Official packers - browns game thread 10/20/2013

[ThunderDan]

and if you're gonna say that a defender can't hit a player while another defender is in the middle of tackling him, then there should be a 15 yard penalty called on almost every play

Just not in the head while in the process of being tackled. The NFL said it was going to clean up this kind of play during the offseason. There were a lot of unnecessary roughness penalties called during the preseason for just this. Also for an OL coming in and drilling a defensive player in the tackling pile.

Neither has been called during the regular season.

[pbmax]

Like the Offense ????

Worse on ST and no Rodgers to paper over the holes. Masthay could have helped but whatever he was doing while punting/kicking away from the Cleveland returner they feared was killing his length of kicks.

[red]

Worse on ST and no Rodgers to paper over the holes. Masthay could have helped but whatever he was doing while punting/kicking away from the Cleveland returner they feared was killing his length of kicks.

it didn't help that his best punt of the day, was called back by stupidity and resulted in his worst kick of the day

[pbmax]

and if you're gonna say that a defender can't hit a player while another defender is in the middle of tackling him, then there should be a 15 yard penalty called on almost every play

Just not a shot to the head.

[red]

Just not a shot to the head.

i'm not sure it was

if i had to lay blame, i'd say it was finley leading with his head. the browns player was making a textbook tackle IMO, shoulder to the midsection and his head to the outside of the body, when finley brought his head right into the path of the browns players head.

like i said in the other thread, it was the crown of finley's helmet hitting the side of the browns players helmet, not vice versa

[pbmax]

i'm not sure it was

if i had to lay blame, i'd say it was finley leading with his head. the browns player was making a textbook tackle IMO, shoulder to the midsection and his head to the outside of the body, when finley brought his head right into the path of the browns players head.

like i said in the other thread, it was the crown of finley's helmet hitting the side of the browns players helmet, not vice versa

I don't know how it can be a text book tackle when he led with a shoulder and didn't look to wrap up. He just dived with his shoulder. Those kind of hits are the ones that need to go.

I'll grant that this one would be hard to legislate because legit tackles often make contact with a helmet (see Nick Perry on Luck last year) but I would even be willing to give refs latitude on unnecessary roughness to allow them to call the dive bombers and let the form tackling slide. But that would cause an uproar.

[red]

i just don't see what else the defender could do there, unless like thunder dan said he just tries to pull up toavoid a hit and hope that finley doesn't regains his balance or break the tackle and keep going

there's a chance finley could have put a hand down to hold himself up, it obviously didn't happen, but we have seen guys do that before

i just don't know, i think the rule is just really flawed

[run pMc]

Actually, I'm ok with it being called a penalty whether you think it was or not...I hate Triplette and I think he hates football, its fans, and especially the Packers. What an ugly game - 22 penalties total.
It's a shame Finley got hurt -- with all the injuries - esp. at linebacker - they've had to patch together ST squads. I'd give Slocum a little bit of leeway there. Rodgers had a rough 2nd half until the Browns crapped the bed and went for it on 4th and 15...after that the game was mostly over except for some garbage scores (for both teams).
I am impressed by the team's depth -- some of these guys stepped up today. They beat a team they were supposed to, and it really wasn't that close. Good for them.
Now they gotta get healthy and start beating the rest of the division.

[pittstang5]

I might be off base here, but did anyone stop to think that at the speed it happened, it might have looked like the defender nailed Finley with his helmet, add to the fact that Finley went down with a thud - which to me, would indicate a head shot. Refs don't have replay for judgemental calls.

So, I just rewatched it on my DVR. In real time, and even my wife agrees, it looked like a helmet to helmet. In slow motion replay - you can see the Brown defender hit with his shoulder.

[channtheman]

That's what I thought watching the game pittstang. And the announcers just went on and on and on about it. They didn't go on and on over the numerous bad calls against the Packers though.

[digitaldean]

Special teams, patched together or not, were atrocious. The miss by Crosby, I put on ARod. That sack he took could have been avoided. Masthay's punts were inconsistent. His kick offs weren't that deep. Kick coverage and onside kick teams were horrific. We lucked out with a dumb Cleveland penalty.
Thankful we had Weeden as opposing QB. For most part he is slow in timing plus they had at least 4 drops.
House played well, Lattimore as well.

[red]

Special teams, patched together or not, were atrocious. The miss by Crosby, I put on ARod. That sack he took could have been avoided. Masthay's punts were inconsistent. His kick offs weren't that deep. Kick coverage and onside kick teams were horrific. We lucked out with a dumb Cleveland penalty.
Thankful we had Weeden as opposing QB. For most part he is slow in timing plus they had at least 4 drops.
House played well, Lattimore as well.

the kickoffs might have been due to the wind. i know early on when they were heading towards the south endzone (from left to right on the screen) he was sending them out of the endzone. it didn't look too windy, i mean the rain was coming straight down. but the wind does some weird things when it gets in that bowl and i have no clue what kind of mess the new south endzone causes when its windy

and i think 4 drops is being easy on his receiving core. it might have been double that, with twice as many just flat out horrible throws. makes you feel good about having a-rod who's a year younger then the 2nd year suck fest that is weedon

[pbmax]

I might be off base here, but did anyone stop to think that at the speed it happened, it might have looked like the defender nailed Finley with his helmet, add to the fact that Finley went down with a thud - which to me, would indicate a head shot. Refs don't have replay for judgemental calls.

So, I just rewatched it on my DVR. In real time, and even my wife agrees, it looked like a helmet to helmet. In slow motion replay - you can see the Brown defender hit with his shoulder.

Yes, I agree with you. I am sure that was what they saw, just as Triplette saw Weeden's head turn after hawk swiped at his helmet.

But there are two distinct problems then:

1) He was not defenseless and therefore helmet to helmet is not illegal.

2) If they are calling an unnecessary blow to the head as unnecessary roughness (something I think they should do) then the crew are not enforcing the rules as written.

There is wiggle room as the refs have been instructed to err on the side of caution. But we are also debating what SHOULD be called here. So benefit of the doubt or no, I think its a great example of something the League doesn't have a handle on yet.

[Pugger]

Wasn't worth it, but its a good call to challenge.

I disagree. I remember saying "keep that hankie in your pocket Mike!" I'm glad we didn't need that TO.

[Pugger]

Problem with the challenge is that there could be much more important calls to challenge later.

+1