Snap Thoughts

[3irty1]

Patler could find good stats, but the best I could find was a site that showed two-point conversion percentages per team -- last year, we were at 60%, with no attempts this year. League average in 2009 was 40%, but it has been as high as 60%, according to an NY Times story.

I don't blame him, but I would have gone for two. It was asking a lot of a jury-rigged D to make a stop in OT (even though they did), and I think the Fins were kind of discombobulated after the way Rodgers walked in the TD. Hit 'em when they're on their heels, you know.

I'm not sure that play wouldn't have worked twice. They came out in that formation the first time and Miami called a TO to make sense of it.

[Noodle]

Agree, wouldn't call the same play twice, I'm just saying there seemed to be a lot of confusion in Fin-land after the TD play, so line up while they're still bitching at each other and use a different play, but run it quick.

It's not like they never practice a two-point conversion practice in TC. Blow the dust off a play from the package and run it. Quick.

[mraynrand]

The two point conversion at home to win? It's just not done. Ask Dave Wannstedt how well that worked out for him.

I would have liked to see it, given how ugly the game ended, but you would have heard a lot of carping had they gone for it and failed.

[Pugger]

No way does the coach get tossed because he loses two games in OT with half the team on IR.

Whatever you are smoking, we need to get it legalized in the US as well.

OK

Seriously, McStubby didn't start coaching 2 weeks ago. You want McCarthy? Ok then, say hello to the mediocre era. U GOT IT!!!

I may be a fan of the Packers that's a fish out of water; I expect Packers to contend. My bad.

Contend even with the injuries they have?

4th string DE. 4th string OLB. 3rd string safety.

D didn't lose this game. Go back to smoking.

NB - please start an OFFICIAL McCARTHY THE GREAT THREAD. You can weed it out there!

Our PS and 3rd string defenders couldn't get off the field. Miami had the ball for over 37 minutes to our 28. We made Henne look like Peyton Manning and didn't lay a finger on him. Injuries have ruined this season and we are now a shell of what we were coming out of TC. It is all rather sad, frankly.

[Patler]

Our PS and 3rd string defenders couldn't get off the field. Miami had the ball for over 37 minutes to our 28. We made Henne look like Peyton Manning and didn't lay a finger on him. Injuries have ruined this season and we are now a shell of what we were coming out of TC. It is all rather sad, frankly.

The offense is struggling more than the defense, and has been all season so far. Yet, all they were missing was Grant, one player. Even with the loss now of Finley, its not an excuse for the offense. Finley has been more about what he can mean, than what he has meant to the offense. This was a good offense before Finley emerged, and should be without him, too.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Anybody who thinks you can lose the players we lost and not have it affect the team is insane. I see that picture being painted right now. Yes, I realize many players could be playing better (Rodgers and Woodson included). But how many think we wouldn't 5-1 if Clay Matthews hadn't gotten hurt last week? And that's one player. You just have a lot more margin for error when other guys can lean on the likes of Grant, Finley, Pickett, Neal, Barnett, Matthews, Chillar, etc. I think it speaks to the depth on the team that we can compete against a decent Miami team when 2 of our 4 best DL, 3 of our 5 best LBs, a solid corner, and 3 of our best 4 or 5 safeties are out. It is what it is. Sure, we could scratch and claw and beat these ordinary teams, but any Super Bowl aspirations are pretty much history in my book. Yes, our offense should have scored a bit more--despite the loss of Grant, Finley, and Tauscher--but Miami is an offense that a good defense should throttle. And their strength is their defense, so it's not shocking that the offense struggled. Instead, Henne got all day to pass and ate up most of the clock. If healthy, perhaps our offense is given more time to find their rhythm. And let's face it, Finley's emergence was one of the two biggest reasons our offense went from solid (I wouldn't classify us as good before that) to very good last year. That and Rodgers improved pocket awareness.

[3irty1]

Anybody who thinks you can lose the players we lost and not have it affect the team is insane. I see that picture being painted right now. Yes, I realize many players could be playing better (Rodgers and Woodson included). But how many think we wouldn't 5-1 if Clay Matthews hadn't gotten hurt last week? And that's one player. You just have a lot more margin for error when other guys can lean on the likes of Grant, Finley, Pickett, Neal, Barnett, Matthews, Chillar, etc. I think it speaks to the depth on the team that we can compete against a decent Miami team when 2 of our 4 best DL, 3 of our 5 best LBs, a solid corner, and 3 of our best 4 or 5 safeties are out. It is what it is. Sure, we could scratch and claw and beat these ordinary teams, but any Super Bowl aspirations are pretty much history in my book. Yes, our offense should have scored a bit more--despite the loss of Grant, Finley, and Tauscher--but Miami is an offense that a good defense should throttle. And their strength is their defense, so it's not shocking that the offense struggled. Instead, Henne got all day to pass and ate up most of the clock. If healthy, perhaps our offense is given more time to find their rhythm. And let's face it, Finley's emergence was one of the two biggest reasons our offense went from solid (I wouldn't classify us as good before that) to very good last year. That and Rodgers improved pocket awareness.

Clay and Finley are two of our top three players but at least we're getting Clay back. The Grant injury seems to be whats sinking us. The offense can't overcome being totally one dimensional. The running game reps MUST INCREASE until defenses are forced to respect it.

On the defensive side of the ball the injuries are truely devastating but the team is deep enough to overcome them all imo. As long as Clay and the core of our hogs (Raji and Jenkins) are still playing ball, our defense is good enough to win with.

[Tony Oday]

17 run plays...

[bobblehead]

Re: Snap Thoughts

The NFL has sent a message to the league that it is acceptable to T off on ARod. They may fine you after, but they will NOT throw a flag. Hit him as hard and illegally as you want. It's ok.

did ocheapshoto even get a fine?

$5k

So its on par with twittering about a signed ball 60 minutes before kickoff....sounds about right for a concussion.

[bobblehead]

I was pissed at this loss, but upon reflection, if the team had:

Barnett
Matthews
Grant
Pickett
Finley

Do you think this team would've lost? I don't.

OK, we would have won by three. The point still stands.

This team has always been a joke when it mattered under MM. Even many of our wins last year had teams coming back hard in the second half. It's not all coincidental.

this is my snap judgement as well. Somehow the D is keeping us in games despite all the injuries. The O will figure it out soon and we will go on a winning streak to get in the playoffs, then when it counts (like AZ), the D will be fully healthy, our optimism will be high, and we will give up 50 with the O doing just enough to make it fun, but then have a crushing turnover to dash our dreams.....its tough being a packer fan lately.

[pbmax]

The two point conversion at home to win? It's just not done. Ask Dave Wannstedt how well that worked out for him.

I would have liked to see it, given how ugly the game ended, but you would have heard a lot of carping had they gone for it and failed.

Yes, and the Packers weaknesses kill them in OT, but McCarthy always trusts the players to pull though even in the face of overwhelming evidence. They constantly lose field position either by Special Teams or penalty. Even after the D stopped Miami, they took the punt and went backward. First a penalty, then a sack.

[Tarlam!]

NB - I loved the call on 4th and goal - very Peyton like but McCarthy won't ever, ever bring a championship to Packers. Gut feeling & I got no evidence as I ain't got no crystal ball.

I understand your opinion and am just as frustrated as any Packer fan. My gut tells me, your assumption above is a good one.

But, then I get to thinking that they were a dumb ass INT away from playing the Patriots with, IIRC a less talented football team and DC than they have today. That's hard evindence that he does have it in him. Or at least had it in him.

He also finished last season 7-1, missing Harris and Kampy.

So, it's a tough call for TT and I challenge you to name any other team in the NFL that can lose as many starters as this team, yet stay competitive.

[packerbacker1234]

In my opinion, you don't go for 2 in that situation when your QB is barely completing 50% of his passes on the day.

I would watch the game again, but i deleted it (intentionally). How much of the 50% was drops?

Not a lot today I don't believe, but does it matter? I wasn't trying to single out Arod. My point is that when you are barely completing 50%, no matter the reason, going for 2 there would be too much of a gamble.

And if you're only completeing 50% of your balls, there is even LESS of a chance of your team putting together a drive in OT to get into scoring position. At least in going for two, you are in a position to not just score, but to win the game, versus relying on an offense to drive the field who couldn't drive the field all game, and took going for it twice on 4th down on the final drive to even get the TD.

[Patler]

In my opinion, you don't go for 2 in that situation when your QB is barely completing 50% of his passes on the day.

I would watch the game again, but i deleted it (intentionally). How much of the 50% was drops?

Not a lot today I don't believe, but does it matter? I wasn't trying to single out Arod. My point is that when you are barely completing 50%, no matter the reason, going for 2 there would be too much of a gamble.

And if you're only completeing 50% of your balls, there is even LESS of a chance of your team putting together a drive in OT to get into scoring position. At least in going for two, you are in a position to not just score, but to win the game, versus relying on an offense to drive the field who couldn't drive the field all game, and took going for it twice on 4th down on the final drive to even get the TD.

If you tie the game with an extra point (almost a certainty), you force the other team to do something positive to beat you. If you go for two in that situation, you stand a 50% chance (or whatever) of allowing the other team to win while doing nothing further to get points.

I would prefer to force the other team to do something to win in that situation.

[MichiganPackerFan]

Quite honestly, the loss didn't hurt as much because I just assumed they'd lose. Let's be real here. If you had told me before the year that Grant, Finley, Tauscher, Pickett, Neal, Barnett, Matthews, Chillar, Bigby, Burnett, Harris, Martin, etc. would all be hurt, I'd tell you that it would be hard for us to win a game. I'm actually surprised we've hung in games. I've come to the early realization that this isn't our year. This isn't the same team that we all had Super Bowl aspirations over. You just can't overcome THAT many injuries.

completely agree on this