Pack given C grade for past 3 drafts

[Scott Campbell]

First 3 years:

Derick Mason 608 yards 3 TD's
James Jones 1390 yards 8 TD's

First 2 years:

Derick Mason 519 yards 3 TD's
Jordy Nelson 686 yards 4 TD's

[Scott Campbell]

So Jones and Nelson are off to faster career starts than 2 of the top 3 receivers from this year, and 5 of the top 22.

I'm not quite ready to write them off yet.

[Bretsky]

Honestly I don't see much from Jones or Nelson. I would not want either to be the #2 WR when DD retires.

Then you aren't looking too closely. Both are good enough to be #2 WRs...especially with Rodgers tossing the ball. They are every bit as talented as Robert Brooks or Antonio Freeman...who were made to look better than they were by Favre.

Nelson and Jones simply don't get much of a chance with Driver, Jennings and Finley being such huge threats on the field. We don't run too many 4 and 5 WR sets with an OL that is giving up 50 sacks a year.

Everybody underestimes how good Robert Brooks was becoming. He's beter than both of those guys; I wouldn't even compare them yet. Also think Freeman was better as well although he seemed to lose his fire fast after he got the big deal.
Maybe too much partying with Sam Cassell ?

They're both decent. They're decent. I don't think either would tear things up as a #2 but both might be alright there as long as there are plenty of weapons around them that are better to take the focus away.

It's a solid debate to figure out who is going to be better.

[Bretsky]

So Jones and Nelson are off to faster career starts than 2 of the top 3 receivers from this year, and 5 of the top 22.

I'm not quite ready to write them off yet.

Those are good stats SC; thanks for posting them.....I'd be curious to know how many passing yards the teams had with those other players.

A couple things strike me. Wes Welker...poor guy was on the Dolphins and I think they were pretty bad when he was there the first three years.

I think Mason was on the run first team as well. It's surprising he had even that many catches in early years

Driver, coming out of college, was a project and not nearly as NFL ready as either guy. He didn't have a ton of opportunity early on....but that dude has improved as much as any NFL player I've ever seen from his rookie year.

Vincent Jackson...plenty thought they saw star potential in him...but his early years were pretty LT dominated I think. But I think he had Rivers or Brees so on a legit passing team.

Miles Austin...gosh I can't even remember that guy in college. In his first two years was he even in the top 4 on the Cowboyz ? That guy has come a ways. I think he's a burner though.

JJ seems like he'd have the most upside but he's been a flasher so far. I'm not sure why he can't take the bull and run with his talent

Jordy is just steady Eddie. He's decent. I'd much rather have both of these guys as very good #3 options than starters at this point.

Plenty of time for either to emerge.

[RashanGary]

I've seen enough talent in both of them already to think they'd be solid #2's. The average #2 gets about 800 yards per season. Jones almost had that in his rookie year behind Driver and Jennings.

Both of these guys have talent. We just think around here that #2 receivers are 1000 yd per season players and that just isn't the case for the most part.


I'm glad we have them. I'd like to see this as Drivers last year. I don't know if either as as good as Driver was last year, but I think both will be as good as Driver two years from now and that's when the decision needs to get made. Not this year, the year after.

[Gunakor]

We are a pass first team, but not a pass only team. We have, after all, had a top 10 rusher in each of the past 2 seasons. Would have been 3 straight had Grant been inserted as our starter earlier than week 9 of the 2007 season.

It's a poor comparison between Jones/Nelson and Breaston as they are in different offenses and have different levels of responsibility within those offenses. Neither Jones nor Nelson have ever been the target of as many passes as Breaston has been the past 2 years, so it's silly to expect similar numbers.

Either would make a fine #2 on our team. Nelson would make a fine #2 on many teams around the league, especially one that already had a speed guy as a #1. He doesn't drop very many passes at all. Isn't going to be much of a deep threat, but could develop into one of the premier possession receivers in the game. Jones drops more balls, but he's strong as an ox and has a bit of speed. He's tough to bring down once he has the ball in his hands. Very much like Driver in that sense. Don't know how many other teams would play him as a #2, I'd have to imagine a few would, but he'd make a very serviceable #2 in Green Bay and a FANTASTIC #3.

[twoseven]

just watching them play, both receiving and in the return game, Breaston looks head and shoulders above Jordy. forget stats for a minute, Breaston shows the tools you want in a WR and can take a hit. Jordy is a blue collar big guy with great hands, but without the quickness you want as a return man. you can't teach that, and as Jordy matures he is more likely to get bigger, not smaller. he reminds me more of Freeman than Brooks.

Jones is not even in this conversation. To me he does not have great hands, and is minus the quickness and the breakaway speed. i won't deny he has bobbed and weaved into the endzone on occasion, but he is never going to be what Driver is in the open field.

personally, i wouldn't mind seeing Jordy continue to bulk up and possibly make a switch to TE. at 6-3 and 220 (lee is 6-4 and 245), he is not hoplessly out of range to be the right weight. not sure if this could work out, but thinking of Finley and and about a 240+ lb nelson as bookends ala Chmura and Jackson 96' is a nice image.

feel free to tell me how dumb this sounds now.

[Fritz]

Honestly I don't see much from Jones or Nelson. I would not want either to be the #2 WR when DD retires.

Then you aren't looking too closely. Both are good enough to be #2 WRs...especially with Rodgers tossing the ball. They are every bit as talented as Robert Brooks or Antonio Freeman...who were made to look better than they were by Favre.

Nelson and Jones simply don't get much of a chance with Driver, Jennings and Finley being such huge threats on the field. We don't run too many 4 and 5 WR sets with an OL that is giving up 50 sacks a year.

Everybody underestimes how good Robert Brooks was becoming. He's beter than both of those guys; I wouldn't even compare them yet. Also think Freeman was better as well although he seemed to lose his fire fast after he got the big deal.
Maybe too much partying with Sam Cassell ?

They're both decent. They're decent. I don't think either would tear things up as a #2 but both might be alright there as long as there are plenty of weapons around them that are better to take the focus away.

It's a solid debate to figure out who is going to be better.

Thank you Bretsky. It was a crying shame he got hurt, because I felt and feel that he was on his way to being a top flight receiver in the league. He was fearless over the middle, he ran good routes, he was fast (remember the 97 yarder or whatever it was against Da Bears?), he had good hands, and he worked hard. I loved the guy. He would have been, in my opinion, much better than Freeman.

As for the Jones/Nelson thing, my impression of Jones is that he has a hard time getting open in man coverage, especially on longer routes, and he doesn't make the over the shoulder catch as well as he might. I like the guy and have been slightly disappointed in his lack of ability to create separation. But I hope he's great this year and proves me wrong.

[twoseven]

Robert Brooks was by far our best receiver at the time his arm was broken in 96', showing hands, quickness, speed, and the ability to cross the middle and get up from a crushing hit.

the only time a ever remember freeman running away from the pack was on his 60+ yard TD catch in our SB win over the Pats. he pulled away from Ty Law and Lawyer Milloy who had the angle on him and to this day i still don't know how he did it, he channeled Desmond Howard's speed for that one play.

[TennesseePackerBacker]

Quit using logic! Jones and Nelson are scrubs because I just don't see anything in them.

[packrulz]

WR James Jones #89
Pro Summary
Talented and physical third-year wideout will look to bounce back in 2009 after a frustrating second season that saw him battle a knee injury throughout the year
Originally sprained his right knee in preseason game at Denver and struggled to stay healthy for any extended period for the remainder of the season
Did show flashes of his abilities down the stretch, catching half of his 20 receptions during the final four games of 2008, including a career high 132-yard receiving game at Jacksonville (Dec. 14), the third-highest yardage output total by a Green Bay receiver on the season
As a rookie in 2007, quickly earned No. 3 receiver job and held it the entire season
Posted one of the top pass-catching seasons in Green Bay annals for a rookie, with his 47 catches and 676 yards both ranking fourth in club history
Reception total trailed only Sterling Sharpe (55, 1988), Billy Howton (53, 1952) and RB Gerry Ellis (48, 1980) in team’s rookie record book, while yardage total trailed only Howton (1,231), James Lofton (818, 1978) and Sharpe (791)
His totals also ranked third, respectively, among all 2007 NFL rookies behind Kansas City’s Dwayne Bowe (70-995) and Detroit’s Calvin Johnson (48-756)
Also caught two TD passes, including a 79-yarder on Monday Night Football in Denver (Oct. 29), the longest TD catch by a Green Bay rookie in 53 years (Max McGee, 82 yards, 1954)

WR JORDY NELSON #87
Pro Summary
Steady performer will look to continue role as No. 3 wideout in a talented wide receiver group
Played in every game during his debut season in Green Bay, the only rookie on the roster to accomplish that feat
Finished fourth on the team with 33 receptions for 366 yards (11.1 avg.) and two touchdowns
Will also compete for time as a kick returner after posting 11 returns for 208 yards (18.9 avg.) in ’08
Became only rookie in franchise history to post 30-plus catches and a 45-plus yard kick return
After starting his college career as a walk-on safety at Kansas State, went on to become one of the most prolific receivers in school history
Finished career second in school history with 206 receptions for 2,822 yards, trailing only Kevin Lockett (1993-96), who caught 217 passes for 3,032 yards and went on to be selected in the second round by the Kansas City Chiefs in 1997
Became only the fifth player in school history to surpass the 2,000-yard career receiving mark
As a senior, posted school records for receptions (122) and receiving yards (1,606) on his way to earning consensus All-America honors
Was one of three finalists for the Biletnikoff Award, given annually to the top receiver in the country
His 122 receptions broke the Big 12 conference record for catches in a season by a senior
Ranked second in the country and in the Big 12 in receptions and yardage, trailing only Texas Tech’s Michael Crabtree (134-1,962)
Set school single-game yardage mark at Iowa State in ’07 with 214 yards and also single-game reception record vs. Missouri State and Fresno State with 15 receptions in each contest
Showed his versatility by returning two of his six career punt returns for touchdowns, an 89-yarder and a 92-yarder, and threw two passes as a senior, both for touchdowns

[Brandon494]

Honestly I don't see much from Jones or Nelson. I would not want either to be the #2 WR when DD retires.

Then you aren't looking too closely. Both are good enough to be #2 WRs...especially with Rodgers tossing the ball. They are every bit as talented as Robert Brooks or Antonio Freeman...who were made to look better than they were by Favre.

Nelson and Jones simply don't get much of a chance with Driver, Jennings and Finley being such huge threats on the field. We don't run too many 4 and 5 WR sets with an OL that is giving up 50 sacks a year.

Oh Im looking closely enough, Im just not looking thru green and gold glasses. Every bit as talented as Brooks or Freeman huh?

[Scott Campbell]

First 3 years:

Robert Brooks 954 yards 5 TD's
James Jones 1390 yards 8 TD's

First 2 years:

Robert Brooks 306 yards 1 TD's
Jordy Nelson 686 yards 4 TD's

[Brandon494]

So Jones and Nelson are off to faster career starts than 2 of the top 3 receivers from this year, and 5 of the top 22.

I'm not quite ready to write them off yet.

All those recievers you listed mean nothing.

I could list just as many recievers who put up similair numbers who have never started. I hope I'm wrong and they can prove me wrong but I just don't see it.

[Scott Campbell]

So Jones and Nelson are off to faster career starts than 2 of the top 3 receivers from this year, and 5 of the top 22.

I'm not quite ready to write them off yet.

All those recievers you listed mean nothing.

Obviously not - given the way you base your analysis. You've backed you claim up with what exactly?