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**woodbuck27** · 08-18-2006, 11:46 PM

Packer fan comments on this article;

** Ted Fri Aug 18, 2006 11:00 pm

Ok ted just pisses me off, ur crazy to say hes doing a good job, with the 2nd highest salary cap wtf u have a chance to save ur kicking game by adding adam vinatieri, but b/c the best kicker in the leagues asking price was to much for tightwade thompson. you'd think ted is trying to set up brett for retirement by letting go mike flanagen mike wahle and marco rivera. doing that he leaves a huge hole in the middle of the line he also got rid of greg ruegamer so tell me who u have in that line besides clifton and tauscher? with all that money the only person to make a big impact is basicly woodson. but i mean in my opinion they had a great draft, but still where did all the money go anyway? screw building for the future at this point you have brett freaking favre u can build a super bowl team around him he shoulda signed some vets and like vinatieri, woodson,hunchinson, and then possibly others like porter, or LaVar arrington but what does he do? he signs one guy and saves some money while the packers will have to suffer this year b/c of his actions. the packers could really use a better GM
letting favre be gm? Fri Aug 18, 2006 10:46 pm

** thanks for the gut laugh. let's see, peyton manning has had marvin harrison for many seasons, joe montana and steve young had jerry rice, troy aikman had michael irvin, etc., etc. what's favre had, and for how many seasons in a row? anybody of the calibre of those folks? how many games has he misssed? how many times has he held out or publicly complained about the supporting talent? if that's a gm, no wonder the packers haven't been to the big game in a decade. thompson may turn out to be the best gm the packers ever had, but make no mistake, he did favre wrong. since the days of reggie white, leroy butler and keith jackson, the only big-time weapon favre has had has been ahman green, and his best days are behind him.

** Where was the money??? Fri Aug 18, 2006 7:41 pm

"But some how, some way, Thompson should have found a way to re-sign Wahle."

Someone should have called Thompson and let him know about the "money tree" that was around somewhere pehaps. A year later and all there is talk about what "should have been". It is over and we have to live with what we have and hopefully it will not be as bad as all the pessimist Packer fans seem to think.

** How to run a team Fri Aug 18, 2006 7:24 pm

The last 6 years we've been doing whatever it took to get Favre to win. Many poor decisions were made because we were living in the now instead of looking long term. It started when we paid Freeman too much and Sherman carried that torch even furthur when he traded up for Walker and overpaid for free agents.

Now we are doing it right. That means not paying guards a ton, not paying your kicker a ton. We are buliding through the draft and not letting Favre being our GM. It's going to be a little painful, especially if we lead the league in injuries like last year. It's worth it though, Thompson is doing the right thing for the Packers, not Favre and that's how it should be.

Comment woodbuck27:

HOLY MACKERAL.

GO PACKERS ! HOLD FAITH PACKER FANS !!

**Kiwon** · 08-19-2006, 05:31 AM

I think the title of the article is right on. If Farve gets hurt this year or is hurried to the point of ineffectiveness then I think the blame goes straight to the top.

**Bretsky** · 08-19-2006, 07:26 AM

When I saw the title posted I already knew I'd agree.

TT has failed to bring in anybody resembling proven and has chosen to roll the dice. It's his success or failure for these young guys.

**the_idle_threat** · 08-19-2006, 07:39 AM

When Brett Favre gets hit ... DRINK!

**Bretsky** · 08-19-2006, 07:44 AM

Originally posted by the_idle_threat

When Brett Favre gets hit ... DRINK!

If he played two quarters we'd all be in DETOX

**FavreChild** · 08-19-2006, 07:56 AM

Oh, I'll blame Ted alright.

But just in case that doesn't make me feel better, I'll try the drinking game, too.

**woodbuck27** · 08-19-2006, 09:16 AM

Originally posted by Bretsky

When I saw the title posted I already knew I'd agree.

TT has failed to bring in anybody resembling proven and has chosen to roll the dice. It's his success or failure for these young guys.

B. and anyone else:

Do you agree with this statement?

I feel it's time, that members of OUR Packer Forum - Our Home as Packer fans - are astute (fully aware) to what is really "in OUR face" regarding the immediate future we share as Packer fans.

End of statement.

Further comment:

I don't mean that anyone accept my view ,but that as Packer fans here. . . .

We should be more, than less in concert, with regard to where OUR team really is.

Many people here could mean many views. We all share one thing in common. We are unique but this place needs a common understanding, of "the TRUTH" to determine "a reality - of progress".

As fans of the Packers. I believe it's the TEAM and the TEAM's success that is FIRST.

We are powerless to make the decisions, that will warrant any REAL success, but as fans we need to demand " the reality of that success " and not accept failure.

We are, as a board here - strong.

The level of intelligence here, the understanding of the game of football at the competition level here, the manners and personality's here, the degree of passion we have in concert here for THE GREEN BAY PACKERS . . .

is outstanding.

I recommend, that as members of the Packer Community of fans that we utilize this Forum, with one central focus. The health of "the PACKERS" as a football team. Is the TEAM getting what is necessary for support to be competitive?

Today, I am going to post on some hard facts that raise concerns in me, as a Packer fan. I am going to really think, as I post, really try to spark a discussion that may lead us to a conclusion/conclusions that are concrete.

I recommend. As to where are we now. Please let's not scapegoat on the Mike Sherman Era. Let's get past that. He was fired last January. It's TIME - to at least begin " the stop on scapegoating, on Mike Sherman ".

It's time to fully focus on the current GM Ted Thompson, and HC Mike Mccarthy and his Coaching staff.

We need to arrive at the TRUTH, and we need to deal with just that.

I merely suggest, that as members in OUR HOME, that we not go all political, or all arrogant, or all I'm right and that poster is "out to lunch" wrong.

Everyone here has insight. Everyone here has the strength in him/her to be forthright, regarding where OUR Packer fan fortunes/future lies.

There is a poster here that wants to paint me as an emotional person. I assure all of you. Yes, I have emotiions but I am certainly passionate and try very hard to use my humble gifts as a person, to be a positively contributing Packer fan member here.

I never want to be more or less that the rest of the membership here but we need a focus as a board.

I never would expect we ALL act as clones, but I have faith that we can discern the TRUTH, and from that, aim to get real as Packer fans - that deserve the best for OUR team.

That means another Super Bowl - ASAP. It at least means, that OUR team has all the tools in place "in reality" to be competitive.

I'll open with this.

That is far far away with regards to what we presently have in place as a possible final roster to start OUR season. With the level of competence and their real ability to lead us (OUR VET's) and now given the fact they will soon be retired. How soon will it really be before we can compete after the Vet's?

Take Favre and Green and Franks and Charles Woodson's (potential) and Al Harris's (potential) and Henderson - now add Driver and Clifton and Tauscher and . . .

Take them all away and what have we got?

As I'm seeing it. . .

We have Ted Thompson and what Ted Thompson reallly brings (with all he is) to OUR table as Packer fans. Ted Thompson is in charge fully today, for OUR fortunes as Packer fans.

What happens in 2006, will in a large part and reality (I sence) determine the the outcome of the fine careers and contributions of Brett Favre, Ahman Green and William Henderson. These outstanding Green Bay Packers, along with Bubba Franks and Chad Clifton and Mark Tauscher and Donald Driver are the cornerstone of OUR Offense.

HOW WELL - has PACKER GM - TED THOMPSON, PROTECTED THESE FINE PACKERS FOR 2006 ?

I'll start . . . HE HASN'T !!! SORRY - for shouting.

I feel strongly.

That to support OUR team "in it's reality", it's incumbant on us as a board - as Packer fans, to try to determine what is really at issue in the Green Bay Packer's Organization.

THE GREEN BAY PACKERS !!!

**GBRulz** · 08-19-2006, 09:23 AM

I wonder if TT has a clause in his contract that says HE gets a bonus for every dollar of cap money he has left over. I can't think of another reason why the guy is such a tightwad.

I know this debate will go on and on (and it has) but we could have found a way to resign Whale. especially with the cap room TT knew we had the following year.

TT was a week late to FA this year. Wasn't he on vacation or out of town for something? There were minimal FA's this year to go around because of the unusual cap increase. He should have been more agressive, but being agressive is not his style....unless we're talking about driving his Escalade and nearing running into people as he pulls out of the player parking lot...

**mraynrand** · 08-19-2006, 09:43 AM

Originally posted by woodbuck27

..........

Geez Woody, I thought you were going to recommend we storm HQ with ultimatums for TT.

TT has a completely different philosophy than Sherman had. Sherman was all "win now with Favre." I wonder if Sherman would have changed that philosophy after Favre retired and would have started building from the ground up like TT?

That being said, TT could have placed a priority on protecting Favre - but he didn't. I have no problem believing that he has a philosophy and is sticking to it - I think he expected his plan to sufficiently protect Favre, but it's not working yet (some bad luck is involved of course, with injuries). With TT's philosophy, you have to have the long view on things and perhaps Favre will take a beating in the short term. But here's the thing - Favre is not TT's guy. A-rod is. No matter how much TT likes Favre, he blew a #1 pick on A-rod, and he's going to see him start. I wouldn't be surprised if TT is secretly hoping Favre leaves sooner than later, because TT likes his guys and I bet he doesn't like Favre's gunslinger mentality and, if the Packers continue to lose for the next year or so, he certainly won't like Favre's "chuck it up, it doesn't matter" philosophy.

Bottom line: I suspect that TT and Favre essentially have "philosophical differences" and that Favre's end in GB will not be happy as a result.

**mraynrand** · 08-19-2006, 09:45 AM

Originally posted by GBRulz

unless we're talking about driving his Escalade

Michele-Is it a WHITE Escalade? Is it pimped out like the players' trucks? I have this theory.....

**woodbuck27** · 08-19-2006, 09:58 AM

Originally posted by GBRulz

I wonder if TT has a clause in his contract that says HE gets a bonus for every dollar of cap money he has left over. I can't think of another reason why the guy is such a tightwad.

I know this debate will go on and on (and it has) but we could have found a way to resign Whale. especially with the cap room TT knew we had the following year.

TT was a week late to FA this year. Wasn't he on vacation or out of town for something? There were minimal FA's this year to go around because of the unusual cap increase. He should have been more agressive, but being agressive is not his style....unless we're talking about driving his Escalade and nearing running into people as he pulls out of the player parking lot...

My question GBRulz and ALL.

What is Ted Thompson's agenda - his FOCUS?

Does he really believe, he did enough for OUR team's fortunes in 2006 to be successful - competitive? He had in my view a fine draft. After that - what did he do to really give us success in 2006?

In my view he failed in OUR off season, to secure the help we as fans deserved, for OUR Offense to be successful; and because of that, like "a house of cards" it will in all likelihood - collapse.

I forecast that - the stress of adversity will take a heavy toll on OUR team.

If it's otherwise, then I'll be just one of the most surprised Packer fans.

How could Ted Thompson leave us in the mess we find OURSELVES in, as loyal Packer fans?

In terms of the work he didn't do to re-tool OUR OL. To build back OUR Offense? Ted Thompson's way will determine OUR overall success as a team in the NFL this season.

Why did Ted Thompson leave us so naked on offense, so vulnerable to a collapse as the season progress's?

Ted Thompson has left way too much up to - "well - if this happens or that we'll be fine". He's either out to lunch, or plain n' simple - incompetent to be OUR GM. I am no longer going to attribute Ted thompson's ways to a learning curve as he came to us highly recommended.

Yet, based on what Packer fans? He had success as a smart man in the process of drafting players with the Seattle Seahawks and he worked with Ron Wolf prior to that for us.

or

He has to be the luckiest GM in the NFL. I am so proud to be a member here and see the optimism of I'd have to say the majority of Packer fans here. That sustains me to support them when push comes to shove as this is primarily a Packer fan Forum.

GPRulz.this post is difficult. I have to deal with me. NOT always easy.

I have to deal with loyalty issues regarding OUR vet's that are OUR leaders and will give OUR HC Mke Mccarthy any real chance of success.

I now take you all to back to the start of 2005. We are about three games into the schedule and Mike Sherman called a spade a SPADE.

He said word's to this effect:

(and I paraphrase)

" I can only work with what is giving me ". . . . Mike Sherman

Often the most difficult thing to deal with is described "in TRUTH".

My name is Ed.

**GBRulz** · 08-19-2006, 10:00 AM

actually no, the only thing white is the drivers hair.... as the vehicle is dark blue. It's probably the only Escalade in the players lot that ISN'T pimped out !!

i suppose that ruins your theory?

**mraynrand** · 08-19-2006, 10:48 AM

Originally posted by GBRulz

actually no, the only thing white is the drivers hair.... as the vehicle is dark blue. It's probably the only Escalade in the players lot that ISN'T pimped out !!

i suppose that ruins your theory?

Yep, for the moment, the theory is on hold. My OTHER theory, that TT really doesn't like Favre, and wants A-rod in there ASAP, is as strong as ever.

**vince** · 08-19-2006, 02:28 PM

Here's my take on Ted Thompson...

Ted has a vision. That vision is comprised of a goal and a number of strategies he employs to achieve the goal.

He believes his responsibility is NOT to put a "competitive" team on the field in 2006 - as you state, Woody. If you believe that's his responsibility, then it's obvious to see why you won't think he's doing a good job. Your goal for him is different than his goal for himself. The strategies a GM would use to achieve the goal of "putting the best team possible on the field this year" are different than the strategies Ted Thompson is using to achieve his goal.

Ted Thompson is working toward the vision of reestablishing the Green Bay Packers as a DYNASTY. This means that he wants to build an organization and team that will win year after year after year after year - not just in 2006.

The way Ted is going about achieving his goal is by:

1. Objectively evaluating the current state of the franchise at all times.
2. Establish and maintain the cap management to act in ways consistent with your other strategies.
3. Offenses score points. Defenses win championships.
4. Build your foundation through the draft.
5. Invest in quality free agents, preferably young ones, at the time when it makes sense (See strategy 1).

When Ted Thompson took over, I believe he saw a team that wasn't very good, with some exceptions. He saw a porous defense. He saw a great quarterback, and he saw serious cap problems. The Packers had significant dead cap space on their books, still accounting significant dollars for the likes of Joe Johnson and Cletidus Hunt. He saw an aging team that, if not for the greatness of Brett Favre, had far less talent and a far worse cap situation than in the past. This team was not a dynasty, they were a team that was eeking into the playoffs because of a weak division and Brett Favre.

In order to build a dynasty, he had to take control of the salary cap situation. And he did that.

In order to build a dynasty, he has to build a formidable defense. He's doing that. Hawk, Hodge, Collins, Pickett, Kampman, Manual, and possibly Blackmon add a rock solid foundation to the defense. A couple more young pieces to this puzzle and we're set for a decade.

In order to build a dynasy, he has to rebuild his offense. The players he drafted on offense will be strong contributors for years to come. Will they learn a lot - through making mistakes - this year? I'd bet that will be the case. But I believe Jennings, Spitz, Colledge, and maybe even Moll, will be good. I see them as very capable of growing into stalwart members of the offense for years to come.

Obviously, there are some more pieces needed on offense. For the future, I think he needs to get a stud running back, a pass-catching TE, and another stud receiver, and a shut-down Tackle. On offense, we'll see about Ahman for 2006 (I think he's still got enough left), but Ahman isn't getting any younger.

Given the current state of the franchise, going out and overpaying for free agents just doesn't make sense. If you do that, you will end up overpaying for players who are typically on their last chance to cash in with a big contract, and often only have a couple productive years left before their performance declines significantly. For what? To get the Packers from 4-12 to 8-8? Maybe even eke into the playoffs, only to get beat in the first round- and find yourself in cap hell once again?

To build a dynasty, you have to understand the state of your team, and get your targeted free agents when your FOUNDATION is together and young, and you are perhaps a team that is one or two players away from Super Bowl contention. The Packers are not there yet.

Next year at this time? Perhaps.

I see a bright future for the Packers. It just will most likely take another year for the youngsters to gain experience and for a few additional pieces to come together to see it blossom.

I happen to agree wholeheartedly with Thompson's approach. I want to see the Packers build a dynasty, rather than a team that sneaks into the playoffs, only to get blown out by the NFL's elite each year.

I hope Brett sticks around another year to help make it happen.

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When Brett Favre gets hit, blame Thompson

When Brett Favre gets hit, blame Thompson

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