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  • #1

    running game

    I know the media is ready to throw in the towel on our running game already, but I'm still convinced B-Jack & Kuhn can do it. This is however my problem...

    If McCarthy thinks he's going to get away with just tossing the ball around, and running it every now and then, not gonna happen. Jackson and Kuhn are good at?? Passing catching...I don't care if it was the Bills, where were the screens or flat passes? I don't remember there being one planned pass to Jackson the entire game.

    PLUS...we're up in the 4th quarter, and we're throwing the football, or just running straight ahead lead dives with Kuhn...seriously?
    "I would love to have a guy that always gets the key hit, a pitcher that always makes his best pitch and a manager that can always make the right decision. The problem is getting him to put down his beer and come out of the stands and do those things." - Danny Murraugh
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  • #2
    Let's see where we're at around week 8 or 9. Several years in a row now the running game has been slow out of the gate, only to get it together around midseason. Not sure exactly why, but there is enough data here to indicate trend rather than mirage.

    Tough to say if that will continue without Grant, and a healthy and effective Clifton specifically and the rest of the line in general will play a major role in the success, or lack thereof.

    Just a gut feeling, but I get the sense confidence is a big deal to BJack. If he can rip off a couple nice runs early, that will help his confidence and could lead to a big game. Conversely, if he struggles early I see that affecting his confidence and, as a result, performance. A side effect would be McCarthy's confidence in the run game and his willingness to stick to it, early effectiveness will help that too.

    With BJack, I expect to see a couple 100+ yard games bookended by some stinkers. A mix of rushing lines such as 21-114 and 14-38 sounds about right. Hopefully Kuhn can help add balance to the rushing attack as I see his results being more consistent.
    "My problems with him are his vision and tendency to dance instead of pounding a hole." - Harvey Wallbangers

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    • #3
      Originally posted by superfan
      Just a gut feeling, but I get the sense confidence is a big deal to BJack.
      Agreed. Watch him in interviews, and you see a kid that is kind of shy and seems to lack confidence. You watch Finley, Matthews, Jennings, Rodgers, etc. and they were just sure they'd be great players some day. This kid needs to have a good game or two, and then maybe he can get rolling. I'm starting to think priority #1 next year will be to get a good RB--along with grabbing another long-term OT and CBs.
      "There's a lot of interest in the draft. It's great. But quite frankly, most of the people that are commenting on it don't know anything about what they are talking about."--Ted Thompson

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      • #4
        I give up. All is lost.

        "Never, never ever support a punk like mraynrand. Rather be as I am and feel real sympathy for his sickness." - Woodbuck

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        • #5
          Don't be surprised if James Starks is a key part of the running game by week 8 or 9, similar to Grant in 2007. There is an article in JSO about the recoveries of the guys on the PUP list. Starks sounds pretty good. http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/103762424.html

          Starks is a guy who probably would have been a 2-3 round pick if not for a shoulder injury that forced him to miss his senior season. Whe healthy, he may be the most talented RB on the Packers roster.
          I can't run no more
          With that lawless crowd
          While the killers in high places
          Say their prayers out loud
          But they've summoned, they've summoned up
          A thundercloud
          They're going to hear from me - Leonard Cohen

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          • #6
            I think Jackson just needs to trust his instincts. Maybe that's the confidence part of the equation. There were holes there last week against the Bills and he just missed them a couple of times. I agree with you that we need to establish a consistent running game and I think BJack can be a good reliable running back for us. Hopefully he'll get it going.
            GO PACK!!!!

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            • #7
              Let's not forget the Colts had the 27th ranked rush offense last year and if not for a few calls would've won the Super Bowl.
              If you don't like me....bite me...
              ....want some, come get some!

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              • #8
                Re: running game

                Originally posted by ND72
                I know the media is ready to throw in the towel on our running game already, but I'm still convinced B-Jack & Kuhn can do it. This is however my problem...

                If McCarthy thinks he's going to get away with just tossing the ball around, and running it every now and then, not gonna happen. Jackson and Kuhn are good at?? Passing catching...I don't care if it was the Bills, where were the screens or flat passes? I don't remember there being one planned pass to Jackson the entire game.

                PLUS...we're up in the 4th quarter, and we're throwing the football, or just running straight ahead lead dives with Kuhn...seriously?
                What's the matter with you, ND? You clearly have not been listening to the national announcers, who, when the Packers finally finally tried one screen pass in preseason, went on and on about how good a screen team the Packers are...

                It kills me that these guys get paid so much money and do not actually know their teams. Everybody on this board knows perfectly well that the Packers USED TO BE a good screen team, but that was back when Ahman Green was the featured back and some guy with a funny name was the quarterback.

                Like you I am puzzled as to why MM does not really like the screen pass. There was a wonderful thread a year or two ago here about the draw vs. the screen, and it was pointed out by some Packerrat luminaries that my desire for more draw plays was probably not as good a way to deter a fierce pass rush as a good screen game.

                I don't know a whole lot about football, so here's a question: it's the guards that have to get out on the screen, right? If so, that would shoot down my theory that the reason MM doesn't call many and that the ones they do try don't work well is because the tackles are too old and immobile to make the screen work.

                But you are right: B-Jack's stock-in-trade is the third-down back with good hands. The screen should be his play.
                "The Devine era is actually worse than you remember if you go back and look at it."

                KYPack

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Joemailman
                  Don't be surprised if James Starks is a key part of the running game by week 8 or 9, similar to Grant in 2007. There is an article in JSO about the recoveries of the guys on the PUP list. Starks sounds pretty good. http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/103762424.html

                  Starks is a guy who probably would have been a 2-3 round pick if not for a shoulder injury that forced him to miss his senior season. Whe healthy, he may be the most talented RB on the Packers roster.
                  As much as I like Starks you have to remember he hasnt played football in almost 2 years so I doubt he can come in and save our running game. We need to go out and get someone.

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                  • #10
                    superfan has a point. And there is another reason I expect delay on retooling or changing the run calls/screens. McCarthy is stubborn in his belief in the supremacy of his passing game. He is much like Holmgren in this regard. Holmgren was often chastised for forgetting his running game before they broke through in the playoffs.

                    It took him eight games, a 4-4 record and a loss to a dysfunctional Bucs team to alter his approach last year with a faltering O line and occasionally shaky QB timing and feel.

                    Grant being hurt, early and definitively, might hasten the decisions this time. But its going to take time before he will implement changes. And I would expect fewer changes the more they win, at least short term.
                    Bud Adams told me the franchise he admired the most was the Kansas City Chiefs. Then he asked for more hookers and blow.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by pbmax
                      superfan has a point. And there is another reason I expect delay on retooling or changing the run calls/screens. McCarthy is stubborn in his belief in the supremacy of his passing game. He is much like Holmgren in this regard. Holmgren was often chastised for forgetting his running game before they broke through in the playoffs.

                      It took him eight games, a 4-4 record and a loss to a dysfunctional Bucs team to alter his approach last year with a faltering O line and occasionally shaky QB timing and feel.

                      Grant being hurt, early and definitively, might hasten the decisions this time. But its going to take time before he will implement changes. And I would expect fewer changes the more they win, at least short term.
                      That's the way I see it as well. The run game is going to get more and more forgotten the longer this team keeps winning. MM wont feel a need to change his style, especially with grant gone, if the team wins. As I said awhile back, think the Indianapolis Colts. The run game is barely even an afterthought in that offense - it just doesn't exist at all.

                      The only problem I see for us is going to come in december. Passing attacks don't work as well in the cold and snow, and of course if we get some home games in the playoffs, it's going to matter even more. First 12 or so games I don't think the run game is going to matter as we should win most of those games if were as good as we appear (that also means that our defense is also as good as it appears), but in the same breath - I think Grant came on late last season not because he was necessarily motivated by what Green was showing out there, but because MM simply called more run plays as the weather started to turn. He knew that he needed a run game to win those home games late in the season.

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                      • #12
                        I don't know how the running is going to start producing, but without a good ground game we will not win the superbowl. The running game we have right now will just not cut it. Ryan Grant was one of those guys on the team were his replacement is a huge step down. We need to make a trade or hope Starks can provide a spark cuz I have zero confidence in Jackson. Jackson is barely a servable number two running back to me.

                        The line needs to play better also. They are blocking like crap right now.

                        Rodgers better be on fire against the Bears.
                        Draft Brandin Cooks WR OSU!

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