What free agent "risk" did Ron Wolf ever take?

[Patler]

Shamrock, do you have a favorite cartoon character?

tyler

Ally Oop. I think it is a long-discontinued comic strip. Anyone remember him? He was a caveman.

[Guiness]

Shamrock, you also add a lot to the quality of the debate in this forum. I like the civility you usually bring to football argumentation. You'll notice that Gureski, Patler, Harv, and Bretsky (usually) tend to be civil as well.

Thanks Swede. I normally try to be civil, albeit persuasive.
I thought Patler was a "no show" on this board?

Mmm. I think the mention of Patler was a Freudien slip.

I dunno HW and Jack. You could be right. I was going on the fact that his posts were basically gramatically correct, and devoid of spalling erros. Both pretty uncommon at JSO. Also tends to use the same tense.

A quick search back at 'Has TT Really done nothing' shows me some lists of facts Pat was known for. So I'll agree, although I haven't seen enough numbers to convince me!

'course you are him Patler, I wanna know why you didn't respond to my PM at JSO!

[Guiness]

Shamrock, do you have a favorite cartoon character?

tyler

Ally Oop. I think it is a long-discontinued comic strip. Anyone remember him? He was a caveman.

No, no, no. The Bender's still produce it. And it's Alley Oop (nice try at inserting a spelling error)

If you want to see the daily strip, go to http://www.comics.com/comics/alleyoop/index.html

Right now, Tunk just invaded because he thought Guz stole his crown. Someone found it under a bush, and Alley and Guz had Dinny and his pals chase them out of Moo.

[Patler]

Guiness, that's fantastic! I have not seen it in years! I just assumed it had gone to that great comic section in the sky!

[gureski]

Timmerman is one guy that I'll never understand why Wolf let get away. I mean he clearly wanted to stay in GB, yet he had indicated that the Packers never even attempted to keep him.

Wolf's specialty was bringing in guys who could fill holes when we needed. Hard to compare his situation to TT, where a hole here and there was much easier than the damn sinkhole TT has. But...ya gotta start somewhere and TT has the cash so let's pony it up already!!

Because he had Mike Whale ready to take over the starting guard spot. That's why he let him go. We've heard fans cry for an entire year that giving up on Whale was just a catastrophic mistake. Well, you'd never have given Whale a chance to play if you hadn't gotten rid of Timmerman. Why pay Timmerman 3 million a year if you have a guy making a million or less ready to start and play at a high level? The coaches and GM's know the talent of the guys on their roster before they hit the field. They let Timmerman go because they knew what Whale could do.

Gureski, Wahle was no where near "ready to take over the starting guard spot" when Timmerman was allowed to leave. Wahle started in 1999, but gave up more and more time to McKenzie who took over as the starter. In 2000 they moved Verba from tackle to guard, and tried to play Wahle at left tackle for a few games until he was again replaced, this time by Clifton, a rookie. Verba stayed at guard and Wahle went to the bench. Wahle didn't become a legitimate starter at guard until 2001.

Insert Verba for Whale then. The timeline after all these years isn't 100% on but it's close enough. The main point is that they had a replacement ready. They had it covered and they did have a guy on the team that had the talent, though developing, to be an all-pro. Sometimes you just have to toss that player in and devleop them.

[Patler]

Insert Verba for Whale then. The timeline after all these years isn't 100% on but it's close enough. The main point is that they had a replacement ready. They had it covered and they did have a guy on the team that had the talent, though developing, to be an all-pro. Sometimes you just have to toss that player in and devleop them.

Actually, Wolf really "lucked" out during that whole time period, but he made his own luck by drafting well.

In 1997 Verba took over at left tackle for the inept John Michaels.

In 1998 Aaron Taylor left. The untested Marco Rivera took over at LG and struggled, but survived.

1n 1999 Timmerman left, Rivera moved from LG to RG and Wahle/McKenzie struggled together at left guard.

In 2000 Verba moved to guard, Wahle moved to tackle and was horrible. Luckily the untested rookie, Chad Clifton was inserted into the starting lineup in place of Wahle and solidified things. However, even worse was the fact that Earl Dotson went down for the year, and Mark Tauscher, an afterthought for many, stepped in also as a rookie.

In 2001 Verba left and Wahle came back in at LG, struggled but then settled in. Also, Flanagan replaced Winters as the starter at center.


With the exception of Rivera, it was musical chairs in the O-line for 5 years, and 4 of the 5 starters were replaced in two years.

Wolf changed guards at the drop of a hat. From 1991 to 2000 the starters LG & RG were:

Moran & Hallstrom
Moran/Winters & Hallstrom
Widell & Galbreath
McIntyre/Winters & Galbreath
Taylor & Galbreath
Taylor & Timmerman
Taylor & Timmerman
Rivera & Timmerman
McKenzie/Wahle & Rivera
Verba & Rivera.

10 years and 12 different starters. Never went more than two years with the same combination of guards. Only Taylor and Timmerman started at the same position for as much as 3 years.

[Tarlam!]

I thought Patler was a "no show" on this board?

And you know Patler, because...?

[Patler]

I thought Patler was a "no show" on this board?

And you know Patler, because...?

The very first day I was here, the first string I opened to read was about Faine. The string started with two long quotations from "Patler" that had been copied and pasted by Partial. I asked who "Patler" was and was directed to his postings on JSonline. He has been mentioned several times since. I've read some of his postings on JSonline.

[Guiness]

In 2000 Verba moved to guard, Wahle moved to tackle and was horrible. Luckily the untested rookie, Chad Clifton was inserted into the starting lineup in place of Wahle and solidified things. However, even worse was the fact that Earl Dotson went down for the year, and Mark Tauscher, an afterthought for many, stepped in also as a rookie.

I remember when Dotson went down - I live near Buffalo, and the game was locally televised. Tauscher came trotting out and I was thinking "who is this guy, and what are we in for now?"

He wasn't exactly on the radar, as I recall.

[Bretsky]

I thought Patler was a "no show" on this board?

And you know Patler, because...?

The very first day I was here, the first string I opened to read was about Faine. The string started with two long quotations from "Patler" that had been copied and pasted by Partial. I asked who "Patler" was and was directed to his postings on JSonline. He has been mentioned several times since. I've read some of his postings on JSonline.

Yes, and I dedicate a thread in the beloved Badger section and he still doens't show up.

[GBRulz]

Timmerman is one guy that I'll never understand why Wolf let get away. I mean he clearly wanted to stay in GB, yet he had indicated that the Packers never even attempted to keep him.

Wolf's specialty was bringing in guys who could fill holes when we needed. Hard to compare his situation to TT, where a hole here and there was much easier than the damn sinkhole TT has. But...ya gotta start somewhere and TT has the cash so let's pony it up already!!

Because he had Mike Whale ready to take over the starting guard spot. That's why he let him go. We've heard fans cry for an entire year that giving up on Whale was just a catastrophic mistake. Well, you'd never have given Whale a chance to play if you hadn't gotten rid of Timmerman. Why pay Timmerman 3 million a year if you have a guy making a million or less ready to start and play at a high level? The coaches and GM's know the talent of the guys on their roster before they hit the field. They let Timmerman go because they knew what Whale could do.

Um, Gureski? Wahle was nowhere near being a starting guard at that time as his rookie season was Timmermans's last season in GB. In fact, Wahle was in the dog house with many in his first couple of seasons even after Timmerman was gone.

That was my whole point - was why we didn't even attempt to resign Timmerman. Do we know he would require a 3 million dollar salary to stay in GB? No, we do not. No biggie, I was just speculation on one guy that I was sad to see leave GB, when it possibly could have been avoided.

[Harlan Huckleby]

The very first day I was here, the first string I opened to read was about Faine. The string started with two long quotations from "Patler" that had been copied and pasted by Partial. I asked who "Patler" was and was directed to his postings on JSonline. He has been mentioned several times since. I've read some of his postings on JSonline.

There is speculation that you and patler are one and the same.

And I'm afraid you are now condemned to forever live under the clowd of this horrible accusation. (Only kidding, patler is fine.)

It wouldn't be patler's style to deny a direct question, he's a rather honest fellow. But then again, if you really WERE patler, he'd be too proud to admit his deception!

You poor man, forever stained by doubt.

[KYPack]

Gureski,

What a thoughtful post. Your recall of the facts regarding Heinrich and Wolf are spot on. To me, the Wolf era was a perfect storm that involved Favre, White, Holmgren, and that awesome draft--was it '93?--that brought us so many starters. But Wolf was by no means perfect. As you point out, along the way we lost players to free agency and we missed on players in free agency. That's just gonna happen.


Shamrock, you also add a lot to the quality of the debate in this forum. I like the civility you usually bring to football argumentation. You'll notice that Gureski, Patler, Harv, and Bretsky (usually) tend to be civil as well.

KY, I like your posts, too, but please take it easy on Tank. He's like the little brother that you know is an idiot but you'll defend him against anyone. Forum life is better with a variety of personalities.
.

Arrite, Swede.

You are a decent sort, so I'll lighten up on Baby Tanky if it bothers ya.

You see Tank did a lot of stupid and immature stuff on the old Forum, so I like to call him on some of his foolishness. It doesn't really keep him in line, but I was letting him know WE ARE AWARE of his nonsense.

This is the Packer Rat pool of domestic tranquility & I don't wanna be the one to make waves.

[Guiness]

You poor man, forever stained by doubt.

Who said he's a man?

Oh. That speculation belongs in another forum...

[Patler]

The very first day I was here, the first string I opened to read was about Faine. The string started with two long quotations from "Patler" that had been copied and pasted by Partial. I asked who "Patler" was and was directed to his postings on JSonline. He has been mentioned several times since. I've read some of his postings on JSonline.

There is speculation that you and patler are one and the same.

And I'm afraid you are now condemned to forever live under the clowd of this horrible accusation. (Only kidding, patler is fine.)

It wouldn't be patler's style to deny a direct question, he's a rather honest fellow. But then again, if you really WERE patler, he'd be too proud to admit his deception!

You poor man, forever stained by doubt.

What direct question?
What deception?