MVP

[jmbarnes101]

Troy Polumalu

Like Clay, you can tell when he is not in the game and is the one big difference for that team from this year to last.

And the trio of Peyton, Brees, and Rivers

[bobblehead]

Arian Foster. Especially if the Texans win their division or even make the playoffs.

WRs simply don't win MVP awards in this era. If any WR has the kinds of numbers that are MVP worthy, the credit goes to the QB who likely has the best QB numbers out there.

If Moss didn't win it after the 2007-8 season, I don't see how any WR can win it.

Your talking about the year Brady threw 50TD passes to break marino's record right....ok, gotcha. What record did Moss break that year by the way?

Like I said in my post, anytime a WR has outstanding numbers the credit goes to the QB. Try reading the post next time before attempting some mocking.

Oh, you mean the record Rice set in 12 games? Yea, he broke it in 16, then disappeared in the playoffs. Brady on the other hand has rings and was the MVP of the league, that team, and the universe that year, not moss.....and I don't even like Brady.

[Cheesehead Craig]

Arian Foster. Especially if the Texans win their division or even make the playoffs.

WRs simply don't win MVP awards in this era. If any WR has the kinds of numbers that are MVP worthy, the credit goes to the QB who likely has the best QB numbers out there.

If Moss didn't win it after the 2007-8 season, I don't see how any WR can win it.

Your talking about the year Brady threw 50TD passes to break marino's record right....ok, gotcha. What record did Moss break that year by the way?

Like I said in my post, anytime a WR has outstanding numbers the credit goes to the QB. Try reading the post next time before attempting some mocking.

Oh, you mean the record Rice set in 12 games? Yea, he broke it in 16, then disappeared in the playoffs. Brady on the other hand has rings and was the MVP of the league, that team, and the universe that year, not moss.....and I don't even like Brady.

What the hell is your problem? All I said was that WRs don't win MVPs anymore. I used Moss' season as that was the most incredible season by a WR in a long time and he really didn't get much consideration. I then also said that the QB would get it if there is a big season by a WR. Never once did I say Brady didn't deserve it and Moss did. That's an argument you are creating.

[Tarlam!]

Craig, Bobble just posts like that, he's not trying to start an argument, IMO.

The flaw in your example is that Brady was more valuable than Moss that year. I agree, Moss certainly did an outstanding job, but Brady was lights out that year.

And I acknowledge your point that usually a QB or RB is gonna get the award. I go even further and suggest the RB by committee is making it ever more difficult for RBs to win it.

But that's football. Wasn't Chuck the only defensive player to win the Heisman? I know that's college, but it's the same type of deal.

[pbmax]

Desmond Bishop. He seriously is the only Packer who is exceeding expectations now. Maybe Tramon too, but the distance between expectation and performance with him was far less than Bishop.

Forgetting John KUUHHHHN are you? Or did you expect him to be averaging 4.2 yds/carry on 6 carries/game?

What did Kuhn do for me lately? 5 for 9 yards, that's what.

And he is no longer getting into the endzone on the fullback dive.

[Cheesehead Craig]

Craig, Bobble just posts like that, he's not trying to start an argument, IMO.

The flaw in your example is that Brady was more valuable than Moss that year. I agree, Moss certainly did an outstanding job, but Brady was lights out that year.

And I acknowledge your point that usually a QB or RB is gonna get the award. I go even further and suggest the RB by committee is making it ever more difficult for RBs to win it.

But that's football. Wasn't Chuck the only defensive player to win the Heisman? I know that's college, but it's the same type of deal.

Gotcha.

[Tarlam!]

Re: B

If a QB must be considered... forget Peyton - what about Kyle Orton? No one is talking about him... yet he is second in the league in passing yards, has a stellar QB rating right now, and has 8 tds to just 2 ints... and all that coming off the pressure of knowing they are looking to eventually replace you with Tebow.

Who would of thunk at any point Kyle Orton would be among the best QB's in the league during any season, but here he is with almost no one playing better.

6. Still on record-breaking pace

Kyle Orton is still never mentioned in the same breath as Peyton Manning or Tom Brady, and for that matter, Philip Rivers or Drew Brees. However, Orton remains on pace -- he is averaging 41.2 throws and 323.7 yards a game -- to challenge Dan Marino's single-season passing mark of 5,084 yards. The Broncos can't run very well, and the passing will continue this week against the Raiders and their No. 8 pass defense. Orton is going to be asked to throw it 40-50 times vs. Oakland. That's different than last year, when Orton averaged 28.5 passes and 217.5 yards in two games against the Raiders.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81b83f97/article/titans-in-spotlight-favre-back-at-lambeau-among-week-7-stories?module=HP_cp2

Well PB1234, someone else noticed!

[Fritz]

Desmond Bishop. He seriously is the only Packer who is exceeding expectations now. Maybe Tramon too, but the distance between expectation and performance with him was far less than Bishop.

Forgetting John KUUHHHHN are you? Or did you expect him to be averaging 4.2 yds/carry on 6 carries/game?

What did Kuhn do for me lately? 5 for 9 yards, that's what.

And he is no longer getting into the endzone on the fullback dive.

It's too soon to say. Much season left to go, and Pat Lee's star is rising. He just passed Brandon Underwood on the depth chart last week. Next thing you know he'll be vying for that dime back position once Al Harris gets back!

[Guiness]

Re: B

If a QB must be considered... forget Peyton - what about Kyle Orton? No one is talking about him... yet he is second in the league in passing yards, has a stellar QB rating right now, and has 8 tds to just 2 ints... and all that coming off the pressure of knowing they are looking to eventually replace you with Tebow.

Who would of thunk at any point Kyle Orton would be among the best QB's in the league during any season, but here he is with almost no one playing better.

6. Still on record-breaking pace

Kyle Orton is still never mentioned in the same breath as Peyton Manning or Tom Brady, and for that matter, Philip Rivers or Drew Brees. However, Orton remains on pace -- he is averaging 41.2 throws and 323.7 yards a game -- to challenge Dan Marino's single-season passing mark of 5,084 yards. The Broncos can't run very well, and the passing will continue this week against the Raiders and their No. 8 pass defense. Orton is going to be asked to throw it 40-50 times vs. Oakland. That's different than last year, when Orton averaged 28.5 passes and 217.5 yards in two games against the Raiders.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81b83f97/article/titans-in-spotlight-favre-back-at-lambeau-among-week-7-stories?module=HP_cp2

Well PB1234, someone else noticed!

The guy's a horse, he's on my FF teeam

Many thanks to the brain trust in Chicago for giving him to Denver as a 'throw-in' on the Cutler deal!

Would be something if he broke Marino's record, wouldn't it?

[bobblehead]

Craig, Bobble just posts like that, he's not trying to start an argument, IMO.

The flaw in your example is that Brady was more valuable than Moss that year. I agree, Moss certainly did an outstanding job, but Brady was lights out that year.

And I acknowledge your point that usually a QB or RB is gonna get the award. I go even further and suggest the RB by committee is making it ever more difficult for RBs to win it.

But that's football. Wasn't Chuck the only defensive player to win the Heisman? I know that's college, but it's the same type of deal.

Gotcha.

He is right, I have a glib style that rubs sometimes, no offense meant. I usually post that way while I'm working and don't feel like taking too long to explain, and I'll have to try and temper it. My point was that a WR needs a record setting QB to have a huge season. He can't do much on his own. Its very rare that a WR truly carries a team.

In the case of Moss, Welker had a HUGE season as well, catching over 100 passes if I recall. A WR by himself can be taken out of a game, but a RB and/or a QB can not. Its also the reason Clay is more valuable than Finley.

[Cheesehead Craig]

Craig, Bobble just posts like that, he's not trying to start an argument, IMO.

The flaw in your example is that Brady was more valuable than Moss that year. I agree, Moss certainly did an outstanding job, but Brady was lights out that year.

And I acknowledge your point that usually a QB or RB is gonna get the award. I go even further and suggest the RB by committee is making it ever more difficult for RBs to win it.

But that's football. Wasn't Chuck the only defensive player to win the Heisman? I know that's college, but it's the same type of deal.

Gotcha.

He is right, I have a glib style that rubs sometimes, no offense meant. I usually post that way while I'm working and don't feel like taking too long to explain, and I'll have to try and temper it. My point was that a WR needs a record setting QB to have a huge season. He can't do much on his own. Its very rare that a WR truly carries a team.

In the case of Moss, Welker had a HUGE season as well, catching over 100 passes if I recall. A WR by himself can be taken out of a game, but a RB and/or a QB can not. Its also the reason Clay is more valuable than Finley.

I think we had the same point, but just didn't communicate clearly to each other.

All's good.

[Fritz]

So you're both saying that Pat Lee is heading for the MVP then, right?

[bobblehead]

Craig, Bobble just posts like that, he's not trying to start an argument, IMO.

The flaw in your example is that Brady was more valuable than Moss that year. I agree, Moss certainly did an outstanding job, but Brady was lights out that year.

And I acknowledge your point that usually a QB or RB is gonna get the award. I go even further and suggest the RB by committee is making it ever more difficult for RBs to win it.

But that's football. Wasn't Chuck the only defensive player to win the Heisman? I know that's college, but it's the same type of deal.

Gotcha.

He is right, I have a glib style that rubs sometimes, no offense meant. I usually post that way while I'm working and don't feel like taking too long to explain, and I'll have to try and temper it. My point was that a WR needs a record setting QB to have a huge season. He can't do much on his own. Its very rare that a WR truly carries a team.

In the case of Moss, Welker had a HUGE season as well, catching over 100 passes if I recall. A WR by himself can be taken out of a game, but a RB and/or a QB can not. Its also the reason Clay is more valuable than Finley.

I think we had the same point, but just didn't communicate clearly to each other.

All's good.

Seems correct. I thought you were complaining about WR's never getting the MVP but you were pretty much making the point I was making while refuting the point I THOUGHT you were making.....if that makes sense.

And yes, Pat Lee for MVP....our defense needs it.