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  • Packers Secondary

    Here's some positivity. Good notes on the secondary--although they still ranked them below Cleveland. I threw the Vikings stats on here for RastaK--I had a feeling the Vikings secondary probably didn't great out nearly as well as most Purple Rubes would say. They were practically glowing about the play of Darren Sharper though.

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    12. Green Bay

    Ask Al Harris if his shoulders are sore. They likely are — from carrying the Green Bay secondary last year. For most of the year, Green Bay was the best defense in the league against opposing number one receivers. In Week 4, for example, Harris kept Steve Smith to an absurd 12 yards on two catches. But his stats declined late in the year because he was so tired from being a one-man army.

    To give Harris some help, GM Ted Thompson made a big splash in the free agent market, bringing the highly-touted, but sometimes underperforming Charles Woodson to Lambeau Field. Although not the superstar that he was a few years ago, Woodson should be a significant upgrade, and Ahmad Carroll should be better in the nickel role. The addition of Marquand Manuel helps an already decent safety core. The other starter, Nick Collins, ranked sixth out of 75 safeties by stopping 67 percent of passes during his rookie season.

    15. Minnesota

    The Vikings have a better secondary than they put on the field last year, and yet most of the starters remain the same. Cornerbacks Antoine Winfield and Fred Smoot both had sub-par years last year. Winfield ranked 73rd among 83 cornerbacks with a 46 percent Stop Rate, and was tied with Quentin Jammer for most touchdowns allowed. Is this the same man that previous Viking owners hired a private plane to steal away from the New York Jets? Smoot was better, but far from the caliber of player who signs a six-year, $36 million contract. Smoot's Stop Rate of 48 percent ranked him an expensive 65th.

    On the other hand, Darren Sharper was everything the Vikings could have asked for. Sharper provided excellent cover skills as well as good run stopping ability. His nine picks ranked him second only to Deltha O'Neal and Ty Law, and there were no touchdowns where game charters listed him as the defender in coverage. Safety Tank Williams was supposed to play opposite Sharper, but a broken kneecap will cost him the season; Dwight Smith, waived by New Orleans, will replace him. Like Williams, Smith is strong against the run, weak in pass coverage. The Vikings drafted hard-hitting Cedric Griffin in the second round. He played both cornerback and safety at Texas and adds versatility.
    "There's a lot of interest in the draft. It's great. But quite frankly, most of the people that are commenting on it don't know anything about what they are talking about."--Ted Thompson

  • #2
    Minnesota's front seven will make their secondary look good.

    Green Bay's front seven can't generate enough pressure to help the secondary. They can't cover forever.

    Edge to Minnesota b/c their front seven is so much better than Green Bay's.
    wist

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    • #3
      Edge to Green Bay b/c their front seven is so much better than Green Bay's.
      Draft Brandin Cooks WR OSU!

      Comment


      • #4
        I think Kamp and KGB will get decent pressure. I think they'll have a blitz package with Poppinga too.
        Formerly known as JustinHarrell.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by GregJennings
          I think Kamp and KGB will get decent pressure. I think they'll have a blitz package with Poppinga too.
          I agree with ol' GregJennings! The defense may not start out great but I think by the end of the season we will have the beggings of something GREAT! And I am looking forward to it.

          My main hope is that that Barnett has a great year and they pay him like it. Yes I would like to see Hodge excel and take over in the middle and Barnett could use his speed on the outside. There are alot of options. Hell even trading him for anouther Player would be a great deal if they cannot come to terms next year.

          Oh, BTW there Greg. Thanks for signing me and my daughters hats at Family Night!

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by GregJennings
            I think Kamp and KGB will get decent pressure. I think they'll have a blitz package with Poppinga too.
            GJ,

            I've got history on my side for this argument... KGB and Kampman get sacks sporadically, and over time have proven that they can't provide consistent pressure.

            They flash occasional pressure... but, it's never consistently disruptive. KGB will get the corner once or twice per game, and then nothing much else; and, Kampman will clean up on the occassional coverage sack. Together, they're just not consistent enough.

            KGB would be more effective if his work load were reduced on early downs; but, coaching staff after coaching staff talk about it, but ultimately never make the move. Kampman would be more effective with more stunts and blitzes on his side, but the coaching staff doesn't seem inclined to do that either.

            So, some of their ineffectiveness is self inflicted, IMO.
            wist

            Comment


            • #7
              I think the addition of Woodson will mean more blitzing from the DB's this year. Woodson is lining up in the slot in the nickel package, which puts him in a position to blitz. Also, having 2 shut-down corners should free up the safeties to occasionally blitz. I also have hopes that Hawk and Poppinga will also be able to apply pressure from the LB position.
              I can't run no more
              With that lawless crowd
              While the killers in high places
              Say their prayers out loud
              But they've summoned, they've summoned up
              A thundercloud
              They're going to hear from me - Leonard Cohen

              Comment


              • #8
                You know, I watched alot of plays in that SD game keying in on KGB. The reason I did this is because it kind of floored me that the left tackle bit on his move when he ran almost untouched to the QB. I was suprised to see that he actually moved his guy back quite a bit, and he seemed alot stronger than I gave him credit for. Also, he bullrushed alot straight into the tackle, and that is why the tackle bit on the outside rush. KGB started to run straight at him, put his hands up as if to push him backwards, and then just as the tackle got his weight forward, he just ran right around him. But, he gave alot more pressure alot more consistently than he gets credit for. There are very few players that can give constant pressure aka reggie and LT. I think we take him for granted.
                "...one thing about me during the course of a game, I get emotional and say things my grandmother lets me know about later. But nobody wants to win on that field anymore than I do, no one." Brett Favre

                Comment


                • #9
                  I think its going to come down to Manual's health. If he can't get over his injury or can't stay healthy, we will be in trouble. I think we got the comeback player of the year when we signed Woodson. He flashed some quickness that I haven't seen out of a Packer's corner since Craig Newsome. He also seems to be responding well to the coaching.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by wist43
                    I've got history on my side for this argument... KGB and Kampman get sacks sporadically, and over time have proven that they can't provide consistent pressure.
                    You've got history? Then tell me what history Kenechi Udeze and Erasmus James have?
                    "There's a lot of interest in the draft. It's great. But quite frankly, most of the people that are commenting on it don't know anything about what they are talking about."--Ted Thompson

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by 4and12to12and4
                      You know, I watched alot of plays in that SD game keying in on KGB. The reason I did this is because it kind of floored me that the left tackle bit on his move when he ran almost untouched to the QB. I was suprised to see that he actually moved his guy back quite a bit, and he seemed alot stronger than I gave him credit for. Also, he bullrushed alot straight into the tackle, and that is why the tackle bit on the outside rush. KGB started to run straight at him, put his hands up as if to push him backwards, and then just as the tackle got his weight forward, he just ran right around him. But, he gave alot more pressure alot more consistently than he gets credit for. There are very few players that can give constant pressure aka reggie and LT. I think we take him for granted.
                      Good observation. It's a joke that people say he only has one move. You don't average 10+ sacks/year with one move. Otherwise, Jamal Reynolds might still be in the NFL.
                      "There's a lot of interest in the draft. It's great. But quite frankly, most of the people that are commenting on it don't know anything about what they are talking about."--Ted Thompson

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by 4and12to12and4
                        You know, I watched alot of plays in that SD game keying in on KGB. The reason I did this is because it kind of floored me that the left tackle bit on his move when he ran almost untouched to the QB. I was suprised to see that he actually moved his guy back quite a bit, and he seemed alot stronger than I gave him credit for. Also, he bullrushed alot straight into the tackle, and that is why the tackle bit on the outside rush. KGB started to run straight at him, put his hands up as if to push him backwards, and then just as the tackle got his weight forward, he just ran right around him. But, he gave alot more pressure alot more consistently than he gets credit for. There are very few players that can give constant pressure aka reggie and LT. I think we take him for granted.
                        KGB should be somewhat stronger physically as he worked hard on that ie the weight room since way back when that program began. I don't discount KGB.
                        ** Since 2006 3 X Pro Pickem' Champion; 4 X Runner-Up and 3 X 3rd place.
                        ** To download Jesus Loves Me ring tones, you'll need a cell phone mame
                        ** If God doesn't fish, play poker or pull for " the Packers ", exactly what does HE do with his buds?
                        ** Rather than love, money or fame - give me TRUTH: Henry D. Thoreau

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by wist43
                          Minnesota's front seven will make their secondary look good.

                          Green Bay's front seven can't generate enough pressure to help the secondary. They can't cover forever.

                          Edge to Minnesota b/c their front seven is so much better than Green Bay's.
                          Huh?? Where are the Vikings getting all the pressure from? In 2005:

                          The Vikings had 34 sacks on 533 opponent passing attempts
                          The Packers had 35 sacks on 430 opponent passing attempts.

                          In 103 fewer opportunities, the Packers had 1 more sack than the Vikings had last year.

                          Maybe if their DEs come around this year the Vikings might generate pressure, but they didn't get much pressure last year from anyone in their front seven on any consistent basis.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Here's a question for you homers - which DL, across the board, would you rather have, Minnesota's or Green Bay's???

                            Any rational person would, or course, take Minnesota's... it isn't even close. The biggest defensive stat is turnovers, Minnesota forced 35, Green Bay "forced" 21 - I use the term "forced" disparagingly wrt the Packers b/c, on defense, they don't "force" an offense to do anything.

                            Minnesota's DL is immeasurably more talented than Green Bay's and generates pressure on a much more consistent basis... Not necessarily b/c Minnesota's DL are the "Purple People Eaters" reincarnated, but b/c Green Bay's DL is well below average - especially at DE.

                            Many of Green Bay's sacks come against very inferior T's, and other than the occasional clean sack, i.e. KGB getting the corner, there is no pressure. QB's are allowed to operate unhurried and unmolested in the pocket the vast majority of the time.
                            wist

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by HarveyWallbangers
                              Originally posted by wist43
                              I've got history on my side for this argument... KGB and Kampman get sacks sporadically, and over time have proven that they can't provide consistent pressure.
                              You've got history? Then tell me what history Kenechi Udeze and Erasmus James have?

                              Monday night? It's just a start but I thought they looked pretty solid. Brooks was running for his life.

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