official: union decertifies

[rbaloha1]

It's not the same thing though as hiring replacements during a strike. You hire replacements during a strike because you hope to break the union by encouraging people to cross the picket lines. During a lockout, you hire replacements because you want to maintain production... there's no picket line to cross because all of the players are locked out. So the league has nothing to gain by doing it.

Yes they do. Is it better to have an empty stadium or a whatever filled stadium? Is it better to have some tv and radio revenue or zero revenue? Isn't the revenue due to the savvy league owners? If so, why does it matter who fills the roster since the owners could conceivably collect higher profit margins without superstar player demands.

[Lurker64]

Yes they do. Is it better to have an empty stadium or a whatever filled stadium? Is it better to have some tv and radio revenue or zero revenue? Isn't the revenue due to the savvy league owners? If so, why does it matter who fills the roster since the owners could conceivably collect higher profit margins without superstar player demands.

Asking people to play full price to see Brooks Bollinger throw to Kai Bidde instead of Peyton Manning throwing to Reggie Wayne will do much more to permanently damage the brand than it would to actually make money. Fans would revolt.

[rbaloha1]

Asking people to play full price to see Brooks Bollinger throw to Kai Bidde instead of Peyton Manning throwing to Reggie Wayne will do much more to permanently damage the brand than it would to actually make money. Fans would revolt.

They already do by charging full price for pre season games and paying all players the same wage. What is the attendance for preseason games? The model is already in place. Remember the owners are smart and the players are dumb.

[Lurker64]

They already do by charging full price for pre season games and paying all players the same wage. What is the attendance for preseason games? The model is already in place. Remember the owners are smart and the players are dumb.

The only reason that most NFL teams are able to sell preseason games is because people buying regular season games are obligated to buy preseason tickets as well. If the entire season were preseason quality, nobody would buy tickets.

What's that about "paying all players the same wage" anyway? They do that in the playoffs too, you know. Is that a problem?

[rbaloha1]

The only reason that most NFL teams are able to sell preseason games is because people buying regular season games are obligated to buy preseason tickets as well. If the entire season were preseason quality, nobody would buy tickets.

What's that about "paying all players the same wage" anyway? They do that in the playoffs too, you know. Is that a problem?

No its not. The owners are so smart that they can find another Manning and Brady from whatever you want to call them players. Remember Kurt Warner?

[Lurker64]

No its not. The owners are so smart that they can find another Manning and Brady from whatever you want to call them players. Remember Kurt Warner?

But Manning and Brady are not only valuable to NFL teams because they throw touchdown passes with some reliability. They're valuable to NFL teams because they excite fans, and they get fans to buy tickets and jerseys, and to sign up for NFL Sunday Ticket. Even if they could find 32 guys on the street who are every bit as good as Brady, they still won't make as much money this season.

Remember, the reason this fight is taking place now, and not in August, is that neither side really wants to miss games this season.

[rbaloha1]

But Manning and Brady are not only valuable to NFL teams because they throw touchdown passes with some reliability. They're valuable to NFL teams because they excite fans, and they get fans to buy tickets and jerseys, and to sign up for NFL Sunday Ticket. Even if they could find 32 guys on the street who are every bit as good as Brady, they still won't make as much money this season.

Remember, the reason this fight is taking place now, and not in August, is that neither side really wants to miss games this season.

But the owners are so smart they can identify the players to retain a good profit margin. Who cares about the public?

[Lurker64]

But the owners are so smart they can identify the players to retain a good profit margin. Who cares about the public?

If you increase profit margin while drastically decreasing total revenue, you've done nothing positive.

Plus, it's not owners who find players... it's the scouts and general managers employed by the owner. Jim Irsay isn't going to be out there looking for quarterbacks, that's Bill Polian's job.

But in terms of who cares about the public ? here? Nobody. Neither the owners nor the players. They both simply need the public, since that's where their money comes from. But as far as Goodell and Smith are concerned you and I are just obstacles to be overcome before they can get all of the money in our wallets.

[rbaloha1]

If you increase profit margin while drastically decreasing total revenue, you've done nothing positive.

Plus, it's not owners who find players... it's the scouts and general managers employed by the owner. Jim Irsay isn't going to be out there looking for quarterbacks, that's Bill Polian's job.

But in terms of who cares about the public ? here? Nobody. Neither the owners nor the players. They both simply need the public, since that's where their money comes from. But as far as Goodell and Smith are concerned you and I are just obstacles to be overcome before they can get all of the money in our wallets.

The point is the owners are the geniuses that HIRE the personnel to secure the talent. Its the owners that do not care about the public. Due to the NFL's popularity the owners think they can put whomever out there and still make a profit.

If the owners felt otherwise they would make a legitimate offer rather than continuing to negotiate and forcing the public to turn against the players.

[mraynrand]

He is locked out, so he could show up, but he will be waiting outside the gate in full uniform.

I'm confused. I thought the lockout could only be enacted against the union. So there is a lockout of individual players? Based on what? There is that lawsuit, but I thought not all players are named on it. What justification is there for a lockout by owners of individual players with which they have a contract?

[Lurker64]

Its the owners that do not care about the public.

No, the players also do not care about the public. Both sides in the negotiation are solely interested in getting the best deal for them, if their interests align along with the public or against it that is purely accidental.

If the players actually cared about the public, they would have agreed to a deal, or at least an extension instead of walking away from the bargaining table. Both are much more effective means of ensuring football continues than going through the courts.

[rbaloha1]

No, the players also do not care about the public. Both sides in the negotiation are solely interested in getting the best deal for them, if their interests align along with the public or against it that is purely accidental.

If the players actually cared about the public, they would have agreed to a deal, or at least an extension instead of walking away from the bargaining table. Both are much more effective means of ensuring football continues than going through the courts.

What extension? According to MM no legitimate offer was offered. How else do you deal with greedy billionaires? Keep buying league propaganda. The players shall win in court ultimately leading to a better working agreement.

[mraynrand]

What extension? According to MM no legitimate offer was offered. How else do you deal with greedy billionaires? Keep buying league propaganda. The players shall win in court ultimately leading to a better working agreement.

You seem to like painting with one brush. Are all owners 'greedy?' Are any players 'greedy?' Define greedy in absolute terms. Define greedy in terms of the current situation.

[Lurker64]

What extension? According to MM no legitimate offer was offered. How else do you deal with greedy billionaires? Keep buying league propaganda. The players shall win in court ultimately leading to a better working agreement.

DeMaurice Smith came out and said last Friday that "we will not agree to an extension unless [specific financial data] is offered to us." How is saying "the NFLPA was unwilling to agree to an extension" in any way buying into anybody's propaganda? Why would he say this if there was no extension offered?

The players, like the owners, are simply trying to get the best deal for themselves everything else be damned.

[rbaloha1]

You seem to like painting with one brush. Are all owners 'greedy?' Are any players 'greedy?' Define greedy in absolute terms. Define greedy in terms of the current situation.

Lets go with your definition since its impossible to know all 32 owners. My term usage comes from the puppet representing the owners.