DEFENSIVE PLAYERS DISAPPOINTING ? Your list .......

[mission]

I can agree with that.

It seems that the identity of the team has changed to become the passing juggernaut they were supposed to be.

As simple as that is, it's probably the best point in the whole thread. Think back to last year--we're struggling to score points, Rodgers is trying to find his way, guys like me are calling for MM's head because he "can't playcall". We have pretty short memories and associate last year's team with the one that ran through the playoffs. The defense was strong and we barely made the playoffs... played some close post season games where the defense came up big when it mattered and the offense was starting to really pull it together.

Now we're playing some nail biters but generally proving we're betting than everyone else, but our defense has taken a step backwards at first glance. Their identity is different this year and it's all working together. I'd like to see some defensive growth from here on out this season -- and expect some -- but think our makeup accounts for this in some way. The result can't be argued with.

[vince]

Still does not explain his dropoff in performance earlier in the year. However, both Justin and McGinn noted that Raji had some of his best rushes this week against the G-Men. And the G-Men can pass block. Even if they had to play musical chairs to find a center.

Agreed. The last two games, Raji has been disruptive. It seems as if the reduced snaps strategy is working. Also, Raji paradoxically seems to play better later in the year. Last year he collected most of his sacks in the last 5 or 6 games and was a beast in the playoffs.

Here's what PFW has to say about him as they preview the Raiders game.

Coming off back-to-back particularly lackluster outings, it won't get any easier this Sunday for Oakland's interior line matched up against Raji, who is coming off his best overall performance of the season vs. the Giants. The reduced snap count that Raji has received in recent games — a tactic designed to make him fresher down the stretch — appeared to pay huge dividends against the Giants. While Raji had only one tackle in the Meadowlands, he won practically all of his one-on-one battles (five QB hurries) and came up with a key fumble recovery late in the first half following a sack of Eli Manning by Clay Matthews. Raji showed off his rare athleticism on a number of occasions in the game, confounding the Giants with an assortment of moves, in addition to utilizing his great combination of speed and quickness to the max.

Raji also had some gaffes defending the run vs. the Giants though. On one occasion, he gave up his gap control attempting a spin move as if he read pass and the Giants runner ran untouched through the hole he vacated for a big gain. That'll need to get cleaned up this week.

The wall of Pickett, Raji and Green hasn't been as effective as they should be in controlling the LOS in running situations lately. That's a bit disappointing.

[Upnorth]

I bet that with the raiders, kc and cubs on the slate by the time we get to det we are all confident in our d again. If not oh oh.

[Bretsky]

Brad Jones and CJ Wilson. I didn't expect them to be world-beaters, but I expected Jones to flash a little more ability and maybe take on some snaps with coverage responsibilities once Zombo was done. CJ Wilson was supposed to take the next step and be able to handle some snaps at end so the d-line guys like Wynn could stay fresh.

Fuckers.

Brad Jones ? I can't be disappointed in a guy who sucks. He flashed a bit his rookie yr and had been a JAG starting with the Arizona playoff game when he was miserable. Brad Jones is the Bush of the LB crew ! Out with him....lol

CJ Wilson has not taken a step forward. I still haven't figured out of Wynn is a player or a JAG.

Perhaps none of this matters if we keep scoring nearly 40pts per game

[Smidgeon]

Brad Jones ? I can't be disappointed in a guy who sucks. He flashed a bit his rookie yr and had been a JAG starting with the Arizona playoff game when he was miserable. Brad Jones is the Bush of the LB crew ! Out with him....lol

CJ Wilson has not taken a step forward. I still haven't figured out of Wynn is a player or a JAG.

Perhaps none of this matters if we keep scoring nearly 40pts per game

I was enamored with Brad Jones after his rookie year. But he's done nothing except disappoint me since.

[Pugger]

Neal. I expected something more than the last three games have shown. He's had time to get healthy, so maybe he just has to play into football shape. I expect him to start flashing in either the Chiefs game or the Bears game. If not, I'll start wondering if the injury took something out of him.

Peprah. After last year's solid play, I expected more of the same. Turns out two things are true: Nick Collins had enough range to make up for Peprah's limitations and Burnett is no Nick Collins. I'm not saying Burnett doesn't have potential to be all-pro (I'm not saying he does either), but he's playing his first full season and Collins is better than I had appreciated.

Raji and Woodson. For whatever reason, the plays don't quite seem to be there. Now Raji just had his best game (after the reduced snap count) and could light it up down the stretch. And I'm only disappointed in Woodson because I expect an outstanding play or two every game.

Matthews gets a pass because he's been leading the league in QB pressures since early on (I'm assuming that pace continued) even though the sacks aren't coming.

Shields gets a pass from me because I expected a sophomore slump. He's still new and depending on speed too much last year. I think he's working on technique a lot and is therefore seeming to slump. But when he completes "changing his swing", I think he'll be fine again.

Tramon gets a pass because of his shoulder.

Jones gets a pass because as of a couple weeks ago, he was still ahead of his 2010 catching pace (haven't checked it since).

This.

It also doesn't help our secondary that we have a pretty anemic pass rush. Walden is getting some pressure as is CM3 but they seem to often get there a second too late. Will Neal help? I still think he's still trying to play his way into shape and we'll hopefully see some improvement there in the coming weeks.

[Pugger]

I thought this thread was supposed to be about defensive players. Why are we mentioning/discussing Starks and/or James Jones?

No chit.

[Pugger]

I've been somewhat disappointed in Hawk. He has often seemed pretty slow and been prone to getting faked out. He's never been a speedster but he seems even slower this year. I sort of wonder if Francois might see more snaps in obvious passing downs over Hawk.

Of course, I base that on the "one play" rule -- Francois had that memorable interception in the Lions game--so I could very well be way off base in thinking that this would be more successful.

The other thing that I have been disappointed in is Safety play in general. I suppose they're doing the best they can given their limitations -- I think Burnett will be a fine safety in another year or two once he's seen enough and Peprah is a good backup -- but they both seem to get lost at times. IIRC, Pittsburgh struggles quite a bit when Polamalu is out, so maybe replacing a Pro-Bowl Safety is harder than other positions.

Hawk hasn't been as stellar as last season but I think he's better than Francois and AJ was missed in the Giants game.

Is Burnett still wearing a cast on his hand? If we think about it he is still basically a rookie and one-handed for all these weeks. He went on IR early last season so he's still trying to figure out how to play safety at an NFL level.

[Brandon494]

I don't think Hawk was as much missed as Bishop was. Both backup LBs looked like Hawk missing tackles in the Giants game.

[mraynrand]

I don't think Hawk was as much missed as Bishop was. Both backup LBs looked like Hawk missing tackles in the Giants game.

Pretty much. Although François almost had another ¡intercepción!

[smuggler]

People listing Raji are way off. He can't help that the guys on the line with him are marginal or worse. Pickett and Wynn/Wilson are just not good. And, Walden hasn't looked that good, and Zombo's been hurt. And Peprah has been burnt repeatedly, Burnett missed tackles due to his cast and taken some bad angles. TWilliams has been burnt a few times, Shields has been slightly better than TWill but has missed a ton of tackles.

The 3 guys that are pretty much untouchable are Woodson, Matthews, and Raji.

[mraynrand]

People listing Raji are way off. He can't help that the guys on the line with him are marginal or worse. Pickett and Wynn/Wilson are just not good. And, Walden hasn't looked that good, and Zombo's been hurt. And Peprah has been burnt repeatedly, Burnett missed tackles due to his cast and taken some bad angles. TWilliams has been burnt a few times, Shields has been slightly better than TWill but has missed a ton of tackles.

The 3 guys that are pretty much untouchable are Woodson, Matthews, and Raji.

There have been mentions in several articles that the coaches are expecting more from Raji. But the fact that they've been reducing his snap count suggests that the coaches may realize they're the ones to blame for his loss of productivity due to overwork.

[hoosier]

People listing Raji are way off. He can't help that the guys on the line with him are marginal or worse. Pickett and Wynn/Wilson are just not good. And, Walden hasn't looked that good, and Zombo's been hurt. And Peprah has been burnt repeatedly, Burnett missed tackles due to his cast and taken some bad angles. TWilliams has been burnt a few times, Shields has been slightly better than TWill but has missed a ton of tackles.

The 3 guys that are pretty much untouchable are Woodson, Matthews, and Raji.

Why do you think Pickett is marginal?

[Smidgeon]

Why do you think Pickett is marginal?

Agree with this question.

[Upnorth]

Someone wondered why Raji is on some peoples list. My reason is at the beginning of the season I expected amazing things. He has played very well, but not as disruptive as he was in the past