WR Thoughts

[Guiness]

That's true. The NFL has much easier salary rules to follow. The NBA is like the tax code, I don't even know if the people who write know how it works.

Good analogy for the NBA cap. I don't follow it at all, but off the top of my head I know there's two mid-level exemptions, a max contract, the Larry Bird exemption, a luxury tax, players can be signed to more than a max contract in certain situations, there's a bi-annual exception AND they allow for $100K wiggle room when signing!!!

Ya. That's fucked up.

[pbmax]

Good analogy for the NBA cap. I don't follow it at all, but off the top of my head I know there's two mid-level exemptions, a max contract, the Larry Bird exemption, a luxury tax, players can be signed to more than a max contract in certain situations, there's a bi-annual exception AND they allow for $100K wiggle room when signing!!!

Ya. That's fucked up.

Its goofy, but not as complicated as it sounds. And their contracts are guaranteed, which relives them of all the funny money built into NFL contracts.

With only 15 or so roster spots, they can build an online trade calculator for fans to test hypothetical trade scenarios and their cap effects. So it looks like a nightmare until you watch it for a while.

Not sure about the article. I fully believe fans live in the delusion that they would uniformly behave differently if placed into the circumstance of the athlete or owner (the original veil of opulence). Fans always ignore the obvious changes in perspective and priorities, not to mention the adulation and solicitations of others. But not sure that translates to the accounting aspect of fantasy sports and salary cap as much as the writer thinks. Most of the argument behind these principles are simply fans giving other fans grief over their teams.

Of course its still fun to tell a Bears fan their offense is a mess and they live in the past, but its as much fun to tell them how much they overspent for Brandon Marshall.

[mission]

Jarrett Boykin is better than Gurley or Borel, btw.

[RashanGary]

Jarrett Boykin is better than Gurley or Borel, btw.

It looks like that is very possible.

[RashanGary]

To Harvey's post. . . .

Nelson was a great #1 when Jennings was down too.

[Guiness]

Its goofy, but not as complicated as it sounds. And their contracts are guaranteed, which relives them of all the funny money built into NFL contracts.

With only 15 or so roster spots, they can build an online trade calculator for fans to test hypothetical trade scenarios and their cap effects. So it looks like a nightmare until you watch it for a while.

Not sure about the article. I fully believe fans live in the delusion that they would uniformly behave differently if placed into the circumstance of the athlete or owner (the original veil of opulence). Fans always ignore the obvious changes in perspective and priorities, not to mention the adulation and solicitations of others. But not sure that translates to the accounting aspect of fantasy sports and salary cap as much as the writer thinks. Most of the argument behind these principles are simply fans giving other fans grief over their teams.

Of course its still fun to tell a Bears fan their offense is a mess and they live in the past, but its as much fun to tell them how much they overspent for Brandon Marshall.

What you can do when you are capable of fully ignoring what I bolded above is a big part of Billy Beane and the Oakland A's 'Moneyball' success. It wasn't just that they had better numbers to work with, it was that they acted on them, often despite popular opinion.

[Patler]

So, now, it is Jennings (last spring it was Finley) who makes all the others as good as they are. Without Jennings, Nelson wouldn't be as good as he is. However, isn't it also possible that Nelson and Driver, being as good as they are, also make it just that little bit easier for Jennings? Perhaps they give Jennings the chance a couple times a game to see lighter coverage and capitalize on it?

To listen to some fans 8-10 years ago, it was Favre who made any GB receiver as good as he was. They all were ho-hum without Favre. IMO, the accuracy and decision making by Rodgers is more likely to "make" a receiver than Favre's play was. So why isn't Jennings just another of those GB no-name WRs that is "made" by his QB?

The simple fact is most players are better if they play with better players. The Packer wide receivers all make each other better. It goes both ways.

[Lurker64]

Jarrett Boykin is better than Gurley or Borel, btw.

Boykin is a better receiver than Gurley or Borel right now, and Dale Moss has more upside. So losing Gurley and Borel won't be a huge loss. We'll just get excited about the next PS guy like we did after Chastin West went elsewhere last year.

The only reason they'd keep Borel or Gurley on as WR6 is for STs.

[Brandon494]

Boykin is a better receiver than Gurley or Borel right now, and Dale Moss has more upside. So losing Gurley and Borel won't be a huge loss. We'll just get excited about the next PS guy like we did after Chastin West went elsewhere last year.

The only reason they'd keep Borel or Gurley on as WR6 is for STs.

Exactly! Which is why I don't believe we'll keep Borel or Gurley and go with 4 RBs instead. Sign Boykin and Moss to PS and let to battle it out for the 5th WR spot next year, thats if old man Driver lets them have it.

[rbaloha1]

GJ is a declining player that needs to be cut. No upside.

[Patler]

Exactly! Which is why I don't believe we'll keep Borel or Gurley and go with 4 RBs instead. Sign Boykin and Moss to PS and let to battle it out for the 5th WR spot next year, thats if old man Driver lets them have it.

Kind of neat, in a way. Borel and Gurley have missed lots of time. Jennings has been out a couple weeks. Smithson has been hurt, as have Finley and a couple other TEs. I think a few of the other WRs have missed time here and there too.

....and the old man just keeps playing and playing.
Maybe his wish to play until he is 40 will come true.

[Pugger]

GJ is a declining player that needs to be cut. No upside.

....not sure if serious...

[pbmax]

What you can do when you are capable of fully ignoring what I bolded above is a big part of Billy Beane and the Oakland A's 'Moneyball' success. It wasn't just that they had better numbers to work with, it was that they acted on them, often despite popular opinion.

We could move the Moneyball discussion over to the Brewers thread and fill it up. Never was a topic or idea more misunderstood by talking heads than that one. Even ones that should have known better.

As for as ignoring outside static, I agree. To do a job well, as Thompson and others repeatedly say, you need to ignore the distractions and be willing to take a little heat to put your program into place. And despite all contrary opinions, Thompson's is working out fine.

But there is no question that people other than oneself have an influence on who you are and what you do. Both from your past and the present. However fans who claim they would sign with a certain team for less money for example, are mostly oblivious to the motivations and desires of the player and the owners involved. They treat contract player contract negotiations like a possible lottery ticket. From the fan perspective, taking $4 million less and getting it immediately, while staying in the same city is irresistible. Any other choice is madness. Holding out for the additional $4 mil and having to move makes no sense unless someone (or the Players Union) is greedy and reckless.

Ironically, if fans thought about player negotiations like they do selling their used auto or something on Craigslist or eBay, it would make a lit more sense.

[pbmax]

To Harvey's post. . . .

Nelson was a great #1 when Jennings was down too.

So, now, it is Jennings (last spring it was Finley) who makes all the others as good as they are. Without Jennings, Nelson wouldn't be as good as he is. However, isn't it also possible that Nelson and Driver, being as good as they are, also make it just that little bit easier for Jennings? Perhaps they give Jennings the chance a couple times a game to see lighter coverage and capitalize on it?

....

The simple fact is most players are better if they play with better players. The Packer wide receivers all make each other better. It goes both ways.

Nelson was great but the offensive production was better with Jennings, obviously, and that reinforces Patler's point. However, casual memory makes me believe that Jennings can make the offense go better when he is without Finley or one of Nelson/Jones. So in my mind, he is 1A.

Nelson can be 1B because clearly he can do more things and more reliable things than Jones can.

But the problem with the offense at the end of last year wasn't Nelson's performance as either a 1A or 1B receiver. With Finley mentally hobbled, Driver in his drought and Jones not being either as good wide as either Nelson or Jennings, Nelson had to do too much. And it made it far easier to defense the Packers WR corp.

If circumstances were to be repeated this year, there is no ready replacement for Finley yet, but Cobb might be able to help where Driver couldn't last year.

[Fritz]

We could move the Moneyball discussion over to the Brewers thread and fill it up. Never was a topic or idea more misunderstood by talking heads than that one. Even ones that should have known better.

As for as ignoring outside static, I agree. To do a job well, as Thompson and others repeatedly say, you need to ignore the distractions and be willing to take a little heat to put your program into place. And despite all contrary opinions, Thompson's is working out fine.

But there is no question that people other than oneself have an influence on who you are and what you do. Both from your past and the present. However fans who claim they would sign with a certain team for less money for example, are mostly oblivious to the motivations and desires of the player and the owners involved. They treat contract player contract negotiations like a possible lottery ticket. From the fan perspective, taking $4 million less and getting it immediately, while staying in the same city is irresistible. Any other choice is madness. Holding out for the additional $4 mil and having to move makes no sense unless someone (or the Players Union) is greedy and reckless.

Ironically, if fans thought about player negotiations like they do selling their used auto or something on Craigslist or eBay, it would make a lit more sense.

I've often wondered what it would be like to be a player who grew up as a huge fan of say, the Cowboys, but then get drafted by a different team. Thinking of it like that reminds me that it's a business.