Derek Sherrod Health Speculation

[denverYooper]

[3irty1]

Our front seven seems like a haphazard collection of decent players that really don't fit together in Capers's "whatever-amoeba-nickel" defense.

We'd probably be better off switching back to a 4-3 with the personnel we have. At least if we went back to a 4-3, Capers would be forced to put more than 1 DL on the field.

I'm hoping Capers gets fired mid-season... that would be cause for optimism

I don't understand you. Every team in the league runs more nickle than anything else and the 2-4 is just the most common nickle package for 3-4 teams. The 49ers ran a 2-4 most of the time against us. The only real difference between a 2-4 and a 4-2 is if the outside passrushers have a hand on the ground or not. When you think about it that way its obvious what Capers would do with a guy like Nick Perry or Tank Carradine. I guess this explains why you have such a hardon for the Seahawks, Giants, and Falcons despite all of them being a clear tier below the Packers, they are all 4-3 teams.

[Fritz]

I think Wist is old school and wants a 4-3 with hulking defensive linemen everywhere.

But I can't blame him in that regard. Having grown up in the 70's, I still get a hard on when MM runs the ball two or three times in a row. Well, when it works I get a hard on, anyway. Yet it's been clearly demonstrated that MM's play calling generally works. This team can score.

It's hard to let go of the old ways of thinking.

My problem is not with Wist's desire for a tougher, meaner front seven; it's with his insistence that the Packers deliberately choose to play soft, and that the Packers were lucky to win a SB, and that they are doomed because they choose to keep their heads in the sand. That's the stuff I don't get. You can't tell me that somehow MM and TT are not aware of how physical their team is or isn't, or that they are aware but they don't care. I can't imagine them having a conversation that Wist imagines they'd have. It would go like this:

MM: Well, Ted, I love throwing the ball and being all fancy and cute. And I know Dom loves calling cute trick defenses. He loves himself and wants to show how fancy and smart he is.

Ted: Yes, Mike, I know. And I love being frugal and only drafting players. I don't like signing free agents even if it would make the team better. I also am thought of as a closet homosexual, and so I like prissy, sissy football players. That's why it's so great that you are my coach!

MM: And that's why it's so great that Dom is my DC!

TT: Let's go watch some Real Housewives, and after that we can check out some film on this underweight, dancing-bear left tackle who used to play tight end. We can get him in the third round, I think!

MM: Great! Oh, and Dom wants to know if you can draft a small, quick linebacker who doesn't really like to hit anyone. Dom's thinking of a new package: the 0-5. No defensive linemen at all, and five light, timid linebackers.

TT: Cool. We can get into the playoffs with that, I think. And that's all we really care about, anyway.

[pbmax]

Well JH (AKA Nick Collins),

You really pulled out all the stops on that post.

Before you hurl yourself into oblivion, a few words of advice....

My additions in bold:

1. You can't cheat an honest man.

2. Never play cards with a man named Doc or a man named after a city.

3. Never go to bed with a woman that has more problems than you do.

4. Never, ever smarten up a chump.

5. If there's a con going on and you don't know who the mark it, you are the mark.

Stay with those basics and you should be all right.

[3irty1]

I think Wist is old school and wants a 4-3 with hulking defensive linemen everywhere.

But I can't blame him in that regard. Having grown up in the 70's, I still get a hard on when MM runs the ball two or three times in a row. Well, when it works I get a hard on, anyway. Yet it's been clearly demonstrated that MM's play calling generally works. This team can score.

It's hard to let go of the old ways of thinking.

My problem is not with Wist's desire for a tougher, meaner front seven; it's with his insistence that the Packers deliberately choose to play soft, and that the Packers were lucky to win a SB, and that they are doomed because they choose to keep their heads in the sand. That's the stuff I don't get. You can't tell me that somehow MM and TT are not aware of how physical their team is or isn't, or that they are aware but they don't care. I can't imagine them having a conversation that Wist imagines they'd have. It would go like this:

MM: Well, Ted, I love throwing the ball and being all fancy and cute. And I know Dom loves calling cute trick defenses. He loves himself and wants to show how fancy and smart he is.

Ted: Yes, Mike, I know. And I love being frugal and only drafting players. I don't like signing free agents even if it would make the team better. I also am thought of as a closet homosexual, and so I like prissy, sissy football players. That's why it's so great that you are my coach!

MM: And that's why it's so great that Dom is my DC!

TT: Let's go watch some Real Housewives, and after that we can check out some film on this underweight, dancing-bear left tackle who used to play tight end. We can get him in the third round, I think!

MM: Great! Oh, and Dom wants to know if you can draft a small, quick linebacker who doesn't really like to hit anyone. Dom's thinking of a new package: the 0-5. No defensive linemen at all, and five light, timid linebackers.

TT: Cool. We can get into the playoffs with that, I think. And that's all we really care about, anyway.

Apparently I must spread some rep before giving it to you again.

[Fritz]

My additions in bold:

1. You can't cheat an honest man.

2. Never play cards with a man named Doc or a man named after a city.

3. Never go to bed with a woman that has more problems than you do.

4. Never, ever smarten up a chump.

5. If there's a con going on and you don't know who the mark it, you are the mark.

Stay with those basics and you should be all right.

My problem was always with #3. I loved bad girls, and bad girls are inevitably bat-shit crazy.

[pbmax]

People of all stripes don't really care about scheme, drafting philosophy or scouting system. Fans want success. Capers was fine when it was a top 2 defense. Now that its fallen he is an idiot.

People also tend to forget how high a level the NFL is and what small errors can do to a team.

The best lesson anyone could take about the Packers Defense last year is assignment surety. Play fast and loose with your assignments (I am looking at you Raji and Walden), overcommit, lose leverage or give up an edge and Adrian Peterson gains 220 yards. Those errors can be mental or physical but they are not scheme or alignment.

Same players, same scheme in the playoffs get their act together and keep to the script. No more one gapping on your own and bursting into the backfield. No more headlong chases down the LOS giving up the backside cut. Gap control and patience. Peterson gets 100 yards and the game is on Ponder to win.

The Packer preach fast and aggressive defense. When you face Adrian Peterson with a good O line or the 49ers who are running a form of option at you, they simply turn your aggression into their advantage. Peterson's greatest strength is his patience and then his ability to see the hole crack open after the initial scrum and then kill you by bursting through.

I think KY and Nutz would agree that one trait of ANY option play is that they seek to isolate one player and have them make a choice and then send the ball to the area they just vacated. You follow Gore? CK keeps the ball. Falcons and Ravens run at CK to force a give? Twin double teams by the O line give Gore a six yard carry.

If the Packers changed nothing about their defense except to repeat last year's discipline of the Vikings playoff game against the 49ers, Vikes and Redskins? Then start warming up the victory parade floats.

[3irty1]

People of all stripes don't really care about scheme, drafting philosophy or scouting system. Fans want success. Capers was fine when it was a top 2 defense. Now that its fallen he is an idiot.

People also tend to forget how high a level the NFL is and what small errors can do to a team.

The best lesson anyone could take about the Packers Defense last year is assignment surety. Play fast and loose with your assignments (I am looking at you Raji and Walden), overcommit, lose leverage or give up an edge and Adrian Peterson gains 220 yards. Those errors can be mental or physical but they are not scheme or alignment.

Same players, same scheme in the playoffs get their act together and keep to the script. No more one gapping on your own and bursting into the backfield. No more headlong chases down the LOS giving up the backside cut. Gap control and patience. Peterson gets 100 yards and the game is on Ponder to win.

The Packer preach fast and aggressive defense. When you face Adrian Peterson with a good O line or the 49ers who are running a form of option at you, they simply turn your aggression into their advantage. Peterson's greatest strength is his patience and then his ability to see the hole crack open after the initial scrum and then kill you by bursting through.

I think KY and Nutz would agree that one trait of ANY option play is that they seek to isolate one player and have them make a choice and then send the ball to the area they just vacated. You follow Gore? CK keeps the ball. Falcons and Ravens run at CK to force a give? Twin double teams by the O line give Gore a six yard carry.

If the Packers changed nothing about their defense except to repeat last year's discipline of the Vikings playoff game against the 49ers, Vikes and Redskins? Then start warming up the victory parade floats.

This. People it wouldn't be called the read option if the point wasn't to make watch your defense and then take the option they can't defend. Now in the NFL there are options inside the option. The FB reads the OLB when choosing who to block. We were unprepared for that but we won't be next time.

[Fritz]

PBMax wrote...

"People of all stripes don't really care about scheme, drafting philosophy or scouting system. Fans want success. Capers was fine when it was a top 2 defense. Now that its fallen he is an idiot.

People also tend to forget how high a level the NFL is and what small errors can do to a team.

The best lesson anyone could take about the Packers Defense last year is assignment surety. Play fast and loose with your assignments (I am looking at you Raji and Walden), overcommit, lose leverage or give up an edge and Adrian Peterson gains 220 yards. Those errors can be mental or physical but they are not scheme or alignment.

Same players, same scheme in the playoffs get their act together and keep to the script. No more one gapping on your own and bursting into the backfield. No more headlong chases down the LOS giving up the backside cut. Gap control and patience. Peterson gets 100 yards and the game is on Ponder to win.

The Packer preach fast and aggressive defense. When you face Adrian Peterson with a good O line or the 49ers who are running a form of option at you, they simply turn your aggression into their advantage. Peterson's greatest strength is his patience and then his ability to see the hole crack open after the initial scrum and then kill you by bursting through.

I think KY and Nutz would agree that one trait of ANY option play is that they seek to isolate one player and have them make a choice and then send the ball to the area they just vacated. You follow Gore? CK keeps the ball. Falcons and Ravens run at CK to force a give? Twin double teams by the O line give Gore a six yard carry.

[U]If the Packers changed nothing about their defense except to repeat last year's discipline of the Vikings playoff game against the 49ers, Vikes and Redskins? Then start warming up the victory parade floats"



So...if it's all about discipline, then maybe there's room on the Packers' coaching staff for one more defensive assistant:

[woodbuck27]

PB

Honestly, developmental-wise, I don't think Sherrod is much further along than a 4-year Wisconsin or Iowa player would be coming in. He had a few months of NFL training, other than that all of his experience was at Mississippi State. And he hasn't played real football in a long time. It will be pushing 2 years by the time he takes his first pre-season snap.

I kinda like what Smeefers said, Newhouse starts the season with Sherrod deciding after that. Just the way things have gone for DS, honestly, as much as I've been saying the signs point to Newhouse, I think I'll be more forgiving than a lot of people here during the preseason with Sherrod. If that guy gets a full TC and 4 preseason games under his belt (where he plays alot, left and right) I like how it lines up for him. He has to get better every game. If he does that, and doesn't bomb out, I'm as much of a trend reader as anyone. I'll be honking his horn.

He needs to get his body thumped, really worked into football shape, then a few recovery weeks in the first quarter of the season to build his strength back up. The guy needs a break. Something like that, really good circumstances, would be enough for him to step in at some point in the season as a big, strong, fresh 24 year old with some good, real NFL training under his belt. JH

Life brought me to a man named 'Chance' that's diagnosed/treated for 'Bi-Polar Disorder'. Chance and I became very close friends.That friendship featured some interesting and challenging issues/times. Today some mutual friends don't know what's become of him. He's been in his cave for near two years now. I received a call just this week from one of those mutual friends, 'Don'; my best friend and 'by the way' a Green Bay Packer fan. What's happened to Chance, puzzels Don and I and another friend 'Bill'.

Sadly, Chance won't come out of his cave.

When I read your post JH. I felt strongly about Chance. I miss alot of what Chance was. One of those attributes was his intelligence. In my view a persons intelligence is all about 'keeping it simple'. I don't care how much time it takes to get there. The prize of recognized intelligence goes to the victor or the person who perseveres.

The portion of your post that is deserving of 'the prize' is above. What your telling Packerrats JH, is that Derek Sherrod must be tested by fire.

I'm being tested right now and have been for about a week.

I'm in a terrible struggle with my 'seven (7) round mock draft'. Any help will be appreciated. I reserve the right to make all final decisions.

I've got the back end of that draft fairly well covered but the picks in Rounds 1-3 are burning my ass. I've got the picks in rounds 2 and 3. I'm struggling with pick #26. Too many options send my mock......south. It goes from 'meat and veggies' solid eating to soup.

When I look at the San Francisco 49ers I'm impressed. The 49ers OL is outstanding. Compared to our OL their's ................. 'Universes' apart. Our OL needs an influx of talent. So what can I hope for with the forecast of a Derek Sherrod arrival? Should I simply go with hope? Should I get into 'magical thinking ' and Derek Sherrod?

Absolutely 'no way'.

Ted Thompson cannot invest picks in this draft as glamour picks. I love players like:

WR's DeAndre Hopkins, 6'1" 214 lbs, Clemson, Grade 87.8 and another Greg Jennings and Justin Hunter, 6'4" 196 lbs, Tennessee, **Grade 81.8 and rising like a Rocket.

** All grades I give here come from NFL.Com.

RB Eddie Lacy 5' 11" 231 lbs, Alabama Grade 82.0 a fella that if healthy will move the chains and be a basher. He was able to run his 40 on Thursday. His time (approx. 4.57 sec.) is very good for a man his size, coming off a hammy injury.

TE Tyler Eifert 6'6" 251 lbs, Notre Dame Grade 83.3. Positioned on the depth chart behind Jermichael Finley. Unless we become the NE Patriots on offense...that's pure waste. I'll hate this pick. Ted Thompson must not pick this man. A question of his commitment enhances my position. That's what we need. Another first round pick unsure of his direction.

Every one of Ted Thompsons picks need to be totally excited about becoming Green Bay Packers. At least 4-5 of 8 picks need to make the roster as or near upgrades. We cannot wait four seasons for that to (maybe?) happen.

Others I love and on the defensive side:

DE Datone Jones, 6'4" 283 lbs, UCLA, Grade 85.6. There's 'a drive for show' fella. If I ever saw one. If he was available at #26 ? Would that 'California Star' adapt to playing in small town Green Bay?

CB Taylor Jamer, 5' 11" 192 lbs. A 4.37 sec. 40; 22 Rep's.; 10' 7" Broad and 35 " Vert.; 4.06 20 yard shuttle and 6.82 3-Cone Drill. The 4th ranked CB. Impressive measurements but he's 5' 11".

You want a mid field hitter/ punisher? A football player that's all over the place banging big time? Look no further than LSU's Eric Reid. This fella is impressive and took charge at the college level. His grade is 82.5.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=msB2cYNL_o4

He wears that number 'ONE' but is he our number one round option? Grades ***

For a long time I liked the steady heady style of play of his teammate, ILB Kevin Minter. What do you see?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9VK_NP-cjc

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=89708&draftyear=2013&genpos=ILB

*** Grades charade !

I look for the passion in a prospects game. Does he have game? Of course that can backfire in the 50/50 chance with a NFL draft pick. We thought/hoped that AJ Hawk had game. Too bad it didn't justify that #5 pick nor translate to the NFL level.

Then as Fritz posted; we get a Nick Collins. Ted Thompson is one out of two but we'll remember and grieve Nick Collins.

So is it glamour and flash and dash at the top of our next draft or smart?

I believe those three/four picks at the top have to go to impact and size. To the OL and DL.

After that it gets easier. After pick's #26 and #55 and #88 and #122 there are some 2500 prospects to pick from for RB, Safety and WR. We need a decent backup QB.... pronto!

We don't need a TE. Ted thompson and Mike McCarthy are obviously in some form of 'love affair' with Jermichael Finley.

GO PACK GO !

[woodbuck27]

You just never see a post like JH's on Footballs Future

My hopes for Sherrod and somewhat dim view of Newhouse basically revolve around the prospect of the O line being better this year rather than last. I hope Sherrod does get healthy and comes around and I hope the Packers have good enough (and healthy enough) tackle talent to keep Newhouse on the bench.

And the reason I am invested in this hope is because I don't see them grabbing another starting caliber tackle in this draft.

If starting O line help does arrive in the draft it will probably be at center which is fine. But then Sherrod is the next, most likely player to contribute to better overall play.

Football Future.

They post over there like their always pissing their pants. Smart assed One-Two-Three sentence and outta here .... posts.

As posters..... the anti-matter equivalent to woodbuck27.

[woodbuck27]

Our front seven seems like a haphazard collection of decent players that really don't fit together in Capers's "whatever-amoeba-nickel" defense.

We'd probably be better off switching back to a 4-3 with the personnel we have. At least if we went back to a 4-3, Capers would be forced to put more than 1 DL on the field.

I'm hoping Capers gets fired mid-season... that would be cause for optimism

I think it's this and the 3-4:

a) Look at that decision to go there and the drafting of AJ Hawk. Following up in a subsequent draft; moving up in round one to snare Clay Matthrews III.

b) Was TT afraid of the cost of 'a real' DE or DT?

c) Ted Thompson was a LBer in the NFL.

d) AJ Hawk is likely looking at his last contract as a Green Bay Packer

e) Clay Matthews got handled by a crippled LT Vs San Francisco.

All that and TT's vision for our defense! Maybe TT needs to revise that vision?

PACKERS !

[woodbuck27]

This. People it wouldn't be called the read option if the point wasn't to make watch your defense and then take the option they can't defend. Now in the NFL there are options inside the option. The FB reads the OLB when choosing who to block. We were unprepared for that but we won't be next time.

Great confidence there and we need the talent on the Green Bay Packers to follow through.

It begins two weeks from yesterday... into two weeks from today and tomorrow.

GO TED THOMPSON !

[woodbuck27]

PBMax wrote...

"People of all stripes don't really care about scheme, drafting philosophy or scouting system. Fans want success. Capers was fine when it was a top 2 defense. Now that its fallen he is an idiot.

People also tend to forget how high a level the NFL is and what small errors can do to a team.

The best lesson anyone could take about the Packers Defense last year is assignment surety. Play fast and loose with your assignments (I am looking at you Raji and Walden), overcommit, lose leverage or give up an edge and Adrian Peterson gains 220 yards. Those errors can be mental or physical but they are not scheme or alignment.

Same players, same scheme in the playoffs get their act together and keep to the script. No more one gapping on your own and bursting into the backfield. No more headlong chases down the LOS giving up the backside cut. Gap control and patience. Peterson gets 100 yards and the game is on Ponder to win.

The Packer preach fast and aggressive defense. When you face Adrian Peterson with a good O line or the 49ers who are running a form of option at you, they simply turn your aggression into their advantage. Peterson's greatest strength is his patience and then his ability to see the hole crack open after the initial scrum and then kill you by bursting through.

I think KY and Nutz would agree that one trait of ANY option play is that they seek to isolate one player and have them make a choice and then send the ball to the area they just vacated. You follow Gore? CK keeps the ball. Falcons and Ravens run at CK to force a give? Twin double teams by the O line give Gore a six yard carry.

[U]If the Packers changed nothing about their defense except to repeat last year's discipline of the Vikings playoff game against the 49ers, Vikes and Redskins? Then start warming up the victory parade floats"



So...if it's all about discipline, then maybe there's room on the Packers' coaching staff for one more defensive assistant:

Ahhhhh ..... some distraction strategy.

PACKERS !

[RashanGary]

Thanks for being cool, guys. In hindsight, I feel kinda stupid, but it's nice to go off like that and not be judged or ripped apart for it.T



Woody,

Zach Ertz is another guy who would be interesting. He's not a great athlete, but last year Waldo showed something where WR's had the least correlation between raw athleticism and NFL success. Ertz isn't really a bad athlete. His 3 cone and shuttles were good. His speed isn't bad. He really lacks explosiveness, and that does seem to be a really big trait when it comes to bloicking. He'd probably always be, at best, a below average blocker. If he has a ton of heart though, he could be a guy you can count on to always get in the guys way at least.

It seems like the Packers offense, with AR at the helm, is very reliant on chemistry between the QB/WR. Finley had like an 8-catch 1 or 2 TD game when Flynn started. Flynn has more of a, "my guy vs your guy" mentality. Finley just ran his route and Flynn just tossed him the ball. AR, seems to do well with players who understand what the defense is trying to do, and make little adjustments to really be open.

Ertz seems to have that quality. . . . He seems like a guy who has a natural feel for the game and is highly praised for his route running and hands. He could be a really good fit for us. Having a guy AR really trusts over the middle might be even more valuable than a guy with freakish athleticism like Finley is. And it's not like Ertz is a bad athlete. His agility and ability to cut are on par with probowl TE's.

I think he might be overlooked a little. . .