Mice And Men - Lions

[Zool]

I guess its easy to look the other way when you're winning.

IMO, Rodgers didnt play particularly well the past two games against injury-depleted, mediocre defenses. Take away the game-winning drive vs. Detroit and Rodgers had a pretty average game. Rodgers himself admitted he didn't play well vs. Jacksonville.

Teams have found the blueprint for beating or at least containing the Packers' potent offense: rush only 4, play two safeties deep and dare the Packers to run.

You could blame McCarthy for his playcalling or the OL for their inability to open up holes and give Rodgers all day to throw against only 4 rushers or the rbs' inability to make plays. But a great qb makes everyone around him better. Not saying Rodgers is not great as he certainly is elite. The offense just isn't as "potent" as it should be lately and it starts with Rodgers.

Favre used to make everyone around him better all the time. The same is expected out of Rodgers.

Fuck now I'm confused. Didnt Favre have the best O-lineman in Packer history that Thompson refused to resign?

[LegandofthePack15]

Fuck now I'm confused. Didnt Favre have the best O-lineman in Packer history that Thompson refused to resign?

True, but Favre also played with arguably the worst OL in Packer history. You know the one Thompson assembled with Klemm and Whitticker. Favre made that line look better than it was by taking only 24 sacks. For comparison's sake, Rodger already has taken more sacks this season in just 10 games with a better OL than the one Favre had for all of 2005.

[mraynrand]

Owens or Plaxico? I remember worst versus Plax.

Both, except that I think he had more opportunities to get psyched out and suck against TO than against Pexiglass. I also think he 'played well' against Plex in the reg. season game in 2007 (2 catches, 32 yards, 1 TD), but not against TO (7,156, 1).

[KYPack]

Fuck now I'm confused. Didnt Favre have the best O-lineman in Packer history that Thompson refused to resign?

That Mike Wahle, he just loved to play the game. He was like a kid out there.

I forgot how stupid Tank is.

So you guys just want to fuck with him until we get sick of that, THEN run him out?

Oh, awwright.

[mraynrand]

True, but Favre also played with arguably the worst OL in Packer history. You know the one Thompson assembled with Klemm and Whitticker. Favre made that line look better than it was by taking only 24 sacks. For comparison's sake, Rodger already has taken more sacks this season in just 10 games with a better OL than the one Favre had for all of 2005.

Sure, but until Green was hurt, there was a concentration on the run game in 2005 as well. 2005 was a rebuilding year. This year really wasn't supposed to be, but now you could easily argue that it is a rebuilding year along with O-line with 3 replacements already.

Both Favre and Rodgers made their lines look better, but in different ways. Favre was more elusive and physically tough to shed rushers; Rodgers is quicker to escape and run, and is a more cerebral QB in pre-snap recognition and adjusting the protection and blocking, although by his last few years, Favre got very good at this too.

[LegandofthePack15]

Both Favre and Rodgers made their lines look better, but in different ways. Favre was more elusive and physically tough to shed rushers; Rodgers is quicker to escape and run, and is a more cerebral QB in pre-snap recognition and adjusting the protection and blocking, although by his last few years, Favre got very good at this too.

Agreed. For a moment I thought you were gonna argue that Favre took less sacks b/c, unlike Rodgers, he wasn't prone to holding the ball for an eternity. Instead, Favre just throw the ball to a guy in a different jersey.

[Zool]

That Mike Wahle, he just loved to play the game. He was like a kid out there.

I forgot how stupid Tank is.

So you guys just want to fuck with him until we get sick of that, THEN run him out?

Oh, awwright.

It's like whiskey. I know it won't end up well, but I do it anyway.

[Patler]

True, but Favre also played with arguably the worst OL in Packer history. You know the one Thompson assembled with Klemm and Whitticker. Favre made that line look better than it was by taking only 24 sacks. For comparison's sake, Rodger already has taken more sacks this season in just 10 games with a better OL than the one Favre had for all of 2005.

Worst line in history? With Clifton, Tauscher and Flanagan in the prime of their careers? When you have two tackles who can neutralize anyone with little or no help, as Clifton and Tauscher did then, and a center who is good enough to have finished the year at LT just a couple years earlier, it didn't matter all that much that the guards were weak. With no pressure from the outside, it is easy for a QB to slide away from pressure up the middle only. Besides, Wells started half the games at LG that year.

[Mazzin]

I guess its easy to look the other way when you're winning.

IMO, Rodgers didnt play particularly well the past two games against injury-depleted, mediocre defenses. Take away the game-winning drive vs. Detroit and Rodgers had a pretty average game. Rodgers himself admitted he didn't play well vs. Jacksonville.

Teams have found the blueprint for beating or at least containing the Packers' potent offense: rush only 4, play two safeties deep and dare the Packers to run.

You could blame McCarthy for his playcalling or the OL for their inability to open up holes and give Rodgers all day to throw against only 4 rushers or the rbs' inability to make plays. But a great qb makes everyone around him better. Not saying Rodgers is not great as he certainly is elite. The offense just isn't as "potent" as it should be lately and it starts with Rodgers.

Favre used to make everyone around him better all the time. The same is expected out of Rodgers.

No one can take this guy seriously. Still comparing him to Favre....move along people nothing to see here.

[mission]

Tramon - Started out bad, but really settled down and overall had a good game. Megatron didn't have a Reggie Wayne game and that works for me.
Hayward - Kid is the real real deal Holyfield. Love him even though he still seems rough around the edges.
House - More than the hair reminds me of Al Harris. Our three young corners can be really good (Shields) if they aren't already.

Cliff notes: our CBs are awesome

McMillan - Safety seems like a position that takes a little more seasoning because of the thinking aspect to it. He seems farther along than Burnett or Collins was at this point in his career. I don't know where his ceiling is, might never be a bigtime ballhawk, but we have enough of those.
B.Jones - Making a big difference in the middle. Very smart. That breakup on Larry Fitz on a key third down told me all I needed to know. He might be the only player (besides Clay) that makes that play in the front seven. We haven't had anything like that in the middle since Capers got here.
EDS - Is barely serviceable.

Moss - That strip was play of the game with Rodgers to Cobb for the lead. Such a clutch play. Got lost rushing sometimes, but you can tell he's a football player. Keep him on the team for 4-6 years as a 4th-5th linebacker.
Jordy - Keeps killing me in fantasy football
Cobb - Keeps killing me for not starting in FF


This defense is really coming together just as I thought it would. If we get Clay, Woody and Jennings back and playing well by the end of the year, we will be very tough to beat. Was watching First Take while eating some Dogs at The Varsity for lunch and both Stephen A and the other guy (not skip) were feeling very strong about Packers as Super Bowl champs. Not that I respect those guys, but it's not a secret.

[pbmax]

Well that rare appearance resolves any lingering questions I had.

And we all know Favre had two phases to his sack avoiding career, the first where he ran around like Tarkenton and refused to go down like Roethlisberger and then threw a pick. Later, he made a lightning quick read and then fired off a pick.

Back on topic, Rodgers taking sacks is probably a win in Net Yardage, but its almost as frustrating to watch as a pick.

[ThunderDan]

Well that rare appearance resolves any lingering questions I had.

And we all know Favre had two phases to his sack avoiding career, the first where he ran around like Tarkenton and refused to go down like Roethlisberger and then threw a pick. Later, he made a lightning quick read and then fired off a pick.

Back on topic, Rodgers taking sacks is probably a win in Net Yardage, but its almost as frustrating to watch as a pick.

This got me to thinking. Yardage to me is one of the most important stats in a game. Turnovers greatly alter the yardage gain/loss on change of possession.

Here are the years and INTs by BF and AR.

Brett Favre: ------------------------------ Aaron Rodgers:
92 - 13 INTs - 276 Points --------------- 08 - 13 INTs - 419 Pts
93 - 24 INTs - 340 Pts ------------------- 09 - 7 INTs - 461 Pts
94 - 14INTs - 382 Pts -------------------- 10 - 11 INTs - 388 Pts
95 - 13 INTs - 404 Pts ------------------ -11 - 6 INTs - 560 Pts
96 - 13 INTs - 456 Pts
97 - 16 INTs - 422 Pts
98 - 23 INTs - 408 Pts
99 - 23 INTs - 357 Pts
00 - 16 INTs - 353 Pts
01 - 15 INTs - 390 Pts
02 - 16 INTs - 398 Pts
03 - 21 INTs - 442 Pts
04 - 17 INTs - 424 Pts
05 - 29 INTs - 298 Pts
06 - 18 INTs - 301 Pts
07 - 15 INTs - 435 Pts

[ThunderDan]

Not sure that there is anything that jumps out at you right away. Maybe turnover margin and points differential would give a better result. Add in net yardage on punts and kickoffs.

Boy, if I didn't have a real job I could probably pick just the right combination of stats to prove that INTs by QBs destroy seasons.

[ThunderDan]

I guess the one thing that jumps off the page is ARod in his 4 seasons has never thrown more INTs per season than BF did in any season.

[Mazzin]

Not only that, but growing up when Favre cocked back to launch a deep ball, I would get sick in the pit of my stomach. Each time feeling like it was a 50/50 that it would be a PHENOMINAL play, or that it would be into a mob of opponents jerseys. Then after the game would say something about "wrong route" COME ON MAN if he isn't running the right route don't just chuck it as far as you can. Favre was a great, and a ledgend in his own right. It is a new era though, and I think it will be filled with more Super Bowls, and in the end thats all that matters right?