MCGINN POST NFL DRAFT CHAT

[pbmax]

Given McCarthy's answers to the news that Bulaga and Sitton were moving to the let side, I think we need to consider that the athletic and long lineman is exactly who McCarthy is asking for.

http://host.madison.com/sports/football/professional/tom-oates-offensive-line-changes-show-mccarthy-moving-forward/article_62b3b9b7-1281-572b-ac51-c41d3c3848f4.html

Look near the end for the paragraph that starts with "It really doesn't (matter) ...'

[Joemailman]

I picked that up very clearly as well. What I read was a nice developmental guy ....nice finesse athlete guy who lacks strength. That would be consistent with why Wist hates the pick.....and the trade. I hope I'm wrong but I tend to agree with Wist on this one.

I agree with some of this. Although I liked the trade, I was a bit underwhelmed by the pick. It might be premature to label him a finesse player though. The scouting reports I've read on him talk of his aggressive play and ability to really finish off blockers once he gets them off balance. If he can improve his weight and strength, he would have more in common with someone like Sitton than with someone like Colledge. But if he can't then he's pretty much Daryn Colledge.

[Packman_26]

"Datone Jones needs to be a player immediately. He must be better than any of their rushers on the D-line, and he must take quality snaps at five-technique in the base. This DL is in trouble if he isn't."
It's statements like this that simply drive me nuts. While I think its fair to say that the Packers will need to get better on defense this year, but to say that one player "needs" to be anything is either uneducated or sensationalizing. Sure, it would be great if Jones becomes their best rush DE but if he isn't that means what? They are doomed to get Kapernicked every week? Can't the defense also improve with schematic changes or, gasp, other defense players getting better? Maybe Perry comes back and turns out to be the player we hoped he'd be. Maybe Neal builds upon last years improvements and becomes a factor. The list goes on, Daniels, Worthy, Moses, even Jolly.
I'm very hopeful that Jones becomes a star just like all Packers fans, but to put the fate or the DL and I'd argue in turn, the entire defense on his shoulders is asinine.

[RashanGary]

Given McCarthy's answers to the news that Bulaga and Sitton were moving to the let side, I think we need to consider that the athletic and long lineman is exactly who McCarthy is asking for.

http://host.madison.com/sports/football/professional/tom-oates-offensive-line-changes-show-mccarthy-moving-forward/article_62b3b9b7-1281-572b-ac51-c41d3c3848f4.html

Look near the end for the paragraph that starts with "It really doesn't (matter) ...'

I like that he's committed to being something, to having an identity. I don't particularly love the idea of not finding balance.

I've heard Larry McCarren say the RB makes the line, not the other way around. He's also said the QB makes the line, not the other way around. There is some of both, but in McCarren's opinion, the QB and RB make their respective games tick.

MM had solid rushing attacks in 2008 and 2009; with Ryan Grant getting 1200 yds/season and 4.4 yards per carry. Even then, we had trouble converting short yardage.

Hopefully Lacy is as good as he looks on the clips. Hopefully MM runs as often as he did when Grant was our top back (we were in the middle of the pack, as a rushing team.) Hopefully we convert short yardage better than we have, even in MM's best years.

If our running game can make that kind of improvement, it doesn't have to be like a Minnesota or SanFrancisco, but if we can be middle of the pack with a good short yardage back, I think our offense can be the most explosive offense in the NFL, and push records like it did in 2010.

If we're going to be realistic, we have the best plaeyr in the NFL playing QB for our team. Even if we had Adrian Peterson, the ball would go to AR first. That said, we have to run it better than last year, and significantly so. Whether we spread'em out or not, we have to be able to break those soft looks on D.

[RashanGary]

If MM was really honest, he'd say "We couldn't run against the softest coverages in the NFL. Teams sold out to stop our passing game, and succeeded more often than we like. Aaron Rodgers is great, but not great enough put up 2010 like numbers against those defenses. We have to improve our running game if we want to let AR loose."

He won't say that, and honestly, I hope he's not too proud to admit, when he looks in the mirror, that his offense couldn't do the things they wanted to do last year because they couldn't run the ball. If he (they) don't admit that to themselves, it's kinda scary.

It doesn't take a 20 year offensive coordinator to figure out our running game stunted our entire offense last year. We're just fans, but that much was obvious.


His stubbornness, to suggest running the ball is some sort of side-bar to his grand offense, is a little scary. Hopefully he's just posturing and being stubborn for the media, and behind closed doors, recognizing they NEED to run the ball better. NEED to.

[George Cumby]

I like that he's committed to being something, to having an identity. I don't particularly love the idea of not finding balance.

I've heard Larry McCarren say the RB makes the line, not the other way around. He's also said the QB makes the line, not the other way around. There is some of both, but in McCarren's opinion, the QB and RB make their respective games tick.

MM had solid rushing attacks in 2008 and 2009; with Ryan Grant getting 1200 yds/season and 4.4 yards per carry. Even then, we had trouble converting short yardage.

Hopefully Lacy is as good as he looks on the clips. Hopefully MM runs as often as he did when Grant was our top back (we were in the middle of the pack, as a rushing team.) Hopefully we convert short yardage better than we have, even in MM's best years.

If our running game can make that kind of improvement, it doesn't have to be like a Minnesota or SanFrancisco, but if we can be middle of the pack with a good short yardage back, I think our offense can be the most explosive offense in the NFL, and push records like it did in 2010.

If we're going to be realistic, we have the best plaeyr in the NFL playing QB for our team. Even if we had Adrian Peterson, the ball would go to AR first. That said, we have to run it better than last year, and significantly so. Whether we spread'em out or not, we have to be able to break those soft looks on D.

I'm with you, J.

Last year the running game was just a different critter when Benson was in there. His ability to identify the whole and commit to it made the line look a LOT better.

I think we'll be in good shape with the rooks and Harris as the change of pace.

[RashanGary]

Drew Smith sat down with Pickett. He said he's 20lbs under his usual weight. For Pickett, that's a big deal. He's a big man. For him to lose weight, or stay at the same weight he finished a season at means he has to be working hard. Raji is in a contract year.

I like the odds of our two top DL being ready to rumble. Then the other 3 or 4 guys can hopefully fill in roles around them.

[RashanGary]

I'm with you, J.

Last year the running game was just a different critter when Benson was in there. His ability to identify the whole and commit to it made the line look a LOT better.

I think we'll be in good shape with the rooks and Harris as the change of pace.

Yeah. They were steadier with Benson. Kept AR in good down and distance, kept the offense moving.

MM would be cheating all that is good about football if AR wasn't the center of his offense. The only person he'll be fooling if he doesn't think he needs to run the ball better, unfortunately, is himself. Hopefully Lacy is a bell-cow for us. HOPEFULLY!!!

[pbmax]

Harris made it look better late as well. A healthy RB would really help. Look what even Starks did when he had an actual string of starts in a row.

[Carolina_Packer]

Yeah. They were steadier with Benson. Kept AR in good down and distance, kept the offense moving.

MM would be cheating all that is good about football if AR wasn't the center of his offense. The only person he'll be fooling if he doesn't think he needs to run the ball better, unfortunately, is himself. Hopefully Lacy is a bell-cow for us. HOPEFULLY!!!

I'll 2nd that! Here's a quote from a guy who knew a little something about building an NFL team, regarding the Packers drafting Eddie Lacy.

"The happiest guy in America tonight is (quarterback) Aaron Rodgers," NFL executive Bill Polian said. "He made 40 million dollars and he got a guy who's going to make his life a whole heck of a lot easier.

"He's got a running back he can rely on every down to carry the mail and they no longer have to substitute and use overgrown fullbacks in short yardage situations. That's a huge addition for the Packers."

[cheesner]

A: Bob McGinn - Grizz: . . . They vowed to get bigger players and tougher players. Period. Almost every roster move that they have made in 2013 has been done with those two factors in mind, as colleague Tom Silverstein eloquently pointed out in his fine Sunday story. Lacy and Franklin were drafted to be the team's future backfield. It could happen by September.

. . . Dave: Bakhtiari's issue is strength and power. He is on the short side for LT and seems to lack pop for LG, RG and RT. He's just 21. He needs to get bigger and stronger.

Lol. His contradiction is only 2 questions apart.

[wist43]

I agree we need to run the ball, and I agree that running the ball will take a lot of heat off Rodgers. That said, I was okay with Benson. I thought he played well, and MM actually broke out a few power plays - Sitton and Lang looked good pulling and smashing LB'ers in the hole. Why MM doesn't do more of that is beyond me.

I have no idea what to expect of the musical chairs on the line, although I view it as positive and can only help. It seems like a more natural fit for everyone... we'll see. Lot of moving pieces there... early going could be rough.

Lacy is definitely an upgrade over Benson, so maybe that combined with the reshaped OL, and MM finding his call sheet with the running plays on it... put it all together, maybe we can improve enough to take a step forward. Flipping the line was the best thing they did. If Bulaga can hold up, that will go a long way toward righting the ship.

[Fritz]

I agree we need to run the ball, and I agree that running the ball will take a lot of heat off Rodgers. That said, I was okay with Benson. I thought he played well, and MM actually broke out a few power plays - Sitton and Lang looked good pulling and smashing LB'ers in the hole. Why MM doesn't do more of that is beyond me.

I have no idea what to expect of the musical chairs on the line, although I view it as positive and can only help. It seems like a more natural fit for everyone... we'll see. Lot of moving pieces there... early going could be rough.

Lacy is definitely an upgrade over Benson, so maybe that combined with the reshaped OL, and MM finding his call sheet with the running plays on it... put it all together, maybe we can improve enough to take a step forward. Flipping the line was the best thing they did. If Bulaga can hold up, that will go a long way toward righting the ship.

I have talked about the way that growing up in the 70's influenced my view of running the ball. Contrary to pop op, the 70's was more of a running decade than the 60's and maybe the 50's.

Thus I too yearn for some power running plays. I loved Shermy's U-71 package, if that's the correct name. Brought in an extra lineman as a TE and shaved it down people's throats.

[Joemailman]

I agree we need to run the ball, and I agree that running the ball will take a lot of heat off Rodgers. That said, I was okay with Benson. I thought he played well, and MM actually broke out a few power plays - Sitton and Lang looked good pulling and smashing LB'ers in the hole. Why MM doesn't do more of that is beyond me.

I have no idea what to expect of the musical chairs on the line, although I view it as positive and can only help. It seems like a more natural fit for everyone... we'll see. Lot of moving pieces there... early going could be rough.

Lacy is definitely an upgrade over Benson, so maybe that combined with the reshaped OL, and MM finding his call sheet with the running plays on it... put it all together, maybe we can improve enough to take a step forward. Flipping the line was the best thing they did. If Bulaga can hold up, that will go a long way toward righting the ship.

Well, that was rather positive. What's gotten into you? I pretty much agree. Not sure how much of a transition period there will be. Bulaga will be going back to playing his natural position. Moving to RT in 2010 was more of an adjustment for him than this will be. Hopefully Sitton and Lang are quick studies. Not sure who to hope for at RT. Barclay played pretty well there last year, but Sherrod, if healthy, is more talented. RT will be a battle to watch in training camp.

[Bretsky]

I agree we need to run the ball, and I agree that running the ball will take a lot of heat off Rodgers. That said, I was okay with Benson. I thought he played well, and MM actually broke out a few power plays - Sitton and Lang looked good pulling and smashing LB'ers in the hole. Why MM doesn't do more of that is beyond me.

I have no idea what to expect of the musical chairs on the line, although I view it as positive and can only help. It seems like a more natural fit for everyone... we'll see. Lot of moving pieces there... early going could be rough.

Lacy is definitely an upgrade over Benson, so maybe that combined with the reshaped OL, and MM finding his call sheet with the running plays on it... put it all together, maybe we can improve enough to take a step forward. Flipping the line was the best thing they did. If Bulaga can hold up, that will go a long way toward righting the ship.

Who has kidnapped Wist :