How Good is TT at Draft Decisions?

[rbaloha1]

It is in place for Seattle to be a high contender for the next 3 years. Last year was not a fluke.

Brilliant reengineering of the roster and drafting.

[Patler]

time to stir some shit

some of those draft picks have gained playing time when maybe they wouldn't have on other teams because of the lack of options TT leaves us by not using free agency

some of those late rounders HAVE TO play, just because there is no other option on the team

guys like will whitiker not only play, but get thrust into starting roles

add to that the fact that we draft special teamers, guys that have no business being on the field for the offense or defense but gets drafted and makes the team because they're a good gunner.........

jarrett bush

and like what was already said. how good will TT and M3 be with all the grunt work guys moved on to other teams?

Interesting that you point to Will Whittaker while simultaneously using the lack of FA activity as a reason for draft picks starting. Whittaker came in and started in a year that TT did try to find guards in FA, and actually paid one quite well. Neither FA guard worked out, and eventually two 7th round picks were the starting guards. Whittaker wasn't a good fit in GB, but went to Washington where they wanted big bruisers and was starting there until he was lost for the year to injury. Never seemed to come back from it.

Giacomini now starts for Seattle. Maybe one of TT's bigger mistakes was trying to keep him on the practice squad, and letting Seattle snatch him away?

[Patler]

I see one player (Newhouse) who has started a lot of games, and some would argue that was be default as much as anything. Tony Moll started some games (badly) when others were hurt. Quinn Johnson was a bad fit. Coston, Hawkins, Martin, Clowney and Giacomini never started a game for the Packers. I will concede the possibility that starting in 2010, the picks have gotten better.

Moll started 18 games for the Packers in 3 years. Maybe he wasn't great, but in those first couple years when TT was turning over the roster he gave them real good value. Lasted another 3 years in the league as a backup, and the Packers had him in last off season for a look.

Giacomini now starts for Seattle. They knew from the start that he would take a few years to settle in to the NFL. They liked him so much that the first year they kept him on the 53 man roster with no intention of playing him. When the numbers didn't work a couple years later, they wanted to keep him on the practice squad, but Seattle signed him.

Some might argue that the Packers should have made Quinn Johnson a better fit. Same with Vonta Leach. If the Packers aren't tough enough as some argue, not physical enough, maybe they should have kept Leach or Johnson. Other teams seem to be able to use them.

What do you expect from 5th round picks, 10 year careers as starters? I don't expect most 5th round picks to sign a second contract with the Packers. If one does, fantastic. I just expect them to fill roles on the team for 3 or 4 years until someone else comes along.

Can't leave this without mentioning Coston. Strange career. Never accomplished a thing, but seemed on the verge a couple times. Maybe you recall that he replaced Colledge at one point, started a couple games when College was playing awful, and articles mentioned what an upgrade Coston seemed to be. Then Coston got hurt, Colledge got the starting job back and Coston disappeared. Certainly Coston never gave the Packers anything, just interesting how pro careers work out. Colledge was replaced or on the verge of being replaced many times, but got his job back due to injuries. The guy might not be great, but I don't think he has missed a single game due to injury.

[Bretsky]

I have to admit......when I saw part of that article I thought the same thing as red
Since Free Agency tends to be the hibernation period for GB it makes sense more draft picks see playing time
Maybe not a fair generalization...but that thought hit me as well

[Joemailman]

I have to admit......when I saw part of that article I thought the same thing as red
Since Free Agency tends to be the hibernation period for GB it makes sense more draft picks see playing time
Maybe not a fair generalization...but that thought hit me as well

It's fair to say that draft picks get more of a chance in Green Bay. But it's also fair to say the Packers wouldn't have won a Super Bowl and been a perennial playoff team if TT wasn't really good on draft day.

[Bretsky]

It's fair to say that draft picks get more of a chance in Green Bay. But it's also fair to say the Packers wouldn't have won a Super Bowl and been a perennial playoff team if TT wasn't really good on draft day.

Also fair to say we probably would not have won a Super Bowl without TT's two big money free agent signings

[rbaloha1]

Also fair to say we probably would not have won a Super Bowl without TT's two big money free agent signings

which is the current trend of the seahawks.

[Bretsky]

Seattle is everybody's darling right now
It's insane...if u belive in Russell Wilson...to think they have a legit starting QB for the next two years at about 300G per year
Thinks of all the excess money they are able to spend before that deal is redone after year three.

It's also interesting that a TT disciple is making all of these bold moves in FA

[pbmax]

TT has been outstanding both in terms of drafting impact players, and drafting players who give you a deep roster. His ability to do the latter made possible a Super Bowl run in a year when the number of injuries would have sunk most teams.

Now if he could just do something about those 5th round picks:

Junius Coston (2005)
Mike Hawkins (2005)
Ingle Martin (2006)
Tony Moll (2006)
David Clowney (2007)
Breno Giacomini (2008)
Quinn Johnson (2009)
Jamon Meredith (2009)
Andrew Quarless (2010)
Marshall Newhouse (2010)
D.J. Williams (2011)
Terrell Manning (2012)

Nearly all of those guys were measurables picks. Giacomini did start for a playoff team last year. And Meredith is still bouncing around. And Johnson was a fine FB if you were Mike Sherman and not Mike McCarthy.

[pbmax]

Young guys starting is a good thing. The are less expensive and are getting better. If the Packers were older with their injury trend then they would have been fielding the Rutgers lineup in two of the last three years.

That youth has a very good record in the NFL. Not all the youth plays right away (Newhouse, Sherrod, Giacomini, Smith, Bishop, House, Heyward, Williams) which means the starting lineup is not a fire sale.

I cannot look at the team's record and say the roster stinks and has lousy veterans and only wins because of Rodgers. That youth plays pretty good.

However, I am coming to the conclusion that the youth does not always play disciplined. And with Collins, Jolly or perhaps Jenkins (ugh!), doesn't get away with it as much as they did early in Capes tenure.

[Patler]

I have to admit......when I saw part of that article I thought the same thing as red
Since Free Agency tends to be the hibernation period for GB it makes sense more draft picks see playing time
Maybe not a fair generalization...but that thought hit me as well

Having now given this some thought, I'm not sure if draft picks really do see significantly more playing time in GB because of the perceived free agency thing or not. A lot of lower level FAs, street FAs and URFA's compete with the draftees for playing time. Guys like Tramon Williams, Shields, Walden, Kuhn, Crabtree, Zombo, EDS, Howard Green (for half a year), Peprah, Bigby, Chiller, Crabtree, all come to mind as free agents of one sort or another who played a lot, took time away from draftees, etc. It's not just the big name guys like Pickett and Woodson who compete with the draft picks for playing time. After all, if not for FAs like Williams and Shields, the likes of Lee and Underwood might have played more, or still been around. Would it have been any different if the Packers signed a couple big name corners instead of Williams and Shields?

I expect there is some impact from it, but perhaps not as much as first appears.

[Patler]

And Meredith is still bouncing around.

Actually, he may have found a home, and as a guard at that. He started 12 games for the Bucs last year after Davin Joseph went out. It will be interesting to see if his career finally takes off, or not. The fluff pieces out of the Bucs PR dept make it sound like they really like him. Of course, Buffalo said the same after he started a few games there in an emergency, too. Could be one of those guys who has a 10 year career playing mostly as a backup for half the teams in the league. He has already drawn checks from the Packers, Bills, Lions, Giants, Steelers and Bucs.

[Patler]

It's fair to say that draft picks get more of a chance in Green Bay. But it's also fair to say the Packers wouldn't have won a Super Bowl and been a perennial playoff team if TT wasn't really good on draft day.

Also fair to say we probably would not have won a Super Bowl without TT's two big money free agent signings

It's also fair to say they probably wouldn't have won the Super Bowl without TT's many small money free agent signings. Not to down play what Woodson and Pickett meant to the team, but wasn't Pickett hurt and playing sporadically at the end of the year? And Woodson missed half the Super Bowl. Luckilly, guys like Peprah, Howard Green, Waldon, Shields, and yes, even Bush stepped up at the right times, and Tramon Williams had a standout season. All small money FA's.

[Bretsky]

It's also fair to say they probably wouldn't have won the Super Bowl without TT's many small money free agent signings. Not to down play what Woodson and Pickett meant to the team, but wasn't Pickett hurt and playing sporadically at the end of the year? And Woodson missed half the Super Bowl. Luckilly, guys like Peprah, Howard Green, Waldon, Shields, and yes, even Bush stepped up at the right times, and Tramon Williams had a standout season. All small money FA's.

Good point as it worked both ways
W/O the big money free agents (which is not always evil) and the lesser priced free agents GB doesn't even see the playoffs. We hardly slipped in there as it was and we needed the help from others that year..........no playoffs........no SB...........

[rbaloha1]

Seattle is everybody's darling right now
It's insane...if u belive in Russell Wilson...to think they have a legit starting QB for the next two years at about 300G per year
Thinks of all the excess money they are able to spend before that deal is redone after year three.

It's also interesting that a TT disciple is making all of these bold moves in FA

There is a reason for the darling treatment.

Keep in mind Carroll has the final say on personnel.