Suddenly, I'm Really Down On This Team

[wist43]

What's disheartening is that both lines are very poor. OT and DT are OK, not great, but OK.

The interior OL is, as everyone knows, an absolute mess; and, the DE's are overpaid and generally unproductive. You can't win in the NFL if you can't compete in the trenches.

I started my prediction at 6-10, drank some Kool-Aid and went up to 7-9... but, realistically, 3-13/4-12 is much more likely. I fully expect the Packers to be competing for the #1 pick next year.

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

jack's smirking revenge-

I agree with your take on not putting it all on TT. He did make am effort this offseason to sign some good free agents, and not to mention many players that he had to resign ( Green, Kampman, etc.). But I guess were I differ from everyone else is that I just don't think this team is that bad. There are some very good players on that defense that could possibly make it to the pro bowl this year. And on offense there are many former pro bowlers, who just need a few second year players and rookies to step up.

[woodbuck27]

Wasn't Colledge given the starting Left Guard job immediately after he was drafted? McCarthy and TT have said time and again that they believe in creating a competitive environment. Colledge obviously didn't get it done on Sat. so why not throw some adversity his way and see how he responds? This, in my opinion, is a wise move. Moll played well and Colledge did not, based on the abbreviated history with each guy, Colledge needs challenged and Moll needs rewarded. I don't see what the big issue with this move is.

That move seems justified and logical LaFours.

GO PACKERS ! HOLD THE FAITH in 2006 !!

[LaFours]

Let's consider the Brett situation and TT for a second:

1. Could TT actually tell Brett not to come back? No. He couldn't. Not the face of the Packers. Not the man whom every Packer fan thinks the world of and rallies around. TT didn't have an option with the Favre scenario. It was always "up to Favre". If he took a stand with Favre, he would've alienated the Packer nation and he understood that, so you have to give him props for not being a hard ass.

2. Could Favre have decided not to come back? Yes. He's a smart football player and a business man. He knows what's going on. He understands that he's not the future of the franchise anymore. He probably realizes that the team isn't going to rebuild itself to get Favre another ring. But he did decide to come back, regardless of circumstances. He has his own reasons and we'll get the "Favre-spin", but we'll really never know the truth of why he came back.

3. Is TT obligated to retool the team just for Favre? No. He's not. The Packers are a business. They are not a monarchy. The franchise will exist long beyond Favre. I disagree with the idea that he needs to break the bank to give Favre one last shot. The odds are slim that such an activity would wreap Super Bowl rewards and could set the franchise back even further in its quest to get back to the big game. There are no guarantees in the game of football, but if you get your team into cap trouble, your team is guaranteed to suffer.

So, don't dump the problems of the Pack squarely on TT. He is doing his job. He has brought in free agents in an attempt to make the team better. Some of them weren't flashy, some weren't the top of the heap of the market. He has drafted relatively well. The future should tell us more about his ability to draft for the Packers.

Yesterday woodbuck, you posted that I speak "the Truth". Well, I don't buy the anti-TT spin as truth, whether its coming from you or anyone else.

This team has lots of problems right now and they aren't all TT's fault.

tyler

I agree with this...plus everyone seems to think that the only way to give Brett one more chance to win a championship is by giving him tools on offense. I disagree with this. Yes, providing Brett with offensive tools (i.e. more accomplished receivers & a healthier running back corps) would be one way to try and provide him one more chance but so will revamping the defense.

Last year the defense kept us in the game time and time again only to see the offense fall short in the end. Doesn't it make sense to think that all of the additions to this defense should allow us to not be in that situation week in and week out? Isn't there a chance that the work being done on the defensive side of the ball could possibly enable Brett to have one more shot at it by keeping opposing offenses from getting ahead continually in the first place?

This is not to say that these predictions will become reality but you cannot ignore the fact that TT focused on upgrading the defense in the offseason and that quite possibly, he is approaching Brett's "final hurrah" in a more unconventional way...improving the defense so opposing offenses aren't as big of a factor in the game's outcome. Maybe I'm blind to his deficiencies but I think in an age where offense has become much more glamorous that defense (to the vast majority of fans) that TT chose to buck the contemporary trend in favor of his own path and build a defense. Brett can make our offense function even if it isn't as efficient as the offenses we have grown accustomed to watching during his tenure with GB. TT knows what "magic" Brett can bring and decided to supplement that with a stronger defense. I, for one, am excited to see what Brett can do with a stronger defense. No he won't be throwing touchdowns to A.J. Hawk or Marquand Manual (but he might to Woodson) but to say that they cannot help his chances of getting there one more time is to discount the fundamental makeup of this sport...it still boils down to the team and last I checked a football team was comprised of an offense and a defense, not just a quarterback, his receivers and running backs.

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

These are my exact thoughts.....

[Creepy]

woodbuck,
just about every post you make it is the same old thing. TT this or TT that, and there fgoing down in flames. Should have signed TO, Hutchinson, Arrington, and any other big name big cost FA to get Favre to the SB.

Give it a rest. Gb willplay well and move forward. Looking at the pre-season the Lions will sweep the North the Vikings and Bears will fight for losing 3d place finish and GB will find it hard to beat a local HS team.

It is one game and thats all. Starters came out before the ned of the 1st quarter, they did move the ball but because of a dropped pass and a little overthrown ball, GB easily culd have been up 10 to 7. There were posiitves andthere were negatives, but nothing that makes me want to give up the ship. If it is too hard for you to watch then go watch another team. Get behidn them or get off the road.

Your truth is your own drivel and it means squat. Other players could have been restructured to make room for Wahle. What players? Sharper? Nope, he had to be cut. KGB? Nope, he was not taking a cut in pay either and would have been a bigger cap hit than Wahle. The money wasn't there so they had to let Wahle go. Get over it and move on.

I expect GB to field a competitive teamthisyear and withte North it is still anybodys division. Neither the Vikings, Lions or even Bears have improved so much that GB can't come back. So for one last time, "Get behind them or get off the road!"

[jack's smirking revenge]

jack's smirking revenge-

I agree with your take on not putting it all on TT. He did make am effort this offseason to sign some good free agents, and not to mention many players that he had to resign ( Green, Kampman, etc.). But I guess were I differ from everyone else is that I just don't think this team is that bad. There are some very good players on that defense that could possibly make it to the pro bowl this year. And on offense there are many former pro bowlers, who just need a few second year players and rookies to step up.

I agree with you PaCKFan. I do believe that we have some great talent on the surface at some positions. With luck, we could have some Pro Bowlers. Depth is our big problem across the board. Injuries could make this a very difficult year, in my opinion. We've got young depth--which can lead to great things as that youth gets experience, but can also lead to growing pains and a disappointing year.

tyler

[LaFours]

These are my exact thoughts.....

I saw where you beat me to the general idea...we must be on the same wavelength.

[Willard]

I like the move to change-up the starters on the OL. I will feel worse (downright panicked) if we still don't have established starters after the CIN game. Reason for optimism? These guys still haven't learned the ZBS. The SD game was their first and only chance to test out the new scheme and they didn't get it done. Is this unusual? Not according to Jags. I take some solace in reading Jags' recollection of the first pre-season game in Atlanta in which the OL was equally inept. Read the following exerpt from today's PackersNews article:

Jagodzinski said Saturday night was similar to his first exhibition game with Atlanta in 2004, when the Falcons' new coaching staff also was putting in the same Alex Gibbs zone-blocking scheme the Packers are implementing now. In the first exhibition game for coach Jim Mora and his staff in '04, also against a 3-4 defensive scheme facing the Baltimore Ravens, the Falcons had a disastrous offensive performance. They gained 134 yards in total offense, averaged 2.6 yards a carry, had only eight first downs and lost 24-0.

The Packers on Saturday gained 218 yards in total offense, averaged 2.4 yards a carry, had 11 first downs and lost 17-3.

Atlanta that season ended up winning its division, advancing to the NFC championship game and leading the NFL in rushing. The parallel only goes so far, because Atlanta had the singular running talent of quarterback Mike Vick to fall back on that season. But Jagodzinski has seen this debut dynamic before.

"It's discouraging, but you keep getting better," he said. "That's what we're going to do here."


I'm sure the Falcons were very disappointed after that first pre-season blow-out, but they got it figured out in time to have a good season. Lets look for continuous improvement against ATL & CIN. If we don't see serious progress by that point then I'll start to mentally prepare for a long depressing season.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Unfortunately, Favre is probably not part of that picture unless he sticks around until next year.

I think he might end up doing so--if he sees some improvement this year. I don't understand people that say Favre is retarding Rodgers development. The best thing for Rodgers is sitting on the bench for two, maybe three years. It worked for Matt Hasselbeck, Mark Brunell, Steve Young, and many other QBs. It's better than him going in this year, getting pounded, and losing all of his confidence. My hope is that we can show improvement this year. Anything close to .500 ball would be fine. Then, with a good offseason and maybe a couple of FA acquisitions, we send the Old Warhorse off on a high note. People that think it takes four or five years to rebuild have no clue about today's NFL. Hell, by that time your young guys start to become free agents. I can see them rebuilding in a couple of years--which means they could start contending next year. I'm glad Favre came back because I will enjoy it if he takes some NFL records from Dan Marino.

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

Very encouraging post Willard.........

[jack's smirking revenge]

Unfortunately, Favre is probably not part of that picture unless he sticks around until next year.

I think he might end up doing so--if he sees some improvement this year. I don't understand people that say Favre is retarding Rodgers development. The best thing for Rodgers is sitting on the bench for two, maybe three years. It worked for Matt Hasselbeck, Mark Brunell, Steve Young, and many other QBs. It's better than him going in this year, getting pounded, and losing all of his confidence. My hope is that we can show improvement this year. Anything close to .500 ball would be fine. Then, with a good offseason and maybe a couple of FA acquisitions, we send the Old Warhorse off on a high note. People that think it takes four or five years to rebuild have no clue about today's NFL. Hell, by that time your young guys start to become free agents. I can see them rebuilding in a couple of years--which means they could start contending next year. I'm glad Favre came back because I will enjoy it if he takes some NFL records from Dan Marino.

That is what is keeping me grounded now. I think this year will be all about growing pains and frustrating games, but there are pieces in place to make 2007 a much more successful year (minus injuries). If we get Colledge, Moll and Spitz--in any combination on our line--a year of experience, next year we will be having different discussions. It took some time for Wahle and Rivera to grow into studs on our line. It will take time for those three to grow as well.

And defense? Think of next year when Hawk, Hodge, and Manuel have had a year in the Packer system. We could have an AMAZING LB corps and a lights-out secondary. Add some free agents on both lines and through the draft and BAM! We're back in the hunt.

This year....too much youth, too much inexperience, too much change.

tyler

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

I have to admit it is exciting to think about next year being a year in which your just adding to the team. If I was TT, next year my first three picks in the draft would be , in this order, DE, Dt, CB. And I would only get one big time free agent, a WR.

[HarveyWallbangers]

That is what is keeping me grounded now. I think this year will be all about growing pains and frustrating games, but there are pieces in place to make 2007 a much more successful year (minus injuries). If we get Colledge, Moll and Spitz--in any combination on our line--a year of experience, next year we will be having different discussions. It took some time for Wahle and Rivera to grow into studs on our line. It will take time for those three to grow as well.

And defense? Think of next year when Hawk, Hodge, and Manuel have had a year in the Packer system. We could have an AMAZING LB corps and a lights-out secondary. Add some free agents on both lines and through the draft and BAM! We're back in the hunt.

This year....too much youth, too much inexperience, too much change.

Good post, and I agree. That's why I'm not down on the long-term prospects of the team. I just hope to see guys develop this year. My hope is that they'll be a lot better at the end of the year than the beginning of the year.

[GBRulz]

I'm glad Favre came back because I will enjoy it if he takes some NFL records from Dan Marino.

I'm with you there! The only record that is probably out of reach is passing yards.

There is a poll on SI right now about whether or not Favre is tarnishing his reputation by playing "too long". 68% currently say yes. Well, let's see that poll again after he's rewritten basically every QB record in the book.