or because they were in a zone blitz. But if you are going to dial up some type of zone blitz, then you have to blitz when you zone your linemen - otherwise there is no pressure. I can't believe they will play that way the next time these two teams meet. It did look like they thought that if they stopped the run, they didn't think Favre could beat them. They won't be thinking that next time.

Capers talked to JSO about this a day or two ago. He said the Packers gave up more than half of Stephen Jackson's long runs on blitz calls.

He did not want that to happen versus Peterson. He obviously did not count on the feebleness of the four man rush. Nor did he count on blown coverages in the secondary. Both conspired to kill the pass D.

[pbmax]

As for two Mikes and John, Shanahan is going to want to have personnel control an issue the Packers exec committee decided was better off split between coach and GM.

Not sure about Holmgren, but I would imagine he wants a similar situation to Shanahan, where he is not the titular head of personnel, but his guys get to decide.

I want no part of Gruden. He torched a pretty good Tampa Bay situation and let the team get very old.

[MOBB DEEP]

Based on the post game comments Charles Woodson made about Favre I'm guessing they probably went into the game believing Favre didn't have enough left in him to whip the ball around like that.

I don't see it that way. They expected some pressure from the pass rush to yield some int opportunities. But their line kept him clean, and he picked them apart like most QB's would.

You can't let guys just stand around back there forever.

Can some one who recorded this game please watch it again and note on how many plays Favre had 7-10 sec. to throw with not even the smell of a defensive lineman in his face. I recall about 4-5 plays and on some of them Favre was pump faking and the defensive lineman were letting up or turning around to run downfield.
I get the feeling from SC's 100th post about Favre having all day, that he is trying to rewrite the history of the game.
I didn't dvr the game, so I may be wrong and he could of taken a nap back there, but thought that was about 4-5 plays.

Gex, he wasn't sitting back in the pocket for 7 seconds play after play. The point is, that even when he was only back there for 4-5 seconds he didn't have to worry about stepping up in the pocket, avoiding tacklers, or throwing from awkward positions to avoid hits. He was completely comfortable in the pocket.

Agreed; now, is it more on our D's inadequacies or on Minny's skill level?

Personally, I think it had more to do with their ability and the pack will turn it around after bye...but I havnt broken down the film like u all

[pbmax]

Based on the post game comments Charles Woodson made about Favre I'm guessing they probably went into the game believing Favre didn't have enough left in him to whip the ball around like that.

I don't see it that way. They expected some pressure from the pass rush to yield some int opportunities. But their line kept him clean, and he picked them apart like most QB's would.

You can't let guys just stand around back there forever.

Can some one who recorded this game please watch it again and note on how many plays Favre had 7-10 sec. to throw with not even the smell of a defensive lineman in his face. I recall about 4-5 plays and on some of them Favre was pump faking and the defensive lineman were letting up or turning around to run downfield.
I get the feeling from SC's 100th post about Favre having all day, that he is trying to rewrite the history of the game.
I didn't dvr the game, so I may be wrong and he could of taken a nap back there, but thought that was about 4-5 plays.

Gex, he wasn't sitting back in the pocket for 7 seconds play after play. The point is, that even when he was only back there for 4-5 seconds he didn't have to worry about stepping up in the pocket, avoiding tacklers, or throwing from awkward positions to avoid hits. He was completely comfortable in the pocket.

Agreed; now, is it more on our D's inadequacies or on Minny's skill level?

Personally, I think it had more to do with their ability and the pack will turn it around after bye...but I havnt broken down the film like u all

What about execution? The Packers had three blown coverages with an essentially new starting safety. Eliminate those, and the Vikings probably have one less score, don't they?

Of course, if the Vikings don't take their foot off the gas, there may have been more opportunities.

[SkinBasket]

Coaches in the NFL get a looooooooong leash.

Not in a mans world; Premier League, Seria A, La Primera Division and even NBA.

I think it's the parity of the NFL that keeps the McCarthy's in the seat.

I'd like to see some figures on this. But remember, Ray Rhodes got only one year and he was 8-8. Bill Cowher got forever and it took a decade for him to stop having alternating good and bad seasons. Paid off pretty handsomely.

The problem is, Ray Rhodes made some god awful coaching blunders during the season. When your team doesn't perform well, there's debate as to player effort versus coaching preparation. When the coach loses a game because he doesn't understand when to call a time-out, well there's not much to debate about that.

[The Shadow]

4 games.
Fire everyone.
Here we go again.
Sigh.

[bobblehead]

Based on the post game comments Charles Woodson made about Favre I'm guessing they probably went into the game believing Favre didn't have enough left in him to whip the ball around like that.

I don't see it that way. They expected some pressure from the pass rush to yield some int opportunities. But their line kept him clean, and he picked them apart like most QB's would.

You can't let guys just stand around back there forever.

The 49ers sent a lot of guys in the first half of their game, and Favre made them pay for their blitzing. They backed off the blitz in the second half and it worked better. I think the Packers thought they could do the same. Play good coverage and generate pressure with 3 or 4 up front. It was stunning that they were unable to generate pressure. Some of it was crappy individual effort, but some of it was focus on the run and screen, and several really poorly conceived schemes. The 7 second drop back had only three guys bringing pressure - and Kampman's 'pressure' was delayed several seconds in as he first dropped into coverage. On several plays you had lineman stopping their pass rush looking to cover running backs either because they were looking for screens or because they were in a zone blitz. But if you are going to dial up some type of zone blitz, then you have to blitz when you zone your linemen - otherwise there is no pressure. I can't believe they will play that way the next time these two teams meet. It did look like they thought that if they stopped the run, they didn't think Favre could beat them. They won't be thinking that next time.

Capers talked to JSO about this a day or two ago. He said the Packers gave up more than half of Stephen Jackson's long runs on blitz calls.

He did not want that to happen versus Peterson. He obviously did not count on the feebleness of the four man rush. Nor did he count on blown coverages in the secondary. Both conspired to kill the pass D.

The entire second half went...AP for 0, AP for -1, 3rd and 11, 3 or 4 man rush, BF completes for 12 or more. I think worrying about AP busting a big run on 3rd and 11 is foolish.

[bobblehead]

4 games.
Fire everyone.
Here we go again.
Sigh.

I see no need in keeping a coach who can't call a fvcking running play...thats all. If we recommit to the run in coming weeks I'll change my tune, but for christs sake, 3 running plays in the second half against cincy and now 13 in the game against that pass rushing demon of a DL.....wtf do you want me to do, be happy with the coaching?

[retailguy]

4 games.
Fire everyone.
Here we go again.
Sigh.

I see no need in keeping a coach who can't call a fvcking running play...thats all. If we recommit to the run in coming weeks I'll change my tune, but for christs sake, 3 running plays in the second half against cincy and now 13 in the game against that pass rushing demon of a DL.....wtf do you want me to do, be happy with the coaching?

He wants you to be happy with his opinion. That's all. Let him think for you. You'll be happier. Trust me.

[woodbuck27]

Can some one who recorded this game please watch it again and note on how many plays Favre had 7-10 sec. to throw with not even the smell of a defensive lineman in his face. I recall about 4-5 plays and on some of them Favre was pump faking and the defensive lineman were letting up or turning around to run downfield.
I get the feeling from SC's 100th post about Favre having all day, that he is trying to rewrite the history of the game.
I didn't dvr the game, so I may be wrong and he could of taken a nap back there, but thought that was about 4-5 plays.

gex, 7-10 seconds is a league worst level rush. When announcers are telling you the QB has all day, he usually has 5 seconds. For most 3-5 step drops, coaches want 4 seconds.

The longest time as I re-call it was (about 7.3 -7.4) seconds before Favre released the ball. A very long time.