THE THREE DAY WINDOW..WHAT DOES TT DO ???? GO ON RECORD

[Joemailman]

I actually really like the way Hall catches the ball out of the backfield. It just looks natural. He is superior blocking and ST. Running? Well, the only time kuhn or hall is getting handoffs is when we are desperate. Add in the H-back we drafted and I think Kuhns days are numbered is all.

Kuhn has 137 receiving yards in 4 seasons. If it's a particular skill of his, it's apparently one the Packers don't value or utilize much. Kuhn has much more value as a short yardage runner.

[Joemailman]

Why does nobody think we resign Bigby at rock bottom prices? If he is healthy (finally) and comes cheap (can't imagine him getting a big offer) I think he is a good roster guy.

I think the Packers are now looking for safeties that have better coverage skills than Bigby (Cue Skinbasket). That's why they moved up to take Burnett. A thumper of a strong safety isn't needed as much now that you always have 4 LB's on the field.

[Smidgeon]

The more I think about it, the more I think Jones is being underrated. He's got the same relative number of drops as Jordy does (and I think not too far ahead of Driver either), but Jones' drops had among them several that could have gone for TDs. Whereas Jordy's and Driver's drops were closer to the line of scrimmage or across the middle. I think it says something that Jones had so many where he was open for the TD. It's just frustrating that those are the ones he drops. It isn't that he drops more. He just drops the wrong ones...

[Smidgeon]

I think the Packers are now looking for safeties that have better coverage skills than Bigby (Cue Skinbasket). That's why they moved up to take Burnett. A thumper of a strong safety isn't needed as much now that you always have 4 LB's on the field.

Well, that and the league moving to even more of a passing league requires even more defensive backs that can cover and intercept first...

[vince]

I'm finding the Hall stays/Kuhn goes argument persuasive. I've always liked Hall when healthy and I think there could be more interest in Kuhn on the open market, which would make him more likely to sign elsewhere. While Kuhn is effective in short yardage situations, I think Green and Starks will both get the job done there as well.

[Brandon494]

Sorry but I'm not buying Hall over Kuhn. Hall is a good special teams player with decent hands but he's a below average blocker who can not seem to stay healthy and is not starting FB in my mind. Kuhn is a starting FB who is also our best short yardage runner. Like a poster said before he might not be great in one area but he is just a good all around player. He's simliar to Mike Alsott in a way. I also don't see Quinn Johnson making the team this season, he just doesn't fit in the west coast scheme.

[Scott Campbell]

I thought it was Howard Green. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=erzMuwXDRK8

He manhandled his guy and got his pressure from the inside. Collins made a nice play, but Green made it all possible.

[red]

agree with any of your player points............but Jenkins made some nice plays at key points of the season and played well in the playoffs. I'm not sure I'd say we won a SB without him

i guess i completely forgot that jenkins came back at some point last year

[vince]

IMO, Hall is a good blocker who has consistently been the "starting" fullback when healthy.

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

Add in his 3 fumbles on 50 caught balls in 2010.

While this aren't exact numbers you have 60 balls went to James Jones that he could have caught in 2010.

10 were dropped and 3 were fumbled. That's over 21% of the time JJ is targeted that a bad outcome occurs.

With my "unoffical" stats method we have:

Jennings - 79 attempts, 3 drops, 2 fumbles - 6.3% failure rate
Driver - 58 attempts, 7 drops, 1 fumble - 13.8% failure rate
Nelson - 55 attempts, 10 drops, 3 fumbles - 23.6% failure rate
Jones - 60 attempts, 10 drops, 3 fumbles - 21.7% failure rate

That pretty much proves to me why Jones and Nelson are fighting for the 3rd WR spot.

And another note:

Driver - 698 career catches - 8 career fumbles - 1.15%
Jennings - 322 cc - 5 cf - 1.55%
Jones - 149 cc - 6 cf - 4.03%
Nelson - 100 cc - 6 cf - 6.00%

Way too much ball on the turf for Jones and Nelson to be serious #1 or 2 WRs in the NFL.

Good points, which is way I wouldn't be overly disappointed if we lose him either. If he comes back cheap though, I would definitely bring him back.

I personal think he is better than Nelson and your stat comparison proves it is at least debatable. And as for Driver, I am not going to argue that Driver has had a better career. Driver was a true number one Wr/pro bowler throughout most of his career. When comparing Jones and Driver, I’m thinking more in terms of who is more valuable to the team for next season. I just have a feeling that the Driver we saw last year is the one we will see this coming year.

IF Jones can limit the number of drops next season, I think people would be surprised at the numbers he could put up. Granted his fumbling problems seem to have been a problem since his rookie year. But at the end of the day, I would be all that disappointed if he walked.

[Brandon494]

IMO, Hall is a good blocker who has consistently been the "starting" fullback when healthy.

Maybe his first few seasons because we had no one better. Neither player is going to be asking for much. I'd rather pay alittle more to keep Kuhn who is the better and more durable player.

[pbmax]

Sorry but I'm not buying Hall over Kuhn. Hall is a good special teams player with decent hands but he's a below average blocker who can not seem to stay healthy and is not starting FB in my mind. Kuhn is a starting FB who is also our best short yardage runner. Like a poster said before he might not be great in one area but he is just a good all around player. He's simliar to Mike Alsott in a way. I also don't see Quinn Johnson making the team this season, he just doesn't fit in the west coast scheme.

If it came down to just those two for a starting job, you might be right. But both might be the backup FB this year. Remember that Qbert became the starting FB when the Packers went 2 backs with Starks.

So the backup FB has got to do ST and the Packers don't play ST well enough to let Hall go without a plan for improving his spot. Each of Kuhn's strong points can be done better by another RB body on the team.

The only hesitancy I foresee would be the injury concern. I could also envision a scenario where if Jackson does not come back, Kuhn sticks to pick up the slack. In that scenario though, much depends on how the rookie RB does.

[Patler]

Hall seems to miss 4 or 5 games every year. MM made one of his "availability" comments about Hall last year, that seemed to indicate he was tiring of Hall's constant injuries. I can see them signing Hall for a minimum salary to bring him into camp, but I don't see them making any effort beyond that.

[vince]

Hall seems to miss 4 or 5 games every year. MM made one of his "availability" comments about Hall last year, that seemed to indicate he was tiring of Hall's constant injuries. I can see them signing Hall for a minimum salary to bring him into camp, but I don't see them making any effort beyond that.

Yeah availability is big and Hall has that going against him. I'm thinking Kuhn's running value will go down though with the addition of Starks and Green. Hall is a good receiver out of the backfield and may well be equal value to Kuhn (minus the availability problem) for cheaper. With the additional TE's, maybe they keep 2 FB's this year and go more with the H-back concept and do even more motioning of TE's into the backfield blocking position. It'll probably come down to the type of offer Kuhn gets elsewhere.

Mark me down as officially not having a clue as to whether Hall and/or Kuhn will be Packers this year.

[Smidgeon]

Good points, which is way I wouldn't be overly disappointed if we lose him either. If he comes back cheap though, I would definitely bring him back.

I personal think he is better than Nelson and your stat comparison proves it is at least debatable. And as for Driver, I am not going to argue that Driver has had a better career. Driver was a true number one Wr/pro bowler for a couple years in his career. When comparing Jones and Driver, I’m thinking more in terms of who is more valuable to the team for next season. I just have a feeling that the Driver we saw last year is the one we will see this coming year.

IF Jones can limit the number of drops next season, I think people would be surprised at the numbers he could put up. Granted his fumbling problems seem to have been a problem since his rookie year. But at the end of the day, I would be all that disappointed if he walked.

Fixed