Cap & Trade

[bobblehead]

People who think TT would never trade flynn w/o a deal in place answer me this. What happens to the packers 2012 regular season if Rodgers gets hurt? Flynn may be worth keeping for another year even if we couldn't move him (assuming it doesn't cost us being able to resign someone TT values).

[Little Whiskey]

People who think TT would never trade flynn w/o a deal in place answer me this. What happens to the packers 2012 regular season if Rodgers gets hurt? Flynn may be worth keeping for another year even if we couldn't move him (assuming it doesn't cost us being able to resign someone TT values).

Bobble, no way TT keeps flynn for 15mil. no way flynn signs a deal for less than that. he ended the season with a huge game. some gm will be willing to risk a few bucks to see what he can do as a starter.

[red]

NE had to throw Vrabel in with Cassel to get a 2nd round pick in the trade. I don't think Flynn will garner more than that on his own.

Letting him "walk" is not for nothing. They would get compensation, likely high compensation because his contract will be big.

wasn't there a lot of talk at the time that BB gave whats his face a massive discount?

no one at the time could figure out how NE could trade him for so littel

or am i thinking of something else?

the eagles got a 2nd and a former first round pick with a lot of potential for kolb. and IMO, kolb never showed the talent that flynn has

and didn't the seahawks just trade a 2nd last year for some backup chump who has never played?

[pbmax]

The other thing that argues against a Cassell type trade is that all the parties involved knew each other and could agree beforehand to the specifics. Pioli knew Belicheck and Cassell. He also was about to hire (or had hired) a Belicheck disciple in Haley to run the offense. Haley would have gotten the stamp of approval from Belicheck under an questioning by Cassell. That is a lot of dominoes to have lined up.

In Flynn's case, there are no current teams running McCarthy's offense, unless someone was to hire Philbin or Clements away. And then you need to line up the GMs. In today's NFL Thompson knows and would probably implicitly trust Reinfeldt (Titans) and John Schneider and Scot McCloughan (Seattle) off the top of my head. McKenzie could get the GM gig in Oakland, but all indications are that the new GM will be asked to keep Hue Jackson and perform a miracle with no high draft picks.

Seattle would seem a possibility as they don't have someone to young to groom and they might not get either top QB pick. Pete is flaky enough that he would go back on his word to Tavaris and Bevell runs a West Coast offense.

But more importantly, the team to who Thompson wants to trade him to must be willing to match Flynn's asking price. He is driving the bus. If for instance, the Bears or Vikings were to offer a boatload of money (I know, unlikely, but still) Thompson would prefer not to trade Flynn to them, but Flynn might want that deal. It will take a serious degree of luck to line up another team that will pony up the dollars AND that Thompson wants to deal with (and will offer something better than a 3rd round pick).

[pbmax]

wasn't there a lot of talk at the time that BB gave whats his face a massive discount?

no one at the time could figure out how NE could trade him for so littel

or am i thinking of something else?

the eagles got a 2nd and a former first round pick with a lot of potential for kolb. and IMO, kolb never showed the talent that flynn has

and didn't the seahawks just trade a 2nd last year for some backup chump who has never played?

Kolb was not a Free Agent.

Flynn and Cassell were like trying to trade a UDFA at the end of camp for a pick. A team could surrender the pick and be assured of getting that player, or they could wait for waivers (or the FA period) and take their shot at a couple of different options.

[Lurker64]

the eagles got a 2nd and a former first round pick with a lot of potential for kolb. and IMO, kolb never showed the talent that flynn has

The big difference between trading for Kolb and trading for Flynn is that Kolb was already under contract at a reasonable rate, whereas if Matt Flynn is traded his contract status would be at the franchise tag level. It's much easier to work out an extension for Kolb in that way (though the one Arizona gave Kolb was ridiculous.)

[pbmax]

People who think TT would never trade flynn w/o a deal in place answer me this. What happens to the packers 2012 regular season if Rodgers gets hurt? Flynn may be worth keeping for another year even if we couldn't move him (assuming it doesn't cost us being able to resign someone TT values).

Well, it will cost you resigning someone, sometime. Maybe Finley or Wells. Maybe a soon to be free agent next year. But if you are Flynn, do you want to stay?

And do the Packers want a $15 mil backup price tag? When Thompson kept cap space open to accept Favre back to camp, he had his backup on a relatively cheap end of first round rookie deal. Now Rodgers is making serious QB dough plus a $15 mil/year backup. Way too much money to commit.

[red]

The big difference between trading for Kolb and trading for Flynn is that Kolb was already under contract at a reasonable rate, whereas if Matt Flynn is traded his contract status would be at the franchise tag level. It's much easier to work out an extension for Kolb in that way (though the one Arizona gave Kolb was ridiculous.)

yes but part of that trade was the understanding that kolb would get a new, huge, deal

he got a 5 year, 64 million dollar deal with 21 million up front

just because you tag flynn, that doesn't mean that the next team is on the hook for that whole 15 million or whatever it is. only the team that tags him is the one that is on the line for that whole amount

a new team would more then likely turn that 15 million and then some into a signing bonus for the new contract.

if i'm not mistaken. the packers could tag him at 20 million or whatever, then trade him, and the new team could sign him for like 3 years with 10 million overall. if i'm not mistaken that franchine number goes completely away once he's traded and signs a new deal

[Patler]

I think today showed that keeping Flynn this year was a wise move, even if it means getting only a 3rd or 4th round compensatory pick when he leaves. The Packers were/are well positioned for a SB run, and can win a game against a playoff team even if Rodgers goes down.

But, hang on to him next year for $15 million? I can see that happening in only once scenario, if Rodgers were to get hurt in the playoffs and be questionable for the start of next year. Then, the one year investment might be worth it.

[ND72]

#1, once Flynn would be traded the team can resign him at their contract level, so he wouldn't be at $15mil.
#2, he would structure a new contract with that team before that team would agree to a trade.

[ThunderDan]

Its too much of a risk, Matt Cassell played a whole season while Fylnn has only had a couple of great games. I might be wrong but I think hes a lot like Kevin Kolb aka a system QB.

And what did the Eagles trade Kolb for?

[red]

And what did the Eagles trade Kolb for?

a shitload

[Lurker64]

#1, once Flynn would be traded the team can resign him at their contract level, so he wouldn't be at $15mil.
#2, he would structure a new contract with that team before that team would agree to a trade.

Whatever contract Flynn signs with the team that acquires him, can't make that $15m guaranteed disappear, it has to actually be paid. The most you can do is restructure it.

[Lurker64]

a shitload

They got a 2nd round draft pick and the rights to Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie. Cromartie is now a free agent (or will be in March) so it's not that big a haul. Since, between "a second round pick" and "a backup corner in a wasted season", the second round pick is the prize.

[pbmax]

yes but part of that trade was the understanding that kolb would get a new, huge, deal

he got a 5 year, 64 million dollar deal with 21 million up front

just because you tag flynn, that doesn't mean that the next team is on the hook for that whole 15 million or whatever it is. only the team that tags him is the one that is on the line for that whole amount

a new team would more then likely turn that 15 million and then some into a signing bonus for the new contract.

if i'm not mistaken. the packers could tag him at 20 million or whatever, then trade him, and the new team could sign him for like 3 years with 10 million overall. if i'm not mistaken that franchine number goes completely away once he's traded and signs a new deal

True, but as Kolb is under contract and must report, the team that acquired his rights has more leverage than trying to get a current FA to agree to the outlines of a deal. The most Kolb could do is refuse to negotiate, but he would still need to play the balance of the deal. Flynn's entire leverage rests on his need to test the market. So any deal for Flynn is going to be measured against the entire market, not just the teams willing to meet the original team's trade price for Kolb.

And in a trade scenario, Thompson might rule out some teams right from the beginning.